Breaking news: Shooting at Virginia tech

[leeaspell]

Listening to fox news on sirius radio and there has been a shooting in the parking lot of the university about 2 hours ago. Details are scarce but there was another round of gun fire abouy 20 minutes ago. Post more details as i hear them. One cop and at least one student killed. Suspect still at large

[Scott N]

That's certainly not good news. But.... I thought VT was a "gun free" zone? :confused:

[leeaspell]

I guess making it gun free didnt help much

[Scott N]

I guess making it gun free didnt help much

I shouldn't joke about someone losing their life, but it does go to show how "effective" gun control is.

[leeaspell]

I wonder if this will show up in pro registry debates here now especially since a cop was killed. Hope theu find the loser and send him to the chair

[James M]

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/nationnow/2011/12/virginia-tech-shootings-2-killed-including-police-officer.html

[Jamie Black R/T]

I shouldn't joke about someone losing their life, but it does go to show how "effective" gun control is.

thats not offensive....cause its true...an armed guard or two on campus could make all the difference...not even to mention if they allowed concealed carry.

hoping this turns out better than the last time...its off to a terrible start :sick::mad:

[leeaspell]

Thanks for posting the link. Dont know how to copy and paste on phone lol

[fordtruckin]

thats not offensive....cause its true...an armed guard or two on campus could make all the difference...not even to mention if they allowed concealed carry.

hoping this turns out better than the last time...its off to a terrible start :sick::mad:

Virginia Tech has its own police force, as do most large universities in the US. As for gun free zones you can't carry on school property as its against most state statutes.

[HunterDave]

Initial reports sounds to me to be some sort of criminal as opposed to a wacko on a shooting spree.

[Jamie Black R/T]

Virginia Tech has its own police force, as do most large universities in the US. As for gun free zones you can't carry on school property as its against most state statutes.

so the gun free only applies to criminals and the students then?

[James M]

so the gun free only applies to criminals and the students then?

By the looks of it...it only applies to campus cops and students.

[FishingMOM]

A campus police officer was killed following a routine traffic stop shortly after noon, and a second victim was found in a nearby parking lot, the school said in a statement. There were witnesses to the shooting.



THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A ROUTINE TRAFFIC STOP

[fordtruckin]

so the gun free only applies to criminals and the students then?

and your point is? When you get a CCW there are rules about where you can and can not carry. Schools are one of those places as are Banks, Federal Facilities, Bars ect.... Police obviously would be exempt from that.

[Jamie Black R/T]

and your point is? When you get a CCW there are rules about where you can and can not carry. Schools are one of those places as are Banks, Federal Facilities, Bars ect.... Police obviously would be exempt from that.

i was asking what gun free could possibly mean.....your answer is it means nothing that was not already established by carry laws.

thanks.

[fordtruckin]

i was asking what gun free could possibly mean.....your answer is it means nothing that was not already established by carry laws.

thanks.

ok so restate your question so that a normal person can understand what your asking? Your question sounds more like a statement.

[eastcoast]

does your own personal questions about the gun registry have anything to do with this shooting?

[FishingMOM]

Gun free. Means only law enforcement may carry a weapon.


Ford was trying to tell you that there are a number of places that legal gun owners can not take a gun. Those include Airports, Banks and Schools. However Police officers are exempt from these regulations!

[Jamie Black R/T]

ok so restate your question so that a normal person can understand what your asking? Your question sounds more like a statement.

so the gun free only applies to criminals and the students then?

its a pretty damn simple question.....every forum this is posted on people are going on about how making this school gun free did nothing....my understanding is the school was always gun free.

im not trying to make a political statement at all...it was a legitimate question....either you severely lack in reading comprehension or you were just assuming i was trying to make a point, and went on the defensive.

understandable given the behavior on this board over the years.

anyway! back on topic.

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/12/08/reports-of-shots-fired-at-virginia-tech/?hpt=hp_t3

[huntinstuff]

Gun Free. Hmmmm
Appears the criminal did not care.

