Gun News - Rifle Manufacturer John Noveske Mysteriously Killed Shortly After Posting Controversial Article

[magnummike]

Conspiracy theory who knows???

But read the bottom of John Noveske's last writing to see what is responsible for all these shootings..........Pharmaceutical DRUGS!!!



http://www.texasgopvote.com/issues/stop-big-government/gun-news-rifle-manufacturer-john-noveske-mysteriously-killed-shortly-after-005014

[CaberTosser]

Reading the article I was surprised to hear of the murder of the creator of FPS Russia, which they noted was the #10 YouTube account. If the creator is also the 'host' of that series I don't know, but its shocking all the same.

Edit: Further checking revealed that the murder victim was not the FPSRussia host, but a producer.

I don't know if the drugs or the pre-existing mental illness these killers had was the primary cause of the murders they committed, but its an interesting theory. I'm sure there are many people on those med who haven't gone on to kill.....

[magnummike]

Here's another article


http://www.naturalnews.com/038616_John_Noveske_mysterious_death_car_crash.htm l

[TreeGuy]

Here's another article


http://www.naturalnews.com/038616_John_Noveske_mysterious_death_car_crash.htm l

Good God!

That's maybe one of the most ridiculous articles I've ever read! "Orders from the top", are the reason for Sandy Hook? The GOVERNMENT had a shooter/s slaughter 20 six year old children?????

It's the stupidest damn thing I've ever read.

Do these gun fanatics even realize that they're making us ALL look like raving lunitics?

Too angry to continue productively.........

[tractor1971]

Reminded me of a joke I heard a long time ago. The Newfie decided to go to the bar with a few friends, but heard that mixing different drinks does not work too well. He stuck with rum and coke for the night, and got really hammered. Learning from the experience, he decided to try a different combination the next time, stuck with brandy and coke. He got hammered again. Really trying something different, he tried to stick with vodka and coke the next time- and got hammered again. This time he figured out what caused his predicament- it was the coke.......:sign0161:

[CaberTosser]

Oh, I suppose I should join TreeGuy in noting the tinfoil hat nature of the second link, the first one hinted at possibilities, but at least allowed for the fact that the storys are just revealing themselves (in relation to the FPSRussia murder at least, as the Noveske car accident seems pretty cut & dried). Even the OP's title is misleading: John Noveske Mysteriously Killed? Really? Its a freaking single vehicle car accident where the kinetic energy of a human body at speed loses against a collision with a stationary boulder or two. There's not a shred of mystery there until one starts rambling about big pharma, illuminati and maybe throw in a Masonic lodge or two for good measure. And naturally Obama's "kill list", don't forget that :rolleyes:. Somewere in there will be stuff about aliens and Ghostbusters more than likely, right by the triple-agent assasin mermaid expose. I had quickly checked out the FPSRussia link and didn't root through the 'natural news' due to my not being paranoid.......

[magnummike]

Never mind the tin foil theories but what we should look at is John Noveske's Facebook posting.
Pharmaceutical drugs are linked and probably the cause of all these shootings.

[Ryry4]

Never mind the tin foil theories but what we should look at is John Noveske's Facebook posting.
Pharmaceutical drugs are linked and probably the cause of all these shootings.

A few too many coiencedenses going on.

[st99]

watch this one, and there's alot more...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhO0Pul_FcE&feature=player_embedded

[bigshell]

Never mind the tin foil theories but what we should look at is John Noveske's Facebook posting.
Pharmaceutical drugs are linked and probably the cause of all these shootings.

Hmmm, not all the same drug though,more than likley mental illness is to blame for random acts of INSANITY but then again what the heck would craziness have to do with killing strangers for nothing.....

[CaberTosser]

A few too many coiencedenses going on.


Like that every killer was crazy? Even checking into other singular or mass killings, tortures, horrific beatings, etc where the offenders had never been on such medications, it turns out that yup, they were crazy too!! A bit of a 'chicken and the egg' circular argument; perfect for random theories......

[Bushrat]

Yes there are crazy psychotic people out there, always have been. The drugs don't seem to help them much either. BUT... there are a whole lot of people who go to the doctor that are a little depressed or have a bit of anxiety. They are given prescriptions, they don't help, so they are given another, and another and so forth, they always seem to get worse and are given more powerful prescriptions. So now we have people that were a little out of sorts who are now full of drugs, they become sucicidal, pshycotic, full blown depression etc. The more they take the worse they seem to get. There is a lot of evidence that many of these people when taken off these drugs improve to the point of being back to just a little sad like they were in the first place or completely back to normal.

I personally know a guy who had problems focusing on his school work and his grades were slipping, his folks were worried that he might not graduate. He was given a prescription, he went from one light prescription to many, long story short he didn't graduate, beat up his mother and put her in hospital, he ended up in a mental hospital for over two years, the prescriptions continued, got so bad they ended up putting him into a rubber room. Over that time his body became toxic from the drugs they thought it might become fatal, he developed liver damage then had a heart attack. They didn't think he would live, took him off the drugs and simply sedated him, a week later he woke up lucid and feeling much better, he improved steadily, refused any more drugs. Within 3 months he was back at home and starting a job That was over 15 years ago and he has been fine since.

Its pretty telling when you see an add for a anti-smoking cessation medication on a TV add that tells you that the side effects can be psychotic episodes and suicidal feelings. They are dealing far more potent and dangerous drugs to children with developing minds like candy these days. Back in the day before kids were on antidepressants and such, you know, before the days of multiple school shootings when parents told their kids to pay attention in school and kicked their butts when they acted up, and let them simply get over or grow out of whatever was bothering them, we didn't have this problem in any magnitude compared to today when the first thing they do is give the kid a prescription at the first indication of sadness or anxiety. We are brain damaging our children instead of just letting them get over the ups and downs of growing up.

We are beginning to reap the results of a psychiatric medical community thats gotten completely out of control.

[purgatory.sv]

Go to service, embrace the fresh air.

[Matt L.]

I agree with ya Bushrat. This medicate the hell out of everything attitude has to stop. We're going to face even bigger problems if we don't.

[FishingMOM]

They are dealing far more potent and dangerous drugs to children with developing minds like candy these days.

We are brain damaging our children instead of just letting them get over the ups and downs of growing up.


It's worse than some Imagine.

When my son was 9 months. YES I SAID 9 MONTHS OLD the family doctor wanted to put him on Ritalin! To slow him down.
The doc felt he was hyper and needed to be on medication.

That doc was told in no uncertain terms where to go and where to stick his medications. We changed docs. As I no longer trusted that one.

I have also seen a family where the school officials attended medical appointments with a student and his family, because they wanted to be sure that the child was on a particular drug. Yes this student had issues and yes the parents had some issues including one parent being illiterate and the other having a reading/comprehension level below 3rd grade.

Another friend years ago had cervical cancer (undiagnosed) and her family doc couldn't figure out what was wrong with her. So they loaded her full of these drugs, and at one point the doc told the husband, the best he could ever hope for was that she would kill herself and he could get himself a good woman. They finally went to a new doc and the cancer was discovered. They did sue their family doctor and won. Once they got her off the nasty meds and dealt with the cancer she was back to being the loving wife he married.

Those with migraines are often given anti depressants as docs just figure its all in their heads.

Showing anger or being upset while in an appointment with the doctor can also result in them giving anti depressants.


It seems doctors are taught that these drugs are the be all and end all for everything that could be possibly be happening.

[bigshell]

Sure some Dr.'s just hand out pills for everything even a cold,won't argue with ya there.
But plenty of disturbed people who shoulda been on meds or institutionalized killed other folks.About 50 yrs ago a paraniod schitsophrenic with violent fantasies was released from a phsyciatric hospital to his parents care.Was given a prescription and told to take them.He went on to kill 9 members of a random household he went to along the highway.Now was that his pre-existing mental illness that made him do it or the drugs the Dr. prescribed???

[riden]

I haven't seen it mentioned, so I will. The oldest here is 27, and almost all of them are under 21.

As I understand mental illness, it usually appears in the late teens and continues to get worse. I think it is far more likely these young men all had severe mental illness and were undiagnosed. No expert, but I don't see many anti psychotic drugs on that list, these drugs were likely pointless given the severity of their illness. The article even blamed Paxil for a young man's hallucinations, I bet it wasn't the Paxil!


I am not judging the parents either. How hard would it be for parents to recognize their teen is severely ill and a threat to the public. How many of us could admit that about our teen? Even great parents would be trying to find help.

Actually, lets throw this out. You have an 18 year old, and you know he is disturbed and a threat. I bet you would have few options, and I bet all of them are extremely expensive. I don't think there are many easy answers here.

[catnthehat]

CRAP??!!:confused:
I didn't realize that John Noveske was dead!!
He was very well known in the firearms industry, for sure!
Cat

[Cyclops]

Hmmm, not all the same drug though,more than likley mental illness is to blame for random acts of INSANITY but then again what the heck would craziness have to do with killing strangers for nothing.....

You got it Pontiac. :) Blaming the drugs for these things is silly. Millions of people take these kind of drugs and it allows them to live their lives with relative normality. Yes, I believe the doctors are too quick with the prescription pad but mental illness is to blame, not the pills that attempt to help these people.

[bigshell]

I haven't seen it mentioned, so I will. The oldest here is 27, and almost all of them are under 21.

As I understand mental illness, it usually appears in the late teens and continues to get worse. I think it is far more likely this young men had severe mental illness and was undiagnosed. No expert, but I don't see many anti psychotic drugs on that list, these drugs were likely pointless given the severity of their illness. The article even blamed Paxil for a young man's hallucinations, I bet it wasn't the Paxil!


I am not judging the parents either. How hard would it be for parents to recognize their teen is severely ill and a threat to the public. How many of us could admit that about our teen? Even great parents would be trying to find help.

Actually, lets throw this out. You have an 18 year old, and you know he is disturbed and a threat. I bet you would have few options, and I bet all of them are extremely expensive. I don't think there are many easy answers here.

A freinds son shot a guy in Calgary last year.He is 25 yrs old He was diagnosed with ADDHD shortly after he began school.He self medicated with pot.He had delusions about being a mafia dude,bought a pistol from somewhere and just shot a fella outside the train station.
His Mom blames herself.I doubt its her fault.

[FishingMOM]

No expert, but I don't see many anti psychotic drugs on that list, these drugs were likely pointless given the severity of their illness. The article even blamed Paxil for a young man's hallucinations, I bet it wasn't the Paxil!



Eric Harris age 17 (first on Zoloft then Luvox)
ZOLOFT (sertraline hydrochloride) is indicated for the treatment of major depressive disorder in adults.
LUVOX Fluvoxamine Maleate (fluvoxamine maleate) Tablets are indicated for the treatment of obsessions and compulsions in patients with obsessive compulsive disorder (OCD)


Jeff Weise, PROZAC (fluoxetine hcl) ® is indicated for the acute and maintenance treatment of Major Depressive Disorder in adult patients and in pediatric patients aged 8 to 18 years

Cory Baadsgaard, PAXIL (paroxetine hydrochloride) is indicated for the treatment of major depressive disorder.

Chris Fetters, PROZAC (fluoxetine hcl) ® is indicated for the acute and maintenance treatment of Major Depressive Disorder in adult patients and in pediatric patients aged 8 to 18 years

Christopher Pittman, ZOLOFT (sertraline hydrochloride) is indicated for the treatment of major depressive disorder in adults.

Mathew Miller, ZOLOFT (sertraline hydrochloride) is indicated for the treatment of major depressive disorder in adults.

Kip Kinkel, PROZAC (fluoxetine hcl) ® is indicated for the acute and maintenance treatment of Major Depressive Disorder in adult patients and in pediatric patients aged 8 to 18 years
Ritalin (methylphenidate hcl) is indicated as an integral part of a total treatment program which typically includes other remedial measures (psychological, educational, social) for a stabilizing effect in children with a behavioral syndrome characterized by the following group of developmentally inappropriate symptoms: moderate-to-severe distractibility, short attention span, hyperactivity, emotional lability, and impulsivity. The diagnosis of this syndrome should not be made with finality when these symptoms are only of comparatively recent origin. Nonlocalizing (soft) neurological signs, learning disability, and abnormal EEG may or may not be present, and a diagnosis of central nervous system dysfunction may or may not be warranted.

Luke WoodhamPROZAC (fluoxetine hcl) ® is indicated for the acute and maintenance treatment of Major Depressive Disorder in adult patients and in pediatric patients aged 8 to 18 years

A boy in Pocatello, ID (Zoloft) see above

Michael Carneal Ritalin - see above

A young man in Huntsville, Alabama (Ritalin) See above

Andrew Golden, age 11, (Ritalin)
Mitchell Johnson, aged 14, (Ritalin)

TJ Solomon, age 15, (Ritalin)

Rod Mathews, age 14, (Ritalin)

James Wilson, age 19, (various psychiatric drugs) from Breenwood, South Carolina, took a .22 caliber revolver into an elementary school killing two young girls, and wounding seven other children and two teachers.

Elizabeth Bush, age 13, (Paxil) see above

Jason Hoffman Effexor (venlafaxine hydrochloride) is indicated for the treatment of major depressive disorder.
Celexa (citalopram HBr) is indicated for the treatment of depression.

Jarred Viktor, age 15, (Paxil), see above

Chris Shanahan, age 15 (Paxil) See above

Jeff Franklin (Prozac and Ritalin), see above
Neal Furrow (Prozac) in LA Jewish school shooting reported to have been court-ordered to be on Prozac along with several other medications.

Kevin Rider, age 14, Prozac when he died from a gunshot wound to his head. Initially it was ruled a suicide, but two years later, the investigation into his death was opened as a possible homicide. The prime suspect, also age 14, had been taking Zoloft and other SSRI antidepressants.

Alex Kim, Lexapro (escitalopram) is indicated for the acute and maintenance treatment of major depressive disorder in adults and in adolescents 12 to 17 years of age

Diane Routhier WELLBUTRIN is indicated for the treatment of major depressive disorder. A physician considering WELLBUTRIN for the management of a patient's first episode of depression should be aware that the drug may cause generalized seizures in a dose-dependent manner with an approximate incidence of 0.4% (4/1,000)

Billy Willkomm, Prozac see above

Kara Jaye Anne Fuller-Otter, Paxil see above

Gareth Christian, Vancouver, Paxil see above

Julie Woodward, Zoloft see above

Matthew Miller Zoloft. see above

Kurt Danysh, Prozac, see above

Woody Zoloft. see above

A boy from Houston, age 10, Prozac see above

Hammad Memon, Zoloft and "other drugs for the conditions."

Matti Saari, SSRI and a benzodiazapine.

Steven Kazmierczak, Prozac,see above
XANAX Tablets (alprazolam) are indicated for the management of anxiety disorder (a condition corresponding most closely to the APA Diagnostic and Statistical Manual [DSM-III-R] diagnosis of generalized anxiety disorder) or the short-term relief of symptoms of anxiety. Anxiety or tension associated with the stress of everyday life usually does not require treatment with an anxiolytic.

Ambien (zolpidem tartrate) is indicated for the short-term treatment of insomnia characterized by difficulties with sleep initiation
***special note****
Use in patients with depression

As with other sedative/hypnotic drugs, Ambien (zolpidem tartrate) should be administered with caution to patients exhibiting signs or symptoms of depression. Suicidal tendencies may be present in such patients and protective measures may be required. Intentional over-dosage is more common in this group of patients; therefore, the least amount of drug that is feasible should be prescribed for the patient at any one time.

Finnish gunman Pekka-Eric Auvinen, antidepressants

Asa Coon from Cleveland, Trazodone- Oleptro™ is indicated for the treatment of major depressive disorder (MDD) in adults.

Jon Romano, age 16, on medication for depression, fi


WARNINGS THAT COME WITH SSRI

It is unknown whether the suicidality risk extends to longer-term use, i.e., beyond several months. However, there is substantial evidence from placebo-controlled maintenance trials in adults with depression that the use of antidepressants can delay the recurrence of depression.

All patients being treated with antidepressants for any indication should be monitored appropriately and observed closely for clinical worsening, suicidality, and unusual changes in behavior, especially during the initial few months of a course of drug therapy, or at times of dose changes, either increases or decreases.

The following symptoms, anxiety, agitation, panic attacks, insomnia, irritability, hostility, aggressiveness, impulsivity, akathisia (psychomotor restlessness), hypomania, and mania, have been reported in adult and pediatric patients being treated with antidepressants for major depressive disorder as well as for other indications, both psychiatric and nonpsychiatric. Although a causal link between the emergence of such symptoms and either the worsening of depression and/or the emergence of suicidal impulses has not been established, there is concern that such symptoms may represent precursors to emerging suicidality.

[roy9525]

and most of these drugs are used because parents and teachers do not want to deal with kids who have lots of energy. its called parenting a thing which too many people do not make time for.

[riden]

A freinds son shot a guy in Calgary last year.He is 25 yrs old He was diagnosed with ADDHD shortly after he began school.He self medicated with pot.He had delusions about being a mafia dude,bought a pistol from somewhere and just shot a fella outside the train station.
His Mom blames herself.I doubt its her fault.

I may upset the 420 friendly crowd, but I have a family member with a severe mental illness. On meds, he holds a decent job, works long hours, loves OT and contributes. Off his meds, he can't hold a job for 5 min.

His dad tells me his psychiatrist and counselor have both called him to warn him that pot is the worst thing for him. That it is very common for these guys to self medicate with pot, that they like the calming effect of the pot. But, it greatly magnifies the symptoms.

[bigshell]

I may upset the 420 friendly crowd, but I have a family member with a severe mental illness. On meds, he holds a decent job, works long hours, loves OT and contributes. Off his meds, he can't hold a job for 5 min.

His dad tells me his psychiatrist and counselor have both called him to warn him that pot is the worst thing for him. That it is very common for these guys to self medicate with pot, that they like the calming effect of the pot. But, it greatly magnifies the symptoms.

Yes I gotta wonder how many of the fellas on FM's list were dope smokers??
I watched an interesting nature of things documentary last winter about how marijuana caused psychosis in a small percentage of users.I think it was about whether or not the pot caused the psychosis or if it was present in the individuals already and woresend by the weed.

[riden]

fishingmom

I am not completely sure what your point was. My point was these young men clearly had severe mental illness, and the drugs listed in the article are not prescribed for severe illness.

This is a list of anti-psychotic drugs:
Second generation antipsychotics
Main article: Atypical antipsychotic
Clozapine (Clozaril) - Requires weekly to biweekly complete blood count due to risk of agranulocytosis.
Olanzapine (Zyprexa) - Used to treat psychotic disorders including schizophrenia, acute manic episodes, and maintenance of bipolar disorder
Risperidone (Risperdal) -Divided dosing is recommended until initial titration is completed, at which time the drug can be administered once daily. Used off-label to treat Tourette syndrome and anxiety disorder.
Quetiapine (Seroquel) - Used primarily to treat bipolar disorder and schizophrenia, and "off-label" to treat chronic insomnia; it is a powerful sedative.
Ziprasidone (Geodon) - Approved in 2004[83] to treat bipolar disorder. Side-effects include a prolonged QT interval in the heart, which can be dangerous for patients with heart disease or those taking other drugs that prolong the QT interval.
Amisulpride (Solian) - Selective dopamine antagonist. Higher doses (greater than 400 mg) act upon post-synaptic dopamine receptors resulting in a reduction in the positive symptoms of schizophrenia, such as psychosis. Lower doses, however, act upon dopamine autoreceptors, resulting in increased dopamine transmission, improving the negative symptoms of schizophrenia. Lower doses of amisulpride have also been shown to have antidepressant and anxiolytic effects in non-schizophrenic patients, leading to its use in dysthymia and social phobias. Amisulpride has not been approved for use by the Food and Drug Administration in the United States.
Asenapine (Saphris) is a 5-HT2A- and D2-receptor antagonist under development for the treatment of schizophrenia and acute mania associated with bipolar disorder.
Paliperidone (Invega) - Derivative of risperidone that was approved in 2006, it offers a controlled release once-daily dose, or a once-monthly depot injection.
Iloperidone (Fanapt, Fanapta, and previously known as Zomaril) - Approved by the FDA in 2009, it is fairly well tolerated, although hypotension, dizziness, and somnolence were very common side effects.
Zotepine (Nipolept, Losizopilon, Lodopin, Setous)- An atypical antipsychotic indicated for acute and chronic schizophrenia. It was approved in Japan circa 1982 and Germany in 1990.
Sertindole (Serdolect, and Serlect in Mexico). Sertindole was developed by the Danish pharmaceutical company H. Lundbeck. Like the other atypical antipsychotics, it is believed to have antagonist activity at dopamine and serotonin receptors in the brain.
Lurasidone (Latuda), recently approved by the FDA for schizophrenia and pending approval for bipolar disorder. Given once daily, it has shown mixed Phase III efficacy results but has a relatively well-tolerated side effect profile.
[edit]

Third generation antipsychotics
Aripiprazole (Abilify) - Mechanism of action is thought to reduce susceptibility to metabolic symptoms seen in some other atypical antipsychotics.[84] The extent to which these effects differ from other atypical antipsychotics is debated.[85]
Partial agonists of dopamine receptors.

[canoes]

Blaming the drugs for these things is silly. Millions of people take these kind of drugs and it allows them to live their lives with relative normality.

I agree,, 100%. Saying they are the cause is just the other side of the coin, which says all firearms are the cause. So ban all drugs and firearms and we will alll live in peace :grouphug:


http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w220/canoes5/para_zpsa89f6d40.png

[bigshell]

Here's the link (I hope I did it right)

http://www.cbc.ca/player/Shows/Shows/The+Nature+of+Things/ID/1398511775/?page=4

[riden]

Yes I gotta wonder how many of the fellas on FM's list were dope smokers??
I watched an interesting nature of things documentary last winter about how marijuana caused psychosis in a small percentage of users.I think it was about whether or not the pot caused the psychosis or if it was present in the individuals already and woresend by the weed.

So, for the sake of interest only, I came across this in the list of anti-psychotics.

Other options
Cannabidiol is one of the main components of Cannabis sativa. Cannabidiol differs from the active drug in cannabis, tetrahydrocannabinol, in that cannabidiol lacks the typical mind altering and recreational effects. One study has suggested that cannabidiol may be as effective as atypical antipsychotics in treating schizophrenia.[86] Some further research has supported these results, and found fewer side effects with cannabidiol than with amisulpride.[87]



Maybe there is something in pot more than we know that causes schizophrenics to believe it is helping, when it is making things worse.


But I am just speculating.

[bigshell]

That is kinda the gist of the documentary I mentioned I am watching it again right now.According to these reseachers the pot grown now is higher in THC and lower in cannabidiol than the pot grown 20 yrs ago.

[Bushrat]

Sure some Dr.'s just hand out pills for everything even a cold,won't argue with ya there.
But plenty of disturbed people who shoulda been on meds or institutionalized killed other folks.About 50 yrs ago a paraniod schitsophrenic with violent fantasies was released from a phsyciatric hospital to his parents care.Was given a prescription and told to take them.He went on to kill 9 members of a random household he went to along the highway.Now was that his pre-existing mental illness that made him do it or the drugs the Dr. prescribed???

The problem was a violent schitsophrenic was realeased into society. What heck were they thinking? Thats what asylems are for. Unfornatunately there is a need for these institutions. Instead of putting these types of people away we give them a handful of prescriptions and put them back on the street. There are many people out there ready to snap with plenty of indications pointing to it that should be institutionalized. Unfortunately the medical system is putting individuals rights above the safety of society.

The diagnosis of these illnesses is in it's infancy and mostly subject to a physicians opinion, of which most are untrained in this field. On the opposite of the spectrum is a host of powerful drugs handed out with unknown reactions to different individuals. Sure one anti depressant might calm Grandmas nerves, it might also send uncle Tom over the edge. Yet they are handed out like candy.

[riden]

The problem was a violent schitsophrenic was realeased into society. What heck were they thinking? Thats what asylems are for. Unfornatunately there is a need for these institutions. Instead of putting these types of people away we give them a handful of prescriptions and put them back on the street. There are many people out there ready to snap with plenty of indications pointing to it that should be institutionalized. Unfortunately the medical system is putting individuals rights above the safety of society.

The diagnosis of these illnesses is in it's infancy and mostly subject to a physicians opinion, of which most are untrained in this field. On the opposite of the spectrum is a host of powerful drugs handed out with unknown reactions to different individuals. Sure one anti depressant might calm Grandmas nerves, it might also send uncle Tom over the edge. Yet they are handed out like candy.

The flip side is, you'd be locking someone away indefinitely based on a physician's opinion.


Tom Selleck said recently, gun violence is the price of freedom, he has a legit point. The kind of thinking you are suggesting, goes a lot further than just this one topic and I am not talking about just gun control either.

We could cure Aids, we just have to lock up everyone diagnosed.

Fundamentally, we are a free country.

[Gust]

I didnt read the op's link but how did karen silkwood die?

[bigshell]

The problem was a violent schitsophrenic was realeased into society. What heck were they thinking? Thats what asylems are for. Unfornatunately there is a need for these institutions. Instead of putting these types of people away we give them a handful of prescriptions and put them back on the street. There are many people out there ready to snap with plenty of indications pointing to it that should be institutionalized. Unfortunately the medical system is putting individuals rights above the safety of society.

The diagnosis of these illnesses is in it's infancy and mostly subject to a physicians opinion, of which most are untrained in this field. On the opposite of the spectrum is a host of powerful drugs handed out with unknown reactions to different individuals. Sure one anti depressant might calm Grandmas nerves, it might also send uncle Tom over the edge. Yet they are handed out like candy.

That tragedy happened back in 1967,now the institutions for the mentaly ill are few and far between.Alot of them live on the streets alot of them self medicate with drugs and alcohal...
I believe it has less to do with individual rights than it does with economics.Hospitals are expensive to run and with mental illness an out-patient with a prescription is seen as more cost effective than an in-patient with a team of Psychyatrists,nurses,orderlies etc.

[riden]

That tragedy happened back in 1967,now the institutions for the mentaly ill are few and far between.Alot of them live on the streets alot of them self medicate with drugs and alcohal...
I believe it has less to do with individual rights than it does with economics.Hospitals are expensive to run and with mental illness an out-patient with a prescription is seen as more cost effective than an in-patient with a team of Psychyatrists,nurses,orderlies etc.

FWIW

These drugs are so dam expensive. A great deal of these guys have trouble holding employment or have jobs with no insurance and we prescribe them expensive meds.

How does this make any sense? Many of these guys, deep down, don't think they need them and they have to spends hundreds a month on meds.

Would it not be a lot cheaper in the long run to subsidize these types of meds?

[Rocky7]

Tom Selleck said recently, gun violence is the price of freedom, he has a legit point. The kind of thinking you are suggesting, goes a lot further than just this one topic and I am not talking about just gun control either.

We could cure Aids, we just have to lock up everyone diagnosed.

Fundamentally, we are a free country.

I could not agree more.

At the same time, I think there are some things we (and the U.S.) can do to lessen the more horrific crimes, but it has nothing to do with gun control. When the Canadian Press named Luka Rocco as "Newsmaker of the Year", they did more to stimulate other hyenas than all the gun displays in every gun store.

[bigshell]

Couldn't agree more there Rocky,the msm is profiting through the missery of others.Sensationalizing these mentaly ill killers and creating a cult like following just for profit must create more killers? Then again maybe not?

[Rocky7]

Couldn't agree more there Rocky,the msm is profiting through the missery of others.Sensationalizing these mentaly ill killers and creating a cult like following just for profit must create more killers? Then again maybe not?

The American Pychologists Association has said that publicity is like catnip for these creeps. They have recommended that their identities not be broadcast.

Instead, we make them household names.

[Matt L.]

At the very least it should be stopped just for how sick it is.

[riden]

The American Pychologists Association has said that publicity is like catnip for these creeps. They have recommended that their identities not be broadcast.

Instead, we make them household names.

I hear you, but I struggle. I know rights and freedoms are not absolute, but I largely do see them that way.

But I don't blame the media, we really have a morbid fascination with this type of crime. We seem to crave it and demand the information, we want intimate details of the crimes and the killers. This became world wide news, the same with the Norway killer.

I don't have any answers though. I don't know how to fix it. But you are right, newsmaker of the year was an idiotic move.

[Cyclops]

I hear you, but I struggle. I know rights and freedoms are not absolute, but I largely do see them that way.

But I don't blame the media, we really have a morbid fascination with this type of crime. We seem to crave it and demand the information, we want intimate details of the crimes and the killers. This became world wide news, the same with the Norway killer.

I don't have any answers though. I don't know how to fix it. But you are right, newsmaker of the year was an idiotic move.

This is a good point. Although I tend to blame the media a lot, the fact is that they only publish and report on what people want to read/see/hear. It's all about ratings for them and money, can't really fault them for wanting to make money, they are businesses. It's society and our culture that's the problem. That doesn't help in a search for a solution I know. Maybe there is no solution. :confused0024: