suffield farmers

[biggameassassin]

Hi! me and my dad were planning on heading up to suffield base next year to try and get our self an elk, my dad is priority nine, so since it takes so long to get to be able to hunt there i thought its probably not someones main hunting spot (if it is im not trying to take it xD) and was wondering if anyone would be kind enough to let me know some farmers names and maby their addresses that let them hunt on their land before in a previous hunt, i heard the farmers were ussually very nice and would ussually be accomidating. in wmu's 143,150 or 151. We will go down and knock on doors also, but it would be a great help if we had somewhere to start and a general area to check out even if it is just one farmer. Im hoping this will be a good chance for my dad to get his first elk =). message me if you could provide me any information on this.

thanks!!!
sincerely biggameassassin :)

[packhuntr]

You will need a County of Cypress map book, a Special Areas map book, a Med Hat as well as a Brooks and area phone book. All your dreams are contained within!

[biggameassassin]

oh okay thanks =).

[trophyboy]

It surprising how many people want everyone to tell them all of their hunting spots, landowner contacts, etc. on this board.:thinking-006:I have spent countless hours(and alot of $) knocking on doors, phoning people, asking for permission, researching spots, driving to far away destinations, etc., it's actually kind of fun and most folks are great people to visit with. Some let you hunt and some don't. I'm all for helping people out but for some reason hunting is different as I've been screwed over by far too many people that I tried to help out and never get an invite to their spots, mainly because they're too lazy to have any. For that very reason, from now on only a few close buddies and I share info.

[Big Daddy Badger]

Hope spring eternal I guess...

[smith88]

It surprising how many people want everyone to tell them all of their hunting spots, landowner contacts, etc. on this board.:thinking-006:I have spent countless hours(and alot of $) knocking on doors, phoning people, asking for permission, researching spots, driving to far away destinations, etc., it's actually kind of fun and most folks are great people to visit with. Some let you hunt and some don't. I'm all for helping people out but for some reason hunting is different as I've been screwed over by far too many people that I tried to help out and never get an invite to their spots, mainly because they're too lazy to have any. For that very reason, from now on only a few close buddies and I share info.

IMHO if people are too lazy or cheap to log the kilometers to find good places to hunt, get ownership maps, and get permission they don't deserve the right to hunt the game on "so long to get to" areas. Buck up or ***k off!!!

[swift1]

I agree with you guys who posted above regarding get your own permission, but on a hunt that you may get drawn for every 10 years, does it really matter? He's just looking for some direction and states that he'll head down and knock on doors next year if they get drawn. Areas that a guy hunts every year is different than an area that you may have a chance to hunt every 10 years. IMHO.

[Rhino81]

Hi! me and my dad were planning on heading up to suffield base next year to try and get our self an elk, my dad is priority nine, so since it takes so long to get to be able to hunt there i thought its probably not someones main hunting spot (if it is im not trying to take it xD) and was wondering if anyone would be kind enough to let me know some farmers names and maby their addresses that let them hunt on their land before in a previous hunt, i heard the farmers were ussually very nice and would ussually be accomidating. in wmu's 143,150 or 151. We will go down and knock on doors also, but it would be a great help if we had somewhere to start and a general area to check out even if it is just one farmer. Im hoping this will be a good chance for my dad to get his first elk =). message me if you could provide me any information on this.

thanks!!!
sincerely biggameassassin :) I have a special areas map book if you would like to borrow it . Or if you want to keep it I could sell it to you for cheap.

[cacty]

Hi! me and my dad were planning on heading up to suffield base next year to try and get our self an elk, my dad is priority nine, so since it takes so long to get to be able to hunt there i thought its probably not someones main hunting spot (if it is im not trying to take it xD) and was wondering if anyone would be kind enough to let me know some farmers names and maby their addresses that let them hunt on their land before in a previous hunt, i heard the farmers were ussually very nice and would ussually be accomidating. in wmu's 143,150 or 151. We will go down and knock on doors also, but it would be a great help if we had somewhere to start and a general area to check out even if it is just one farmer. Im hoping this will be a good chance for my dad to get his first elk =). message me if you could provide me any information on this.

thanks!!!
sincerely biggameassassin :)

Sent you a PM, hope it helps.

[hunted]

I agree with you guys who posted above regarding get your own permission, but on a hunt that you may get drawn for every 10 years, does it really matter? He's just looking for some direction and states that he'll head down and knock on doors next year if they get drawn. Areas that a guy hunts every year is different than an area that you may have a chance to hunt every 10 years. IMHO.

Thats exactly it. I live here and can't hunt in my area for like 10+ years. If a lot of people start helping everyone out and everyone gets a big elk it soon will be 50 years to get drawn. It is big and tuff country out there and takes time and lots of km's to get it figured. People will help people in this area but come on asking for the keys right from the start is a pipe dream.

[Redfrog]

It might help if you got out in the spring/summer and made a couple weekends of it, getting to know the ranchers and maybe helping out for a few days fencing or branding or whatever.

[Sledhead71]

Thats exactly it. I live here and can't hunt in my area for like 10+ years. If a lot of people start helping everyone out and everyone gets a big elk it soon will be 50 years to get drawn. It is big and tuff country out there and takes time and lots of km's to get it figured. People will help people in this area but come on asking for the keys right from the start is a pipe dream.

Not a chance my friend, the CFB elk are almost worse than gophers here.. I see in the near future, more tags, more zones and increased chances of bagging a trophy of a life time...

[biggameassassin]

thanks guys!! no thanks ill buy my own map at the town and country there. Ya well this year ive been out scouting pre season for around 6 days and went on two hunting trips and have also gone out and asked for permission in an area we have seen many deer around so i do put alot of time in around 18 days total in hunting/scouting this year. But its just that its a place no where near where i live and i know its a good place to go, but there is a big area there and it is like once in like ten years you get that chance to go hunt down there and its not like i want to take peoples places i just want to get my bearing on where to start out and then take it from there, and beleive me i will be knocking on door and scouting a lot. if you dont wish to tell me you dont have to, but some people are nice enough to give out a little bit information that will help me get started. (PS. thank you guys who did give me some, i really appreciate it, i will probably start scouting after this season is over).

[shooter3456]

X2 What has already been said the NE corner landowners are a good place to start, or just save your priority for when they open up the base for hunting.....

