I hate barbed hooks

[conan]

I was out ice fishing with a new fishing buddy going after walleye and things were slow so I decided to hop on my quad and try out some different areas. When I returned he had rigged up a tip up of mine and a pike grabbed it shortly after, when I pulled the pike up I noticed that the treble was barbed. I had a bugger of a time getting those stupid barbs out. barbless are so so much better. Yes I gave him a slap on the noodle and no I did not report him.:snapoutofit:

[huntsfurfish]

I hate the barbed hook law:)

[Hellraiser]

"I hate the barbed hook law"


I agree. I do not believe that fishing barbless will improve fish mortality rates anymore than when using a barbed hook.

[Lefty-Canuck]

Did you hear that......?

......sounded like a can of worms......

LC :)

[pickrel pat]

"I hate the barbed hook law"


I agree. I do not believe that fishing barbless will improve fish mortality rates anymore than when using a barbed hook.

reread posters story......... duh.....

[MoFugger21]

I hate the barbed hook law:)

[ ] Is serious
[x] Sarcasm

"I hate the barbed hook law"


I agree. I do not believe that fishing barbless will improve fish mortality rates anymore than when using a barbed hook.

[ ] Picked up on the sarcasm
[x] Will get flamed for the above statement


:party0052:

[wetdream]

"I hate the barbed hook law"


I agree. I do not believe that fishing barbless will improve fish mortality rates anymore than when using a barbed hook.

yes, because ripping and twisting the hooks out with a lot of force couldn't possibly damage the fishes mouth or gills. In fact, it's exactly the same as a barbless hook. A barbed hook slides out of the mouth soooo easily....SARCASM ALERT!!!:fighting0030::)

[fishslayer420]

not only is barbless bettr for the fish,its more of a challenge to catch them... barbs are for babies

[horsetrader]

I can see the horse coming out soon ......:)

[huntsfurfish]

[ ] Is serious
[x] Sarcasm



[ ] Picked up on the sarcasm
[x] Will get flamed for the above statement


:party0052:



Actually serious, but that is no secret with me.:)
No scientific evidence to support it.
Bait ban would have made more sense.
Useless law. No basis. Not a popular law. :argue2:

[TyreeUM]

Actually serious, but that is no secret with me.:)
No scientific evidence to support it.
Bait ban would have made more sense.
Useless law. No basis. Not a popular law. :argue2:

no scientific evidence to support it? what? There have been numerous studies...

[horsetrader]

I always just figured it if you learn how to fish barbs arn't needed.
I don't miss them at all find it a lot easier for me and the fish...

[pickrel pat]

Actually serious, but that is no secret with me.:)
No scientific evidence to support it.
Bait ban would have made more sense.
Useless law. No basis. Not a popular law. :argue2:

:bad_boys_20: :sign0161:

[huntsfurfish]

no scientific evidence to support it? what? There have been numerous studies...

nothing really conclusive

[huntsfurfish]

Bait ban would have done more.

[WCTHEMI]

Speaking from my experience, a barbless hook is way easier to remove than one with those stupid barbs on it. Seems like a no-brainer to me that is would be "easier" on the fish as well.

[TyreeUM]

nothing really conclusive

Yes, your right - it is far from cut and dry. I have spent quite a bit of time reading articles on this subject as I am trying to decide where my vote goes for the current regs in Saskatchewan. For every article that supports barbless, there is one that concludes there is no difference. The one thing that thing that all articles agree on though is CPUE is always lower with barbless. (catch per unit effort)

[TyreeUM]

on a side note - barbless hooks means less hook extraction in the ER, which means less government money spent on healthcare. It's a government conspiracy!

[Kokanee9]

..................The one thing that thing that all articles agree on though is CPUE is always lower with barbless. (catch per unit effort)

Good that you have actually taken the time and effort to research this. I can't say the same for myself unfortunately.

I believe that the CPUE that you refer to, also results in better rod handling skills after a couple have been lost.

[highwood]

Regardless of conclusive evidence, there is no way anyone can claim that barbless would be worse than barbed. Intuitively, it makes sense. Use your brains gentlemen. If you can honestly tell me it is easier to dig a treble hook with barbs out of a deeply hooked fishes throat compared to a barbless hook...you're nothing more than a liar.

[ericlin0122]

I hate treble hooks. It's even much lamer than single barb hook.

[flyguyd]

Regardless of conclusive evidence, there is no way anyone can claim that barbless would be worse than barbed. Intuitively, it makes sense. Use your brains gentlemen. If you can honestly tell me it is easier to dig a treble hook with barbs out of a deeply hooked fishes throat compared to a barbless hook...you're nothing more than a liar.

If you have to dig a treble hook out of the back of the fishes throat, the argument over barbed and barbless would be redundant . Its probly gonna die anyway:thinking-006:

[CamoDerrick]

Barbless is sure nice when you snag your clothing though.

[MoFugger21]

Actually serious, but that is no secret with me.:)
No scientific evidence to support it.
Bait ban would have made more sense.
Useless law. No basis. Not a popular law. :argue2:

O.....

:sad0071:

[New Hunter Okotoks]

Hookless would be really good for the fish and much more challenging. I think that's the way I've been fishing this year from the results I have achieved.

[highwood]

Hookless would be really good for the fish and much more challenging. I think that's the way I've been fishing this year from the results I have achieved.

Classic!

[Rockymtnx]

Stick a barbed hook 1/4" into your arm. Then stick a barbless hook 1/4" into your arm. Tell me which one comes out easier.

I am all for barbless hooks. I have learned to fish with them and think its the only way to go!

[Mike_W]

Stick a barbed hook 1/4" into your arm. Then stick a barbless hook 1/4" into your arm. Tell me which one comes out easier.

I am all for barbless hooks. I have learned to fish with them and think its the only way to go!

Exactly !!

[Isopod]

I support barbless. Might not make much difference to a whitefish that tends to take hooks lightly in the lip, but something like pike that often inhale hooks deeply, barbless hooks are much, much easier on the fish. I just wish they were more available in stores because using a Dremel to remove barbs gets tedious. Or when they are available in stores, I wish they weren't priced double or triple the price of barbed hooks.

[Springer]

Not only am i for Barbless especially when fishing for Pike , using those big Rapalas i also remove the middle treble and cut 1 of the 3 hooks hooks from the front and back hook because i dont like performing surgery to remove these hooks that Northern Pike like to inhale like candy..
Good on ya for educating your buddy Conan.

[pike_king780]

not only is barbless bettr for the fish,its more of a challenge to catch them... barbs are for babies

X2.. I agree!

[huntsfurfish]

Regardless of conclusive evidence, there is no way anyone can claim that barbless would be worse than barbed. Intuitively, it makes sense. Use your brains gentlemen. If you can honestly tell me it is easier to dig a treble hook with barbs out of a deeply hooked fishes throat compared to a barbless hook...you're nothing more than a liar.

Actually there may be. There is talk and maybe some evidence to show that barbless is worse. Barbless hooks do penetrate further possibly leading to higher mortallity rates.:) You maybe shouldnt be digging any hooks out of a throat! See more people digging for hooks that should be left now too. And I have dug barbed hooks out of me. Same rule applies, quick twist with pliers and its out! Whose the babies now:)LOL

[huntsfurfish]

So how many of you barbless fans would be in favour of going baitless? Other than fly fishermen.




Ya thats what I thought.

[npauls]

So how many of you barbless fans would be in favour of going baitless? Other than fly fishermen.




Ya thats what I thought.

All baits or just real baits?

If it was just real and you could still use plastics then I would do my best to make it work.

[braxxtonn]

Barbless hooks are bull****!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[TyreeUM]

I fish barbless 99% of the time for several reasons and I am sure one of them is that I feel better about catch and release fishing using barbless, regardless of whether there is a current study that shows statistically significant evidence that barbless results in less mortality. I guess my question is why fish barbless? If it is a matter of loosing fish, it should only take a few lost fish to help understand that your technique needs improving. So again, why fish barbed in the first place?

[lone wolf]

I guess my question is why fish barbless? If it is a matter of loosing fish, it should only take a few lost fish to help understand that your technique needs improving. So again, why fish barbed in the first place?

Couldn't agree more. The use of barbless hooks hasn't prevented salmon anglers on the West Coast from putting tens of thousands of salmon in their fish tubs every summer. We took our biggest Chinook (50 lbs) on a single barbless, with no concerns. It also makes the release so much easier.

[horsetrader]

Actually there may be. There is talk and maybe some evidence to show that barbless is worse. Barbless hooks do penetrate further possibly leading to higher mortallity rates.:) You maybe shouldnt be digging any hooks out of a throat! See more people digging for hooks that should be left now too. And I have dug barbed hooks out of me. Same rule applies, quick twist with pliers and its out! Whose the babies now:)LOL

I don't think there is any scientific evidence as to wether a hook should be left in or taken out. So we're back at the beginning again ....:)

[hunter49]

You maybe shouldnt be digging any hooks out of a throat! See more people digging for hooks that should be left now too.

Please don't tell me you are one of the fisherman leaving hooks inside a fish when it is hooked deep. The hooks do not rust out, so try your best to get it out.:angry3:

I fish in Ontario every summer and use barbed hooks. If you know how to properly unhook a fish, barbed hooks are no worse on fish. If you twist on the hooks and rip their face off then obviously it is worse on the fish. But most likely the people who do this would do the same with barbless hooks. When fishing single hooks (jig) barbed I can usually pop it out with my finger...no harm done!

[Swolf]

I think they should ban the use of 2 treble hooks on one lure.

Lear how to fish and barbs are no longer required!

[Jamie Black R/T]

Learn how to fish and barbs are no longer required!

thats a pretty rude statement...sure to ruffle feathers....too bad its true!

Remember the days where you could head out on the ice and tell where guys had success because there was patches of blood left near the holes?

you dont see much of that anymore...barbless hooks are a great thing IMO....we were pinching barbs for years before it was law, especially on the double or triple hooked crankbaits...those things are a PITA with barbs.

[kevinhits]

Barbless is sure nice when you snag your clothing though.

or your skin...LOL

[spopadyn]

Stick a barbed hook 1/4" into your arm. Then stick a barbless hook 1/4" into your arm. Tell me which one comes out easier.

I am all for barbless hooks. I have learned to fish with them and think its the only way to go!

