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View Full Version : Seibert Lake Walleye and Pike Status, and Why Albertas regulations are they way they are.


Levy
07-26-2012, 11:56 AM
So those of you who were following the Seibert lake Petition thread have the most to gain from this but i think everyone could learn a thing or two. All I'm doing is relaying information gained from a meeting with the Lakeland Biologist (as promised). Because I am unable to get a hold of unpublished and active research i cannot produce a presentation with nice figures and charts on fish ages, sizes, and distribution in Seibert Lake. I can however relay the info i have gleaned. Also this fall the Catch and Release proposal for Seibert Lake Pike will be brought up in the meeting and if there is a warm welcome to the idea it could possibly be implemented in 2013 but it is more likely to be brought before the board in 2013 for the 2014 regulations.

So i met with Jordan Walker who is responsible for the lakes in the beaver reaver drainage basin a while ago and he gave a good hour long talk on whats happening in our province with regulations, why they are the way they are, and how the fisheries are improving and changing.

Jordan said the SRD has three priorities; Producing self sustaining fish populations, Aboriginal Rights, and Sport Fishing. With Producing self sustaining fish populations being the most important and producing good sport fishing being the least important.

He also said the biggest complaint they get is that the alberta regulations allow for the harvest of large breeder fish and the lakes are full of small ones. In Alberta the high population, low number of lakes, and small variety of species (compared to the states or provinces like Ontario) in our lakes allows them to be fished out very easily. An Alberta lake will have at most five species that one can target. In most Alberta lakes two species that can be effectively targeted. If we went back to limits where we were allowed to keep fish before they reach maturity and before they have a few years to reproduce we would easily fish out that species before a significant number of them were able to breed.

The current regulations have produced improvements across the board over the past decade with a few exceptions. Slot sizes for walleye have been tried in the past to protect the big breeders and what was found was large number of illegal harvests by a few cm almost completely eliminated the fish in the protected slot size.

The health of a population of fish in a lake is assessed by marking and recapturing over several years. Four characteristics are used to assess the health of a population; age class distribution (number of adults and juveniles), age class stability (distinct numbers of fish at a certain age, and length), age at maturity (females at reproductive age), and growth speed. These four characteristics are graded as Trophy, Stable, Vulnerable, and Collapsed. In Seibert lake past netting since 2000 has put the walleye population at vulnerable. Netting in 2010 seemed to indicated the walleye population was collapsing, but that it may be that the netting that year failed to get a good representation of the population.

Seibert lake doesn't have very good growing conditions and mature female topped out at around 60 cm. Even if they were 17 years old. The majority of walleye in the lake didn't start reproducing until they were close to 50 cm and around eight years old.

The northern pike have not been directly studied but have been measured and assessed because they were captured in netting as well. The largest pike seen in the survey was 110cm and netting saw maybe two or three other pike over that 100 cm mark. What was interesting was how fast the pike were growing. They could make it to 100 cm in some cases as quickly as 10 years, but usually in 12 or 13 indicating a large ecological void for the population to fill. The highest density of fish were caught in a size range between 65 and 70 cm.

Wether its loss of habitat, illegal harvests, or incidental catch and release mortalities, pike are not making it to the legal harvest size.

Jordan Walker also discussed other lakes and show some examples of healthy fisheries across the province. If you are interested in getting a more in depth understanding on the Alberta fisheries management practices and methods, or if your are want to suggest a regulations change call your local Fish and Wildlife office and ask when the next meeting is for proposed regulations changes is. They are usually hosted in the fall and will offer you the chance to give input, learn, and contribute to the fisheries in your area. Im no english professor so if my grammer has made somethings unclear just ask.


Levy

Mutter87
07-26-2012, 12:03 PM
So what your saying is that those clowns that are keeping the big Walleye really are hurting our waters like me and others have been saying? Interesting. Hopefully Alberta starts sending people to prison who keep these big walleye so our fisheries have a chance to improve.

pickrel pat
07-26-2012, 12:05 PM
thanx again Levy........ another interesting good read.

Nakoda boater
07-26-2012, 12:22 PM
Interesting, Thanks.:)

Graffy91
07-26-2012, 01:07 PM
So what your saying is that those clowns that are keeping the big Walleye really are hurting our waters like me and others have been saying? Interesting. Hopefully Alberta starts sending people to prison who keep these big walleye so our fisheries have a chance to improve.

Man I love you. Hahahaha.

Bigwoodsman
07-26-2012, 01:34 PM
Man I love you. Hahahaha.

Thanks Levy. Keep up the good work on this fishery it is a gem that needs saving.

BW

BeeGuy
07-26-2012, 01:48 PM
Great summary, thanks.

ReconWilly
07-26-2012, 03:05 PM
Facts are facts, thanks Levy.

schmedlap
07-26-2012, 04:08 PM
Thanks for keeping on this matter Levy.
The info on the Walleye is interesting because it completely contradicts my experience. I perceive that the Walleye are bigger on average and more abundant than they were at any time over the last 20+ years. Either the netting was just spectacularly unlucky, or I am catching far more "accidentally" (looking for large Pike), than I was "intentionally" (targeting them) - I suppose anything is possible but...(?). If the over 60's are that rare and old, I won't chow down on one next time out. But we have caught several of those last 3-4 trips.

Levy
07-26-2012, 05:15 PM
Thanks for keeping on this matter Levy.
The info on the Walleye is interesting because it completely contradicts my experience. I perceive that the Walleye are bigger on average and more abundant than they were at any time over the last 20+ years. Either the netting was just spectacularly unlucky, or I am catching far more "accidentally" (looking for large Pike), than I was "intentionally" (targeting them) - I suppose anything is possible but...(?). If the over 60's are that rare and old, I won't chow down on one next time out. But we have caught several of those last 3-4 trips.

From what i remember there are many more large walleye now than in 2000, this is believed to be from a change from a slot size to the current 1 over 50 cm harvest limit. The 2006 survey showed the healthiest numbers of adult walleye around 50 cm with no 60 cm ones. The 2010 survey showed the largest eyes but very few. The most significant number of the 2010 population were the small guys. I asked the bio if the largest were the oldest and they were not. The oldest fish was an 17 or 18 year old female at and she was 51 cm. They increase in size consistently until about 45 cm then they plateau. If i remember correct the many of the old walleye in 2010 were 12 and 13 years old and any where from 45 to 60 cm in length (variable growth rates). 98 must have been a good year for rearing and spawning.

schmedlap
07-26-2012, 07:24 PM
Of course, it's entirely possible that it is a matter of the year classes, and the big Walleye will fall off in abundance once those years die out. 2 years ago we had one up to the boat, but escaped on it's last surge, that was at least 26-27 inches (pushing 70 cm) and 7-8 pounds (very beefy indeed). The surprise of seeing that beast at Siebert was probably a factor in it's escape. I would have released it anyway, on a "good genes" basis. Obviously a very rare beast, so one hopes she bred successfully (?) before she expired.
Still, it seems pretty clear that the "over 100" pike population is way down, with almost no really huge mommas left. One assumes that the big ones are feasting on those good Walleye year classes (?). Having never cut one open (we release them, of course) I don't know, but it seems logical from experience elsewhere (?). The lake is capable of producing the REALLY huge ones, from historical accounts, in large numbers, and it would be a shame if this was gone forever. I guess I'll never see a 117 cm again, but it would sure be nice if my sons, who hold this as their favorite place (not just the fishing, but the camping, scenery, wildlife) for a weekend of fishing and camping, had a chance to. The bottom line here is that there is just no good reason to kill those big pike, and one hopes this will be prohibited at some point in the near future. Seeing the carcass of a 106 cm pike in the garbage at the cleaning station just makes me sick, and I have yet to see anyone, at all, defend it. I doubt that the triumphant fisher in question needed the meat to feed his kids(?).
Of course, its not the people who populate this forum who are the problem. It's others who need an education in their own best interests.
The Pike will thank you, if the general population does not. We are very thankful of your unexpected and intelligent efforts.

Penner
07-27-2012, 11:21 AM
The largest pike seen in the survey was 110cm and netting saw maybe two or three other pike over that 100 cm mark. What was interesting was how fast the pike were growing. They could make it to 100 cm in some cases as quickly as 10 years, but usually in 12 or 13 indicating a large ecological void for the population to fill. The highest density of fish were caught in a size range between 65 and 70 cm.

Wether its loss of habitat, illegal harvests, or incidental catch and release mortalities, pike are not making it to the legal harvest size.

This point makes me laugh "Book Smart" (Biologist) vs "Street Smart" (Some of Us Anglers)! Pike are easily making it to the 100cm mark the issue is (as the studies proves) the Pike are being caught and kept thus filtering out most of the 100cm plus Pike. :sHa_sarcasticlol:!


Make this a "C&R" fishery or a specialized "Tag" fishery allowing some select harvest and you'll have plenty of +100cm Pike. I'd be willing to put my paycheck on that.

Good feedback. Enjoyed reading it! Hopefully we see some change.