Overworked Fatigued Pilots

[Mangosteen]

This is a bit surprising in this day and age.
Management calls their pilots " prima donnas" when they complain

I sure hope local West Jet is not following this style of management.

"#2: ‘Management shuts eyes, mocks those who complain’

The whistleblower provided documents showing that pilots, and junior pilots in particular, are being assigned multiple flight shifts in a row, and noted that the crew often does not have enough time for sleep readjustment. He asserted that Flydubai’s top management was aware of the issue, but had done nothing to resolve it.

"
The reason for fatigue is simple – pilots are being repeatedly overworked and not given enough time to sleep between flights.

The whistleblower provided documents showing that pilots, junior pilots in particular, are being assigned multiple flight shifts in a row. He argued that the crew often does not have enough time for sleep readjustment.

Leaked flight log of the co-captain of flight FZ981 Alejandro Cruz Alava
Leaked flight log of the co-captain of flight FZ981 Alejandro Cruz Alava
“Everybody at the company has these dangerous shifts from day flight to night flight, and then back to a day flight, and then back to a night flight, and it has definitely been a big issue for a long time.”

“When I was still at the company, one of the last things I told management is that there would be an accident because of pilot fatigue,” he told RT.

Moreover, rather than trying to fix the problem, the whistleblower claims Flydubai created a culture that shamed pilots for feeling tired, calling them “prima donnas” if they complained.

“I know when I was still with Flydubai there were meetings every two weeks with the chief pilot … In most of those meetings [sleep deprivation] was always brought up and in fact in one of the meetings, the chief pilot referred to us as a bunch of prima donnas, like we complain too much, that’s exactly what he said. He said, ‘you guys are just a bunch of prima donnas'.”

This was copied from today's RT on five things we know from the whistle blower.

It has the pilots flight log shown as back up.

Well the only prima Donna guys I know are the ones I have to align in the oil patch from time to time but that's ok. Pilots NO!
Let them sleep.


Pilots ‘worked to death’: Flydubai whistleblower says fatigue-related crash predicted (RT EXCLUSIVE) — RT News from RT’s Tweet

[Grizzly Adams]

cheap air fares ? This is where it leads. Air lines are looking to cut costs wherever possible and get the most out of their resources, including maintenance. Think about that on your trip to someplace warm. :D

Grizz

[Okotokian]

Just because someone complains doesn't mean their claims are true or justified. Sometimes they are, sometimes they aren't. I wouldn't jump to conclusions here just yet.

[prarie_boy1]

Just because someone complains doesn't mean their claims are true or justified. Sometimes they are, sometimes they aren't. I wouldn't jump to conclusions here just yet.


I work in this field and this has been an ongoing problem. I think there is a lot of validity in the claims made buy the anonymous individual. In an age of cheap air travel airlines are being forced to cut costs at every turn in an effort to get the market share for bottom dollar.

[lannie]

The Pilots need to say no but so many of them out there willing to work for just about free they are their own worst enemy. There is a line up of pilots behind them willing to do the job if they say no. If they went from flying to driving a gravel truck they would have better working conditions and much better pay but it's their choice.....

[Grizzly Adams]

The Pilots need to say no but so many of them out there willing to work for just about free they are their own worst enemy. There is a line up of pilots behind them willing to do the job if they say no. If they went from flying to driving a gravel truck they would have better working conditions and much better pay but it's their choice.....

The story of How Rachel's dad died is a good example of what goes on.

https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1946&dat=19860808&id=2Y0kAAAAIBAJ&sjid=g7kFAAAAIBAJ&pg=1149,3324627&hl=en

Grizz

[prarie_boy1]

The Pilots need to say no but so many of them out there willing to work for just about free they are their own worst enemy. There is a line up of pilots behind them willing to do the job if they say no. If they went from flying to driving a gravel truck they would have better working conditions and much better pay but it's their choice.....

Couldn't have summed it up better!

[Okotokian]

The Pilots need to say no but so many of them out there willing to work for just about free they are their own worst enemy. There is a line up of pilots behind them willing to do the job if they say no. If they went from flying to driving a gravel truck they would have better working conditions and much better pay but it's their choice.....

One would assume this shouldn't be happening in unionized airlines.

[lmtada]

Auto Pilot lets them sleep. "Wake me up when we have to land. Man this is a demanding job. Sure glad I am not a bus driver". :argue2:

[GasGas]

Having worked in the maintenance side of civil aviation for Canada's two major carriers for over 20 years, I can attest that our care and standards in the way we support and fix our fleet haven't diminished in light of tightening our budgetary belts like Grizz slyly insinuates.

Since our legal liability for work accomplished on the aircraft ends the moment it is finally cut up for scrap, you don't find anyone around here scrimping on parts or doing a half assed job. Maybe in YOUR line of work Grizz..not in mine.

But I like that fact that you are even thinking about the maintenance done on your flights to Mexico or Cuba..maybe I could supplement my income by holding a tip jar in your face as you walk off your flight having arrived safely!
:sHa_shakeshout:

[lannie]

The story of How Rachel's dad died is a good example of what goes on.

https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1946&dat=19860808&id=2Y0kAAAAIBAJ&sjid=g7kFAAAAIBAJ&pg=1149,3324627&hl=en

Grizz

I thought the airplane hit the trees because the pilot used the barometric pressure reading from Edmonton rather than updating to where he was landing. This is why he hit the trees while thinking he was in a decent to the airport, just thought he was at a higher elevation than he was. The pilot does always have the last call on the flight leaving or not and the pilot made 2 bad calls really. The first one was departing Edmonton and the second one cost a few lives. The difference between West jet and some "chisel charter outfits" is unfortunately huge and the young pilot trying to amass hours on airplanes on tiny regional carrier does not have any union behind him. Sad but true....Guy is flying trying to make a living with peoples lives on the line and he making a very poor wage with big pressure to make the flight, including the fellows on Buffalo air express.

[CNP]

An airline cannot force a pilot to be on duty beyond the hours regulated by the government. All airlines must comply with national aviation regulations. Don't know what Dubai has in place but here at home it's a 14 hour duty day. That includes the time arriving to work and released from duty (not just flying hours). For example....you get 6 hours flight time out of a 8 hr duty day. Max duty time in a day is 14 hours unless it's changed recently. Things have changed a lot over the years. I remember 18 hours duty days....that could be extended to 20 hours (airforce regulations).........and did many of them. Not as a pilot, but as a crewmember on aircraft where pilots had the same rules. As well as maximum duty hours in a day there are minimum down times (to guarantee sleep), maximum monthly, quarterly and annual flying hours. Where is the "log book" to back this up? Suspect that the whistleblower is blowing on a soother.

[Mangosteen]

An airline cannot force a pilot to be on duty beyond the hours regulated by the government. All airlines must comply with national aviation regulations. Don't know what Dubai has in place but here at home it's a 14 hour duty day. That includes the time arriving to work and released from duty (not just flying hours). For example....you get 6 hours flight time out of a 8 hr duty day. Max duty time in a day is 14 hours unless it's changed recently. Things have changed a lot over the years. I remember 18 hours duty days....that could be extended to 20 hours (airforce regulations).........and did many of them. Not as a pilot, but as a crewmember on aircraft where pilots had the same rules. As well as maximum duty hours in a day there are minimum down times (to guarantee sleep), maximum monthly, quarterly and annual flying hours. Where is the "log book" to back this up? Suspect that the whistleblower is blowing on a soother.

Logbook is clearly displayed on the link. Check it out.

[Grizzly Adams]

Having worked in the maintenance side of civil aviation for Canada's two major carriers for over 20 years, I can attest that our care and standards in the way we support and fix our fleet haven't diminished in light of tightening our budgetary belts like Grizz slyly insinuates.

Since our legal liability for work accomplished on the aircraft ends the moment it is finally cut up for scrap, you don't find anyone around here scrimping on parts or doing a half assed job. Maybe in YOUR line of work Grizz..not in mine.

But I like that fact that you are even thinking about the maintenance done on your flights to Mexico or Cuba..maybe I could supplement my income by holding a tip jar in your face as you walk off your flight having arrived safely!
:sHa_shakeshout:

Not insinuating anything. The facts around the Wapity crash were substantiated by the Transport Canada investigation, which put Wapity out of business. Into the Abyss, a Book written by Carol Schaben, explores the circumstances around the crash, plenty of grist for the mill. As for maintenance, on a personal level, hope you weren't responsible for the 14 hour wait my son and his family had, when an engine failed, before they left the tarmac and the airline eventually had to fly in another plane. :lol:

Grizz

[Mangosteen]

#Flydubaigate spreads: Now exhausted Emirates airline pilots tell RT of overwork (EXCLUSIVE) — RT News from RT’s Tweet

Download the Twitter app

More is emerging on how they were treated.
I can imagine if this is happening in Dubai then most likely in quite a few other places. ( never in Canada right)

[58thecat]

Well that would explain our rather hard landing in Regina last month coming back from Cuba, overhead luggage racks opened and booze bottles broke etc, wife banged her head off the window...made me laugh:)

[prarie_boy1]

#Flydubaigate spreads: Now exhausted Emirates airline pilots tell RT of overwork (EXCLUSIVE) — RT News from RT’s Tweet

Download the Twitter app

More is emerging on how they were treated.
I can imagine if this is happening in Dubai then most likely in quite a few other places. ( never in Canada right)


Surprisingly Canada has some of the worst flight duty regulations in the world Bangladesh and India are more regulated in this regard.

http://globalnews.ca/news/2177082/pilots-call-for-more-fatigue-regulations-in-canada/

[Grizzly Adams]

Surprisingly Canada has some of the worst flight duty regulations in the world Bangladesh and India are more regulated in this regard.

http://globalnews.ca/news/2177082/pilots-call-for-more-fatigue-regulations-in-canada/

I know of one commercial pilot at least, who's an AA member. :D Tough to beat the German pilot though, who flew his plane into a mountainside, as a suicide.

Grizz