[Justin.C]

X2 What has already been said the NE corner landowners are a good place to start, or just save your priority for when they open up the base for hunting.....
you will never hunt in the base.......

[Sneeze]

you will never hunt in the base.......

Interested in the last two posts...

Explain why you think its upcoming or why its never going to happen....?

[Justin.C]

Interested in the last two posts...

Explain why you think its upcoming or why its never going to happen....?There is thousands and thousands of bombs and land mines that are un acounted for on that base... So really if you think it will ever be open inside that base I think you are sadley mistaken... If they do it will be a big cull that is for cows only and will be well beond supervized.I dont even see that happening either but there is always rumors.

[shooter3456]

you will never hunt in the base.......

Are you sure??

I understand the whole liability of unexploded shells and warheads, but back when those elk were first introduced, one of the management policies was to allow hunting if the population reached a threshold,
if you talk to any of the local landowners they are definetly fed up with the elk to a point of complaining to the base, 4000 elk will need to be thinned out somehow, sooner or later.

[Justin.C]

Are you sure??

I understand the whole liability of unexploded shells and warheads, but back when those elk were first introduced, one of the management policies was to allow hunting if the population reached a threshold,
if you talk to any of the local landowners they are definetly fed up with the elk to a point of complaining to the base, 4000 elk will need to be thinned out somehow, sooner or later.Did I NOT post the only hunt you will ever see on the base?????? Also are you that smart you would endanger your life for a possible monster elk????? If so I know the government wont as if they do and somthing happens they will be 10000000000000000000000% liable for letting you on there. So no you will NEVER be aloud to hunt in there.

[slough shark]

Yeah I know there are a lot of elk out there, in fact I am taking out a younger fellow for his first elk (he was drawn for cow late season) I'm suspecting it should be pretty easy to get permission, I'll just grab a map and phone a landowner on the river valley check it out the day before the hunt then go for it, correct me if I am wrong but this should be almost a slam dunk with a cow tag.

[elkhunter11]

There is thousands and thousands of bombs and land mines that are un acounted for on that base... So really if you think it will ever be open inside that base I think you are sadley mistaken.

There are thousands of unaccounted explosives in Camp Wainwright as well, but there is a season in certain parts of the base.

[Rackmastr]

Yeah I know there are a lot of elk out there, in fact I am taking out a younger fellow for his first elk (he was drawn for cow late season) I'm suspecting it should be pretty easy to get permission, I'll just grab a map and phone a landowner on the river valley check it out the day before the hunt then go for it, correct me if I am wrong but this should be almost a slam dunk with a cow tag.

Yep its simple out there....most times if you just shake a grain bucket they will lay down in the back of your truck and you can just take them home like that....

Often times its not a matter of getting one, its scaring the other 6 out of your truck since you dont have tags for them....

[shooter3456]

There are thousands of unaccounted explosives in Camp Wainwright as well, but there is a season in certain parts of the base.

Exactly.
There are unaccounted liabilities out on the range, but how many oil and gas workers are out on the range every day, With just a quick safety brief??
Is an accompanied hunt with a base staff member in a certain area of the base to harvest an elk under strict guidelines, Out of the question? How else are the elk numbers gonna be reduced? A government cull from a helicopter? Have you already forgotten the CWD cull?
I wouldn't be so quick to say never. Things change.

[pikergolf]

Exactly.
There are unaccounted liabilities out on the range, but how many oil and gas workers are out on the range every day, With just a quick safety brief??
Is an accompanied hunt with a base staff member in a certain area of the base to harvest an elk under strict guidelines, Out of the question? How else are the elk numbers gonna be reduced? A government cull from a helicopter? Have you already forgotten the CWD cull?
I wouldn't be so quick to say never. Things change.

Dare to dream... Never's a long time, but it's not going to happen.

[Lefty-Canuck]

There are thousands of unaccounted explosives in Camp Wainwright as well, but there is a season in certain parts of the base.

Most of those "live areas" are areas which the average man cannot (well not supposed to as its "off limits") venture even when inside the base.....I have seen several 3 legged animals around there elk, moose and deer. I hunt alot of the area just outside the base......I assume they found some of the unaccounted for live munitions.

LC

[Justin.C]

There are thousands of unaccounted explosives in Camp Wainwright as well, but there is a season in certain parts of the base.
Yes you are rite cause they know were they are. Different story in Suffield.....

[Justin.C]

Exactly.
There are unaccounted liabilities out on the range, but how many oil and gas workers are out on the range every day, With just a quick safety brief??
Is an accompanied hunt with a base staff member in a certain area of the base to harvest an elk under strict guidelines, Out of the question? How else are the elk numbers gonna be reduced? A government cull from a helicopter? Have you already forgotten the CWD cull?
I wouldn't be so quick to say never. Things change.Well I will bet money that the military gets to shoot them all before you or I ever will.Like I have stated and many others have for years. NEVER..................

[Otter]

there more thing out on the block than UXO.IMO the general public will not hunt the base. they will not even entertain the idea of a miitary hunt as of yet. the differance between suffield and wainwright is there are no impact areas in suffield ( they live fire everywere). I don't see a public hunt like wainwright ever. It will most likely end as a cull.

[shooter3456]

Well I will bet money that the military gets to shoot them all before you or I ever will.Like I have stated and many others have for years. NEVER..................

For years yes, but for the last few years there hasn't been 4000 head of elk pouring out of the base every snow storm, to wreck fences and eat hay bales and crops.
The simple fact is that these elk have reached their social carrying capacity with the neighbors. And it wont take too long (maybe 3-4 years) before they are doubling their population and becoming even more of a threat for CWD and a burden for neighboring ranchers.

The good thing is that we shouldn't have to wait too long to see how it all works out, Alberta residents having a crack at them or military.

I would personally be very surprised to see the military cull, when the province could make alot of people happy and do a good thing for a change, with a little bit of effort put into range safety briefs and some hunting escorts to keep people from blowing themselves up while harvesting their elk...
Time will tell..

[pikergolf]

For years yes, but for the last few years there hasn't been 4000 head of elk pouring out of the base every snow storm, to wreck fences and eat hay bales and crops.
The simple fact is that these elk have reached their social carrying capacity with the neighbors. And it wont take too long (maybe 3-4 years) before they are doubling their population and becoming even more of a threat for CWD and a burden for neighboring ranchers.