Nice story but, real scientific studies have proven that in "catch and release" fisheries barbed is far better for fish, not worse? Care to guess why? We all know that when you are fishing barbless it takes more time and skill to land a fish- thats the problem - the time to land the fish! The quicker you can get a fish off your line with pliers the faster it can recover. I have salmon fished a ton and I will tell you what - barbed hooks would really help if you were doing catch and release (most bigger salmon will fight to the death). Besdies, the only reason we have this law is Ralph Klien salmon fished at his lodge and thought it would be a great idea for Alberta - not!

[Kokanee9]

Hookless would be really good for the fish and much more challenging. I think that's the way I've been fishing this year from the results I have achieved.

Not one fish was harmed prior to writing this post!

[spopadyn]

Couldn't agree more. The use of barbless hooks hasn't prevented salmon anglers on the West Coast from putting tens of thousands of salmon in their fish tubs every summer. We took our biggest Chinook (50 lbs) on a single barbless, with no concerns. It also makes the release so much easier.

You are wrong - need to look at the UBC studies - barbless is not better for fish being released.

[CamoDerrick]

Nice story but, real scientific studies have proven that in "catch and release" fisheries barbed is far better for fish, not worse? Care to guess why? We all know that when you are fishing barbless it takes more time and skill to land a fish- thats the problem - the time to land the fish! The quicker you can get a fish off your line with pliers the faster it can recover. I have salmon fished a ton and I will tell you what - barbed hooks would really help if you were doing catch and release (most bigger salmon will fight to the death). Besdies, the only reason we have this law is Ralph Klien salmon fished at his lodge and thought it would be a great idea for Alberta - not!

Sounds like you want to target the people that hold the fish out of the water for 10 min while taking pictures, rather than the barbed vs barbless debate. Landing a fish quickly is not better for the fish if you do not release it right away.

[spopadyn]

Sounds like you want to target the people that hold the fish out of the water for 10 min while taking pictures, rather than the barbed vs barbless debate. Landing a fish quickly is not better for the fish if you do not release it right away.

Just making a coment on those who claim to have read the studies but didn't. You are right - if you have no intention of releasing a fish - obviously a barbed hook will be worse for the fish! And yes, it is my pet peeve all the posed for pictures with fish to be released. I love watching the fishing guides who release fish by never netting and using a quick flick of the pliers. Those shows on WFN where they take pictures then measure the fish and hold it up for all to see - man that is so annoying. Either kill it or let it go but throwing a fish belly side up in the water is not catch and release!

[Jamie Black R/T]

We all know that when you are fishing barbless it takes more time and skill to land a fish- thats the problem

i would ask you not include me under that "ALL" blanket....if you want to muscle a fish to the boat it makes no difference whether the hook is barbed or not

[Bhflyfisher]

and some people wonder why others are stupid enough to assume a brook trout is a brown trout.....

Just goes to show how educated our angling community is.

:scared:

[spopadyn]

and some people wonder why others are stupid enough to assume a brook trout is a brown trout.....

Just goes to show how educated our angling community is.

:scared:

Really? What are you even trying to say? Your comment demonstartes a lack of education and a lack of being on topic. Maybe you can explain it better...

[spopadyn]

i would ask you not include me under that "ALL" blanket....if you want to muscle a fish to the boat it makes no difference whether the hook is barbed or not

Stop yappin - you make no sense! If you can horse a fish to the boat quickly, they have a much larger chance of survival on being released. Nobody in there right mind would even doubt that. If you are one of those guys that likes to reel a fish in slowly and play around with them, well, frankly, you should really be for barbed hooks. You imply that muscling a fish to the boat is somehow "bad" for a fish - nothing could be further from the truth - just look at all the studies done by the universities and you will suddenly get educated!

[fishpro]

Nice story but, real scientific studies have proven that in "catch and release" fisheries barbed is far better for fish, not worse? Care to guess why? We all know that when you are fishing barbless it takes more time and skill to land a fish- thats the problem - the time to land the fish! The quicker you can get a fish off your line with pliers the faster it can recover. I have salmon fished a ton and I will tell you what - barbed hooks would really help if you were doing catch and release (most bigger salmon will fight to the death). Besdies, the only reason we have this law is Ralph Klien salmon fished at his lodge and thought it would be a great idea for Alberta - not!

Okay, I have to reply to this post, as there are a few things I can comment on.

First of all, scientific studies do not prove things, they support ideas but do not prove them. Making a statement like you did definitely takes away some credibility from your post.

Secondly, we don't all know that it takes more time to land a fish with barbless hooks. I know that it is just as quick for me to land a fish with a barbless hook as a barbed one due to the fact I must keep tension on the fish at all times.

So the fish comes in just as quick, and I find it quicker to unhook them with barbless hooks.

Can you please explain the reason that barbed hooks would help the salmon on the west coast? How would it make the fighting time lower?

[Jamie Black R/T]

Stop yappin - you make no sense! If you can horse a fish to the boat quickly, they have a much larger chance of survival on being released. Nobody in there right mind would even doubt that. If you are one of those guys that likes to reel a fish in slowly and play around with them, well, frankly, you should really be for barbed hooks. You imply that muscling a fish to the boat is somehow "bad" for a fish - nothing could be further from the truth - just look at all the studies done by the universities and you will suddenly get educated!

your reading comprehension just plain sucks...i could not care less if you want to horse a fish into the boat or play him out on light tackle. My post discredits your claims that a barb somehow has a bearing on the final outcome. No university study will sway my opinion on that. Ive seen and felt it both ways and KNOW it makes no difference. Just like i know a semi-automatic rifle is no more dangerous than a bolt action. But i bet i can find a "study" that says otherwise!

If my post does not make sense to you try reading it with your "educated" hat on next time. :kick:

[TyreeUM]

Stop yappin - you make no sense! If you can horse a fish to the boat quickly, they have a much larger chance of survival on being released. Nobody in there right mind would even doubt that. If you are one of those guys that likes to reel a fish in slowly and play around with them, well, frankly, you should really be for barbed hooks. You imply that muscling a fish to the boat is somehow "bad" for a fish - nothing could be further from the truth - just look at all the studies done by the universities and you will suddenly get educated!

I would love to be educated by these university studies that prove barbed hooks are better for fish than barbless, could you please cite this study(s) that you are referring too? Thanks!

[highwood]

I would love to be educated by these university studies that prove barbed hooks are better for fish than barbless, could you please cite this study(s) that you are referring too? Thanks!

Indeed, let's see it

[catnthehat]

I haven't fished with barbs for over 30 years for a few reasons.
1: I can get the hook out a lot faster if releasing back to the water, I don't have to twist the heck out of the fish.
2: it is easier to take an unbarbed hook out of a friend
3: it's easier to take an unbarbed hook out of me
4: it's easier for a kid to get an unbarbed hook out of themselves.
5: It's easier to set an unbarbed hook because it takes less force.
6: Fishing barbless makes me concentrate more on keeping a tight line.
Cat

[huntsfurfish]

I haven't fished with barbs for over 30 years for a few reasons.
1: I can get the hook out a lot faster if releasing back to the water, I don't have to twist the heck out of the fish.
Little to no time difference, quick twist of pliers or forcepts, dont even have to touch the fish.
2: it is easier to take an unbarbed hook out of a friend
Quick twist with pliers hook is out.
3: it's easier to take an unbarbed hook out of me
Quick twist with pliers hook is out.
4: it's easier for a kid to get an unbarbed hook out of themselves.
Quick twist with pliers hook is out. but might concede this one
5: It's easier to set an unbarbed hook because it takes less force.
Also easier to drive hook into vital area due to ease of penetration and constant force from fight allows hooks to bury in.
6: Fishing barbless makes me concentrate more on keeping a tight line.
Keeping a tight line is what I strive for regardless of what hook/barb/barbless
Cat
7: Pain caused by having to squeeze down barb
8: Time spent pinching down barbs better spent actually fishing
9: Fear:) trying to remember if I pinched the barbs down.
10: Feel good law that likely has little to no impact anyway.

I think the barbed/barbless issue should have been left up to the individual!
And not rammed through by Klein and made a law.
jmho

[BeeGuy]

I support barbless hook policy.

I wish I could use them for whites when using small hooks though. Lose a lot due to them being barbless. Only for whites though, I don't find it makes much difference for other species, especially when you can still use 3 treble hooks on a line.

In the Bow you can use 3 trebles. In BC rivers you can only use single barbless...

[braxxtonn]

losing the fish of a lifetime becuase you had a babrless hook would also suck!!
my theory is that in alberta there are to many city boys that dont know how to take out a barbed hook, thats why it is the law, and in Bc there is to many ignorant albertans that come there so thats why it is the law there, :scared0018::scared0018:

[Bhflyfisher]

Really? What are you even trying to say? Your comment demonstartes a lack of education and a lack of being on topic. Maybe you can explain it better...

Make the comparison to the fact that some anglers dont fully understand regs. The arguments towards barbed hooks being less harmful then barbless is completely stupid. Similar to people assuming a type of char being a true trout. Its pretty straight forward information that is easily understood if you have any common sense. My argument is based on anglers having common sense, and I'm not seeing a whole lot of it on this thread.

Is that explained well enough for you?

[BeeGuy]

losing the fish of a lifetime becuase you had a babrless hook would also suck!!
my theory is that in alberta there are to many city boys that dont know how to take out a barbed hook, thats why it is the law, and in Bc there is to many ignorant albertans that come there so thats why it is the law there, :scared0018::scared0018:

hahahaha, what about the rest of the country?

[fishpro]

losing the fish of a lifetime becuase you had a babrless hook would also suck!!
my theory is that in alberta there are to many city boys that dont know how to take out a barbed hook, thats why it is the law, and in Bc there is to many ignorant albertans that come there so thats why it is the law there, :scared0018::scared0018:

How would you know it was because of a barbless hook though? Fish can be lost with barbed hooks too.

I know what you mean though, it would cause you to question if you could have landed it with a barbed hook.

[catnthehat]

7: Pain caused by having to squeeze down barb
8: Time spent pinching down barbs better spent actually fishing
9: Fear:) trying to remember if I pinched the barbs down.
10: Feel good law that likely has little to no impact anyway.

I think the barbed/barbless issue should have been left up to the individual!
And not rammed through by Klein and made a law.
jmho

Have you ever axctually tried that "quick twist with the pliers" thing on your self ?
I have , it's not the easy.
I takes a second for me to pinch down barbs.
And yes, I believe it should be left up to the individual, that is why I was using barbless long before the law was inected.
Cat

[huntsfurfish]

Have you ever axctually tried that "quick twist with the pliers" thing on your self ?
I have , it's not the easy.
I takes a second for me to pinch down barbs.
And yes, I believe it should be left up to the individual, that is why I was using barbless long before the law was inected.
Cat

Actually I have, and it is very easy. Did it hurt, of course but only briefly, but is pain the issue. Nope

Just trying to make a point. I have never been against a regulation before this one(that I can recall). There was always science behind the decisions before.

