Ice Auger

[Ronji]

I met a guy out in the ice on the weekend, and he had a new ice auger that was powered by a small propane bottle. It was a gift to him and he was just trying it out that day, and seemed to work pretty good.
Does anybody else out there have any experience with them?

[Big Red 250]

There's quite a few posts on here about them.

[kevinhits]

Really cold weather....Not so good as per last posts....I am sure WC will post on his propane auger

[sparky660]

I'm happy with mine. Starts second pull every time, quiet and tourqey. As for starting in real cold I had mine starts at -25, anything colder than that I don't generally go so I couldn't tell you if it will start any colder than that.

[jeffrey929]

Had mine for three seasons now.. Works like a charm... Throttle lever broke last year but was easy enough to replace... I have had issue at -30 and colder

[wellpastcold]

Jiffy has solved the cold weather issue with an insulated sleeve for the propane bottle. You place a disposable type hand warmer inside the sleeve. Problem solved. TFH, Cabelas, WSS have the sleeves. Cost about $10.

[jeffrey929]

I purchased the sleeve and some hand warmers.. Haven't had chance to try it yet this season

[Ronji]

Thanks for the feed back. Looks like I will using the Visa soon!

[cube]

Gas is a lot cheaper than propane and hand warmers. You can also find gas everywhere.

Unless your drilling inside a hut I don't see any advantages for the propane at this point. (If your drilling inside electric would probably be a better option anyway.)

[Doubledroptine]

i bought one this year, the advantage is that you don't have to deal with stale gas and gummed up carbs. you don't have to mix gas,. As for the cold propane, i just keep the bottle in the truck on the way to the lake.

[AppleJax]

It's such a chore to mix gas, not to mention draining it at the end if the season. Putting a hand warmer on your fuel source sounds much easier......:thinking-006:

[sparky660]

It's such a chore to mix gas, not to mention draining it at the end if the season. Putting a hand warmer on your fuel source sounds much easier......:thinking-006:

Darn right it does!!! Don't drain the gas ethanol wrecks everything, take the gas out then all the gaskets and seals dry out, give me my propane!!!!!

[jeffrey929]

Cleaner burn, no priming, no mixing, no choking, no flooding, no spilling........ No regrets here....

[cubes]

Propane :sHa_shakeshout: so far so good...

[1bluZebec]

Never had a problem in three years with my eskimo but once it goes caput I would consider one but would probably go with electric

[Geezle]

It's such a chore to mix gas, not to mention draining it at the end if the season. Putting a hand warmer on your fuel source sounds much easier......:thinking-006:
I have to agree, while it does solve the problem, putting a little jacket and a hand warmer on the propane bottle sounds like a pretty hokey 'fix'.

Darn right it does!!! Don't drain the gas ethanol wrecks everything, take the gas out then all the gaskets and seals dry out, give me my propane!!!!!

Buy premium gas with no ethanol?


I haven't drained the tank on my old Eskimo auger since I got it about 3 years ago. Fired it up this winter on last year's gas in 2 pulls. I see no problem with this.

I realize that cost of fuel isn't a big issue with such small motors, but still for the cost of one of those little 1 lb bottles and a pack of hand warmers I can fill my little 5 liter jerry can and have gas for the entire ice season with lots to spare.

I guess the propane augers have their place, and the guys who have them seem to like them okay when they work right, but I don't see myself making the switch.

[AppleJax]

[QUOTE=Geezle;2276683]I have to agree, while it does solve the problem, putting a little jacket and a hand warmer on the propane bottle sounds like a pretty hokey 'fix'.

Well, when you buy propane you need "propane accessories".:sHa_shakeshout:

[AlbertaAngler]

Buy premium gas with no ethanol?

What Geezle said and also I found putting some sea foam in, cleans the carbs and stabilizes the fuel. I have yet to drain the fuel from my auger at the end of the season and have it 8 years now with no problems, still starts first pull.

Sorry for the derail with regards to Propane, my FIL has one and really likes it and I have had no problems using it. We used it at about minus 22 no shack bottle and auger left outside and it started first pull and ran fine.

[Geezle]

[QUOTE=Geezle;2276683]I have to agree, while it does solve the problem, putting a little jacket and a hand warmer on the propane bottle sounds like a pretty hokey 'fix'.

Well, when you buy propane you need "propane accessories".:sHa_shakeshout:

http://static4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120107020136/kingofthehill/images/0/0e/Hank.png

[HuyFishin]

I've ran mine -30 and its fine

[AppleJax]

I've ran mine -30 and its fine

Your bottle wasn't at -30.

[HuyFishin]

hrmmm I leave it outside of my tent on the ground for many hours of the day and when I move to another hole its still fine hehe who knows lol
maybe it was only -29

[sparky660]

Buy premium gas with no ethanol?


.