The good thing is that we shouldn't have to wait too long to see how it all works out, Alberta residents having a crack at them or military.

I would personally be very surprised to see the military cull, when the province could make alot of people happy and do a good thing for a change, with a little bit of effort put into range safety briefs and some hunting escorts to keep people from blowing themselves up while harvesting their elk...
Time will tell..
The province has zero say in the matter, DND.

[Justin.C]

For years yes, but for the last few years there hasn't been 4000 head of elk pouring out of the base every snow storm, to wreck fences and eat hay bales and crops.
The simple fact is that these elk have reached their social carrying capacity with the neighbors. And it wont take too long (maybe 3-4 years) before they are doubling their population and becoming even more of a threat for CWD and a burden for neighboring ranchers.

The good thing is that we shouldn't have to wait too long to see how it all works out, Alberta residents having a crack at them or military.

I would personally be very surprised to see the military cull, when the province could make alot of people happy and do a good thing for a change, with a little bit of effort put into range safety briefs and some hunting escorts to keep people from blowing themselves up while harvesting their elk...
Time will tell..Hey shooter do you think the government cares about our needs or if we are happy????? NO.... There is no extra money to pay our fish pigs let alone pay for base escorts for a hunt. Heck they are talking about getting rid of wainwright hunt rite now. So why would they create more costs.... As stated you will never kill a bull on the base.... The only hunt would be a giant cull on cows.... But really there is still way to much to chance having anybody on the base for any hunt. Any oil and gas guys on the base are only aloud on roads and a very small space marked out by the military as they have marked and made sure it was safe. Pretty hard to do that on any hunt...So again dont ever see how your dream hunt would ever happen.

[slough shark]

Yep its simple out there....most times if you just shake a grain bucket they will lay down in the back of your truck and you can just take them home like that....

Often times its not a matter of getting one, its scaring the other 6 out of your truck since you dont have tags for them....

That would be rather different if it was that easy, I know there are a pile of them out there, I'm reasonably confident as long as they are out of the base on land where I have permission we should be able to sneak up on one. Is the biggest issue out there the fact that they are always on the base and sneak out only during a storm, or are there generally a number resident elk off base? I hunt in 151 a little and mainly 152 in the area, I have seen some of them around, they always seem a little transient and migratory, closer to the base are they a little more stable or do they still travel a bit?

[Sledhead71]

The province has zero say in the matter, DND.

Exactly ! Not going to happen....

[sheephunter]

There is thousands and thousands of bombs and land mines that are un acounted for on that base... So really if you think it will ever be open inside that base I think you are sadley mistaken... If they do it will be a big cull that is for cows only and will be well beond supervized.I dont even see that happening either but there is always rumors.

I keep hearing this but they ran a huge cattle drive through the base a dozen years ago and it was far from closely supervised. There were hundreds of horsese and riders and wagons and support vehicles. I'm sure there are areas of Suffield, like Wainwright that are dangerous but there are lots of areas where a hunt could be conducted.

[elkhunter1234]

I keep hearing this but they ran a huge cattle drive through the base a dozen years ago and it was far from closely supervised. There were hundreds of horsese and riders and wagons and support vehicles. I'm sure there are areas of Suffield, like Wainwright that are dangerous but there are lots of areas where a hunt could be conducted.

And that my friend is what keeps my dream alive, P 9 and i will be 999 it for the next few years to see how this over population issue will be worked out..

[Justin.C]

I keep hearing this but they ran a huge cattle drive through the base a dozen years ago and it was far from closely supervised. There were hundreds of horsese and riders and wagons and support vehicles. I'm sure there are areas of Suffield, like Wainwright that are dangerous but there are lots of areas where a hunt could be conducted.
There is only one place on witch I am aware of. Either way I don't see it happening. If I figured for one second that I had a chance to hunt in the base I would not use my high priority till it opens. Either way we will see how my priority gets used or not when next years draw book comes out.

[sheephunter]

There is only one place on witch I am aware of. Either way I don't see it happening. If I figured for one second that I had a chance to hunt in the base I would not use my high priority till it opens. Either way we will see how my priority gets used or not when next years draw book comes out.

The cattle drive went right across the base over the course of three days....there's lots of room for hunters out there.

[jrs]

I thought i read somewhere the idea with suffield is to grow it to 20 000 elk then stabilize it. Maybe im off my rocker, but i saw it somewhere...

[sheephunter]

I thought i read somewhere the idea with suffield is to grow it to 20 000 elk then stabilize it. Maybe im off my rocker, but i saw it somewhere...

That's more elk than we have in the entire province.

[Justin.C]

The cattle drive went right across the base over the course of three days....there's lots of room for hunters out there.
So if this is the case why has the elk hunt never been inside the base? Also why is it that they patrol it extra well to keep people out during hunting season? I know a few people that work on the base and people in the military and all say the same thing never going to happen. So why and were is all of this they are going to let people hunt come from? Trust me I am with elkhunter. I would love a tag in my pocket the first year they open it if they ever do. You have a great chance on killing a world record if the year was perfect.

[albertadave]

There are thousands of unaccounted explosives in Camp Wainwright as well, but there is a season in certain parts of the base.

I thought I read on here one time that the reason they can allow the public into Wainwright, and not Suffield, is that chemical weapons, or something along that lines, had been/are used at Suffield, and not at Wainwright? Any truth to that?

[sheephunter]

So if this is the case why has the elk hunt never been inside the base? Also why is it that they patrol it extra well to keep people out during hunting season? I know a few people that work on the base and people in the military and all say the same thing never going to happen. So why and were is all of this they are going to let people hunt come from? Trust me I am with elkhunter. I would love a tag in my pocket the first year they open it if they ever do. You have a great chance on killing a world record if the year was perfect.

I never said it was going to happen Justin....I was just pointing out that the whole arguement that the base is too dangerous just doesn't hold water. They've let the public enmass on it before.

[sheephunter]

I thought I read on here one time that the reason they can allow the public into Wainwright, and not Suffield, is that chemical weapons, or something along that lines, had been/are used at Suffield, and not at Wainwright? Any truth to that?