I dont see to well and am nervous about getting a ticket so I probably spend more than a few seconds on each hook. I find that irratating when it serves no real purpose is all.

[madatter]

:argue2:Speaking from my experience, a barbless hook is way easier to remove than one with those stupid barbs on it. Seems like a no-brainer to me that is would be "easier" on the fish as well.

Gotta agree....
The 2 times I have been unfortunate enough to hook myself(before the barbless rule) myself and the attending ER physician both agreed it would have been much easier without the barbs!:)

Treble hooks and barbs are a nightmare!:scared0015:

[Mike_W]

So whats everyones argument as to why they like barbless?

I personally like the rule and I belive that more fish are saved in the long run by it.
Might not make the biggest difference with an educated angler but lets face it there are many youths and inexperienced anglers that fish and there are many situations to where a barbless hook is much much easier to remove than a barbed one would be. Not only the time it would take but the ripping and damage caused by a barb is much more significant with a barb.

Many of you say it doesnt take any longer or cause more damage I would like to have a two part challenge with you then. First one lets stick a treble deep in a pikes mouth with two out of three in the flesh let see who can get it out the fastest and see who causes less damage.
Second lets hook our arms just above the wrist through and through with a single octopus and see who can remove theres quicker and have less dammage and blood.

Of course you would be using barbs and I would be barbless.

Mike

[Jamie Black R/T]

Of course you would be using barbs and I would be barbless.

Mike

LOL the latest university study shows you aint gonna get any takers on that one!

[Bhflyfisher]

Actually I have, and it is very easy. Did it hurt, of course but only briefly, but is pain the issue. Nope

Just trying to make a point. I have never been against a regulation before this one(that I can recall). There was always science behind the decisions before.

I dont see to well and am nervous about getting a ticket so I probably spend more than a few seconds on each hook. I find that irratating when it serves no real purpose is all.

I don't think pain is the real issue here. Put a barbless hook into yourself and then a barbed pull each of them out and compare the damage done. They both might hurt the same but the barb definitely causes more damage. The twist and pull method might work but it definitely causes more damage to the fish appearance, and if you're trying the twist and pull from deep within the throat of the fish, it would cause more damage to the sensitive tissues then a simple barbless hook would cause.

[greylynx]

hahahaha, what about the rest of the country?

What is like in the rest of the country?

Alberta would not go barbless until the social pressure became to great.

I like barbs, but follow the dumb law.

Where are those guys from Newfoundland when we need them?

[WillyOneStyle]

It's easier to shake a barbless out of a tree.....

[BobLoblaw]

What is like in the rest of the country?

Alberta would not go barbless until the social pressure became to great.

I like barbs, but follow the dumb law.

Where are those guys from Newfoundland when we need them?

Be careful what you ask for...:)

I used to be a Newfie.
I've been fishing barbless since my first fishing trip to the Fernie area. This was before Alberta went barbless. I followed the "barbless hooks only" law for flowing waters out there, & quickly realized it made releasing fish so much easier, and had very little effect on landing percentages (if you know what you're doing).

[greylynx]

Be careful what you ask for...:)

I used to be a Newfie.
I've been fishing barbless since my first fishing trip to the Fernie area. This was before Alberta went barbless. I followed the "barbless hooks only" law for flowing waters out there, & quickly realized it made releasing fish so much easier, and had very little effect on landing percentages (if you know what you're doing).

I come from the old school where the studies showed the damage in terms of fish cortisol stress levels, slime loss, tissue damage, internal organ damage,
were not significant enough to warrant a barb versus barbless law. Then the super study came along, and there was a large public pressure for barbless.

I still have to find out if fishing is barbless. My two sporting clays shooting buddies from Newfoundland should be able to tell me. They are the ones who give me all the ammuntion to have fun with a couple of buys on the forum.:)

[huntsfurfish]

So whats everyones argument as to why they like barbless?

I personally like the rule and I belive that more fish are saved in the long run by it.
Might not make the biggest difference with an educated angler but lets face it there are many youths and inexperienced anglers that fish and there are many situations to where a barbless hook is much much easier to remove than a barbed one would be. Not only the time it would take but the ripping and damage caused by a barb is much more significant with a barb.

Many of you say it doesnt take any longer or cause more damage I would like to have a two part challenge with you then. First one lets stick a treble deep in a pikes mouth with two out of three in the flesh let see who can get it out the fastest and see who causes less damage.
Second lets hook our arms just above the wrist through and through with a single octopus and see who can remove theres quicker and have less dammage and blood.

Of course you would be using barbs and I would be barbless.

Mike

First Trebles are a whole other issue. Trebbles are hard on fish, and so is bait. Do you use bait?

Second Is the barbless issue about fishermen hooking themselves?:)

Studies show there is no significant difference.

You pinch the barbs and feel it makes a difference, hence feel good law.:)

[highwood]

So is anyone on this thread going to quit blabbering and actually cite some literature that provides tested empirical evidence supporting either side of the issue? If not, then the horse has bean officially beaten to death.

[RACKER]

I learned my lesson the hard way not cutting off all the barbs on this Firetiger.Had to have it surgically removed after i cut the hook off in my arm!I still kept fishing for 5 hours after!

[catnthehat]

First Trebles are a whole other issue. Trebbles are hard on fish, and so is bait. Do you use bait?

Second Is the barbless issue about fishermen hooking themselves?:)

Studies show there is no significant difference.

You pinch the barbs and feel it makes a difference, hence feel good law.:)

I don't need a study, I have the history.
I've hooked myself three times in about 40 years, and once my younger brother got hooked.
I can tell you for sure that the times I got hooked wit the barbs on , they couldn't be taken our without a doctor's help.
The none time it did was when a small pikes shook it loos and buried an unbarbed hook into my thumb.
THAT ONE did come out without too much trouble by me.
Cat

[Mike_W]

First Trebles are a whole other issue. Trebbles are hard on fish, and so is bait. Do you use bait?

Second Is the barbless issue about fishermen hooking themselves?:)

Studies show there is no significant difference.

You pinch the barbs and feel it makes a difference, hence feel good law.:)

My point was not about hooking yourself it wa the ease of removing a barbless hook vs a barbed hook more damage is cause by a barbed hook no matter if it's to the fish, fisherman or clothing for that matter!
How can you honestly feel that less or similar damage is caused by barbed hooks than barbless....... Sounds like we have a deal? What's the winner get?

[michaelmicallef]

Alberta manages the people not the resourse. Thanks Ralph.

[huntsfurfish]

My point was not about hooking yourself it wa the ease of removing a barbless hook vs a barbed hook more damage is cause by a barbed hook no matter if it's to the fish, fisherman or clothing for that matter!
How can you honestly feel that less or similar damage is caused by barbed hooks than barbless....... Sounds like we have a deal? What's the winner get?

So no damage is done going in or when the fish trashes around and pulls to get away? Or now that there is no barb, penetration is deeper and can be fatal. Damage is already done.




Do you use bait or trebbles?



For those that do and wont answer that question. You are killing lots of fish.
Way more than someone using barbs. But yet it is barbless?
Feel good.

[huntsfurfish]

I don't need a study, I have the history.
I've hooked myself three times in about 40 years, and once my younger brother got hooked.
I can tell you for sure that the times I got hooked wit the barbs on , they couldn't be taken our without a doctor's help.
The none time it did was when a small pikes shook it loos and buried an unbarbed hook into my thumb.
THAT ONE did come out without too much trouble by me.
Cat


Why couldnt they?

Your right studies are useless.:);) Klein ignored them too.:)

[Freedom55]

Alberta manages the people not the resourse. Thanks Ralph.

...to an issue that has nothing what-so-ever to do with a past great leader of the province and every thing to do with ethical sportsmanship.

I, and others, have fished barbless for decades; BC went barbless and I caught salmon in the Queen Charlottes, as it was called then, on barbless teaspoon spinners or single hook roe bag/slip float fishing. Big salmon. In rivers, not off shore.

Alberta soon went to barbless (too bad about not going single barbless) and nothing changed, except I had to go through my whole tackle box and mash down the barbs on the balance of my lures.

Saskatchewan demands barbless in all catch and release waters, including slot size waters like the Saskatchewan River where the Vanity Cup is held. Imagine 160 boats with some touring pros and many semi-pros (pardon the pun) catching 10-16 pound walleyes on 6 lb line and size 12 barbless hooks. I have done it myself; last September I hooked onto more than a few trophy walleyes using 6lb fluoro and a single barbless #12 octopus hook, a leech and a borrowed super light rod/reel that was rigged for a right hander. I am a lefty and had to quickly learn to go "goofy-hand" to fight the fishes. Barbless tiny hook using a technique never tried before and feeling like a rock star because I did it! No whining about small tackle and light gear or any blaming of the government of the distant past for putting me in that situation!

There's the science. An actual laboratory experiment that worked as advertised, done by a qualified technician in a controlled environment that proves hands down that barbless works. Not to mention that since my first encounter with the new rule I had to mash the barbs on one small box of lures. Now I have three big boxes and several bags full of trays. I routinely tie 100 spinner rigs/ lindy rigs per season and not one barb in the mix.

More science. The kids that fish with us do not know the difference as they have never fished with a barbed hook, and manage as well as the next kid in learning how to land fish. We also teach patience and sportsmanship.
We rarely fish with people who think they are exempt from rules and when we do, we make a few subtle changes in their attitude or we put them ashore.

Get off your whinyhorse and give it an honest try. But do not evoke the name of Ralph Klein, or anybody else for that matter, in your pathetic attempt to blame someone else for your failings.

Free (to agree with the OP)

[Dale S]

My fishing partner is 75% blind. He gets lots of hooks stuck in himself.He likes the barbless rules he says way easyer to pull them out of himself.I've fished barbless before it was law. Don't care if I lose a couple of fish I hardly keep any.It can be the story about the big one that got away.

[Jamie Black R/T]

You are killing lots of fish.
Way more than someone using barbs

were you fishing when barbs were allowed?

ever unhook a walleye hooked in the throat with a barbed jig? or are you one of those guys who leaves the hook in there?

Ill admit...i complained about the "stupid" barbless law when they announced it....but it took me one season to realize it didnt hurt my success one bit and the fish i released were put back in the water faster and with much less trauma than one caught deep with a barbed hook.

im not sure how anyone who does any amount of fishing can dispute that...and i dont care to acknowledge a college professors studies as any more valid that my personal experiences on the subject...im the guy with scales and gill plate cuts all over his hands....not the guy in khakis behind a desk.

[Mike_W]

So no damage is done going in or when the fish trashes around and pulls to get away? Or now that there is no barb, penetration is deeper and can be fatal. Damage is already done.




Do you use bait or trebbles?



For those that do and wont answer that question. You are killing lots of fish.
Way more than someone using barbs. But yet it is barbless?
Feel good.

You are such a broken record.
I do not dispute the fact that barbless hooks cause damage to the fish also but the point was removing them and the damage caused then.
How do you figure that barbless penetrate deeper? Once your at the bend in the hook you cant penetrate any deeper!

I do fish with bait and trebbles rarely.
When I use bait its for walleye and perch both I keep for the frying pan anyway but I really dont find it gets fish any deeper in the mouth....as a matter of fact I cant even remember the last time I didnt have a nice lip hookset in the lips on either a perch or a walleye.

I fish barbless not to "feel good" but because I KNOW I have an easier time removing the hooks I also KNOW that the majority of the fish I release live because they spend minimal time out of the water and arnt bleeding anywhere.

Before you decide to reply (because I KNOW you will never let this go) why don't you find me a "study" that shows that fish are better off being caught with a barbed hook.

So you can "Feel Good"!

[highwood]

So the babble continues...still waiting for some peer reviewed literature....pony it up gentlemen

[Jack&7]

...im the guy with scales and gill plate cuts all over his hands....not the guy in khakis behind a desk.

I like that line. Well said.

Plus....khakis are stupid.

[TheLegend]

I suport barbless as well.

I did a experiment last summer. I fished using barbed hooks and barbless hooks. It is way easier to remove the barbless. Removing a barbed hooked involved having to hold the fish tightly and do a bit of twisting a ripping. It usually resulted in blood and tearing of flesh. Especially with the bigger hooks.

However I am somewhat for using barbed hooks when using tiny nymphs and dry flies. Like size 18 and up. That little barb is usually all that makes it possible to keep the fish on.

[Gust]

I will say one thing for a barbed hook, it keeps the hook at the first strike area of the mouth,,, I just got back into bait fishing and each inhale of the bait (Pike) merely takes a hook out and replaces it further and further back in the mouth.

[nekred]

I did not read all posts because there are many but there have been many studies done on this issu and in fact in one of my course in university I did a literature review on this issue about barbless hooks and mortality.... and the results were actually inconclusive...

Fish are more likely to die from poor handling than from bared or barbless hooks...

The funny thing is barbless hooks penetrate deeper and have a tendency to "saw" into fish while it is fighting...thus oenetrating deeper into the wound dring fight... especially single barbless whe Pressure is all on sigle point...

Now with barbed treble hookonce it is stuck it stays where it is and then for releasing of course it is more difficult but if one uses pliers and does not toch fish and can remove with simple twist from lip caught fish, barbed/no narbed, treble/single makes no difference...

Conversely a gill hooked fish, barbed/no barbed makes very little difference fish is majorly injured and while released safely often becomes prey to predators or parasites...

Now where the saving grace is that barbless hooks increase chances for "hook and release" thereby improving chances of hooked fished surviving and that is hard to get conclusive evidence on as well.

To me it is more of a political game... it is a way to allow people to fish with less chance of successfully landing a fish, until they gain the necessary experience to be able to be as proficient with a barbless hook as with a barbed hook.
In the meantime the fish stocks are less depleted with increased angler effort and thus more licenses sold!...

[Mike_W]

The funny thing is barbless hooks penetrate deeper and have a tendency to "saw" into fish while it is fighting...thus oenetrating deeper into the wound dring fight... especially single barbless whe Pressure is all on sigle point...


Maybe its just me but I am struggling to see how if that hook was barbed it wouldnt "saw" into the fish?

[fish gunner]

I tie my own flys ,some down to size 18.a fly that small fished with a barb may only last one fish,due to the difficulty of removal. the same fly fished barbless,may last a half dozen fish due to ease of removal.yes the odd fish may be lost useing barbless,but I can assure you that is no fault of the hook.
for me this is a no brainer,barbs are hard on fish hands down.who in the barbed camp wants to try taking a barbed hook out of a great white,theres a study I would like to be a witness to.

[AxeMan]

Here are my own personal observations after fishing many years with both barbed and barbless hooks:

Are barbless easier and quicker to remove from the fish with less damage? Yes
Do I lose more fish with barbless hooks? Yes
Can my super fishing skill prevent me from losing those fish? No
Am I okay with the barbless rules? Yes

All the other stuff is pretty subjective imho.

[Paul C]

Wondering if there is any studies done by SRD that have supported the barbless issue. The fish that take the hook down deep barbless of barbed does the same amount of damage.

[Gust]

Wondering if there is any studies done by SRD that have supported the barbless issue. The fish that take the hook down deep barbless of barbed does the same amount of damage.

That's kind of what I was getting at a few posts back,,, when a fish hits the bait with a barbed hook chances are it will stay at that part of the mouth but if it swims and double gulps with a barbless it just unhooks and works it's way more towards the throat. i'm a barbless beleiver but this ha puzzled me for awhile

[catnthehat]

Why couldnt they?

Your right studies are useless.:);) Klein ignored them too.:)

Becuase they were in too dam deep for me to get out.
My own findings were enough for me, and my kids learned to fish wit safety glasses on as well, is that a useless thing , too?
Cat

[AxeMan]

Gustav, no doubt in my mind that what you are describing happens. If I am fishing for trout with bait and a barbless hook and I let the fish take the bait for a while the hook is usually very deep or even down the hatch. I try to set the hook as soon I feel that the fish has my bait in its mouth. This more often than not reduces very deep hooking.

[Gust]

Gustav, no doubt in my mind that what you are describing happens. If I am fishing for trout with bait and a barbless hook and I let the fish take the bait for a while the hook is usually very deep or even down the hatch. I try to set the hook as soon I feel that the fish has my bait in its mouth. This more often than not reduces very deep hooking.

Trout is never a problem but pike in the fall, it has happened in view,, you'd figure that they'd spit it when reeling them in, maybe it's that reflex in their mouth???. It's not so much a problem for me as I use good quality long shank single hooks.

[Mike_W]

Once a fish is hooked barbed or barbless that hook ain't going to get " gulped" down any further.... There is just too much tension on the line!

[huntsfurfish]

...to an issue that has nothing what-so-ever to do with a past great leader of the province and every thing to do with ethical sportsmanship.

I, and others, have fished barbless for decades; BC went barbless and I caught salmon in the Queen Charlottes, as it was called then, on barbless teaspoon spinners or single hook roe bag/slip float fishing. Big salmon. In rivers, not off shore.

Alberta soon went to barbless (too bad about not going single barbless) and nothing changed, except I had to go through my whole tackle box and mash down the barbs on the balance of my lures.

Saskatchewan demands barbless in all catch and release waters, including slot size waters like the Saskatchewan River where the Vanity Cup is held. Imagine 160 boats with some touring pros and many semi-pros (pardon the pun) catching 10-16 pound walleyes on 6 lb line and size 12 barbless hooks. I have done it myself; last September I hooked onto more than a few trophy walleyes using 6lb fluoro and a single barbless #12 octopus hook, a leech and a borrowed super light rod/reel that was rigged for a right hander. I am a lefty and had to quickly learn to go "goofy-hand" to fight the fishes. Barbless tiny hook using a technique never tried before and feeling like a rock star because I did it! No whining about small tackle and light gear or any blaming of the government of the distant past for putting me in that situation!

There's the science. An actual laboratory experiment that worked as advertised, done by a qualified technician in a controlled environment that proves hands down that barbless works. Not to mention that since my first encounter with the new rule I had to mash the barbs on one small box of lures. Now I have three big boxes and several bags full of trays. I routinely tie 100 spinner rigs/ lindy rigs per season and not one barb in the mix.

More science. The kids that fish with us do not know the difference as they have never fished with a barbed hook, and manage as well as the next kid in learning how to land fish. We also teach patience and sportsmanship.
We rarely fish with people who think they are exempt from rules and when we do, we make a few subtle changes in their attitude or we put them ashore.

Get off your whinyhorse and give it an honest try. But do not evoke the name of Ralph Klein, or anybody else for that matter, in your pathetic attempt to blame someone else for your failings.

Free (to agree with the OP)

What you have posted is hardly "science", in fact actually hardly worth reading(a little insulting but then I look at the source:)).

I fish barbless, it is the law(albeit a useless one):).

Klein screwed up - get over it!:snapoutofit:

[huntsfurfish]

Becuase they were in too dam deep for me to get out.
My own findings were enough for me, and my kids learned to fish wit safety glasses on as well, is that a useless thing , too?
Cat

Sorry cat, I still think it should be the individuals choice rather than law when there is no conclusive evidence to support barbless.

And I also think it should be your choice on removal, I will remove my own hooks (barbed or barbless):);)

Safety of your kids is paramount.

Good fishin to you man!

[flyguyd]

Once a fish is hooked barbed or barbless that hook ain't going to get " gulped" down any further.... There is just too much tension on the line!


I wouldnt be so sure . Have ever hooked an acrobatic , frisky 5 lb rainbow on a barbless fly in fas****er. I fished barbless alot before the law came in and alot of the bigger fish were hooked in the corner of the mouth at release time but were bleeding from other places inside the mouth. This leads me to believe that the hook is coming out and hooking in somewheres else between hook set and release:thinking-006: Big frisky rainbows got lots of fight and even the best fisherman cant always keep up.

[catnthehat]

Sorry cat, I still think it should be the individuals choice rather than law when there is no conclusive evidence to support barbless.

And I also think it should be your choice on removal, I will remove my own hooks (barbed or barbless):);)

Safety of your kids is paramount.

Good fishin to you man!

if you look back i said that I could care less about the law and if it is a bad law or a good one, , I choose to use barbless hooks, and yes, it really should be up to the individual.


Personally I think there are far more reasons for fish mortality.
Cat

[huntsfurfish]

if you look back i said that I could care less about the law and if it is a bad law or a good one, , I choose to use barbless hooks, and yes, it really should be up to the individual.


Personally I think there are far more reasons for fish mortality.
Cat

I agree Cat

[huntsfurfish]

I wouldnt be so sure . Have ever hooked an acrobatic , frisky 5 lb rainbow on a barbless fly in fas****er. I fished barbless alot before the law came in and alot of the bigger fish were hooked in the corner of the mouth at release time but were bleeding from other places inside the mouth. This leads me to believe that the hook is coming out and hooking in somewheres else between hook set and release:thinking-006: Big frisky rainbows got lots of fight and even the best fisherman cant always keep up.

Interesting, I have caught a few fish that were bleeding from places other than where they were hooked.:thinking-006: Makes sense now.

[WayneChristie]

...to an issue that has nothing what-so-ever to do with a past great leader of the province and every thing to do with ethical sportsmanship.


Free (to agree with the OP)

so in your opinion the many thousands(millions?) of anglers who fished from the beginning of time until the barbless rule were totally unethical? and every fisherperson who doesnt live where barbless hooks are the law are unethical. :snapoutofit:

[Bhflyfisher]

Maybe its just me but I am struggling to see how if that hook was barbed it wouldnt "saw" into the fish?

Exactly my thoughts, If there is tension on the line and anglers horsing fish in, that angler applying force will create that "saw" as you say. That barbed hook or barbless is going in just a deep as its counter part.

So sick of hearing this, "oh barbed hooks dont harm fish like barbless do for reason a, reason b, and reason c." Seriously, wake up and give your head a shake. :snapoutofit:

Its kind of funny how alberta is completely barbless, and i'll bet a good percentage of this forum dont follow that regulation. :thinking-006:

If you're that worried about losing a fish here and there, you need to really think hard as to why you fish in the first place, and if you're still of the mindset that barbed hooks cause less damage you need to -----> :snapoutofit:

[huntsfurfish]

Exactly my thoughts, If there is tension on the line and anglers horsing fish in, that angler applying force will create that "saw" as you say. That barbed hook or barbless is going in just a deep as its counter part.

So sick of hearing this, "oh barbed hooks dont harm fish like barbless do for reason a, reason b, and reason c." Seriously, wake up and give your head a shake. :snapoutofit:

Its kind of funny how alberta is completely barbless, and i'll bet a good percentage of this forum dont follow that regulation. :thinking-006:

If you're that worried about losing a fish here and there, you need to really think hard as to why you fish in the first place, and if you're still of the mindset that barbed hooks cause less damage you need to -----> :snapoutofit:

Its OK if you dont get the point:).




And that wouldnt surprise me either. Its an unpopular law. In fact one of the studies I read (dont remember which one exactly but believe it was from an upper western state(Northwest State)) mentioned that in their study. Claiming that if would be very unpopular and would not be followed by many anglers. Thereby creating a situation that would possibly lead to worse infractions or something to that effect(getting old dont remember exactly). Incidently they also found barb/barbless issue inconclusive.

[braxxtonn]

Well I know for sure when i go to the Jackfish ice derby this Saturday in Sask I am gonna have some huge barbs on my hook, dont want to loose that $150 000.00
fish !!!:bad_boys_20:

[huntsfurfish]

Lol

[WayneChristie]

Its kind of funny how alberta is completely barbless, and i'll bet a good percentage of this forum dont follow that regulation. :thinking-006:



and what do you base that assumption on? you ever fish with any other members?

[Mike_W]

I wouldnt be so sure . Have ever hooked an acrobatic , frisky 5 lb rainbow on a barbless fly in fas****er. I fished barbless alot before the law came in and alot of the bigger fish were hooked in the corner of the mouth at release time but were bleeding from other places inside the mouth. This leads me to believe that the hook is coming out and hooking in somewheres else between hook set and release:thinking-006: Big frisky rainbows got lots of fight and even the best fisherman cant always keep up.

Oh I agree that a hook may come dislodged from deeper in the mouth and catch again on the way out. I was stating that a hooked fish "gulping" a barbless hook further into its is petty darm near impossible if there is any tention on the line.

And for the record I am not ststing that any angler fishing with barbs is unethical I just know why I do it!

[madatter]

Sorry cat, I still think it should be the individuals choice rather than law when there is no conclusive evidence to support barbless.

And I also think it should be your choice on removal, I will remove my own hooks (barbed or barbless):);)

Safety of your kids is paramount.

Good fishin to you man!

Well after fishing for most of my life,barbed and barbless I can honestly make my own conclusion....
There is no comparison between removing a barbed hook(especially a treble) and a barbless one.
Be it removing the hook from me or a fish a barbless hook is easier,requires less handling of the fish.
If less handling of the fish means a higher survivability rate....which I believe it does then barbless is the only way to go...
Useless law...I don't think so!

[TyreeUM]

...to an issue
....I, and others, have fished barbless for decades....
Alberta soon went to barbless.....Saskatchewan demands barbless....I have done it myself; last September I hooked onto more than a few trophy walleyes...feeling like a rock star because I did it!
There's the science....More science....We rarely fish with people who think they are exempt from rules....in your pathetic attempt to blame someone else for your failings.
Free (to agree with the OP)

What the hell was that...

[ak-71]

Cought myself on a barbed trebble (new lure, never used) in a crammed tackle box. Took a while to push it through the frozen finger and cut the barb with left hand. No more debarbing when I need it for me.

[Jwood 456]

From my personal experience, the few times I used barbed trebles, they wound up making a large mess of the fish and were a real pain to pull out. Whenever using trebles now, I cut one of the points off of the treble and with no barbs, I have found that it is day and night easier to pull the hook out of the fishe's mouth and doesn't make such a mess of the fish either.

[huntsfurfish]

Well after fishing for most of my life,barbed and barbless I can honestly make my own conclusion....
There is no comparison between removing a barbed hook(especially a treble) and a barbless one.
Be it removing the hook from me or a fish a barbless hook is easier,requires less handling of the fish.
If less handling of the fish means a higher survivability rate....which I believe it does then barbless is the only way to go...
Useless law...I don't think so!


If it makes you feel better.:)


It really doesnt seem to make much difference whether the hook is barbed or barbless.

Useless law:);)
And at the very least a needless law.

[Mike_W]

If it makes you feel better.:)


It really doesnt seem to make much difference whether the hook is barbed or barbless.

Useless law:);)
And at the very least a needless law.

No more feeding the troll guys!!

[TyreeUM]

As I stated before, I have been researching this topic for quite sometime for reasons not important to this thread, and to be honest, I have really been on the fence with this one. I have no doubt in my mind that the people on this thread that think it should be up to the angler are more than likely fishing at a level where there would be no statistically significant difference in mortality if they fished a barbed hook or not. It is the average and below average joe that cant pop a barbless hook out the way you can that end up mishandling the fish, thus resulting in a higher level of mortality after the release. I think this is reason enough for me to lobby for barbless.

[BeeGuy]

As I stated before, I have been researching this topic for quite sometime for reasons not important to this thread, and to be honest, I have really been on the fence with this one. I have no doubt in my mind that the people on this thread that think it should be up to the angler are more than likely fishing at a level where there would be no statistically significant difference in mortality if they fished a barbed hook or not. It is the average and below average joe that cant pop a barbless hook out the way you can that end up mishandling the fish, thus resulting in a higher level of mortality after the release. I think this is reason enough for me to lobby for barbless.

Do you have any good primary literature references handy?

[TyreeUM]

Do you have any good primary literature references handy?

you should be able to find a decent amount of abstracts on google scholar and a few full PDF's as well. If you are still having trouble let me know.

[BeeGuy]

Ya, I've done those searches before for past barbed-hook discussions on here, and have found some original research. Just thought you might have the goods on hand.

There are some obvious problems with experimental design, which have a significant impact when they try to run stats on their data.

Their treatments are too confounded by other factors.

[huntsfurfish]

As I stated before, I have been researching this topic for quite sometime for reasons not important to this thread, and to be honest, I have really been on the fence with this one. I have no doubt in my mind that the people on this thread that think it should be up to the angler are more than likely fishing at a level where there would be no statistically significant difference in mortality if they fished a barbed hook or not. It is the average and below average joe that cant pop a barbless hook out the way you can that end up mishandling the fish, thus resulting in a higher level of mortality after the release. I think this is reason enough for me to lobby for barbless.

I dont completely agree with you there TyreeUM. Poor fish handling is just poor fish handling with average and below average anglers as well as anglers just starting out(and some experienced anglers as well). Again I believe differences would be minimal.

[huntsfurfish]

Could someone tell me why a province would go barbless and still allow the use of bait?



Can the guys on here defending the use of barbless(no significant difference in mortality rates) explain how they can justify using bait when there is a significant difference in mortality rates with it use.



Hypocritical!
to say the least.:snapoutofit:

[madatter]

Could someone tell me why a province would go barbless and still allow the use of bait?



Can the guys on here defending the use of barbless(no significant difference in mortality rates) explain how they can justify using bait when there is a significant difference in mortality rates with it use.



Hypocritical!
to say the least.:snapoutofit:

So do you use bait?
Curious with all your knowledge if there is any province that has a complete bait ban?

[TyreeUM]

I dont completely agree with you there TyreeUM. Poor fish handling is just poor fish handling with average and below average anglers as well as anglers just starting out(and some experienced anglers as well). Again I believe differences would be minimal.

I dont expect you to agree with anyone, you already had your mind made up before you even entered this discussion.

[ishootbambi]

im not sure this law is good or not. screw the studies....im going on 35 years of fishing experience and have come to this conclusion. fish mortality in my opinion is going to be largely dependant on the angler. ive seen a few that like to drag out a fish fight for as long as possible because they arent catching many and want that fun to last......that aint good for fish.

ive seen lots more drag fish up onto the rocks and gravel/prairie/bottom of the boat etc to flop around for several minutes while they dig up a tape measure to see if they are allowed to kill it....without realizing THEY ALREADY ARE!!! for christ sake, if you want to keep one where size limits exist, have that crap ready before the fish gets to you!!!

others yet will turn a fish inside out removing the hooks and then shot put it for distance like they are training for the olympics. again....not good for the fish.

how about the guy that horses them up from 60 feet of water thinking that minimalizing the fight time will save them......without knowing anything about the swim bladders....

for those that care about fish, the best thing you can do is to try to educate those who dont know on the proper handling of fish if you plan on releasing them. for those interested....im pretty well C&R only. its been quite a while since i knowingly killed a fish. im sure some of those that swim away from me looking pefectly healthy go on to die, but for the most part i do my best to limit handling. i keep the pliers on me and if i can avoid it, i wont even touch a fish. pretty well all my tackle is single hooks, and ive been pinching barbs for much longer than it has been the law.

im not trying to sound h0olier than thou....just explaining my point of view. do i think barbless laws make sense......i dunno....maybe, maybe not.....id like to see more guys get help on this stuff from those that know and care. good fishing to all......

[huntsfurfish]

So do you use bait?
Curious with all your knowledge if there is any province that has a complete bait ban?

Yes I do! For over 50 years:)

To my knowledge there are no complete bait bans.

[huntsfurfish]

im not sure this law is good or not. screw the studies....im going on 35 years of fishing experience and have come to this conclusion. fish mortality in my opinion is going to be largely dependant on the angler. ive seen a few that like to drag out a fish fight for as long as possible because they arent catching many and want that fun to last......that aint good for fish.

ive seen lots more drag fish up onto the rocks and gravel/prairie/bottom of the boat etc to flop around for several minutes while they dig up a tape measure to see if they are allowed to kill it....without realizing THEY ALREADY ARE!!! for christ sake, if you want to keep one where size limits exist, have that crap ready before the fish gets to you!!!

others yet will turn a fish inside out removing the hooks and then shot put it for distance like they are training for the olympics. again....not good for the fish.

how about the guy that horses them up from 60 feet of water thinking that minimalizing the fight time will save them......without knowing anything about the swim bladders....

for those that care about fish, the best thing you can do is to try to educate those who dont know on the proper handling of fish if you plan on releasing them. for those interested....im pretty well C&R only. its been quite a while since i knowingly killed a fish. im sure some of those that swim away from me looking pefectly healthy go on to die, but for the most part i do my best to limit handling. i keep the pliers on me and if i can avoid it, i wont even touch a fish. pretty well all my tackle is single hooks, and ive been pinching barbs for much longer than it has been the law.

im not trying to sound h0olier than thou....just explaining my point of view. do i think barbless laws make sense......i dunno....maybe, maybe not.....id like to see more guys get help on this stuff from those that know and care. good fishing to all......



Very well said.

[Freedom55]

...for reasons not important to this thread, ...I have ...no ...mind ... the people ...are ...statistically ...a ...below average joe ...that end up mishandling ...a ...mortality ...for me ...

...expect ...your mind ...before you ...discuss...

Does not make a lot of sense to me either, done this way. I will say this; I lied earlier when I said I "put them ashore." What I meant was, "I throw them overboard."
As you can see, I too can have a bit of fun misquoting you.

Free

[Freedom55]

so in your opinion the many thousands(millions?) of anglers who fished from the beginning of time until the barbless rule were totally unethical? and every fisherperson who doesnt live where barbless hooks are the law are unethical. :snapoutofit:

Took you a while Mr. Christie, but you were finally, after two years, able to Troll me. That's patience.

Free

[TyreeUM]

Does not make a lot of sense to me either, done this way. I will say this; I lied earlier when I said I "put them ashore." What I meant was, "I throw them overboard."
As you can see, I too can have a bit of fun misquoting you.

Free

you are a wack-o

[madatter]

Yes I do! For over 50 years:)

To my knowledge there are no complete bait bans.

I'm a little curious as to why the barbless law has you so excited when in your own words bait fishing has a much higher effect on fish mortality....yet you have no issue whatsoever bait fishing.
Using bait is allowed.
Using barbed hooks isn't.
Get over it!

[huntsfurfish]

I'm a little curious as to why the barbless law has you so excited when in your own words bait fishing has a much higher effect on fish mortality....yet you have no issue whatsoever bait fishing.
Using bait is allowed.
Using barbed hooks isn't.
Get over it!

Makes lots of sense! Not.

You still cant figure that out?

I suppose you were for the long gun registry too!:snapoutofit:

[madatter]

Makes lots of sense! Not.

You still cant figure that out?

I suppose you were for the long gun registry too!:snapoutofit:

Well I know you make no sense....
Guess that's the way you like it tho...

[madatter]

Could someone tell me why a province would go barbless and still allow the use of bait?



Can the guys on here defending the use of barbless(no significant difference in mortality rates) explain how they can justify using bait when there is a significant difference in mortality rates with it use.



Hypocritical!
to say the least.:snapoutofit:

You seem a little hypocritical using bait for 50 years:):snapoutofit:

[huntsfurfish]

I guess you will never get it:)

[huntsfurfish]

I'm a little curious as to why the barbless law has you so excited when in your own words bait fishing has a much higher effect on fish mortality....yet you have no issue whatsoever bait fishing.
Using bait is allowed.
Using barbed hooks isn't.
Get over it!

I guess you need a little help.:thinking-006:

Would make more sense the other way around.

Using barbed hooks is allowed.
Using bait isnt.

[madatter]

I guess you will never get it:)

I got a headache from reading this!
Practically every province has a barbless rule...
No province has bait ban....which really means squat when we are talking about the barbless rule....good thing too cause you love using bait!:)
Guess you are smarter than everybody..:sHa_sarcasticlol:

[huntsfurfish]

:sign0161:Some people just cant get it.:)

Guess you are smarter than everybody..

Heck no just smarter than you ..... Just Kidding.(I think-hope I am just average smart).

Remember the long gun registry? This is the fishin version.:);):lol:

[madatter]

:sign0161:Some people just cant get it.:)

Guess you are smarter than everybody..

Heck no just smarter than you ..... Just Kidding.(I think-hope I am just average smart).

Remember the long gun registry? This is the fishin version.:);):lol:

Uh no....the long gun registry was a proven money waster with little or no benefit.
While you say barbless is not proven to be any better,it sure isn't proven to be worse.
You don't like it....too bad
Most people think it helps and don't mind taking the seconds to crimp/file barbs....
Time to move on....:scared0018:

[huntsfurfish]

Uh no....the long gun registry was a proven money waster with little or no benefit.
While you say barbless is not proven to be any better,it sure isn't proven to be worse.
You don't like it....too bad
Most people think it helps and don't mind taking the seconds to crimp/file barbs....
Time to move on....:scared0018:

Thats the whole point!!!! Barbed or Barbless no significant difference. sheesh.:sHa_sarcasticlol:
Thank you for this post. You made my point!!!!

[madatter]

Thats the whole point!!!! Barbed or Barbless no significant difference. sheesh.:sHa_sarcasticlol:
Thank you for this post. You made my point!!!!

In your mind yes.....it's not proven,YOU SAY...
In mine yes....it is proven by personal experience
U can't make your point,why would I?:)
Still the law...you still have to get over it!:rolleye2:

But you could stop using bait....since you keep bringing it up!:sHa_sarcasticlol:

[huntsfurfish]

Ok I was wrong - Yes I am smarter than you:)lol

Same thing dude. Lots of similarities.
Only difference was the amount of money spent.
If you cant see that, well I cant help you.:sHa_sarcasticlol:
I bet you have not even read the studies in question, they are out there do a search. You are spouting the same liberal reasoning used in the Long gun registry.:fighting0030::sHa_sarcasticlol:
And ya you did make my point!:sHa_sarcasticlol:

PS-I was not in favour of long gun registration:)

Did we get over the long gun registry:):snapoutofit:

[madatter]

Ok I was wrong - Yes I am smarter than you:)lol

Same thing dude. Lots of similarities.
Only difference was the amount of money spent.
If you cant see that, well I cant help you.:sHa_sarcasticlol:
I bet you have not even read the studies in question, they are out there do a search. You are spouting the same liberal reasoning used in the Long gun registry.:fighting0030::sHa_sarcasticlol:
And ya you did make my point!:sHa_sarcasticlol:

PS-I was not in favour of long gun registration:)

Did we get over the long gun registry:):snapoutofit:

You might be the smartest d...b person I know!:)
Ok I don't know you....
I find it very interesting you keep bringing up other things,bait fishing,long gun registry that have ZERO to do with the topic.
I guess smart people like you think they do in your world....wherever that may be.
Comparing the long gun registry to the barbless rule may be the silliest thing I have ever heard....but if it makes sense in your world all the power to ya!

[AxeMan]

Comparing the long gun registry to the barbless rule may be the silliest thing I have ever heard.

x2, beyond silly! Totally unrelated laws really.

[huntsfurfish]

Not if you give it a little thought.:)

But some might have to give it a lot of thought though.:):sHa_sarcasticlol:

Can you spell s l o w.

Besides no need for you guys to hurt yourselves:sHa_sarcasticlol:

[huntsfurfish]

Some may not like/appreciate the references to bait, hypocracy, long gun registry. I can understand that. But those that cannot see why I have made the references are beyond help:)

[pickrel pat]

wow dude, go fishing or something...... (dont forget to pinch those barbs.)

[huntsfurfish]

Thanks Pickeral Pat, Good idea, getting cranky and wound a little tight! Always pinch the barbs cause its the law.

[pickrel pat]

Thanks Pickeral Pat, Good idea, getting cranky and wound a little tight! Always pinch the barbs cause its the law.

lol, no problem.

[horsetrader]

x2, beyond silly! Totally unrelated laws really.

Now was the long gun registry not a law that had no scientific evidence that it would change anything but was pushed through because of social pressure.

Hey didn't we hear something like this before....... Hmmmmm

[AxeMan]

Lol, I still don't get it....I must be slow. Could you hotshots explain it again.

SRD makes an attempt to reduce fish mortality in province with a great deal of catch and release fishing and they are compared to a money wasting liberal gun registration law. The argument about no scientific evidence is pretty weak too. Common sense I would think, especially with all of us inexperienced nubes and greenhorns.....lol.

If we are reduced to these silly analogies in this thread; I really like the one about ramming a barbed and a barbless hook deep in your arm. At least that one will prove a point about ease of removal. Any takers? :kap:

[horsetrader]

Lol, I still don't get it....I must be slow. Could you hotshots explain it again.

SRD makes an attempt to reduce fish mortality in province with a great deal of catch and release fishing and they are compared to a money wasting liberal gun registration law. The argument about no scientific evidence is pretty weak too. Common sense I would think, especially with all of us inexperienced nubes and greenhorns.....lol.

If we are reduced to these silly analogies in this thread; I really like the one about ramming a barbed and a barbless hook deep in your arm. At least that one will prove a point about ease of removal. Any takers? :kap:

See there's your problem the comparison is not a money thing it's a we are making this a law even though we can't prove it will make a difference thing.