Even without ethanol gasoline starts to break down after 3 months. Premium isn't the answer. I have a 500 hp big block that needed the carb rebuilt to prove that premium isn't the cure.

[1bluZebec]

I too have an eskimo and have had it for four years now and have never done anything to it since new including blades!! It's been great never drained the tank or anything. Just the best premium gas and oil, with near exact mixture.

[EZM]

Even without ethanol gasoline starts to break down after 3 months. Premium isn't the answer. I have a 500 hp big block that needed the carb rebuilt to prove that premium isn't the cure.

The viper brand (and the jiffy brand) oil that you mix up contains more than just oil for the mix. It contains a high level of hydroquinone and fuel stabilizer. It has a suspension (mixed shelf life of 18+ months).

Use ethanol free premium - like at Shell - and the shelf life increased to 24+ months ...... no worry about gumming up (creating monomers) as there is no few additives, agents or contaminants to create problems through degradation of the fuel/oil.

Premium fuel with no ethanol and use the Viper or Jiffy oil = no worries.

[Geezle]

Your bottle wasn't at -30.

Could have been...if it was full?

[Geezle]

Even without ethanol gasoline starts to break down after 3 months. Premium isn't the answer. I have a 500 hp big block that needed the carb rebuilt to prove that premium isn't the cure.

Not exactly an apples to apples comparison is it?

I think I gave mine a splash of Sea Foam last season if that makes all the difference?

[CanadianBadass]

I have to agree, while it does solve the problem, putting a little jacket and a hand warmer on the propane bottle sounds like a pretty hokey 'fix'.



Buy premium gas with no ethanol?


I haven't drained the tank on my old Eskimo auger since I got it about 3 years ago. Fired it up this winter on last year's gas in 2 pulls. I see no problem with this.

I realize that cost of fuel isn't a big issue with such small motors, but still for the cost of one of those little 1 lb bottles and a pack of hand warmers I can fill my little 5 liter jerry can and have gas for the entire ice season with lots to spare.

I guess the propane augers have their place, and the guys who have them seem to like them okay when they work right, but I don't see myself making the switch.

My exact thoughts also,

I never drained my Eskimo Z71 at the end of last season, Just plain laziness, however I did run it several times in my garage over the summer, to keep flowing gas thru ( maybe 3 times in the summer ) and when I went fishing this season for the first time, she started great,

And that's why I bought a bigger heater that attaches to a 20lb bottle, Those little bottles even on a mini buddy heater get expensive, probably 20-30 bottles/ice season if you fish a lot like some of us, And that's easily 60-80$ if not more a season for holes in the ice ? :scared0015: but last year I used my small 5l jerry can and had lots to spare with one 5$ fill up .....

Ive tried the propane auger, And it works, had no issues drilling the 5 holes I did, but speed was lacking compared to a Z51 or Z71, Speed does matter when your chasing fish and wanna drill some quick holes,

But the one thing I could say very positive about the propane Jiffy, It was ultra light compared to my Z71 , I noticed that instantly, But still isn't enough to make me switch .

But the guy who let me use his said he had his all last season and never had issues, until he went fishing in -25 and it was in the back of his truck and extremely cold from the drive, 1/2 hour to thaw, and was good to go! :fishing:

[CanadianBadass]

The viper brand (and the jiffy brand) oil that you mix up contains more than just oil for the mix. It contains a high level of hydroquinone and fuel stabilizer. It has a suspension (mixed shelf life of 18+ months).

Use ethanol free premium - like at Shell - and the shelf life increased to 24+ months ...... no worry about gumming up (creating monomers) as there is no few additives, agents or contaminants to create problems through degradation of the fuel/oil.

Premium fuel with no ethanol and use the Viper or Jiffy oil = no worries.

I like the Viper brand for the eskimo augers, and dirt cheap !

[sparky660]

Not exactly an apples to apples comparison is it?

I think I gave mine a splash of Sea Foam last season if that makes all the difference?

I would bet the rubber used in the carb and the gum build up are just aboUT identical. The parts that the fuel degrades are larger in my Holley but will have the same chemical composition so the affects are the same, so it is apples to apples. Neither gas or propane are perfect it's just the convenience of the propane was a better choice for me. I have a bad ass muscle car to tinker with, an ice auser doesn't justify wasted tinker time when there is a viable solution like being propane powered.

[EZM]

I would bet the rubber used in the carb and the gum build up are just aboUT identical. The parts that the fuel degrades are larger in my Holley but will have the same chemical composition so the affects are the same, so it is apples to apples. Neither gas or propane are perfect it's just the convenience of the propane was a better choice for me. I have a bad ass muscle car to tinker with, an ice auser doesn't justify wasted tinker time when there is a viable solution like being propane powered.

Sorry, we didn't know your car was 2 stroke .........lol .... just teasing you.

I would argue that there is a significant difference, and it's not an apples to apples comparison at all.

I'm really going to simplify this - so that it makes sense....

The stuff that "gums up" in gasoline is process and chemistry similar to a polymerization in/when making polyethylene (plastics).

There is less of this stuff in high octane (C8) fuel with no ethanol.

note; polyethylene and ETHANOL - the same family ..... and similar molecular structure that screws up and gums up your engine as the fuel becomes unstable and molecularly separates over time.

SO DON'T USE ethanol gas - Choose something like Shell Premium fuel, with no ethanol, and you will be fine. It contains very little of these harmful contaminants in the first place.

Granted, over time, even good fuel will begin to break down - however - here comes the difference ...........

2 strokes need oil ........... so add the viper/jiffy oil. This stuff has HQ (hydroquinone which removes moisture and water) and the oil contains other stabilizers as well to increase shelf life. 2 strokes will, inherently, because of the stabilizers and oil, have better fuel shelf life.

Viper and Jiffy brand oil is packed with this stuff !!!!!!! Other 2 stroke oils don't fortify their products with as much HQ or other stabilizers.

SO ..........Use the name brand oil and pump in no ethanol premium and you are almost guaranteed no issues for a really really long time.

It's simple chemistry.........:thinking-006:

[CanadianBadass]

Sorry, we didn't know your car was 2 stroke .........lol .... just teasing you.

I would argue that there is a significant difference, and it's not an apples to apples comparison at all.

I'm really going to simplify this - so that it makes sense....

The stuff that "gums up" in gasoline is process and chemistry similar to a polymerization in/when making polyethylene (plastics).

There is less of this stuff in high octane (C8) fuel with no ethanol.

note; polyethylene and ETHANOL - the same family ..... and similar molecular structure that screws up and gums up your engine as the fuel becomes unstable and molecularly separates over time.

SO DON'T USE ethanol gas - Choose something like Shell Premium fuel, with no ethanol, and you will be fine. It contains very little of these harmful contaminants in the first place.

Granted, over time, even good fuel will begin to break down - however - here comes the difference ...........

2 strokes need oil ........... so add the viper/jiffy oil. This stuff has HQ (hydroquinone which removes moisture and water) and the oil contains other stabilizers as well to increase shelf life. 2 strokes will, inherently, because of the stabilizers and oil, have better fuel shelf life.

Viper and Jiffy brand oil is packed with this stuff !!!!!!! Other 2 stroke oils don't fortify their products with as much HQ or other stabilizers.

SO ..........Use the name brand oil and pump in no ethanol premium and you are almost guaranteed no issues for a really really long time.

It's simple chemistry.........:thinking-006:

^------- This ! Lol

[EZM]

I would bet the rubber used in the carb and the gum build up are just aboUT identical. The parts that the fuel degrades are larger in my Holley but will have the same chemical composition so the affects are the same, so it is apples to apples. Neither gas or propane are perfect it's just the convenience of the propane was a better choice for me. I have a bad ass muscle car to tinker with, an ice auser doesn't justify wasted tinker time when there is a viable solution like being propane powered.

Oh yeah - forgot to add one thing - your "rubber" in your motor is probably not organic (like real rubber) it's probably synthetic (like a phenolic maybe) - not 100% sure - but let's call it rubber for the point of simplicity.

Real organic rubber would disintegrate very quickly ....

I bet it's the reaction (of the fuel breaking down and the contaminants that are now "free" in the remaining fuel) that makes it stick to the "rubber" - not necessarily the "rubber" itself that becomes the issue. The breaking down of the "rubber" as it degrades is likely only a contributing factor - but certainly not the catalyst.

Again, just my opinion based on a dangerous level (basic level) of knowledge from a past life when I worked in a petrochemical facility.

I hated that job !!!!!!

[sparky660]

This is where I disagree. I have used premium fuel (shell) without ethanol, in a carb updated with seals and gaskets intended up fuel up to 10% ethanol along with fuel stabilizer during cruising season and seafoam over the winter storage and had to clean the bowls and both accelerator pumps as they were cracked and weeping. I have been doing exactly what you recommend for the 10 year life of the engine. Still have to install a carb kit every 3 to 4 years. Please explain why this is? The only thing I can think is the extra heat or the lack of oil in my fuel hat is in a 2-stroke to keep the rubber pliable.

[jeffrey929]

Another reason to purchase a propane auger... No need to become a chemist... Step one, attach bottle to hose... Step two, start auger

[sparky660]

Oh yeah - forgot to add one thing - your "rubber" in your motor is probably not organic (like real rubber) it's probably synthetic (like a phenolic maybe) - not 100% sure - but let's call it rubber for the point of simplicity.

Real organic rubber would disintegrate very quickly ....

