Obama to use Executive Order to ban bullets?

[Johnny Huntnfish]

Just read this one this morning. Seems like he's been making up his own rules lately.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/article/2560750

[fish_e_o]

buy your 223 now!! it sounds like the americans will be buying everything they can

[TBD]

when are the american people going to stand up to this BS ?

[NEWB]

when are the american people going to stand up to this BS ?

They won't. You throw "Used by terrorists" in any statement and the shepple will eat it up, follow blindly and agree to anything.

[Fisherpeak]

22 longs are like gold there now.I`m thinking of trading a few bricks for some land in Idaho.

[silverdoctor]

They won't. You throw "Used by terrorists" in any statement and the shepple will eat it up, follow blindly and agree to anything.

Sounds familiar north of the border too.

[Wild&Free]

Just setting up a republican win next election. nothing to see here.

[KGB]

when are the american people going to stand up to this BS ?

He has nothing to loose. This is his last term as a president, so he does what he wants... Just be patient and he will go away....

[Fisherpeak]

I can hardly wait to see the next puppet.

[Wild&Free]

I can hardly wait to see the next puppet.
Won't even see the fingers wiggle with the next one, everyone will be ignoring the men behind the curtians by then.

[airbornedeerhunter]

What can one expect from a socialist liberal. Seems there was another thread on fire here today about a similar subject! You seeing this? This is what happens when people like your beloved shiny pony are at the helm!

[greylynx]

Listen to the U.S. talk shows about the OP's post.

Americans think this is a joke. Rush Limbaugh today was quite amazed that no one seemed concerned on his call in.

And yes I know. For all you gun confiscators on AO, "Rush Limbaugh is an idiot". You don't have to post now.

[mischief]

If I read the article correctly it is saying he is trying to ban the M885 armour piercing round or "green tip" not all of the .223 or 5.56 (whichever you prefer). No skin off of my teeth I do not need armour piercing rounds and I tend to agree that the average Joe does not need them either. Nothing I have ever seen living in the mountains, hills or plains has ever been wearing body armour so I am not sure what you would need it for.

[ex811]

ObamaTruedeuobamatruedeuobamatruedueoneandthesame. ..we should all be scared. One ban leads to another, and another, and another................

[Twisted Canuck]

If I read the article correctly it is saying he is trying to ban the M885 armour piercing round or "green tip" not all of the .223 or 5.56 (whichever you prefer). No skin off of my teeth I do not need armour piercing rounds and I tend to agree that the average Joe does not need them either. Nothing I have ever seen living in the mountains, hills or plains has ever been wearing body armour so I am not sure what you would need it for.

What has need got to do with it? It's inexpensive target shooting at it's finest, the point of the ban is stupid, pointless, and will do nothing as far as making the citizens safer. Why tolerate any infringement by government on what we can or can't buy....

Like incandescent light bulbs in Canada. That one really charred my tender loins.

[Sundancefisher]

Just read this one this morning. Seems like he's been making up his own rules lately.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/article/2560750

Please feel free to understand this more.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/guns/ammoban.asp#0tfRYruIKrGPgRPc.99

Stop the paranoia. Inform.

The big business gun and ammo makers are just laughing all the way to bank.

In the other side...someday zombies won't have a chance.

[mischief]

What has need got to do with it? It's inexpensive target shooting at it's finest, the point of the ban is stupid, pointless, and will do nothing as far as making the citizens safer. Why tolerate any infringement by government on what we can or can't buy....

Like incandescent light bulbs in Canada. That one really charred my tender loins.

So by you logic someone should be able to buy an RPG at wal-mart, 10lbs of angel dust at a pharmacist and a child sex slave at McDonalds, if they want as the government had no right to stop people from buying those things in the first place. Interesting idea if majorly flawed.

For a 1000 rounds of Green tip 62 grn ammo it costs $635.00 while a 1000 rnd of 55 grn FMJ is $475.00 in the states. As there are cheaper alternatives that were not specifically designed to render body armour useless available, I do not see the need for it.

http://www.bulkammo.com/rifle/bulk-5.56x45-ammo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dGxRw8Jq70 A short video showing what it is able to do.

[recce43]

If I read the article correctly it is saying he is trying to ban the M885 armour piercing round or "green tip" not all of the .223 or 5.56 (whichever you prefer). No skin off of my teeth I do not need armour piercing rounds and I tend to agree that the average Joe does not need them either. Nothing I have ever seen living in the mountains, hills or plains has ever been wearing body armour so I am not sure what you would need it for.

Its not a true ap round it will defeat soft body armour so will a 30/06 180 gr bullet it does have a steel core . So does plenty of 7.62x39mm

[brendan's dad]

Almost all rifle rounds will defeat police vests, many are only rate to 44 cal pistol energy/velocities. Even with plates most rifle rounds go right thru. Kinda a useless law and just burdens gun owners for no good reason.

[doetracks]

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2015/02/robert-farago/atf-ban-on-m855-ammunition-the-real-issue-and-the-real-answer/

Very good article on armor-piercing and the agreed definition thereof prior to this out-in-left-field plan.

[greylynx]

Remember when Brian Williams said a Glock would not show up on an x-ray. Shown to be bogus.

Or remember when Brian Williams was describing the banning of some sort of "cop killer" hand gun ammunition that was proven to be bogus.

Time to sit back and watch how this .223 banning incident washes out.

[Twisted Canuck]

So by you logic someone should be able to buy an RPG at wal-mart, 10lbs of angel dust at a pharmacist and a child sex slave at McDonalds, if they want as the government had no right to stop people from buying those things in the first place. Interesting idea if majorly flawed.



And you got all that from what I wrote? Really , I just want to be able to buy incandescent light bulbs without some politician telling me I can't. As for the 'armor piercing' bullets, they've been around and used for a long time, and yet mankind hasn't shot itself to extinction.

The bit you wrote up there is obtuse at best.

[propliner]

So by you logic someone should be able to buy an RPG at wal-mart, 10lbs of angel dust at a pharmacist and a child sex slave at McDonalds, if they want as the government had no right to stop people from buying those things in the first place. Interesting idea if majorly flawed.

For a 1000 rounds of Green tip 62 grn ammo it costs $635.00 while a 1000 rnd of 55 grn FMJ is $475.00 in the states. As there are cheaper alternatives that were not specifically designed to render body armour useless available, I do not see the need for it.

So what if 55grn FMJ is cheaper to shoot? Does that mean that they shouldn't have the option to shoot more expensive ammo? And what's next after the green tip ban? Jacketed bullets? Only because they're harder than cast lead? And they can penetrate, for instance, a car door? And then, just maybe anything above a certain energy level that might penetrate a sheet of gyproc? For the kids' safety?

It's obviously death by a thousand cuts. There's a reason for it all in the Nanny State's mind. The people can't be trusted.

Heck, ban knives while we're at it... they're armour piercing, too.

Maybe everyone should just stay home, just to be extra safe.

[skidderman]

Why does anyone need armour piercing bullets? Seems to me if the NRA would give up a little maybe there can be some middle ground. Am I missing something?

[Twisted Canuck]

Why does anyone need armour piercing bullets? Seems to me if the NRA would give up a little maybe there can be some middle ground. Am I missing something?

Yes. It starts with something, and then something else, and pretty soon we can't use incandescent light bulbs any more because they are harmful. :)

I personally don't need armor piercing bullets, but the real issue isn't the bullets or the danger. The reality is that there are already plenty of laws in place to make the world perfect. Like don't commit murder. Piling all manner of other laws on top of that doesn't keep a single criminal from committing a crime, because by definition they are not law abiding. All these extra laws and bans do is to put odious burdens and measures of control on a captive population by a government that is in theory elected to represent them, rather than suppress them. How's that?

[CNP]

Why does anyone need armour piercing bullets? Seems to me if the NRA would give up a little maybe there can be some middle ground. Am I missing something?

Yes you are. Why do you need to ban them?

[propliner]

Yes. It starts with something, and then something else, and pretty soon we can't use incandescent light bulbs any more because they are harmful. :)

I personally don't need armor piercing bullets, but the real issue isn't the bullets or the danger. The reality is that there are already plenty of laws in place to make the world perfect. Like don't commit murder. Piling all manner of other laws on top of that doesn't keep a single criminal from committing a crime, because by definition they are not law abiding. All these extra laws and bans do is to put odious burdens and measures of control on a captive population by a government that is in theory elected to represent them, rather than suppress them. How's that?

How's that? That's perfect. It's an explanation that defies the sense of those who seek to control the world by small, creeping, senseless increments. Your explanation flies in the face of all those who seek to rid the world of non-existent boogeyman. Sadly, these cowards who are afraid of their own shadows cannot see the larger picture, for what they seek is their mothers' bosoms again... a perfect unattainable safety, yet only at the expense of free man's freedom. The paranoid, public safety bandwagon nuts always refuse to see the bigger picture and are simply cowed by fear. Best you all stay home lest you get hurt somehow.

[skidderman]

Yes you are. Why do you need to ban them?

What is wrong with normal bullets? Does someone have to be able to shoot through steel to prove a point? Honestly I would not care except to the point that I do agree that the gun haters are going to whittle away at us until there is nothing left. With or without armour piercing doo dads.

[nelsonob1]

Is it just me or do we have one of these bullet banning conspiracy threads every winter?

[connexion123]

If I read the article correctly it is saying he is trying to ban the M885 armour piercing round or "green tip" not all of the .223 or 5.56 (whichever you prefer). No skin off of my teeth I do not need armour piercing rounds and I tend to agree that the average Joe does not need them either. Nothing I have ever seen living in the mountains, hills or plains has ever been wearing body armour so I am not sure what you would need it for.

Most FMJ will pierce armour.

It is skin off your teeth because this is the beginning...

[connexion123]

Why does anyone need armour piercing bullets? Seems to me if the NRA would give up a little maybe there can be some middle ground. Am I missing something?

You're missing a lot

[ELKOHOLICS]

Black nazi !

[Sundancefisher]

Yes. It starts with something, and then something else, and pretty soon we can't use incandescent light bulbs any more because they are harmful. :)

I personally don't need armor piercing bullets, but the real issue isn't the bullets or the danger. The reality is that there are already plenty of laws in place to make the world perfect. Like don't commit murder. Piling all manner of other laws on top of that doesn't keep a single criminal from committing a crime, because by definition they are not law abiding. All these extra laws and bans do is to put odious burdens and measures of control on a captive population by a government that is in theory elected to represent them, rather than suppress them. How's that?

Incandescent bulbs removal is an artifact of the global warming activists. That is just the tip of the iceberg coming are way.

[propliner]

The ban is a further attempt to stem the flow of ammunition to the public. Although this particular round doesn't even meet the criteria of armour-piercing projectiles (due to its lead core and gilding metal percentage), the definition is being skewed to make it fit this agenda. This is one of the most popular sporting rounds in the USA and hasn't been proven to be of any more danger to the public than any other projectile. The Obamites are having trouble banning guns, so are now going after the ammo supply in lawyeresque fashion to meet the same objective. And so many weak-minded left-leaners will fall for it.

[220swifty]

For a 1000 rounds of Green tip 62 grn ammo it costs $635.00 while a 1000 rnd of 55 grn FMJ is $475.00 in the states. As there are cheaper alternatives that were not specifically designed to render body armour useless available, I do not see the need for it.

http://www.bulkammo.com/rifle/bulk-5.56x45-ammo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dGxRw8Jq70 A short video showing what it is able to do.

Quoting today's prices isn't an accurate portrayal. There have been mumblings of this coming down the pipe for a while, and from what I understand, it has created a drastic spike in prices. Hoarders are out in full force.

I won't even get into your sheeple ways when it comes to how you gobbled down the 'armor peircing' tripe, and continue to regurgitate it as if it's gospel.

After you're done smiling and happily allowing them to ban green tip, don't be shocked when they want to ban anything over 150 gr/2500 fps, because they too go through armour like hot butter.

[mischief]

I won't even get into your sheeple ways when it comes to how you gobbled down the 'armor peircing' tripe, and continue to regurgitate it as if it's gospel.

After you're done smiling and happily allowing them to ban green tip, don't be shocked when they want to ban anything over 150 gr/2500 fps, because they too go through armour like hot butter.

Yes my "sheeple" view as opposed to your "everything is a conspiracy" view. The manufactures sell it as piercing ammunition, states it right on the boxes, so they should know what they are making shouldn't they. Before I regurgitated anything I read several pages of info and watched about 12 you tube videos showing the round punching through various armours/steel plates with a success rate of about 73%. So I trust my research, I also found out that to this point there is no recorded incident on record with that type of ammunition. But it is my belief that do to the increase of domestic terrorism and the constant fear of lone wolf gunmen that the BATF are trying to be a little more proactive in taking tools out of these peoples hands. If the ammunition was labeled any thing other the what it is I also believe that there would not be that big of a deal.