They give lots of reasons but at the end of the day, they have permitted a large sector of the public to use the base in the past.

[Deer Hunter]

30 townships sitting there...
Cattle drives dont shoot guns. Imagine MND dealing with an accidental shooting of a british soldier who traditionally have had the run of the place.
Maybe a bow season could be proposed to try break the ice.

[sheephunter]

36 townships sitting there...
Cattle drives dont shoot guns. Imagine MND dealing with an accidental shooting of a british soldier who traditionally have had the run of the place.
Maybe a bow season could be proposed to try break the ice.

Hold the seasons when no training is going on....no soldiers have been shot at Wainwright.

[Justin.C]

I never said it was going to happen Justin....I was just pointing out that the whole arguement that the base is too dangerous just doesn't hold water. They've let the public enmass on it before.I never said you did. Someone else did. I keep hearing all of this talk. I would love to know what th real deal is. I am not going to say that there has not been people on the base. But how it happens is you are cleared from point A-B only. Hunting has never worked like that. So other that the reserve were else would be not like that? Also what they did once may never be again. Just like albertas trophy muledeer numbers.

[Deer Hunter]

Hold the seasons when no training is going on....no soldiers have been shot at Wainwright.

And when do they stop training in there?

[sheephunter]

And when do they stop training in there?

They do try to acccomodate the hunters during the specified season on the base. Certain areas will be closed on certain days but there are always open hunting areas. It's not like there is any new ground to break here. We already have a hunting season on a military base in Alberta and the public has been allowed to use the Suffield base for recreation in the past. We need to quit buying into the excuses and put some pressure on. The precident is there.

[Sledhead71]

TJ,

I think the centenial cattle drive is the one you are refering too ? Tough to compare this to hunting on the base..

You will see a slaughter before you are allowed access... IMO

[sheephunter]

TJ,

I think the centenial cattle drive is the one you are refering too ? Tough to compare this to hunting on the base..

You will see a slaughter before you are allowed access... IMO

I don't see it hard to compare at all.....the public was permitted on the base for recreational purposes...no different than a hunting season on the base.

[Sledhead71]

I don't see it hard to compare at all.....the public was permitted on the base for recreational purposes...no different than a hunting season on the base.

You can't even compare the costs, red tape and organization of a centennial cattle drive to a permit of access for hunting...

[huntslots]

I never said you did. Someone else did. I keep hearing all of this talk. I would love to know what th real deal is. I am not going to say that there has not been people on the base. But how it happens is you are cleared from point A-B only. Hunting has never worked like that. So other that the reserve were else would be not like that? Also what they did once may never be again. Just like albertas trophy muledeer numbers.

What other area? Lots of drilling and gas wells on the Block. How many people were involved in the horse round up? I'd guess quite a few in lots of areas in the Block. It probably won't ever happen though.

[sheephunter]

You can't even compare the costs, red tape and organization of a centennial cattle drive to a permit of access for hunting...

You're right...I'm sure the hunt would be way less expensive to administer. There would be no overnight camping on the base, no horses to worry about, just guys on designated trails and on foot in designated areas. We already have a model at Wainwright.

[Justin.C]

I don't see it hard to compare at all.....the public was permitted on the base for recreational purposes...no different than a hunting season on the base.
Ok. I agree. There is no difference between hunting on that base and hunting in our provincial parks than other than landmines and bombs. So why can't we hunt them aswell?

Just to make this clear I am not against hunting in suffield or provicial parks. We as hunters and outdoorsmen keep loosing more and more land every year. So why don't we fight back to get back what we once had.

[sheephunter]

Ok. I agree. There is no difference between hunting on that base and hunting in our provincial parks than other than landmines and bombs. So why can't we hunt them aswell?

Just to make this clear I am not against hunting in suffield or provicial parks. We as hunters and outdoorsmen keep loosing more and more land every year. So why don't we fight back to get back what we once had.

Not sure what one has to do with the other Justin. I don't disagree but you need to focus! We are talking about Suffield here. Provincial parks are yet another kettle of fish. Why don't we indeed? Why don't we look for new opportunity?

[Justin.C]

Not sure what one has to do with the other Justin. I don't disagree but you need to focus! We are talking about Suffield here. Provincial parks are yet another kettle of fish. Why don't we indeed? Why don't we look for new opportunity?
What I am saying is one has no access other than for oil and gas. The other is a 100% access to everything other than hunting. They are no different. No hunting. As for suffield yes you are right I think a lot is smoke. But you are trying to get the government to give us the truth. Good luck. When it comes to getting access. It is a very slim chance. But is possible. I think you should head up a big potition to get the ball rollin as I think you have way more time than most of us. You also have been a big part of our outdoor community for a long time. I think Walking Buffalo also would be great for this one. Or at least to help.

[sheephunter]

LOL...likely better if we all got involved Justin.

[Deer Hunter]

While youre at it, throw in Banff and Jasper too :)

[sheephunter]

While youre at it, throw in Banff and Jasper too :)

There's no precident for hunting in national parks in Alberta....there is on military bases but I like your way of thinking ;)

[Justin.C]

LOL...likely better if we all got involved Justin.
Lol. Sorry could not help myself. But really we need somone to start it all so everyone else can fallow. People know who you are. I would do it but most just think I am a loud mouth ginger. So what do u say TJ?

[sheephunter]

Lol. Sorry could not help myself. But really we need somone to start it all so everyone else can fallow. People know who you are. I would do it but most just think I am a loud mouth ginger. So what do u say TJ?

Sounds like a good resolution for the AFGA to me. If you want to get something done, that's the place to start.

[Justin.C]

While youre at it, throw in Banff and Jasper too :)

Lol. Have no want to hunt either one of the even if it opened. When it comes to parks we got screwd with spray lakes and peter louheed parks. Those are the two that make a lot of people mad. And actually we use to be aloud by law to hunt in provincial parks. Just made lots of work for the park warden. That is why there is all kinds of rules pertaining to the parks now.

[sheephunter]

And actually we use to be aloud by law to hunt in provincial parks. .

When was that Justin?

[Justin.C]

When was that Justin?

That was a long time ago when I was a kid. Heck you can hunt in the provincial park around pinehurst lake rite now. I will get the real date on the old days as I know a guy that use to do it and never got charged by the warden but always had to deal with him.

[sheephunter]

That was a long time ago when I was a kid. Heck you can hunt in the provincial park around pinehurst lake rite now. I will get the real date on the old days as I know a guy that use to do it and never got charged by the warden but always had to deal with him.

Ya, I'd appreciate that. I've only been hunting in Alberta for 26 years and it's never been legal since I've been here so it must be a while ago. You can hunt a provincial park at Pinehurst? How's that work? It's my understanding that all provincial parks are closed to hunting other than under special circumstances. There was a hunt in Writing on Stone 15 or 20 years ago for does that I remember.

[walking buffalo]

There is no extra money to pay our fish pigs let alone pay for base escorts for a hunt.

:snapoutofit::snapoutofit::snapoutofit:

Really Justin, Take a breathe and the time to read what you write before you post.....


There are many precidents for hunting in National Parks, Provincial parks and on Military Bases. A hunt on Suffield is possible....

Pretty soon something has to give with this elk population. Be it a large fire, severe drought, disease, or a hunt. These animals will experience a severe population crash or migration if controls to population growth are not put in place.

[Justin.C]

Ya, I'd appreciate that. I've only been hunting in Alberta for 26 years and it's never been legal since I've been here so it must be a while ago. You can hunt a provincial park at Pinehurst? How's that work? It's my understanding that all provincial parks are closed to hunting other than under special circumstances. There was a hunt in Writing on Stone 15 or 20 years ago for does that I remember.
When it comes to the any parks that is from a guy you and I both know. It was probably a gray area or somthing. The pine hurst pp was the only one in the province I knew you could hunt. I just looked at the map and regs and it has changed. I never hunted it but I read it in the regs that you could.

[ishootbambi]

There's no precident for hunting in national parks in Alberta....there is on military bases but I like your way of thinking ;)

thats the rub tj. the cattle drive went through the nwa if im remembering right. i looked on the interweb and the best evidence i found of it was this.

http://pursuitofidlepleasures.blogspot.com/2011/03/1996-centennial-western-stock-growers.html

scroll halfway down and you will see the pictures are along the river. that is the national wildlife area on the eastern edge of the base. thats the only place out there that the military doesnt use for training, though they admit there is likely some dangerous stuff that landed in there unexploded.

for the guy that asked about chemical weapons, yes they do have an area out there where some scary stuff has gone on.

for the guy that mentioned 20000, word is that computer modelling has shown an estimated population of 20000 coming soon. i dont remember the exact date, but they are multiplying at an astounding rate. guess them wolves they dumped in arent keeping up.....:sHa_sarcasticlol:

the long and the short is that i work in there and the way things are....hunting is not an option. every year the military guys get hurt discovering things from the past, and they know what they are doing. regarding the nwa....it amounts to a national park, so a cattle drive may fly, but hunting.....no the precedent certainly hasnt been set.

heck, just this summer, i spent a few hours on a well site. after i had left, the crew discovered an unexploded mortar shell sticking half out under a water tank. scary to think that guys i work with could have been hurt. the next day the area was shut down for a bit as the military came in to blow the "blind".

im not saying i know much about the place, but i know more than some in this thread.

while im on it, let me take a minute to thank the doofus who raised a stink about the elk pics i posted here earlier this summer. it is my job that gets me access to the base, and i wouldnt risk my job to show you guys some pics. i asked if it was ok when i was briefed about safety on the base, and was told that it would be fine to take pics. to the idiot that thinks you kicked me in the nuts.....guess again fool. they have asked me not to post them anymore. what that means is that while i am in there working, i will still enjoy the view of the wildlife, but i wont be able to share it with thousands of other albertans who dont get to see it firsthand. well done dummy! a quick look around the internet will turn up hundreds of pictures from inside suffield, proving the harmlessness of it, but you done good pal!!!

[sheephunter]

When it comes to the any parks that is from a guy you and I both know. It was probably a gray area or somthing. The pine hurst pp was the only one in the province I knew you could hunt. I just looked at the map and regs and it has changed. I never hunted it but I read it in the regs that you could.

LOL....okay thanks.

[elkhunter11]

I thought I read on here one time that the reason they can allow the public into Wainwright, and not Suffield, is that chemical weapons, or something along that lines, had been/are used at Suffield, and not at Wainwright? Any truth to that?


I have no idea of whether chemical weapons were tested at Suffield. However, I don't see the authorities allowing a cattle drive if there was a danger to the people involved.

[Justin.C]

:snapoutofit::snapoutofit::snapoutofit:

Really Justin, Take a breathe and the time to read what you write before you post.....


There are many precidents for hunting in National Parks, Provincial parks and on Military Bases. A hunt on Suffield is possible....

Pretty soon something has to give with this elk population. Be it a large fire, severe drought, disease, or a hunt. These animals will experience a severe population crash or migration if controls to population growth are not put in place.I did before I posted that. I hate them and every part of srd. A monkey could do a better job than any of them have done in the last 10+ years.

[Justin.C]

LOL....okay thanks.
Well I have no idea what is so funny but I have every regulation for the last 20 years so. I will find it and you won't be laughing then.

[sheephunter]

Well I have no idea what is so funny but I have every regulation for the last 20 years so. I will find it and you won't be laughing then.

LOL...okay thanks.....I'm all for learning Justin and that's why I asked, just no more "grey" areas about a guy who knows a guy please.

[ishootbambi]

.....I'm all for learning .

so did you skip my post then?

[Justin.C]

LOL...okay thanks.....I'm all for learning Justin and that's why I asked, just no more "grey" areas about a guy who knows a guy please.
I must have missed that. I understand. I am also posting off my crapberry. So I might have missed a little here or there.

[sheephunter]

so did you skip my post then?

Huh?

[shooter3456]

There is a difference between suffield and wainwright is that wainwright is actually provincial land leased by DND and suffield is in fact federal lands.
As far as oil and gas contractors sticking to exact routes and roads, ask any survey workers how they get their job done by staying on a road all day? Those guys are all over the range all day.
There is a high degree of liability, but history has shown us that the risk can be managed.
Coordinating a hunt and escorting hunters in between battle group exercises would be a lot easier and less complicated than slaughtering a couple thousand cow elk and disposing of them.
I guess they could have the "fish pigs" shoot them again eh Justin??

[walking buffalo]

There are active hunting seasons in Canadian National Parks as we post.

This is not the only one, just the newest one.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfoundland-labrador/story/2011/09/02/nl-parks-moose-902.html

[Justin.C]

so did you skip my post then?

I sure did. Just like you mist my ginger comment. Lol

[Justin.C]

There is a difference between suffield and wainwright is that wainwright is actually provincial land leased by DND and suffield is in fact federal lands.
As far as oil and gas contractors sticking to exact routes and roads, ask any survey workers how they get their job done by staying on a road all day? Those guys are all over the range all day.
There is a high degree of liability, but history has shown us that the risk can be managed.
Coordinating a hunt and escorting hunters in between battle group exercises would be a lot easier and less complicated than slaughtering a couple thousand cow elk and disposing of them.
I guess they could have the "fish pigs" shoot them again eh Justin??you got it. They could go get there helicopter and shoot them with there 223 and heck bombs can't jump it to the air.

[jrs]

There are active hunting seasons in Canadian National Parks as we post.

This is not the only one, just the newest one.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfoundland-labrador/story/2011/09/02/nl-parks-moose-902.html

In addition, is there not hunting on the federally owned Onefore research centre in Alberta? Just thinking what other pieces of land are comparable.

[ishootbambi]

I sure did. Just like you mist my ginger comment. Lol

didnt miss it......made me giggle like a school girl. http://i1133.photobucket.com/albums/m581/isb11/lmao.gif

[ishootbambi]

There are active hunting seasons in Canadian National Parks as we post.

This is not the only one, just the newest one.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfoundland-labrador/story/2011/09/02/nl-parks-moose-902.html

ok, the precedent has been set for hunting in national parks. now how about parks within miltary bases where there are explosives present. even in wainwright there are areas off limits because of the dangers.

to be clear, id love to see it happen.....but just dont have any hope for it.

[Lefty-Canuck]

for the guy that asked about chemical weapons, yes they do have an area out there where some scary stuff has gone on.

I can confirm that chemical agents are tested and released on the base as the work I do For DRES-DRDC is directly related to the equipment used to test for chemical agents and they do have excercises involving such said agents.

Just another reason that public safety will over rule public access to the base.

LC

[Justin.C]

didnt miss it......made me giggle like a school girl. http://i1133.photobucket.com/albums/m581/isb11/lmao.gifthat is good as that was for you. I was bent over laughing when I hit send.

[huntslots]

There's no precident for hunting in national parks in Alberta....there is on military bases but I like your way of thinking ;)


You are very much wrong again. When Parks Canada and the Luxton Foundation Representatives presented their re-introduction of the buffalo to Banff Park blurb, Cliff White (retired Parks Biologist) stated Parks Canada allowed a Native cull on elk around the Banff Townsite for quite a few years and very recently.

So there is hunting allowed in Federal Parks in Alberta, but not for everyone.

[sheephunter]

You are very much wrong again. When Parks Canada and the Luxton Foundation Representatives presented their re-introduction of the buffalo to Banff Park blurb, Cliff White (retired Parks Biologist) stated Parks Canada allowed a Native cull on elk around the Banff Townsite for quite a few years and very recently.

So there is hunting allowed in Federal Parks in Alberta, but not for everyone.

I thought it was understood that I meant sport hunting...apparently it wasn't. There was a recent Native cull hunt in Banff? I'd be interested in learning more about that.

[huntslots]

I thought it was understood that I meant sport hunting...apparently it wasn't. There was a recent Native cull hunt in Banff? I'd be interested in learning more about that.


Nope, understood hunting. Anyway get in touch with Cliff White, I am sure you have heard of him. As far as I know he is still working for or with the Luxton Foundation to re-introduce the buffalo to Banff Park. Both him and one of the current Parks biologists stood up bold as brass at the presentation in front of 60 or so people and confirmed when questioned there are Native culls taking place around the Banff Townsite.

[sheephunter]

Nope, understood hunting. Anyway get in touch with Cliff White, I am sure you have heard of him. As far as I know he is still working for or with the Luxton Foundation to re-introduce the buffalo to Banff Park. Both him and one of the current Parks biologists stood up bold as brass at the presentation in front of 60 or so people and confirmed when questioned there are Native culls taking place around the Banff Townsite.

Hmmm, can't find any reference to it. I found White's power point on the subject. The most recent cull referenced was in the 60s but not sure how it was carried out. If you have any reference for this I'd sure be interested. Walking Buffalo, you got any insight?

[walking buffalo]

Hmmm, can't find any reference to it. I found White's power point on the subject. The most recent cull referenced was in the 60s but not sure how it was carried out. If you have any reference for this I'd sure be interested. Walking Buffalo, you got any insight?

Not with Banff.... Gonna passing the Buck.... Greylynx? :wave:

There is an ongoing "cultural" hunt in B.C.'s Gulf Islands National Park Reserve.
Aboriginals only....

Point Pelee National Park had duck hunting as a all skin color "Taditional" hunt until 1989.

[mongo]

thanks guys!! no thanks ill buy my own map at the town and country there. Ya well this year ive been out scouting pre season for around 6 days and went on two hunting trips and have also gone out and asked for permission in an area we have seen many deer around so i do put alot of time in around 18 days total in hunting/scouting this year. But its just that its a place no where near where i live and i know its a good place to go, but there is a big area there and it is like once in like ten years you get that chance to go hunt down there and its not like i want to take peoples places i just want to get my bearing on where to start out and then take it from there, and beleive me i will be knocking on door and scouting a lot. if you dont wish to tell me you dont have to, but some people are nice enough to give out a little bit information that will help me get started. (PS. thank you guys who did give me some, i really appreciate it, i will probably start scouting after this season is over).

wish i could hep ya out but i dont know the area .. good luck & let see some pics if ya score...

[slough shark]

quote-for the guy that mentioned 20000, word is that computer modelling has shown an estimated population of 20000 coming soon. i dont remember the exact date, but they are multiplying at an astounding rate. guess them wolves they dumped in arent keeping up.....:sHa_sarcasticlol:

By the sounds of things they are going to have to do something fairly drastic, I'm hoping if they do something to cut down the population it involves either hunters or a mass transplant to jump start populations on the eastern slopes where they have been hammered by the wolves. They could even do this on an ongoing basis to boost the populations wherever they are hurting, kinda with what they used to do with the elk from banff or the elk from the yaha tinda (before they were eaten by wolves) it could be the elk factory to bring our populations back.

[addictedhunter]

x2,wolves screwed me this year more than southern hunters lol

[ishootbambi]

, I'm hoping if they do something to cut down the population it involves a mass transplant to jump start populations on the eastern slopes where they have been hammered by the wolves. They could even do this on an ongoing basis to boost the populations wherever they are hurting,.

im not saying i hate the plan.....but who the heck is gonna pay for that? you could make the same arguments for the sheep at cadomin....but again, show me the money.

[slough shark]

If f&w could team up with some other outdoors group (rocky mountain elk foundation) off the top of my head to setup some sort of permanent trap area, bait them in from there sedate them and load them on a truck and send them out west (or wherever they are deemed needed) once there was the infrastructure (trap) setup all it would take is the sedating and transport. On a side question at some point aren't the elk going to be forced to migrate looking for food? the #'s would hit carrying capacity soon and I could see them branch out looking for food, they can't all live on the base full time can they?

[cacty]

thats the rub tj. the cattle drive went through the nwa if im remembering right. i looked on the interweb and the best evidence i found of it was this.

http://pursuitofidlepleasures.blogspot.com/2011/03/1996-centennial-western-stock-growers.html

scroll halfway down and you will see the pictures are along the river. that is the national wildlife area on the eastern edge of the base. thats the only place out there that the military doesnt use for training, though they admit there is likely some dangerous stuff that landed in there unexploded.

for the guy that asked about chemical weapons, yes they do have an area out there where some scary stuff has gone on.

for the guy that mentioned 20000, word is that computer modelling has shown an estimated population of 20000 coming soon. i dont remember the exact date, but they are multiplying at an astounding rate. guess them wolves they dumped in arent keeping up.....:sHa_sarcasticlol:

the long and the short is that i work in there and the way things are....hunting is not an option. every year the military guys get hurt discovering things from the past, and they know what they are doing. regarding the nwa....it amounts to a national park, so a cattle drive may fly, but hunting.....no the precedent certainly hasnt been set.

heck, just this summer, i spent a few hours on a well site. after i had left, the crew discovered an unexploded mortar shell sticking half out under a water tank. scary to think that guys i work with could have been hurt. the next day the area was shut down for a bit as the military came in to blow the "blind".

im not saying i know much about the place, but i know more than some in this thread.

while im on it, let me take a minute to thank the doofus who raised a stink about the elk pics i posted here earlier this summer. it is my job that gets me access to the base, and i wouldnt risk my job to show you guys some pics. i asked if it was ok when i was briefed about safety on the base, and was told that it would be fine to take pics. to the idiot that thinks you kicked me in the nuts.....guess again fool. they have asked me not to post them anymore. what that means is that while i am in there working, i will still enjoy the view of the wildlife, but i wont be able to share it with thousands of other albertans who dont get to see it firsthand. well done dummy! a quick look around the internet will turn up hundreds of pictures from inside suffield, proving the harmlessness of it, but you done good pal!!!

NWA is not the only place that they dont train. Hunting may be an option someday, but it would be for Employees that have many yrs on the base I would assume. Chemical weapons have been used from corner to corner at some point, not just one area. Im not saying I know much about the place, but I know more than some in this thread.

[Fordpilot83]

there'll be a cull. maybe a draw hunt someday. ive seen unused rounds but there isnt any landmines out there. who would set up land mines in their own training grounds?

[Sledhead71]

I don't see it hard to compare at all.....the public was permitted on the base for recreational purposes...no different than a hunting season on the base.


You are right, the public was permitted on CFB suffield for recreational purposes for Alberta's centennial, really tough to use this as an arguement for hunting...

When I see some of Alberta's photography personal with access to take pictures of the magestic elk, I will have some hope, till then we all can dream..

What you will see is other zones around the area opening up and more tags issued to control the population, good thing for all us sportsmen and women.

[sheephunter]

You are right, the public was permitted on CFB suffield for recreational purposes for Alberta's centennial, really tough to use this as an arguement for hunting...

.

I honestly see it as the perfect arguemment for hunting. Public recreation is public recreation.

[AbProwler]

I used to work for a company that serviced all the well heads on there.
All are under ground level, and covered with steel plates.
We would checkin at the main offices, they would tell us where they were playing, issue us a map, tell us to leave any projectiles alone and send us on our way! :thinking-006:

[Sledhead71]

I honestly see it as the perfect arguemment for hunting. Public recreation is public recreation.

Public recreation does not equal hunting opportunities.

Look at Cypress Hills, there is a controled elk season, but no turkeys, mule or whitetail deer ? Now lets talk a perfect arguement ! So whats your take on this ? Established system in place for many years, but not expanded to other species ?

[sheephunter]

Public recreation does not equal hunting opportunities.

Look at Cypress Hills, there is a controled elk season, but no turkeys, mule or whitetail deer ? Now lets talk a perfect arguement ! So whats your take on this ? Established system in place for many years, but not expanded to other species ?

Man, they sure are a lot of defeatest on this site when it comes to new hunting opportunities. The Cypress Hills elk hunt is basically a cull hunt as Suffield would be. I'm sure it wouldn't extend to other species either. Special circumstances call for special measures. There will need to be a cull on Suffield without question. Public recreation has been permitted on Suffield in the past just as it had been in Cypress Hills. That's my take on that :)

[Sledhead71]

Man, they sure are a lot of defeatest on this site when it comes to new hunting opportunities. The Cypress Hills elk hunt is basically a cull hunt as Suffield would be. I'm sure it wouldn't extend to other species either. Special circumstances call for special measures. There will need to be a cull on Suffield without question. Public recreation has been permitted on Suffield in the past just as it had been in Cypress Hills. That's my take on that :)

Defeatest I am not, realist I am...

There will be a cull in CFB Suffield, but you and I won't get an invite..

Over and out of this one :)

[walking buffalo]

A retired wildlife biologist (Canadian Wildlife Service) by the name of Garry Trottier would be the man to talk to on this topic.