CCW should be anywhere/anytime. Wherever there are people, CCW should be valid. And in places where there are no people too.....

[Rod1960]

A manhunt that locked down Virginia Tech University came to an end today when police indicated that a gunman who ambushed a cop on the campus later died of gunshot wounds.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/virginia-tech-shooter-believed-dead-lock-lifted/story?id=15114257

Police: Va. Tech shooter not person pulled over

BLACKSBURG, Va. (AP) — A gunman walked into a parking lot and killed a Virginia Tech police officer who was conducting a traffic stop on campus Thursday, state police said.

Sgt. Robert Carpentieri said it appeared that the shooter was not in the car that had been pulled over. The sergeant said another officer later spotted a second person in a different parking lot who was alive at the time. That person, a white man, later died of a gunshot wound.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5ismXTry-2cUs_Ul9e3pUhpStsjfA?docId=632e886b54e845d196fb7ee fc27a19fb

[eastcoast]

Gun Free. Hmmmm
Appears the criminal did not care.

CCW should be anywhere/anytime. Wherever there are people, CCW should be valid. And in places where there are no people too.....

jails,churches,elementary schools,little leagues,the mall?

[honda450]

.


Ford was trying to tell you that there are a number of places that legal gun owners can not take a gun. Those include Airports, Banks and Schools. However Police officers are exempt from these regulations!

Dang and where do most of these mass shootings occur. Why......... schools of course. Nobody can defend themselves or others. Many innocent people die for this reason.

[eastcoast]

Dang and where do most of these mass shootings occur. Why......... schools of course. Nobody can defend themselves or others. Many innocent people die for this reason.

so you would be totally comfortable with your kids kidnegarten teacher packing a 357 on his/her hip while teaching?

[honda450]

so you would be totally comfortable with your kids kidnegarten teacher packing a 357 on his/her hip while teaching?

Depends what her hips looked like. hehehe

Most of these shootings eastcoast are made at the college level not at the grade school level.

[Rod1960]

jails,churches,elementary schools,little leagues,the mall?

Works for me. Add to that grocery stores, the doctors office, movie theaters and grandma's house.

[eastcoast]

Works for me. Add to that grocery stores, the doctors office, movie theaters and grandma's house.

private businesses can restrict anything or anybody they want from entering.

[huntinstuff]

jails,churches,elementary schools,little leagues,the mall?

Yes. Everywhere. What good is a gun if you need it and it's at home?

[eastcoast]

Yes. Everywhere. What good is a gun if you need it and it's at home?

so absolutely everywhere? no restriction at all?

[bowhunter9841]

Gun Free. Hmmmm
Appears the criminal did not care.

CCW should be anywhere/anytime. Wherever there are people, CCW should be valid. And in places where there are no people too.....

Gun control is in place to keep people working! If everyone had a right to carry a concealed weapon, the crime rates would drop like crazy, criminals would no longer be "safe" to do whatever they want to the helpless victims! And the police would no longer be needed! We live in a place where you can't protect yourself until it's already too late!

Honestly, if someone breaks into my house, and I call the police, that's at least 5 minutes till a police cruiser will be there. If I go grab my gun from the cabinet, that's about 1 minute! Hmmm... What will make my family
Safe quicker???? Gun laws are a joke! And so is our justice system! I

[huntinstuff]

so you would be totally comfortable with your kids kidnegarten teacher packing a 357 on his/her hip while teaching?

Yup. And when some a-hole came into the school with a knife or machete and tried to kill kids, Id expect that teacher to shoot him 4 times in the chest and kill him.

[eastcoast]

Yup. And when some a-hole came into the school with a knife or machete and tried to kill kids, Id expect that teacher to shoot him 4 times in the chest and kill him.

I would suspect there is much more of a chance of an accidental shooting than somebody coming into the classroom and killing anybody.

[huntinstuff]

so absolutely everywhere? no restriction at all?

Yes. Anywhere. Buy a stainless for when you shower too. Anywgere and everywhere.

If a business wants no guns, that is their right.

[honda450]

so you would be totally comfortable with your kids kidnegarten teacher packing a 357 on his/her hip while teaching?

Most of these shootings eastcoast are at a high school/college level not a grade school level.

[eastcoast]

Yes. Anywhere. Buy a stainless for when you shower too. Anywgere and everywhere.

If a business wants no guns, that is their right.

the problems with absolutes is they leave no discretion or common sense at all, this isn't a black and white world just all different shades of grey,should a school teacher have a firearm on them at all times? probably not too much of a chance of accidental handling/shooting, now should someone in the school have a gun incase something happens that's a different case altogether.

[eastcoast]

Most of these shootings eastcoast are at a high school/college level not a grade school level.

sure but you guys say anywhere im just testing that theory, it's easy to say everywhere not so easy to make decisions on sensitive places like elementary schools where the risk/reward is different than say at a college.

[huntinstuff]

I would suspect there is much more of a chance of an accidental shooting than somebody coming into the classroom and killing anybody.

You could be right. I dont know any stats on that.

If you ccw, it comes with responsibility. I have been carrying concealed for 12 years. Never lost a gun or citizen. No negligent discharges, no accidents, nothing. And Im relatively simple

If i can do it, so can pretty much anyone else

Its just a tool. Just gotta learn how to use it. No magic

[leeaspell]

You can leave yours at home so you dont accidentally shoot someone or offend someone. Hopefully when your getting held up in an ally by some crackhead with a gun there is a guy with his ccw and 45 on his hip who will step in and save ur azz lol

[honda450]

You could be right. I dont know any stats on that.

If you ccw, it comes with responsibility. I have been carrying concealed for 12 years. Never lost a gun or citizen. No negligent discharges, no accidents, nothing. And Im relatively simple

If i can do it, so can pretty much anyone else

Its just a tool. Just gotta learn how to use it. No magic

Right on.

[eastcoast]

You could be right. I dont know any stats on that.

If you ccw, it comes with responsibility. I have been carrying concealed for 12 years. Never lost a gun or citizen. No negligent discharges, no accidents, nothing. And Im relatively simple

If i can do it, so can pretty much anyone else

for the record I am not against ccw just testing how far people are willing to go when they say "anywhere".

if someone wants a gun or 20 guns in their house that's fine with me,a private business can choose whatever they want cause it's their right,public institutions that's where it gets sticky,schools are public but some are private,some are for kids and some are for adults,that's where the "anywhere" can be sticky.

does ccw stop shootings from happening? maybe depends on who you listen to, there are shootings in ststes that have them and shootings in those that don't have them,are the states that have them more or less violent? how many cases have there been where a good citizen has stepped in and stopped a shooting?

[huntinstuff]

for the record I am not against ccw just testing how far people are willing to go when they say "anywhere".

if someone wants a gun or 20 guns in their house that's fine with me,a private business can choose whatever they want cause it's their right,public institutions that's where it gets sticky,schools are public but some are private,some are for kids and some are for adults,that's where the "anywhere" can be sticky.

does ccw stop shootings from happening? maybe depends on who you listen to, there are shootings in ststes that have them and shootings in those that don't have them,are the states that have them more or less violent? how many cases have there been where a good citizen has stepped in and stopped a shooting?

I totally get where u are coming from

Not everyone would ccw. Some would every day, then get tired of it, then just ccw once in a while. Some would only ccw when they travel or go to the mall. Some would buy the gun and never ccw.

I doubt a teacher would wear a 357. Probably a .25 or .32 nice and light on their belt. Heavy guns are not great to pack around.

Few people would ccw all the time. Very few.

[huntinstuff]

I dont know if ccw would prevent shootings, but it might stop them faster.

Sometimes just having a gun in your hand diffuses a situation. Ive done that dozens of times. Doesnt have to be fired.

[eastcoast]

I dont know if ccw would prevent shootings, but it might stop them faster.

Sometimes just having a gun in your hand diffuses a situation. Ive done that dozens of times. Doesnt have to be fired.

that's true on a personal level I am all for ccw, and at my house I also agree with ccw, when it comes to being at certain places that's where it gets sticky for me.

[huntinstuff]

that's true on a personal level I am all for ccw, and at my house I also agree with ccw, when it comes to being at certain places that's where it gets sticky for me.

And that is totally valid. Some would not be comfortable with ccw in certain places.

[eastcoast]

And that is totally valid. Some would not be comfortable with ccw in certain places.

I would like to know why this thread turned into this? I guess this is an outdoorsmen forum and all, but 2 people are dead what does that have to do with canadian gun laws and what we feel should happen, let the bodies go cold at least til we turn this into a "we should" thread.

[greylynx]

so absolutely everywhere? no restriction at all?

Take a vacation throught the southwestern states.

[eastcoast]

Take a vacation throught the southwestern states.

they can't carry guns in certain places either.

[fordtruckin]

its a pretty damn simple question.....every forum this is posted on people are going on about how making this school gun free did nothing....my understanding is the school was always gun free.

im not trying to make a political statement at all...it was a legitimate question....either you severely lack in reading comprehension or you were just assuming i was trying to make a point, and went on the defensive.

understandable given the behavior on this board over the years.

anyway! back on topic.

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/12/08/reports-of-shots-fired-at-virginia-tech/?hpt=hp_t3

Chill man I'm not tryin to argue I just didn't get your question. (Sorry it came across that way my bad, I've been in a bitchy mood all day....and I know it don't make it right so my apologies) Schools are gun free, Just like schools are "Drug free". Just like the registry in Canada prevents crime and we could go on and on. On paper it looks good but in reality it doesn't do anything. I carry everyday. Part of it is for the job, the other part I carry because I choose. Due to my profession I am allowed to carry in places many people are not. Despite the fact I carry I have been lucky in the fact I've never been in a situation where I felt the need to show my cards. All I know is if you draw you better damn be ready to use it. Don't count on the fact you present a gun makes the bad guy go running...

I also understand why they don't let you carry in certian places and don't get why you can't carry in others. For example why can't you carry in a Post Office? I understand bars and while your drinking ect... So far the only thing I've been able to come up with is if you do commit a crime in one of those "prohibited" locations it just adds another charge on the laundry list of things your gunna be arrested for...

As for carrying in your own house or business usually you are not required to get a CCW as its your property, of course thats dependant upon the specific states and there are only a few against it...

[Hun-Ter]

That's certainly not good news. But.... I thought VT was a "gun free" zone? :confused:

Every school property - including parking lots in the US are "gun free zone"
It's also a criminal act to commit homicide. Maybe the killer didn't know that, or just didn't care... either way it was the gun's fault since gun kill people - at least according to liberals....

[raven-li]

I dont know if ccw would prevent shootings, but it might stop them faster.

Sometimes just having a gun in your hand diffuses a situation. Ive done that dozens of times. Doesnt have to be fired.

And there are plenty of situations where gun in hand escalated situation.

[Scott N]

And there are plenty of situations where gun in hand escalated situation.

So, you're saying that it's better to just be a sheep and take the bullet to your head that's coming? Like in Norway?

[eastcoast]

So, you're saying that it's better to just be a sheep and take the bullet to your head that's coming? Like in Norway?

the murder rate in norway is much lower than the usa,dam socialists.:argue2:

[Pudelpointer]

Fordtruckin, you are not allowed to open/ccw in Post Offices because they are considered "Federal" property.

As for Eastcoast's question "everywhere?". Yes. Everywhere. If an individual can be trusted to carry in public, what possible difference could the location make? I guess being surrounded by screaming 8 year olds all day might make one a bit twitchy, but what is your fear? The kids will hang up on the teacher and steal their firearm?

The restriction I do agree with is a prohibition on consuming alcohol or drugs while carrying. Does that mean carry should be prohibited in establishments that serve alcohol, or do we leave the responsibility with the permit holder? I suggest clear rules and self-responsibility will do more to protect people than a list of no go locations.

But then again, I am a Canadian, so what do I know?

[CentIt3]

This is insane. Why are people so f---ked up?

[eastcoast]

Fordtruckin, you are not allowed to open/ccw in Post Offices because they are considered "Federal" property.

As for Eastcoast's question "everywhere?". Yes. Everywhere. If an individual can be trusted to carry in public, what possible difference could the location make? I guess being surrounded by screaming 8 year olds all day might make one a bit twitchy, but what is your fear? The kids will hang up on the teacher and steal their firearm?

The restriction I do agree with is a prohibition on consuming alcohol or drugs while carrying. Does that mean carry should be prohibited in establishments that serve alcohol, or do we leave the responsibility with the permit holder? I suggest clear rules and self-responsibility will do more to protect people than a list of no go locations.

But then again, I am a Canadian, so what do I know?

:thinking-006:

[Pudelpointer]

:thinking-006:

Okay. Thanks for the thoughtful response.

Maybe try stringing some words together.

[eastcoast]

Okay. Thanks for the thoughtful response.

Maybe try stringing some words together.

everywhere means everywhere,any restrictions and that wouldn't be everywhere.

I have a totally white house,well except for that one black wall ouside:thinking-006:

[Pudelpointer]

everywhere means everywhere,any restrictions and that wouldn't be everywhere.

I have a totally white house,well except for that one black wall ouside:thinking-006:

Try reading it again. I said the restriction against CONSUMING alcohol.... is there a town called "Consuming"?

[eastcoast]

Try reading it again. I said the restriction against CONSUMING alcohol.... is there a town called "Consuming"?

everywhere is an absolute, what you should have said was most places except where alcohol is served.

you can's say everywhere but,it's either everywhere or not.

[Pudelpointer]

everywhere is an absolute, what you should have said was most places except where alcohol is served.

you can's say everywhere but,it's either everywhere or not.

Holy smoke Eastcoast. Read. I state that "I" believe that carry in drinking establishments be allowed as well, as long as you don't drink.

Apologies are graciously accepted....

[eastcoast]

Holy smoke Eastcoast. Read. I state that "I" believe that carry in drinking establishments be allowed as well, as long as you don't drink.

Apologies are graciously accepted....

most people go to drinking establishments to not drink:test:

it's either everywhere or not, im not arguing with your opinon just choice of words,terms like everywhere,always,never,favorite are absolute terms with no exceptions.

[Pudelpointer]

most people go to drinking establishments to not drink:test:

it's either everywhere or not, im not arguing with your opinon just choice of words,terms like everywhere,always,never,favorite are absolute terms with no exceptions.

Not sure how much clearer I can make it for you Eastcoast, but here goes:

If properly licensed, you should be allowed to carry everywhere (schools, court houses, churches, pubs), all the time (as in 24/7), as long as you are not under the influence of alcohol or drugs (zero tolerance or legal limit - I'll let you decide.
Any questions?

[eastcoast]

Not sure how much clearer I can make it for you Eastcoast, but here goes:

If properly licensed, you should be allowed to carry everywhere (schools, court houses, churches, pubs), all the time (as in 24/7), as long as you are not under the influence of alcohol or drugs (zero tolerance or legal limit - I'll let you decide.
Any questions?

well that's alot clearer than your previous post, one question where do you put your gun after you had a few too many?

[Pudelpointer]

well that's alot clearer than your previous post, one question where do you put your gun after you had a few too many?

Easy, just like planning for a ride home, if you are going to the pub to drink, leave your pistola at home.

Fwiw I have gone to the pub a fair number of times when I didn't have a drink. If my CcW permit was on the line I sure as hell wouldn't chance it. It's called being responsible.