I'm not saying that barbless is a bad thing but there is no proof it's has made an impact. I fish barbless now fished many many years with barbs don't see a lot of difference I don't let the fish swallow the hook. I'm sure this has not helped you to see the comparison but thats ok.... Oh and by the way the statement about ramming hooks in your arm is not an analogy it is an experiment ... An analogy is comparing the information from one subject to another...

[AxeMan]

I give up, you win. I have lost my interest in debating this anymore. Kind of like arguing for the sake of it now.

[horsetrader]

I give up, you win. I have lost my interest in debating this anymore. Kind of like arguing for the sake of it now.

Ya my wife feels the same way alot she just gives up ....lol

[huntsfurfish]

Lol, I still don't get it....I must be slow. Could you hotshots explain it again.

SRD makes an attempt to reduce fish mortality in province with a great deal of catch and release fishing and they are compared to a money wasting liberal gun registration law. The argument about no scientific evidence is pretty weak too. Common sense I would think, especially with all of us inexperienced nubes and greenhorns.....lol.

If we are reduced to these silly analogies in this thread; I really like the one about ramming a barbed and a barbless hook deep in your arm. At least that one will prove a point about ease of removal. Any takers? :kap:



OK now Im convinced the end of the world is coming. Cant believe Horse and I argued the same point:)lol

OK your on, you first though:). Removal would be slightly easier, little doubt about that. Also, like horse said, I dont really think it is a bad thing either, just unneccessary, because it really doesnt seem to make much difference in mortallity rates.

And that everybody, is the point.

Didnt like the long gun registry, and dont like the barbless law, after all I am an Albertan:)

ps Horse, thanks for the interpretation.:)lol

[huntsfurfish]

A buddy gave me his copy of Alberta Outdoorsman November2011. There is an article in there on the barbless issue by Duane Radford. Some people on here should have a look see.



Wonder if it would be possible to post the article here? Would it Rob?

[AxeMan]

Didnt like the long gun registry, and dont like the barbless law, after all I am an Albertan:)


Well I am an Albertan too and I didn't like the gun registry either but I am not sure those facts support or refute the barbless law. That is my point. That seems to be the basis to your argument. Also, Duane Radford has an opinion but so do many of us.

What I did do is read many of the peer reviewed scientific papers that have studied this issue. Some support increased fish mortality with barbed hooks, some don't, and some are mixed. I also formed an opinion based on my experience fishing barbed and barbless.

In the end, ASRD made a law on barbless only. I don't think it was based on public pressure. People can hate it or love it but using barbless hooks certainly won't negatively impact our fishery.

Huntsfurfish, you hate the law, that's fine and it is your right to do so.

I personally don't hate the law because it does't negatively impact my fishing experience at all even though I do lose the odd fish.

Thats all bud.

[madatter]

OK now Im convinced the end of the world is coming. Cant believe Horse and I argued the same point:)lol

OK your on, you first though:). Removal would be slightly easier, little doubt about that. Also, like horse said, I dont really think it is a bad thing either, just unneccessary, because it really doesnt seem to make much difference in mortallity rates.

And that everybody, is the point.

Didnt like the long gun registry, and dont like the barbless law, after all I am an Albertan:)

ps Horse, thanks for the interpretation.:)lol

Finally you admit the only thing these things have in common are that YOU don't like them!:sHa_sarcasticlol:
At least you are right about the gun registry!......1 for 2 isn't bad ya know!:)

[huntsfurfish]

Finally you admit the only thing these things have in common are that YOU don't like them!:sHa_sarcasticlol:
At least you are right about the gun registry!......1 for 2 isn't bad ya know!:)

OK you ignored the red print:):sHa_sarcasticlol:

I still like it though that you helped to make my point, still buggin ya isnt it.:):sHa_sarcasticlol:

[madatter]

OK you ignored the red print:):sHa_sarcasticlol:

I still like it though that you helped to make my point, still buggin ya isnt it.:):sHa_sarcasticlol:

Oh no I thought you made my point!
I realize you think...and have read on the internet(cause everything on the Internet is true:sHa_sarcasticlol:) that there is no difference in mortality,even though it is easier and involves less handling of fish,less stress....
Can't possibly be better to use barbless!
Me I tend to go with past experience with both,but I guess most of us are not a master angler like yourself at removing barbed hooks.
I am humbled....:)

[huntsfurfish]

Lol:)

So you know (because of all your past experience) that more of your fish are alive now?

I am the one that should bow to you.

[pickrel pat]

how bout you both bow to me? from a stand still position i can jump over 7 feet!

[huntsfurfish]

Be an honour.

Lets all go:fishing:

[horsetrader]

how bout you both bow to me? from a stand still position i can jump over 7 feet!

It dose not count jumping down ....lol

[horsetrader]

OK now Im convinced the end of the world is coming. Cant believe Horse and I argued the same point:)lol

OK your on, you first though:). Removal would be slightly easier, little doubt about that. Also, like horse said, I dont really think it is a bad thing either, just unneccessary, because it really doesnt seem to make much difference in mortallity rates.

And that everybody, is the point.

Didnt like the long gun registry, and dont like the barbless law, after all I am an Albertan:)

ps Horse, thanks for the interpretation.:)lol

I'm wearing my tinfoil hat lol

[ivegonefishing]

It appears that there is some evidence for anecdotal observations being the basis for a lot of the arguments that are contrary to the idea of using barbless hooks and are really of little value when it comes to scientific conclusions (in other words if Uncle Clem says barbed hooks are better in his opinion, this is a conclusion reached without scientific research; and is of little or no value). After reading some of these, and many other articles on barbless vs barbed hooks there appears to be evidence supporting the barbless hook approach as better for the survival of released fish. There are however MANY OTHER huge factors that will affect the survivability of the fish. Sticking to the barbed vs. barbless debate only; the ease of removal, minimized tissue damage, faster removal of the hook and subsequent decreased release times seem to be a few of the big factors that can contribute to a successful fish release.

Personally I like the idea of barbless hooks because of the benefits it affords the fish. It has also made me a better fisherman in terms of technique when I am trying to pull in a good 'Scrapper'. When I was living in Kelowna I had a lot of fruit trees and refused to spray them out of concern for my family's health and the affect of chemicals on the environment. So I did get some apples, peaches, cherries, etc that were damaged by bugs and fungus but I just picked them off and disposed of them, I felt it was a fair trade. I also think that I don't have to pull in every fish I hook and keep everyone of them. So the thrill of the fight and trying to outsmart my quarry is the challenge and the loss of the odd fish is a fair trade IMHOP.

I realize that my sentiments are not necessarily shared by all but just wanted to post some scientific articles on this thread.

I have included some links below if you are interested in reading some of the scientific evidence.

http://www.news-press.com/assets/pdf/A483941829.PDF

http://www.soma56.com/pdf/SOMA%20Research/Pelletier_et_al%20_2007_catch_and_release_info.pdf

http://www.dnr.state.wi.us/org/es/science/inventory/TroutHooking.pdf


http://www.landfood.ubc.ca/animalwelfare/research/pdfs/fish.pdf

Thanks for reading :)

[Greatgraywolf]

Thank-you for posting the links re: reduced mortality rates using barbless hooks. I agree that it also helps the fisherman develop more skill in actually bringing a catch in, rather than just dragging a laker or pike to the surface. Just as important, as a parent and grand-parent, is the safety issue. Kids and hooks seem to attract each other; my first experience of this was over a half-century ago when I inadvertantly walked into my fly-fishing father's back-lash and ended up with a pierced ear, and a trip to ER to have a Royal Coachman removed from an earlobe. I would never consider fishing with my kids, grand-kids, and dog, for the same reason. Barbless hooks, IMO, should be mandatory if a person is out for a C & R fishing trip. As far as using barbless when fishing for a specific species; consider perch fishing. When I get into a school of perch, I've found that having a barbless hook increases my catch; it's so much easier to pull one up through the ice, flip it off the hook, rebait and start fishing again. Same with any fish that tends to school. Anyway, just a few things to think about.

[madatter]

Lol:)

So you know (because of all your past experience) that more of your fish are alive now?

I am the one that should bow to you.

I agree. LOL:)

[huntsfurfish]

Lol :)

[Submoa_hunter]

If your catching fish with barbs to eat it its a totally different story

[pickrel pat]

If your catching fish with barbs to eat it its a totally different story

your wrong.

[in_search_of_a_monster]

I have fished Ontario almost my whole life but was born in Alberta,I have seen people mangle mouths and gills apart especially on big muskie and pike as many parts of Ontario have no restrictions on barbed hooks.It is no question in my mind that barbless hooks improve mortality rates and just make handling and removing hooks easier, its common sense, you would know if you had gotten used to fishing barbed and then to switch to barbless as i have done beacause i just moved back to Alberta.It makes it more interesting and a little more of a challenge just keep the pressure and youll keep those hooks deep enough with a decent hook set and go with the strongest line possible for your application and species youre fishing,thats my philosophy take it or leave it good luck fellas !

[Fish-killer]

Barb-less is hooks is the best way to go. Well here is what I think,

I think barbed hooks should be aloud on NON-Baited LURES, I.E Rapalas, Jigs and spoons and so on.

When it comes to baited jigs or baited hooks... They should be BARB-LESS because the fish hit and often time will swallow the hook and then its a mess to UN-hook a barbed hook from the throat of the fish. Barb-less its easy to UN hook.
Also helping the fish live better!

[pelada trochu]

I fish barbless 99% of the time for several reasons and I am sure one of them is that I feel better about catch and release fishing using barbless, regardless of whether there is a current study that shows statistically significant evidence that barbless results in less mortality. I guess my question is why fish barbless? If it is a matter of loosing fish, it should only take a few lost fish to help understand that your technique needs improving. So again, why fish barbed in the first place?

nice.

i learned with the barb and ive caught alot of fish. no one ever seemed to care if they were hurting the fish. now that i fish barbless, i find its a little more sporting and gives a better challenge. you still get the same amount of hits so baited or not, as the barb only counts when the fish is on. now that im barbless i have alot less frustration trying to pull a hook out of the fish, the net, your clothes, etc. its better all around.

i also will pull a barbless j hook out of a pickerel's throat and cause much less damage.

[pelada trochu]

if you look back i said that I could care less about the law and if it is a bad law or a good one, , I choose to use barbless hooks, and yes, it really should be up to the individual.


Personally I think there are far more reasons for fish mortality.
Cat

maybe fish licenses should be up to the individual too. or how about motors on motorless lakes. or tossing your trash out the window. rules are in place for a reason. if they are wrong band together and have them tossed out.

[pelada trochu]

Could someone tell me why a province would go barbless and still allow the use of bait?



Can the guys on here defending the use of barbless(no significant difference in mortality rates) explain how they can justify using bait when there is a significant difference in mortality rates with it use.



Hypocritical!
to say the least.:snapoutofit:

bit hard to catch sturgeon without it (some fish require bait to catch)

[pelada trochu]

I have fished Ontario almost my whole life but was born in Alberta,I have seen people mangle mouths and gills apart especially on big muskie and pike as many parts of Ontario have no restrictions on barbed hooks.It is no question in my mind that barbless hooks improve mortality rates and just make handling and removing hooks easier, its common sense, you would know if you had gotten used to fishing barbed and then to switch to barbless as i have done beacause i just moved back to Alberta.It makes it more interesting and a little more of a challenge just keep the pressure and youll keep those hooks deep enough with a decent hook set and go with the strongest line possible [/COLOR]for your application and species youre fishing,thats my philosophy take it or leave it good luck fellas !

when i tried the braid i lost alot of pike as i have no spring effect to hold that hook in there. with mono or fluoro you can have 2 or 3 feet of stretch to create a spring and hold the hook in. with no stretch the heavy braids can create a violent hookset. not against braid but your line should match your rods, stiffer and mono, softer and braid.

dont fish 2lb walleye with your medium heavy rod set with 30lb braid, its not fun, it rips the lips off the fish and you loose them alot due to lack of spring effect.

this isnt meant for anyone in particular its just knowledge to try and educate the newbies when they are picking up their first rod and reel and hear that 30 lb braid will catch everything from perch right up to muskie.

[horsetrader]

maybe fish licenses should be up to the individual too. or how about motors on motorless lakes. or tossing your trash out the window. rules are in place for a reason. if they are wrong band together and have them tossed out.

?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????

[pickrel pat]

?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!

[horsetrader]

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!






.

[Lefty-Canuck]

maybe fish licenses should be up to the individual too. or how about motors on motorless lakes. or tossing your trash out the window. rules are in place for a reason. if they are wrong band together and have them tossed out.

I call BS...

LC :)

[BeeGuy]

It appears that there is some evidence for anecdotal observations being the basis for a lot of the arguments that are contrary to the idea of using barbless hooks and are really of little value when it comes to scientific conclusions (in other words if Uncle Clem says barbed hooks are better in his opinion, this is a conclusion reached without scientific research; and is of little or no value). After reading some of these, and many other articles on barbless vs barbed hooks there appears to be evidence supporting the barbless hook approach as better for the survival of released fish. There are however MANY OTHER huge factors that will affect the survivability of the fish. Sticking to the barbed vs. barbless debate only; the ease of removal, minimized tissue damage, faster removal of the hook and subsequent decreased release times seem to be a few of the big factors that can contribute to a successful fish release.

Personally I like the idea of barbless hooks because of the benefits it affords the fish. It has also made me a better fisherman in terms of technique when I am trying to pull in a good 'Scrapper'. When I was living in Kelowna I had a lot of fruit trees and refused to spray them out of concern for my family's health and the affect of chemicals on the environment. So I did get some apples, peaches, cherries, etc that were damaged by bugs and fungus but I just picked them off and disposed of them, I felt it was a fair trade. I also think that I don't have to pull in every fish I hook and keep everyone of them. So the thrill of the fight and trying to outsmart my quarry is the challenge and the loss of the odd fish is a fair trade IMHOP.

I realize that my sentiments are not necessarily shared by all but just wanted to post some scientific articles on this thread.

I have included some links below if you are interested in reading some of the scientific evidence.

http://www.news-press.com/assets/pdf/A483941829.PDF

http://www.soma56.com/pdf/SOMA%20Research/Pelletier_et_al%20_2007_catch_and_release_info.pdf

http://www.dnr.state.wi.us/org/es/science/inventory/TroutHooking.pdf


http://www.landfood.ubc.ca/animalwelfare/research/pdfs/fish.pdf

Thanks for reading :)


Read your articles.

3 of the 4 are essentially review articles (1 being a meta-analysis) which do not provide any real science (experiment and replication), and the 4th (non-peer reviewed) found no statistical differences between hook types.

The meta-analysis found that circle hooks are more difficult to remove, and are less efficient than j-hooks, but likely cause less damage.

[bobalong]

It appears that there is some evidence for anecdotal observations being the basis for a lot of the arguments that are contrary to the idea of using barbless hooks and are really of little value when it comes to scientific conclusions (in other words if Uncle Clem says barbed hooks are better in his opinion, this is a conclusion reached without scientific research; and is of little or no value). After reading some of these, and many other articles on barbless vs barbed hooks there appears to be evidence supporting the barbless hook approach as better for the survival of released fish. There are however MANY OTHER huge factors that will affect the survivability of the fish. Sticking to the barbed vs. barbless debate only; the ease of removal, minimized tissue damage, faster removal of the hook and subsequent decreased release times seem to be a few of the big factors that can contribute to a successful fish release.

Personally I like the idea of barbless hooks because of the benefits it affords the fish. It has also made me a better fisherman in terms of technique when I am trying to pull in a good 'Scrapper'. When I was living in Kelowna I had a lot of fruit trees and refused to spray them out of concern for my family's health and the affect of chemicals on the environment. So I did get some apples, peaches, cherries, etc that were damaged by bugs and fungus but I just picked them off and disposed of them, I felt it was a fair trade. I also think that I don't have to pull in every fish I hook and keep everyone of them. So the thrill of the fight and trying to outsmart my quarry is the challenge and the loss of the odd fish is a fair trade IMHOP.

I realize that my sentiments are not necessarily shared by all but just wanted to post some scientific articles on this thread.

I have included some links below if you are interested in reading some of the scientific evidence.

http://www.news-press.com/assets/pdf/A483941829.PDF

http://www.soma56.com/pdf/SOMA%20Research/Pelletier_et_al%20_2007_catch_and_release_info.pdf

http://www.dnr.state.wi.us/org/es/science/inventory/TroutHooking.pdf


http://www.landfood.ubc.ca/animalwelfare/research/pdfs/fish.pdf

Thanks for reading :)

As you stated common sense and experience are all you need to know that barbless hooks reduce stress, which decreases mortality. Barbless hooks are a very simple law but some people have just do not have any common sense, which results in even simple being far beyond comprehension.

[Kim473]

The only reason I don't like barbless hooks, is the fish keep stealing my bait. Those maggots and mealworms get rather expensive. I still land just as many fish, just takes an hr or two longer.

[pickrel pat]

The only reason I don't like barbless hooks, is the fish keep stealing my bait. Those maggots and mealworms get rather expensive. I still land just as many fish, just takes an hr or two longer.

cut little squares from a rubberband. after putting on your bait, put a little peice of rubberband behind it......... problem now solved!!! keeps it on better than just a barb.......:)

[huntsfurfish]

As you stated common sense and experience are all you need to know that barbless hooks reduce stress, which decreases mortality. Barbless hooks are a very simple law but some people have just do not have any common sense, which results in even simple being far beyond comprehension.

Actually it is all about fish handling as a whole. Ignoring the science is not what I would call common sense. And while you might think it is simple it really is not.:)

[pelada trochu]

what... where... when... barb how...
:argue2::sHa_sarcasticlol:

[greylynx]

I will bet you this is how the decision for barbless hooks was made in Alberta.

Upper level fisheries biologist: " There is no evidence that barbless hooks will significantly create damage to our fisheries." ( Which BTW are already collapsed)

ADM: "Since all those eco retards are screaming for barbless lets go with it and get the pressure off our backs. I will get a fat raise and promotion for not stirring anythiing up."

Thats the real world boys and girls.

[pickrel pat]

I will bet you this is how the decision for barbless hooks was made in Alberta.

Upper level fisheries biologist: " There is no evidence that barbless hooks will significantly create damage to our fisheries." ( Which BTW are already collapsed)

ADM: "Since all those eco retards are screaming for barbless lets go with it and get the pressure off our backs. I will get a fat raise and promotion for not stirring anythiing up."

Thats the real world boys and girls.

Im glad the "eco retards" got something right........:)

[norma mag]

I was out ice fishing with a new fishing buddy going after walleye and things were slow so I decided to hop on my quad and try out some different areas. When I returned he had rigged up a tip up of mine and a pike grabbed it shortly after, when I pulled the pike up I noticed that the treble was barbed. I had a bugger of a time getting those stupid barbs out. barbless are so so much better. Yes I gave him a slap on the noodle and no I did not report him.:snapoutofit:

I hate barbs as well. It's always nice to loose a 10lb rainbow near the boat:happy0180:

[greylynx]

Im glad the "eco retards" got something right........:)

And I bet you "feel" real good. And that is good too. Because that is what fishing is all about.

Even though Alberta has a collapsed fishery, I see the objective of the fisheries department has not changed over 30 years.

Lets make those voters feel real good, and to hexx with the fish.

If they want barbless, give them barbless, If they want Bass give them Bass.

This is not a province where fisheries management is taken seriously.

Like Duh, how come fishing is not as good the 50's 60's and 70's?

I will let you AO fisheries management people answer that one.:)

Because people were not using barbless hooks?

Don't be Suzuki sucker.

[BeeGuy]

And I bet you "feel" real good. And that is good too. Because that is what fishing is all about.

Even though Alberta has a collapsed fishery, I see the objective of the fisheries department has not changed over 30 years.

Lets make those voters feel real good, and to hexx with the fish.

If they want barbless, give them barbless, If they want Bass give them Bass.

This is not a province where fisheries management is taken seriously.

Like Duh, how come fishing is not as good the 50's 60's and 70's?

I will let you AO fisheries management people answer that one.:)

Because people were not using barbless hooks?

Don't be Suzuki sucker.


It's because there are many, many more people fishing now. Quite simple really. The technical term is 'fishing pressure' and it has gone up.

Can you enter a discussion without name calling?

[huntsfurfish]

I will bet you this is how the decision for barbless hooks was made in Alberta.

Upper level fisheries biologist: " There is no evidence that barbless hooks will significantly create damage to our fisheries."
ADM: "Since a few people are screaming for barbless lets go with it and get the pressure off our backs. I will get a fat raise and promotion for not stirring anythiing up."

Thats the real world boys and girls.


There fixed it.LOL


That about says it all:)