[sheephunter]

You are very much wrong again. When Parks Canada and the Luxton Foundation Representatives presented their re-introduction of the buffalo to Banff Park blurb, Cliff White (retired Parks Biologist) stated Parks Canada allowed a Native cull on elk around the Banff Townsite for quite a few years and very recently.

So there is hunting allowed in Federal Parks in Alberta, but not for everyone.

Gord I have to admit that I've exhausted all my contacts on this and no one can recall a recent or even semi recent Native elk cull in Banff. Perhaps you have some more information? Perhaps you misheard? It would be very interesting if true but I just can't get any confirmation. Can you offer any help? The only reference anyone could offer was a Park's cull that took place over 50 years ago.

[walking buffalo]

Gord I have to admit that I've exhausted all my contacts on this and no one can recall a recent or even semi recent Native elk cull in Banff. Perhaps you have some more information? Perhaps you misheard? It would be very interesting if true but I just can't get any confirmation. Can you offer any help? The only reference anyone could offer was a Park's cull that took place over 50 years ago.

I incorrectly passed the buck to Greylynx, that dollar was meant for Uglyelk.

Maybe he knows something about a recent cull?

[Justin.C]

Another reason you will have a hard time getting a hunt on that base is there is a 25 year lease to the british government. So really who are you going to ask for the hunt???? there priminister or the queen?????



I still like all the dreams that we all have but not going to happen.

[madatter]

X2 What has already been said the NE corner landowners are a good place to start, or just save your priority for when they open up the base for hunting.....


Not gonna happen....

[madatter]

I thought I read on here one time that the reason they can allow the public into Wainwright, and not Suffield, is that chemical weapons, or something along that lines, had been/are used at Suffield, and not at Wainwright? Any truth to that?

Yes mustard gas,nerve agents....other bad stuff you don't want to know about...
Most was stored in open pits,discarded in piles in open prairie....old buildings.
Been there,worked with it,helped dispose of a lot of it.
Personally an elk is not worth even the slightest chance of coming in contact with this stuff,and I'm pretty sure everyone doesn't want to wear a chemical warfare suit while in these areas....
If anyone thinks the DND wants anything to do with babysitting hunters with their stretched resources....well Dream on....

[packhuntr]

Wether they allow a hunt in there or not, something HAS TO HAPPEN and REAL QUICK. This elk situation we have found ourselves in out here is single handedly the biggest F-up in the provinces history. Anyone that understands such things knows that it takes time to build up any herd, be it cattle or what ever have you, but once you reach a breaking/hinge point, she goes on a runaway real fast. This elk deal is going to go sideways real fast if some of these procrastinating dip-schits in charge of this one (among other gong shows) dont get it together and quick. One more thing for our boys in blue,,, telling everyone including area land owners that you are working dilligently to rectify the issues doesnt count as getting something done,,, neither does increasing the tags per hunt boys. More tags equals less dead elk, the elk have somewhere they can escape to and fast with ANY pressure, this is a NO BRAINER and no one is buying it as any kind of a remidial measure!

[sheephunter]

Wether they allow a hunt in there or not, something HAS TO HAPPEN and REAL QUICK.

I totally agree pack and what is the most economical and publically palitable solution?

[Justin.C]

Wether they allow a hunt in there or not, something HAS TO HAPPEN and REAL QUICK. This elk situation we have found ourselves in out here is single handedly the biggest F-up in the provinces history. Anyone that understands such things knows that it takes time to build up any herd, be it cattle or what ever have you, but once you reach a breaking/hinge point, she goes on a runaway real fast. This elk deal is going to go sideways real fast if some of these procrastinating dip-schits in charge of this one (among other gong shows) dont get it together and quick. One more thing for our boys in blue,,, telling everyone including area land owners that you are working dilligently to rectify the issues doesnt count as getting something done,,, neither does increasing the tags per hunt boys. More tags equals less dead elk, the elk have somewhere they can escape to and fast with ANY pressure, this is a NO BRAINER and no one is buying it as any kind of a remidial measure!so what would You do as they are NOT going to let sheep and the boys run around inside as they thinks.

[packhuntr]

I do not know the answer boys, and I do agree Sheep, I was opposed to those horses being removed in the first place. This whole thing was as stupid as Niel Waugh's idea of introducing plains bison onto that little piece of grass called Antelope Creek LOLOLOL. Hopefully Niel is not much of a sales man and that one didnt appear appealing.:scared: Now that we have this impending elk wreck, I see no other options besides a hunt, and a big one at that. The current hunt in its current location is accomplishing NOTHING. If they wait until carrying capacity is reached, the magnitude of this thing will be astronomical no matter the option exercised. If they cull, they will have to do it on a scale of immense proportions, essentially letting the flesh of these animals waste, no other options. Now just how many would need to be culled every year? If not annually, every two years?? With the number of cows present right now youd have to shoot every single calf just to hold this monstrosity of a herd AT BAY. That would be huge, you need to understand the ramifications of such actions when it was initially a situation created by choice. What would the world wide news have to say about an annual slaughter and waste of this proportion? Now procrastinate and dick around like everyone at the helm of this deal is doing,,, watching this thing turn into a monster. What when they reach carrying capacity?? You dont push off 10 000 head of elk for hunters, there would cease to be a fence in the country standing. Want to see some currently choked land owners heading to town looking to find where they built the courthouse?? Use your imagination boys, its all a big reality. Start killing them now and alot of them, or shes gonna be a wreck.

[pikergolf]

All it will take to rectify the situation is one huge range fire. The extremely wet last two summers have exacerbated the problem and unfortunately, with all the grass that is out there, the next dry summer is going to be hard on the elk. Fires are a fact of life for live fire exercises, burn all the food off and there will be mass starvation. Farmers are going to get hit hard and I imagine they will get the green light to protect their hay stacks or the province will organize a quick hunters cull in the winter. It will probably be dealt with in the same way the US deals with their big reserve land herds, hunters shooting half starved elk. The only other solution I can see is wolves, I don't think they would be as devastating to land around the base as in the forested regions simply because there is nowhere for them to hide. I guess we will see how it plays out, but i cannot see a hunt in the base ever harvesting the required number of animals. I don't think a hunt will ever happen, but if it did it would have be either rounded up animals, or a soldier for every hunter, the latter would be extremely expensive and have a fairly limited harvest.