I understand that law abiding gun owners continue to get screwed over on a lot of things but I also know that you can not dig your heels in on everything that does not go your way because after awhile people just stop caring/listening to you. Like it or not compromises have to made on behalf of both parties as with the continuous bickering someone will finally reach a breaking point and in all honesty we will lose. Most people talk tough, especially on the internet, but when it hits the fan they turtle.

Instead of saying no you can not ban the M855 round, why not say "we can live with that if you allow............" , then if they are not willing to compromise you then dig your heels in. Makes gun owners/groups look more reasonable and instead of the media being able to run headlines like " Gun owners want the right to keep cop killer rounds" they only get to run "gun owners offer deal in ammunition dispute". It shows the non gun owning public that we can be reasonable, which in my view is a good thing. But what do I know I am just a "sheeple" with a few black guns.

[mischief]

And you got all that from what I wrote? Really , I just want to be able to buy incandescent light bulbs without some politician telling me I can't. As for the 'armor piercing' bullets, they've been around and used for a long time, and yet mankind hasn't shot itself to extinction.

The bit you wrote up there is obtuse at best.

How is it being obtuse you said the government should not be able to tell people what they can or can not buy? I know a few crack heads that would love to buy drugs legally, a creepy relative in prison ( guess which one he would buy) and more then a few rednecks that would buy belt feed machine guns if they could. All these things are objects that the government tells them they can not buy. When you make a statement as broad as yours it leaves things open to interpretation. If you wish to avoid misunderstandings in the future I would advise being more specific.

[220swifty]

Learning from history is a far cry from thinking everything is a conspiracy.

Lots of cartridges punch through steel plate without much effort. If you want one of these 'super guns', check the buy and sell.

The whole 'it hasn't happened yet, but it might' arguement makes me gag, by the way.

How about you go get yourself casterated. You haven't raped anybody yet, but you have the equipment, so you might.

[mischief]

Learning from history is a far cry from thinking everything is a conspiracy.

Lots of cartridges punch through steel plate without much effort. If you want one of these 'super guns', check the buy and sell.

The whole 'it hasn't happened yet, but it might' arguement makes me gag, by the way.

How about you go get yourself casterated. You haven't raped anybody yet, but you have the equipment, so you might.

I have learned to never bang my head on a closed door as it only wastes time and gives me a headache. So I will agree to disagree as history has taught me different lessons and life experience has shaped my thinking processes differently.

[propliner]

I understand that law abiding gun owners continue to get screwed over on a lot of things but I also know that you can not dig your heels in on everything that does not go your way because after awhile people just stop caring/listening to you. Like it or not compromises have to made on behalf of both parties as with the continuous bickering someone will finally reach a breaking point and in all honesty we will lose. Most people talk tough, especially on the internet, but when it hits the fan they turtle.

Instead of saying no you can not ban the M855 round, why not say "we can live with that if you allow............" , then if they are not willing to compromise you then dig your heels in. Makes gun owners/groups look more reasonable and instead of the media being able to run headlines like " Gun owners want the right to keep cop killer rounds" they only get to run "gun owners offer deal in ammunition dispute". It shows the non gun owning public that we can be reasonable, which in my view is a good thing. But what do I know I am just a "sheeple" with a few black guns.

Do you think that if gun owners stop digging in their heels that the anti-gun coalition will relent? That if gun owners cave a bit that the other side will concede a little for us? Give me a break!

It's a battle to the end, in case you didn't notice. Those headlines you imagined would never make the news if gun owners threw in the towel on the issue. The attacks would only increase with the antis feeling empowered. There is an end goal here. That goal is your guns being chopped up by a cutting wheel.

Your idealism is flawed and your life lessons have been too soft. Your evasion of counter-arguments reeks of modern liberalism. Unfortunately, you live in a dream world where being "reasonable" will work to our advantage. It never has and never will in this battle.

PS- kiss your black guns goodbye with that attitude.

[Jalan]

You do realize this is coming from the ATF and not from Obama or an executive order? It just sounds better when they say Obama is trying to take ammo, just like he was going to take everyone's guns.

His administration might be pushing the ATF to do this, but there is no proof at all on that yet.

[propliner]

You do realize this is coming from the ATF and not from Obama or an executive order?

What different does it make? What are you trying to say? It's more acceptable coming from the ATF? Are they the authority when it comes to suddenly banning something that's been legal for decades? Are you saying that the Obama administration hasn't been trying to ban guns? Your statements are ambiguous at best.

[expmler]

If I read the article correctly it is saying he is trying to ban the M885 armour piercing round or "green tip" not all of the .223 or 5.56 (whichever you prefer). No skin off of my teeth I do not need armour piercing rounds and I tend to agree that the average Joe does not need them either. Nothing I have ever seen living in the mountains, hills or plains has ever been wearing body armour so I am not sure what you would need it for.

Why do you need to hunt when the grocery stores are full of meat? The average Joe gets all the nutrition he needs from without hunting.

[Jalan]

What different does it make? What are you trying to say? It's more acceptable coming from the ATF? Are they the authority when it comes to suddenly banning something that's been legal for decades? Are you saying that the Obama administration hasn't been trying to ban guns? Your statements are ambiguous at best.

I never said it was acceptable. I was merely pointing out Obama has had nothing to do with it. He has hardly been trying to ban guns, it's more the right wings screaming that he is going to take all their guns, even before he was elected.

Blaming Obama for this is like blaming Stephen Harper for the pothole in front of your house not being fixed.

[HalfBreed]

I just knew Harper was to blame.

[backstraps]

The whole "slipperly slope" arguement is pure fallacy and when its used too often the originator looks rediculous. There are lines to be drawn but to disregard moving them to acommodate new information or changing enviroments is just not being reasonable. Use that same arguement with historic changes or other scenarios and it looks shaky. If we could buy grenades 30 years ago doesn't mean we should today and if they took grenades away CCI stingers are next. I am sure in the earlys stages people were incensed that we are not given the choice to DDT as a pesticide and I am sure a lot of farmers were up in arms about having the freedom to used whatever pesticide they so chose.

[greylynx]

The word "need" to own a particular firearm has popped up again on this forum.

The phrase "we have to negotiate to own firearms" has also popped up.

These two ideas have been driving fire arms owners down the road to confiscation in Canada since 1926.

These two ideas are our destruction.

[propliner]

I never said it was acceptable. I was merely pointing out Obama has had nothing to do with it. He has hardly been trying to ban guns, it's more the right wings screaming that he is going to take all their guns, even before he was elected.

Blaming Obama for this is like blaming Stephen Harper for the pothole in front of your house not being fixed.

Obama is indeed actively trying to circumvent the second amendment. He tipped his hat to the UN small arms treaty, and what about his unconstitutional executive orders regarding East German styled mental health and gun ownership laws.

He has praised Australia's "very severe" gun control and will do whatever he can to implement it in the U.S.

He's made calls to reinstate and strengthen the so-called "assault weapons" ban.

He is trying to implement a national registry.

It might not be tops on his agenda, but it's there alright. If you follow American politics you'll know he is not gun friendly.

[Bowie]

The only thing that worries me about this whole thing. Is that homeland security bought up massive amounts of ammunition in 2013. More then what was used in Iraq. Now that ammunition is being taken away from citizens. Seems odd to me. Like let's move all the guns and ammo over to the government and take it away from citizens so they can't fight back

[Deo101]

The only thing that worries me about this whole thing. Is that homeland security bought up massive amounts of ammunition in 2013. More then what was used in Iraq. Now that ammunition is being taken away from citizens. Seems odd to me. Like let's move all the guns and ammo over to the government and take it away from citizens so they can't fight back

Insert "Tin Foil" hat comment here....haha.

It does make you wonder for sure. Seems fairly obvious there's a large group of people that would prefer only our Protectors should have guns.

[diggerrigger]

Who says that the internet is full of right wing funded sites to feed those that love to get fired up about that 'muslim dark president' .Take it easy guys you can have all the guns you need , maybe just not all the guns you want.

Oh wait something is brewing at the Whitehouse according to Faux news .

[propliner]

Who says that the internet is full of right wing funded sites to feed those that love to get fired up about that 'muslim dark president' .Take it easy guys you can have all the guns you need , maybe just not all the guns you want.

Oh wait something is brewing at the Whitehouse according to Faux news .

The loving president's objective here is "you can have all the guns you want, but not the ammunition you need".

[Masterchief]

Insert "Tin Foil" hat comment here....haha.

It does make you wonder for sure. Seems fairly obvious there's a large group of people that would prefer only our Protectors should have guns.

Obama can't ban guns so he takes away the ammo, essentially achieving the same result in the long run. It is concerning how the government, even the US Postal Service has purchased billions of rounds of ammo, while taking it away from the civilians. The second Amendment was established so the people can form militias to fight the government if things go Nazi... makes you wonder why the government is stacking the deck in their favor. I am now taking the tin foil off my hat