I bet it's the reaction (of the fuel breaking down and the contaminants that are now "free" in the remaining fuel) that makes it stick to the "rubber" - not necessarily the "rubber" itself that becomes the issue. The breaking down of the "rubber" as it degrades is likely only a contributing factor - but certainly not the catalyst.

Again, just my opinion based on a dangerous level (basic level) of knowledge from a past life when I worked in a petrochemical facility.

I hated that job !!!!!!

Is there much of a difference in the "rubber" parts in a 2 stroke ice auser than in any other carb?

[sparky660]

Another reason to purchase a propane auger... No need to become a chemist... Step one, attach bottle to hose... Step two, start auger

Step 2.5: add hand warmer if to cold. Thats the Deal breaker, lol.

[jeffrey929]

I did forget that one... Do the hand warmer ingredients make a difference?

[EZM]

Another reason to purchase a propane auger... No need to become a chemist... Step one, attach bottle to hose... Step two, start auger

Lol ....... well played ....... You are probably right ....lol

The way I look at it, dump in one bottle of the viper oil, add 4 liters of shell premium and I'm good for the season.

No worries next year ........

No worries when it's cold .......

No worries about propane tanks, silly hand warmers, insulation sleeves etc...

So no chemistry degree required .......

[EZM]

Is there much of a difference in the "rubber" parts in a 2 stroke ice auser than in any other carb?

No idea ....... The gaskets, and other components are likely similar - but you are right, the oil in the fuel likely helps the "rubber" ........

I just think the comparison isn't quite the same - primarily because of the oil and additives as described - that was my point.

The propane augers are fine - you might just have to keep the tanks in the house overnight and in the cab on the way to the lake - no big deal.

It's after the auger that's been sitting on the lake in really cold weather, would be my only concern. Having to put on a warmer does seem like a pain in the but to me - but whatever.

[sparky660]

No idea ....... The gaskets, and other components are likely similar - but you are right, the oil in the fuel likely helps the "rubber" ........

I just think the comparison isn't quite the same - primarily because of the oil and additives as described - that was my point.

I had thought about the oil right after I hit the submit button and was to stubborn to go in and change my original post,lol. Besides if it's to cold for my auger to start it's to cold for fishing.:)

[jeffrey929]

Lol ....... well played ....... You are probably right ....lol

The way I look at it, dump in one bottle of the viper oil, add 4 liters of shell premium and I'm good for the season.

No worries next year ........

No worries when it's cold .......

No worries about propane tanks, silly hand warmers, insulation sleeves etc...

So no chemistry degree required .......

To be perfectly honest, have yet to use the sleeve or the hand warmers... Not even sure if they will work.... I only have had issue with mine a couple of times, and both times the mercury was in the -30's... Set up the tent, started the heater, few minutes later, voila.... Both times would have been way too cold for me to be wanting out of the tent to drill any more holes outside... I have noticed that if I fire up the auger after removing the propane bottle and let the residual propane burn off, the next time I use it, it starts right away regardless of the outside temp, and that is with doing nothing to the bottles.... Might just be a coincidence

[Geezle]

Thanks for sorta clearing that up EZM...that would have been entirely too much typing for me! :lol:

Maybe I've just gotten lucky with my old auger. Actually I have...for an old thing that I paid $75 for I've gotten more than my fair share of use out of it and it still runs great with almost no maintainance.




For those guys running the propane Jiffy auger, on average how many holes do you get out of a bottle? Do you find that you have freezing issues when you get towards the end of the bottle as it freezes up similar to the issues people have with their Buddy heaters? Any performance difference at the end of the bottle?

I still have yet to see one of these units in action myself.

[jeffrey929]

To be honest, I have no idea how many holes I get out of a bottle.. Seems like upwards of 100, depending on ice thickness... I have not noticed a difference regarding performance once the tank is low

[huntsfurfish]

Lol ....... well played ....... You are probably right ....lol

The way I look at it, dump in one bottle of the viper oil, add 4 liters of shell premium and I'm good for the season.

No worries next year ........

No worries when it's cold .......

No worries about propane tanks, silly hand warmers, insulation sleeves etc...

So no chemistry degree required .......

No idea ....... The gaskets, and other components are likely similar - but you are right, the oil in the fuel likely helps the "rubber" ........

I just think the comparison isn't quite the same - primarily because of the oil and additives as described - that was my point.

The propane augers are fine - you might just have to keep the tanks in the house overnight and in the cab on the way to the lake - no big deal.

It's after the auger that's been sitting on the lake in really cold weather, would be my only concern. Having to put on a warmer does seem like a pain in the but to me - but whatever.

I had thought about the oil right after I hit the submit button and was to stubborn to go in and change my original post,lol. Besides if it's to cold for my auger to start it's to cold for fishing.:)

ION:):):sHa_shakeshout: