Fisheries Round Table in Medicine Hat

[bloom]

Terry Clayton, Fisheries Biologist with Alberta Fish and Wildlife, will be holding a meeting at the Beyond Walls School on Wednesday night, March 28 at 8PM. The purpose of the meeting is to give anglers an opportunity to provide Terry with ideas for angling regulation changes and ways to improve fisheries in the Medicine Hat area. Terry will not be giving a formal presentation, but instead will try to answer questions from those anglers present.

Beyond Walls school is at 1008A Allowance Ave (it looks more like a business than a school). It's by the overpass and REDI Enterprises. (Also across the street from the Outdoorsman sporting goods store).

[npauls]

Hopefully someone who attends can make some suggestions on how to improve 40 mile as a solid fishery again.

From what I have heard, That place used to be a solid fishery and has gone down hill big time over the past 5-7 years.

I won't be able to make it I don't think but hope that there is a big turn out.

Thanks for posting this up here Bloom.

[huntsfurfish]

:)That solid fishery used to be closed(0-limit on walleye). Was opened to 1 fish over 55 just like ridge(and opened at the same time also). I think both are not to bad yet. Not as good after being open for awhile but that would be fairly normal(as is Ridge). Has been open only about that long 7yrs or so. Have you fished 40 mile much Nate?

[tallieho]

thanks for the info.Bloom...I can't attend,but i sure hope that someone asks about Dipping Vat lake.This was at one time going to be a Quality Lk.Fishery,now it's a slough looking for some friends.Back in it's hay days this little lk.,used to produce 8-10lb fish.This was before the tripoloids came about.Which says ,that it has lotsa food for the fish,very little fishing pressure..thanks again Bloom..I'll be at the Prov.Rnd TBL.Mtg. in Red Deer in april..

[whitetail Junkie]

I for one am pretty satisfied with the fisheries around Medicine hat....

Forty mile lake is a mystery on why the fish seem to not get over 55cm often.There are alot of walleye in forty mile,and some days you can catch tons,but good luck getting one over 55cm on every outing...

seems when you do catch one over 55cm ,it's way above the legal size limit,like 65-75 cm which is like a 9-11 pound walleye,and because your only allowed one fish over 55cm,I have a feeling that these pigs are being put into the boat!

-They should keep the one fish a day and put in a slot size of 50cm-55cm or they should have a 0 catch limit for something like 5 years...thats my opinion.

[whitetail Junkie]

Aswell allow bait and Ice fishing at bullshead lake...........:evilgrin:

[npauls]

:)That solid fishery used to be closed(0-limit on walleye). Was opened to 1 fish over 55 just like ridge(and opened at the same time also). I think both are not to bad yet. Not as good after being open for awhile but that would be fairly normal(as is Ridge). Has been open only about that long 7yrs or so. Have you fished 40 mile much Nate?

Not very much. The last time I was there was a few years ago. I was hearing people talk about how good it was before I ever fished there and have heard that it has slowly declined over the years.

[BigJon]

I for one am pretty satisfied with the fisheries around Medicine hat....

Forty mile lake is a mystery on why the fish seem to not get over 55cm often.There are alot of walleye in forty mile,and some days you can catch tons,but good luck getting one over 55cm on every outing...

seems when you do catch one over 55cm ,it's way above the legal size limit,like 65-75 cm which is like a 9-11 pound walleye,and because your only allowed one fish over 55cm,I have a feeling that these pigs are being put into the boat!

-They should keep the one fish a day and put in a slot size of 50cm-55cm or they should have a 0 catch limit for something like 5 years...thats my opinion.

WOW. Those fish must be pretty chunky. I've caught alot of walleye in the 65cm range and none of them were close to 9lbs. I've even caught a handful in the 70-77 range but haven't hit 11lbs.

[WayneChristie]

dont know many of the fisheries around the Hat, but I am hoping to make it to the meeting anyways, maybe learn a few lake X's :bad_boys_20:

[Fishfinder]

dont know many of the fisheries around the Hat, but I am hoping to make it to the meeting anyways, maybe learn a few lake X's :bad_boys_20:

Stay away from my lakes Wayne, u have enough lake X's:fighting0030:
Would love to attend meeting, unfortunately I am out of town till Friday.

WJ, I'm confused, ice fishing is allowed at Bullshead? Am I missing something...perhaps the joke?:confused0074:

X2, thanx for posting this up her Bloom.
If anyone on here attends, please keep us informed on the discussions held.:)

[greylynx]

Don't give the guy a rough time.

Just tell him that you notice that someone from the ADM's office is not here.

He will just smile and not say anything.

[WayneChristie]

Stay away from my lakes Wayne, u have enough lake X's:fighting0030:
Would love to attend meeting, unfortunately I am out of town till Friday.

WJ, I'm confused, ice fishing is allowed at Bullshead? Am I missing something...perhaps the joke?:confused0074:

X2, thanx for posting this up her Bloom.
If anyone on here attends, please keep us informed on the discussions held.:)

thought the bears up north had finished you off, good to see you posting again.

[Fishfinder]

thought the bears up north had finished you off, good to see you posting again.

Thanx, been trying not to post, as it just depresses me to be unable to fish. 1 more week and I'm back. Lol, Yogi is still sleeping and I'ma outta here before he wakes! Wolverines, lynx, and wolves aplenty though:scared0018:
Will get in touch for sure and we'll go find some fish this spring/summer. Lotsa time off coming. This should be a pm I guess, o well, to lazy to retype it.

[Guitarplayingfish]

Talk about Improving fisheries in the Med Hat Area? Maybe they should try Improving fisheries in the entire province of Alberta.. sure the hat is a good start, but will he be stopping anywhere else...?

Regardless, hopefully the turn out is good.

[whitetail Junkie]

Stay away from my lakes Wayne, u have enough lake X's:fighting0030:
Would love to attend meeting, unfortunately I am out of town till Friday.

WJ, I'm confused, ice fishing is allowed at Bullshead? Am I missing something...perhaps the joke?:confused0074:

X2, thanx for posting this up her Bloom.
If anyone on here attends, please keep us informed on the discussions held.:)

Ice Fishing is allowed at bulls head if there is still ice on the lake as of April the 1st like last year....however what I was getting at is that it would be great to be able to fish bullshead year round,even without useing bait....Cant see it happening though.

While we are on the Subject i'll See you out there next sunday on April 1st.I'll be with my cousin and his two year old son,i'll be wearing carharts or a plade jacket....probley fishing the small pond or off the rock dam!

[whitetail Junkie]

WOW. Those fish must be pretty chunky. I've caught alot of walleye in the 65cm range and none of them were close to 9lbs. I've even caught a handful in the 70-77 range but haven't hit 11lbs.

Very fat walleye in the man made southern alberta lakes....forty mile fish are so chunky that fish between 45-50cm are over 3 pounds

These are from another lake,and the middle eyeball was around 72cm and was just over 10 pounds,which I originally threw back.The fish had a cut on her which I reconized.I swear to god 5 days later I caught her again,so i figured that it was meant to be,so into the frying pan for the family she went....
http://i875.photobucket.com/albums/ab316/whitetail_junkie/051.jpg

[chubbdarter]

Talk about Improving fisheries in the Med Hat Area? Maybe they should try Improving fisheries in the entire province of Alberta.. sure the hat is a good start, but will he be stopping anywhere else...?

Regardless, hopefully the turn out is good.

Terry is holding round tables in areas that he governs as part of his territory.

[WayneChristie]

any members hitting the meeting?

[Fishfinder]

Grrrrrr, I really wish I could be there. You might be the only one Wayne!!! If you still plan to go can you ask a couple questions for me. What is the plan for the Med Hat college pond? Did they put fish back in it? Are they going to? What species, pike and perch again? I really enjoy floating around there when I'm too lazy to go out to a lake/river or if I just need to be close to town for whatever reason. Great lil pond for kids to learn to fish, would hate to see it go to waste.
Cheers n GL:)

[WayneChristie]

I will add those questions to my list. actually that is my whole list :) Id like to ask about the state of the sturgeon fishery as well I guess, just out of curiousity, although I hope they never do bring back a keeper limit.

[Fishfinder]

I will add those questions to my list. actually that is my whole list :) Id like to ask about the state of the sturgeon fishery as well I guess, just out of curiousity, although I hope they never do bring back a keeper limit.

Thanx alot Wayne:) and X2 about the sturgeos, do inquire, please.
Cheers.

[chubbdarter]

I will add those questions to my list. actually that is my whole list :) Id like to ask about the state of the sturgeon fishery as well I guess, just out of curiousity, although I hope they never do bring back a keeper limit.

Right on WC, your doing the right thing. It makes a difference in the long run. Stand and be heard the fishermans opinion has value and can fill in the blanks of even the most scientific study of a water body.

[WayneChristie]

Anyone else from the area that cant make it and has questions, let me know I will try and get answers for you.

[yulful]

Do you have to register for this? Or can I just walk in?

[WayneChristie]

Do you have to register for this? Or can I just walk in?

I hope just walk in, thats what Im going to be doing

[cdkeim]

I suspect I will be there as well tomorrow night if nuttin comes up between now and then. it will be interesting to see if there are any plans for this area beyond the status quo.

[Fishfinder]

Right on guys, I agree with Chubby, the more fisherpeople there, the better. Power by #s:) and if I had to venture a guess, 99.9% certain you can just walk in.

[Daceminnow]

Anyone else from the area that cant make it and has questions, let me know I will try and get answers for you.



would you update us with any info spoke of regarding bullshead? are they happy with the status of the fishery under the current regulations? any changes to the current regulations ever been or being discussed? say through trout unlimited and themselves (Bios and SRD). thanks wayne.

and bloom, thanks for the thread.

Dace

[WayneChristie]

would you update us with any info spoke of regarding bullshead? are they happy with the status of the fishery under the current regulations? any changes to the current regulations ever been or being discussed? say through trout unlimited and themselves (Bios and SRD). thanks wayne.

and bloom, thanks for the thread.

Dace

no prob, although it might be hard to say Bullshead and not the other Bull word when talking to a member of the government. always a first time I guess :sHa_sarcasticlol::sHa_sarcasticlol:

[ishootbambi]

keep this up top.....today is the day of the meeting.

[WayneChristie]

leaving after I eat, see you there, if anyone else from the forum shows up.

[greylynx]

Please post and tell the rest of us in alberta what happened.

Thanks.

[ronnyboy]

we are so backwards .............leave the 50cm + fish...........slot limit should be 2 under 50cm,were taking away our mature fish ???????????????

[huntsfurfish]

we are so backwards .............leave the 50cm + fish...........slot limit should be 2 under 50cm,were taking away our mature fish ???????????????

Then we would just be taking away the all the fish:)

[Pudelpointer]

Sooooo, what happened?

[cdkeim]

I left at 9:45 and it felt like the meeting was just getting going. Wayne was hanging in there pretty good. to that point, all they had discussed was commercial fishing in southern alberta lakes, and improvements that could be made to Reeser and Bullshead fisheries. Wayne should have more info.
Chris

[ishootbambi]

i was there until the end....but i feel out of place in the fishing forum. ill let wayne fill you guys in.

[WayneChristie]

have to do it tomorrow or at least what I can remember, just got home and Im beat. as usual senility sets in and there is a lot I cant remember, but I am going to email Terry with some specific questions and post the reply. best thing for me , besides the large turnout, was to learn that the spots on sturgeon I was concerned about are nothing to worry about, nothing more than random spotting.

[cdkeim]

Thanks for hanging in there Wayne and ISB. You guys did better than I did. How late did it go?

[yulful]

I left around 10:30 and they where still going at it. I'm brand new to this and the meeting was great I've learned alot, maybe too much about commercial fishing. But either way the turn out seemed excellent. There was some great ideas about screening the spillway at bullshead to prevent the fish in the spring from leaving (if this goes foward i'd like to help in anyway).

[cdkeim]

My first meeting as well and I was impressed as well. I was impressed with the amount of local knowledge about the fisheries alot of the guys have. I definitely have lots to learn.

[Pudelpointer]

And...... What the heck happened? Any info on the various reservoirs? Any info on Dipping Vat? Plans for the future? Anything?


Come on guys, help out those of us who couldn't make it.

[cdkeim]

Hey PP, I was there for the first 1:45 hr and all that was discussed to that point were:
1) commercial fisheries Quotas and catches for southern alta lakes and the obvious questions of whyis there a commercial fishery here?, is it monitered?, etc. No changes came from that.

2) Bullshead-discussion on maintainence of water levels and prevention or recapture of fish lost out spillway into creek. Possible fish traps, fencing with future discussions to come on that.

3) Reeser- complaints of suckers and poor trout quality. discussed possibility of introducing browns to aid with sucker population reduction and improved gating to keep suckers out and browns in if they were introduced. Again, Terry has to look further into it.
That is a brief summary upto the point I left. Hope that helps.:)

[cdkeim]

Aaaand some discussion about water levels at Cavan Lake and issues that come from that.

[ishootbambi]

alright, if wayne is out fishing, heres what was discussed.

a good chunk of time was spent with anglers upset at the commercial guys. facts are that the 2011 winter had a well below harvest considering how much is available. we are down to 5 guys left with commercial licences and a lot of water was unfishable this winter due to unsafe ice. the highest southern water harvest was lake newell with an allowable catch of 200 000 lbs of whitefish.....188 000 were taken.

the usual complaints of how commercial guys are stealing from us all were voiced and how it should be stopped. i think a lot of guys in that room were surprised to learn that whitefish were introduced simply to have a commercial fishery, and that whitefish breed plenty fast enough to keep up to the harvest. another thing that got guys thinking was hearing that if the commercial harvest stopped, there MAY be a danger to the pike and walleye fisheries due to overcrowding and stress, and whitefish potentially eating the eggs of other gamefish.

penalties for overharvest were explained...and most agreed that it was too lenient. also explained is that someone from srd is nearly always there monitoring the commercial fishery on the days it is actually happening. one thing ive always found peculiar is how srd views pike and walleye as gamefish....but whitefish are not....at least in terms of the commercial fishery.

[ishootbambi]

next up was bullshead. there are no plans in the near future to lift the quality fishery title from that lake. support for it is nearly unanimous, but police outpost seems to be split more down the middle. for now police remains a quality fishery, but there are no guarantees it will stay that way. anyway, about bullshead....some discussion about the massive numbers of fish lost over the spillway last spring when water levels rose to heights never seen before. local groups are going to devise a plan to erect a trap of some sort at the bottom with the plan that volunteers may be able to transport the fish back up into the lake. for now, its a long way off, but if something develops on that front, im sure it will get reported here. we were told that any such idea would have to happen down in the creek as the department does not want the lake spillway altered. in the mean time, it has been decided that bullshead will be stocked in fall rather than spring to minimize losses.

also, i had terry confirm the reason that bullshead is off limits during winter. it is to protect the quality fishery. because the vast majority of fish caught are returned to the lake, keeping anglers away in the cold winter months only makes sense. damage to gill tissues can happen fast at temps only barely below freezing. given that the wind howling in this part of alberta is the norm, and most winters reach temps of -20 pretty regular, mortality on released fish during those weather extremes could be significant. same goes for the bait ban. fish taken on bait often have the hook deeper in the throat and mortality is higher.

[ishootbambi]

next topic was reesor. the suckers are outcompeting the rainbows for food resulting in stunted unhealthy fish. the suckers have entered the lake through the inlet canal from battle creek. the grate preventing that is in unknown condition, but its suspected to be faulty. same with the grate on the outlet...unknown condtion. a possible solution is to introduce browns too possibly keep the suckers at bay. it is unlikely that large brood stock would survive the trip that far from the hatchery, so IF it happens, it will be more of a long term plan. IF it happens, there likely will be restrictive limits on the harvest of browns....at the very least until browns have grown to enough size to be a legitimate predator to the suckers. it was agreed that rainbows and browns do coexist in several lakes, so rainbows likely would still be stocked as well as the browns.

i regards to this, terry made it clear that he is not opposed to this plan, and that there is no negative side effects to be concerned with IF brown trout were introduced to reesor lake. he made it clear that it is not on his list of priorities at this time, but if he sees enough interest from local anglers to initiate this plan that it is quite doable.

i asked him straight out....will 100 emails be enough to get your attention?....and his response was that it would likely only take a dozen or so to put it on his list of things to do. if you would like to see brown trout in reesor, send terry clayton an email with your thoughts.

[ishootbambi]

cavan was discussed next. the biggest problem with cavan lake is trying to keep water in it. i actually knew a little more about the problems than terry did. i explained that cavan is not actually a lake, but an irrigation reservoir. the water users have first rights to the lake and having fish in there is a bonus that we get from it. i explained the political issues involved in it, where the water comes from and goes to, and why the farmers down the hill get first rights to the water.

this was a thread here on AO a while back. with enough political pressure, cavan lake could be kept full of water and the irrigation users would not have to give up anything in return. if anyone wants more details on this, send me a pm and ill get you the up to date info. i havent heard anything new on this front in a year or so, so i wont type what i know as there may be some new developments i am unaware of.

another thing regarding cavan that didnt come up at the meeting was that the medicine hat fish and game association has agreed in the past to donate the money to purchase an aerator for cavan if water levels drop too low and winterkill is imminent. again, that was a year and a half ago, so i suppose i shouldnt say that it holds true today, although i suspect it does.

[ishootbambi]

sturgeon also were discussed. there is a university student that is working on tracking sturgeon using telemetry tags. there are 123 (iirc) sturgeon that have been tagged locally with the electronic tags. there are several locations all along the river that are picking up the signals from these fish. one fish tagged at koomati (suffield) went all the way to lake diefenbaker over the winter, and appeared to be spawning near the grand forks. thats some miles. another fish was tagged near the forks and a week later was recaptured (by angling) near whiterock coulee. a week later, it was caught again at the rattlesnake hole (olechowski for locals). there were several other fish that really didnt move anywhere. some spent the entire year in a very small stretch of river. there seems to be no rhyme or reason as to why the fish travel, stay or otherwise.

further, 2 local guys have been tagging fish for a few years now. they have tagged (spaghetti tags) over 1200 fish. terry believes the sturgeon population to be in much better shape than what was thought just five years ago, and the population seems to be increasing nicely. from accounts from both terry and the university student, and the two local guys....all age groups seem to be plentiful right from wee little 10 inchers all the way up to the great big lunkers everyone dreams of catching.

from reports by the local guys, srd, and the roomful of local anglers, the rate of catching sturgeon that are tagged seems to run between 10 and 20 percent. very good news on all fronts for sturgeon in the SSR.

[ishootbambi]

the semi-formal fish talk lasted until around 10:50. by then, most of the guests had packed it in, and the talk turned to fishing stories, hunting stories, and other general socializing. i left at 11 and there were 4 guys remaining including terry.

to the other guys that were there, if i left out anything feel free to add. :)

[cdkeim]

Ok, Ok....so I left out a few details..LOL. thanks ISB, that was a well written report. A+ Hope to get those dozen emails as it would be interesting to see how the browns fair in reeser and what effect they have on the suckers and rainbows.

[chubbdarter]

ishootbambi, thats a well done summary Thank You.
To all of you sportsman who attended your regional round table, Thank You. Its your local knowledge that can have a direct influence on how Albertas fishery is managed.
I hope everyone attends their regional fisheries round table meeting.
On behalf of Alberta fisherman, Thank you all

[Daceminnow]

yes. thanks to all the sportsman that attend to represent us. presence from us at these events are very important. thanks also to those who have reported back information from the meeting thus far. bambi, you must be a heck of a note taker. good job.

Dace

[whitetail Junkie]

sturgeon also were discussed. there is a university student that is working on tracking sturgeon using telemetry tags. there are 123 (iirc) sturgeon that have been tagged locally with the electronic tags. there are several locations all along the river that are picking up the signals from these fish. one fish tagged at koomati (suffield) went all the way to lake diefenbaker over the winter, and appeared to be spawning near the grand forks. thats some miles. another fish was tagged near the forks and a week later was recaptured (by angling) near whiterock coulee. a week later, it was caught again at the rattlesnake hole (olechowski for locals). there were several other fish that really didnt move anywhere. some spent the entire year in a very small stretch of river. there seems to be no rhyme or reason as to why the fish travel, stay or otherwise.

further, 2 local guys have been tagging fish for a few years now. they have tagged (spaghetti tags) over 1200 fish. terry believes the sturgeon population to be in much better shape than what was thought just five years ago, and the population seems to be increasing nicely. from accounts from both terry and the university student, and the two local guys....all age groups seem to be plentiful right from wee little 10 inchers all the way up to the great big lunkers everyone dreams of catching.

from reports by the local guys, srd, and the roomful of local anglers, the rate of catching sturgeon that are tagged seems to run between 10 and 20 percent. very good news on all fronts for sturgeon in the SSR.

wow thats alot of typing! Thanks for your effort in shareing what was spoken at the meeting! 2 things...

1.a link to send an email for the Brown Trout in Reesor would be great

2.I knew that the sturgeon were doing very well,was there any talk of a potential harvest on a draw system,just like at some lakes for walleye?

[greylynx]

Thank you Mr IshootBambi.

Excellent factual posting.

I will be returning to your posts

Thanks again.

[pikergolf]

IshootBambi Thank you for taking the time to type all that out. PM sent.

[WayneChristie]

Thank you Mr Bambi for your excellent report, actually I was rototilling my garden. We also discussed the reasoning behind netting whites in spawning season, which is because the roe is a valuable commodity in the Japanese market. As well, the netters in Newell are trying out some live traps, so that incidental catches of pike and walleye can be returned live to the water.

[WayneChristie]

Also for fishfinder, your favourite little pond in town was discussed, Terry wasnt sure who actually owned it, but the general consensus was that since its fed from St Marys it will eventually be repopulated naturally.

[ishootbambi]

hey guys....glad everyone is happy with the report. it was actually wayne taking notes, and with his experience in the fishing forum i thought id give him first crack, but it sounded like pudel was getting anxious.....:) sorry if i stole your thunder wayne. i actually took no notes at all....i have been to many of these and most of what went on is stuff ive been through and discussed many times, but as always, there were a few newthings to learn.

wayne, yep you caught a couple details i missed.

junkie....no talk or hope of a sturgeon harvest in the near future. i suspect it will take a few more years of solid data from the tagging program to convince the powers that be that the river could possibly sustain a limited harvest. now this is NOT FACT, but just my hunch.....i doubt we will see it again.

for those wishing to send terry clayton a message, his email addy is Terry.Clayton@gov.ab.ca

pudel....dipping vat was mentioned briefly, but no discussion was entertained simply because the more local topics around medicine hat took precedence.

[huntsfurfish]

Thanks for the report ishoot.

[Fishfinder]

Excellent report indeed ISB. Thx very much for taking the time to type it out for all of us to read. Interesting stuff. Fish beware, I'ma coming home!:sHa_shakeshout:

[WayneChristie]

your thunder was definitely louder than mine, Im glad you posted your report for sure. I am glad I did the drive, I learned quite a bit even if it cost me a bit of sleep, well worth it. I was impressed with the turnout and the knowledgable locals, it was far from a boring 3 hours. as for a sturgeon harvest, Ive never eaten one, but with the state of the rivers and the no fish consumption advisories, I dont think it would make any sense to bring back a harvest of any sort, there are many other species and Im sure better tasting species out there for the people who want to keep something for the table.

[Shawnlh]

Thanks for the report ISB.
If you guys need any help with Cavan sustainability, I can gather the names of the first and second water rights owners if needed. I'm sure that is probably known already, but thought I'd offer anyways.
I know a local farmer from the area who seems quite knowledgeable, and he told me that it's only 2 people that are allowed to divert the spring run off before it gets to Cavan. He figures that if they would pull from the irrigation district instead of damming and flooding, Cavan would be much more sustainable. Now don't quote me on this, I'm just passing on what I was told. But if I can help in anyway, just let me know.

[Pudelpointer]

Thanks ISB and WC. I am really interested in what is going on / discussed at the local round tables / open houses.

We get only the the most cursory of reports at AFGA conference. Terry was at conference this year but only presented on the Sturgeon research.

This forum is great for keeping everyone informed.



Thanks again guys.

[jrs]

Good update guys. By the sounds of it anyone fishing outpost this year should be sending in pictures of the larger fish if we want to keep the trophy regs. The local old guys around here have been spreading rumors the fish have stunted and there's nothing in there over 12'', theres a push wanting it to retun to a meat fishery.
I'm hoping there's some open houses more in the Lethbridge area, its important to keep up to date and in touch with the regional managers, open houses provide a great opportunity.
Anyway, appreciate the meeting report.