A number of Bighorn Rams Poached near Pincher Creek

[A number of Bighorn Rams Poached near Pincher Creek]

Did any of you see the news on the headless rams found near Pincher Creek. One of the poorest areas for ram trophy size with a huge poaching/subsistence hunting problem good correlation isn't it, in fact its the only correlation you can make with the evidence at hand.

[lilsundance]

I for one would like to know what evidence you have to correlate headless Rams with susistance hunting????? The only evidence you have is some bodies of Rams missing the heads. The rest is speculation on your part. Unless you know something that your not telling us.

[rams]

ctv news calgary should have it on any minute now

[The Highlander]

I didn't see the story.I'm ****ed.

Big surprise. I hate to jump to conclusions without some evidence, but I suspect the same.

On the other hand, there are lots of so called hunters out there with no morals, regardless of ethnicity.

[The Highlander]

Report A Poacher hotline number

1-800-642-3800

Let's catch these bastards.

[SUBSISTED]

Phone 627 1116 (f&w in pc) tomorrow and ask how many rams have been SUBSISTED. Its been a problem for many years, its common knowledge. If metis from Medicine hat have to drive to Pincher Creek to subsitence hunt its a problem.

[jrs]

It was just on the news. I mentioned this a few weeks ago. Looks like the scum bags are getting away with it so far. I think what hunter is refering to is the large amount of sheep removed this fall for "subsistance". That is a different issue from this specific report. Makes me sick though. A lot of sheep have been removed from the area this season. Other kill sites are likely within wooded areas and not going to be found as others who spend lots of time in the area know. I really hope they catch these scum.

[poachers]

I was informed a hunting guide from British Columbia harvested a ram with his subsistence hunting accomplice (from Alberta) in November South of the Crowsnest Pass. Apparently this ram was confiscated. Anyone know these guys names or the outfitter they work for, its good to know just so you don't turn your back on these criminals. Call Blairmore F&W to verify the story.

[Mackaylake]

Thanks Lil, this has come a long way from a couple years ago. Shooting sheep and cutting their heads off is NOT subsistence hunting. It is poaching. Now, someone once told me, being unregistered means that whatever you say doesn't count. So quit disturbing the feces, it has just settled down lately.

[101sonny]

someone once told me, being unregistered means that whatever you say doesn't count:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol Let me guess this person was registered.:rolleyes Thats not alway the case .

[fat cat]

The problem could be easily looked after, If Metie and treatie would only be allowed to hunt female for subsistance during a closed season, and turn over the antlers of a male species, taken for subsistance, during a open season.

[Rackmastr]

The problem could be easily looked after, If Metie and treatie would only be allowed to hunt female for subsistance during a closed season, and turn over the antlers of a male species, taken for subsistance, during a open season.

Actually, the poaching of rams with their heads being cut off has nothing to do with sustinence or metis issues....its been happening for a LONG time before IMHA and usually involves big dollars for big rams....

Not all poaching has a direct correlation to native rights.....beleive it or not, white guys poach as well....

[sheep hunter]

I believe that's it's been going on for a long time Trev but reports of big dollars for poached rams are pure fantasy. I'm not certain if the BC government still does it or not but they used to sell wildlife found dead on the roads and such at auction and a good, mature legal ram rarely fetched more than $500 and that was a legal one. I'm not certain where these stories originated but I know the federal park rangers love to keep them alive so they can get funding, guns, vests etc.

Sure the odd world record head might be worth some serious dough but not an average sheep head from southern Alberta that is illegal and could not be plugged. I've got a couple, legal and plugged pick ups that I'd be happy to part with for big bucks but the truth is that they are nothing more than dust collectors in my basement and reminders of great days spent afield.

I hate seeing these rumours spread as there is always some moron that figures he can get rich quick so he goes and poaches a ram only to find out it's virtually worthless.

[SouthAltaHunter]

On Ebay there is 3 rams 4 sale from B.C. Minimum asking bid is $10,000 U.S. funds for all 3. Nobody has bidded on them yet.

cgi.ebay.com/SHEEP-HORNS-...dZViewItem (http://cgi.ebay.com/SHEEP-HORNS-3-SETS-ROCKY-MOUNTAIN-BIGHORN-RAMS_W0QQitemZ220076982490QQihZ012QQcategoryZ22702 QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem)

[sheep hunter]

Ya and those are legally registered rams and one was book. Really not much market other than artisans.

[jrs]

Did the ram heads in BC have capes? The going rate for a mature cape is over a thousand bucks, for lots of guys thats worth pulling the trigger. Sad but true. I'd agree with you concerning prices however, under 190'' and the horns are not worth much. Misconseptions. I'm surprised those ones on ebay haven't sold though, you'd almost think bass pro or cabelas would go for a three set, opening bid may be too high.

And:

"The problem could be easily looked after, If Metis and treatie would only be allowed to hunt female for subsistance during a closed season, and turn over the antlers of a male species, taken for subsistance, during a open season."

A few lost rams in this area is not as big of a deal as the ewes. This sheep population has been in the gutter for many years. Prior to the 1970's it was the best sheep range in Alberta by a long shot. Then lungworm etc and range improvedment further north have tossed it way down the totem pole. Legal subsistance doesn't help but unauthorized poaching is even worse as the entire carcass aside from head and cape have been wasted.

[Rackmastr]

Yea its true that sheep arent worth a pile of money like it is rumoured, but there is still 'greed' that feeds people, and I was just kinda pointing out the fact that poaching has really nothing to do with the IMHA or native harvesting rights. A poacher who cuts the head off a ram is a poacher...whether he's white or metis....native...etc......its poaching and thats really all that matters.

And ya....usually the cape is worth more than most sheep horns.....$1000 usually at the minimum range. I know some that have sold full-body capes for $2000USD....

Either way, its a bad deal....hope they get caught...

[BeerSlayer1]

illegal and could not be plugged

Sorry for the ignorance but what's plugged? I assume it's like registering the rack to prove it's legality but I'm not familiar with the term.

[sheep hunter]

All rams...killed and found in North America must be registered and have a metal plug inserted in the horns.

[Mackaylake]

Well, I must say "Hunter" is wasting our time. I phoned P.C. f&w and asked how many sheep have been taken by subsistence hunters that they know of. It took a while, but they returned my call and gave me an answer of "0", that's ZERO, NADDA, ZILCH, NOT ONE!!!!

[sheep hunter]

:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin

[TOTAL B#$%^]

None eh, what about the one registered at WATERTON 41 well site. What about the one taken by a guide from Standoff during the first week of December at compressor W. What about the two at crowsnest lake taken by Metis.

You think I would make false claims and waste my time these are REGISTERED rams under subsistence hunting.

[Mackaylake]

I ask you Mr. Schwanky to go ahead and call. Maybe with your big name you can get more out of them than I can. I eagerly await the answer you come up with.

[sheep hunter]

Wasn't laughing at you at all Mackay...easy there big fellow. I was laughing at their answer. There have been numerous rams registered in Alberta taken by subsistence hunters. What's with everyone being so touchy this week...sheesh!

[Mackaylake]

Well all I can say is they are NOT registered in P. Creek.

[number one reason for your total BS response]

Freedom of Information and protection of privacy act. Who was it you talked to???

[sheep hunter]

Gee...or do you think that the officers there were told not to give out that info??????

[Mackaylake]

Hunter posted a # to call to substantiate his claims. I did that, and now I am in an arguement on the info I recieved. I am only relaying the message I was given. Please call them yourselves. And I am not going to put the officer's name all over the internet. Hunter, why don't you put your name on these posts?

[How did you word your question?]

They will only give you a direct response if you are lucky to exactly what you asked, oh well what is is

[jrs]

"Well, I must say "Hunter" is wasting our time. I phoned P.C. f&w and asked how many sheep have been taken by subsistence hunters that they know of. It took a while, but they returned my call and gave me an answer of "0", that's ZERO, NADDA, ZILCH, NOT ONE!!!!"

I talked to one of the guys (i believe out of Blairemore) and the number surprised me. I can't remember how many exactly were rams or ewes or seperated from a poaching ring but the number was significant. I have been thinking my and everyone elses days of hunting 400 for sheep may be numbered if it keeps up. A local officer i talked to was very concerned as well and he knows more than anybody.

And Rackmastr, i paid just under a thousand for a beautiful cape and saw the same prices you mentioned. Lifesize and big bases can run $2500 easy. Large demand due to pick up heads and sheep hunters with poor skinning skills :rollin .

[Mackaylake]

I am not arguing what you heard jrs. I only called the p. creek office and that is what they told me.

[Rackmastr]

Large demand due to pick up heads and sheep hunters with poor skinning skills :rollin .

Heh....which one did you buy the cape for JRS? Pickup or poor skinning? :D

I'm still lookin for my first ram....found a fresh road kill this year, but hopefully 07 finds me holding a ram....

[jrs]

It was just a pick up, i'm hoping to need one from bad skinning next year :lol . I've been close to pulling the trigger two or three times now, hopefully next year. I'll have to get pics when the pickup mounts done, very impressive so far.

[chuck]

Mackay, hunter knows exactly what he is talking about, and would suggest that the PC fish cops are not being very forthcomming. Maybe you didn't really call them?

[Mackaylake]

Chuck, please call them yourself!!!! Before calling me a liar.

[chuck]

Relax. I don't have to call them, and once again, hunter's information is correct. If you won't post the name of the officer you talked to, what is the last letter in his first name?

[Mackaylake]

y

[OOPs]

Turns out none of these rams may have been registered, apparently, subsistence hunters do not require registering of such kills if they do not meet the definition of "trophy" for that WMU. Six of these rams were shot within 1 mile of each other. Even the largest of the rams harvested (that would make seven rams) which was confiscated may not have met the definition of full curl. Apparently the rams taken by the Metis may also not have met "trophy" criteria, therefore did not require registering.

One can only guess how many more were taken as apparently, these rams do not require registering. The CO in Pincher Creek may have answered exactly what you asked for.

At any rate this unregulated harvesting should have put a good dent in the sheep population in WMU 400 this year. My guess its been this way for 30 years as the last Boone and Crockett ram in wmu 400 was shot in 1984 taken by a subsistence hunter ( who would have guessed!!)

[Try calling three different offices]

From the sounds of it you'll probably get at least two different answers

[Rackmastr]

Well....if you ever get two different answers, ask for the legislation to back it up.....theres only ONE right answer, and legislation is the key to finding out the answer.

This is from the Wildlife Regulation:

Requirement to report and deliver wildlife

130(1) This section does not apply with respect to wildlife possessed under a zoo permit, a game animal production farm licence, a wildlife rehabilitation permit or a research permit.

(2) A person who kills a male sheep over the age of one year shall personally
(a) submit a report to the Service, and
(b) deliver the complete and unaltered skull with horns and eyes intact to an appointed officer,

not later than 7 days after the close of the open season in which the animal was killed or 14 days after the date on which the animal was killed, whichever occurs first.


Possession of wildlife not legalized

136(1) Nothing in section 55(2)(c)(ii) of the Act or, subject to subsections (2) and (3), in this Regulation authorizes the possession

(a) of the skull of a dead male sheep over the age of one year if
(i) the skull has been altered,
(ii) an eye has been removed, or
(iii) a horn has been removed,

unless it is a trophy sheep and in that case until after the skull of the trophy sheep has been delivered to an appointed officer in accordance with section 130(2),


The way I read these sections say that all persons have to register them. If you were to call and get conflicting stories, its always worth asking for the legislation so you can ask yourself.

[jrs]

I know a few big rams escaped so far. Officer was telling me there sitting ducks for poachers or subsistance. He said a few of the rams were pretty big, not sure if they were book but there hanging out within 150m of easy access (no hints from me incase certain types are checking this site). I have not seen any further report of this in the news. Its already leaving the radar.

Hunter, there are more issues above subsistance hunting and poaching in this area preventing sheep from surviving. Its hard to watch the sheep herd crash but so many factors are involved. Subsistance has its impacts but i still think habitat issues and access are the main problems. I am afraid sheep hunting may soon be a thing of the past for normal citizens in the area. To me, if we need to shut it down (hunters, and subsistence) to everybody to keep the herds from being completely decimated, its worth it. Conservation first, then maybe it could re-open once the province gets its crap all sorted out. Sorry for being negative but it has to be considered.

[Rackmastr]

Turns out none of these rams may have been registered, apparently, subsistence hunters do not require registering of such kills if they do not meet the definition of "trophy" for that WMU. Six of these rams were shot within 1 mile of each other. Even the largest of the rams harvested (that would make seven rams) which was confiscated may not have met the definition of full curl. Apparently the rams taken by the Metis may also not have met "trophy" criteria, therefore did not require registering.

Are you sure about the registerring thing? It was my understanding that all rams had to be registered....no matter of the type of hunting, found dead, etc......

When you say it turns out that none of the rams have been registered, are you talking about the ones found with their heads cut off or just sustinence rams? Of course the ones with their heads cut off wouldnt be registered...but they have nothing to do with sustinence. I'm sure I'm confusing what you're talking about as the poached rams cant really be compared with sustinence harvests.

Just always thought that all rams had to be registered.....sure should be the way it is if thats not the case....

[sheep hunter]

My understanding is that all do save for lambs shot as non-trophy.

[That would be ironic wouldn't it]

Getting the wmu closed to hunting just because a couple of ethical and concerned hunters took it upon themselves to find out why so many mature rams were dissappearing during the winter months. If it weren't for these guys no one would have known any better and nothing would have been done to stop it.

This same situation happened in WMU 437 even a draw couldn't protect these rams from excessive poaching and subsistence hunting.

As bad as things sound I think the spot light has been put in the right spot and maybe future sheep management practices will put greater emphasis on protecting wintering sheep.

[Rackmastr]

My understanding is that all do save for lambs shot as non-trophy.

Yep thats what I thought as well....

[registering]

Straight from a CO's mouth

[Rackmastr]

I'm assuming you mean a Fish & Wildlife officer as they are no longer classed together with Conservation Officers...

I've always heard they had to be registered....I'll have to do some checkin now to confirm this.....

[Boss442]

"If" it was subsistence hunters, why would they just take the heads? Does'nt make any sense. You would think they would take the whole thing if they were looking for meat? What proof is there that it was in fact subsistance hunters!! Maybe a guy should take a drive out to P Creek or the Pass with a pair of binoculars and snoop around the trailer parks for redneck trophy hunters!!

[bigbore]

The way I read these sections say that all persons have to register them. If you were to call and get conflicting stories, its always worth asking for the legislation so you can ask yourself.
Trev



from what ive been told, a treaty status hunter in alberta can go to town on anything, without limits or regulation, other than the basic firearms laws. dont even need to have evidence of sex attached during transport.


what really bothers me is that who ever manages wmu936 really has it going on, because it is like the law or something that treaty status hunters CANNOT shoot mule deer, not 1 , not 2, but 0, this is the first and only place i have heard of a limitation to treaty status hunting rights. what is so special about this particular wmu that cannot be utilized in other regions of alberta, in particular with animals such as cougars, sheep and grizz?

not to start anything, but i was told for a fact by F&W out of edmonton, that a treaty status indian (i) can actually harvest caribou in alberta, with no season, no limit, but it is highly not recommended. now thats comedy, and the biggest joke i heard that week.

[grandzillaa]

936 is a Provincal Park, therefor laws would be different in this spot. I would think that the park can stop hunting their altogether if they so choose.

As for the caribou, that is <blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>the biggest joke I heard<hr></blockquote>in a while to. Oh well maybe there should be chages in that law....caribou in Alberta do need protection from all human hunters. At least from what I under stand we don't have many around and the wolfs from what I gather arn't helping.

[geezer55]

Today's Lethbridge Herald, February 10, 2007, has an article about the sheep taken around Pincher Creek. There were three shot in December 2006 and two shot in January 2007. The heads and capes were the only things taken. It says nothing about subsistence hunters doing any of the shooting.

Poaching of bighorn sheep some of ‘worst’ ever seen
By LETHBRIDGE HERALD
Feb 10, 2007, 22:54

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PINCHER CREEK — Five bighorn sheep were killed, some of their heads taken and their carcasses left to rot in the past couple of months, southwest of Pincher Creek.
Sought by hunters, collectors and big-game enthusiasts as one of the top trophies, a Pincher Creek Fish and Wildlife officer believes the animals’ heads have made their way onto the black market, where they could garner thousands of dollars.
“The biggest issue we have is the wastage. Given that only the head and capes were removed from the rams, it appears to us somebody has taken these possibly to sell on the black market,” said Perry Abramenko, a Pincher Creek Fish and Wildlife officer.
Now he is asking for the public’s assistance in locating the culprit or culprits who killed and left the bighorn sheep.
The first incident occurred around Dec. 22, when officers found three bighorn sheep in a mountain area 25 kilometres southwest of Pincher Creek
Abramenko said the two rams and a ewe had been shot. The bodies of all the animals were left but the heads and capes of the rams were taken. The cape is the cape of skin around the neck and the shoulders of the animals that is used by a taxidermist when the animal is mounted as a trophy.
Then Jan. 14 in another area three to four kilometres north of the initial location, another ram and ewe were shot, with the head and cape removed from the ram and the rest of body left and all of the ewe left.
Abramenko said he doesn’t know why someone is shooting the ewes.
“We’re seeking information from the public to assist in the investigation of these incidents,” said Abramenko, who added the incidents may be connected.
People who think they have information can phone the report a poacher line at 1-800-642-3800.
“No tip is too small. It may be part of a chain of events that could help identify those responsible.”
Abramenko said hunting for bighorn sheep, which are full-curl rams (mature rams), is allowed in September and October. But he said during the winter the animals are particularly vulnerable because they’re on their winter range.
Someone caught hunting for the purpose of trafficking faces a fine up to a maximum of $100,000 and/or six months imprisonment. Additional fines of hunting out of season and allowing the carcass to go to waste could see an offender risk fines of up to $50,000.
Abramenko said he’s never seen poaching to this extent for the bighorn sheep in the area. “This is the worst I’ve ever seen.”

[HuntingDan]

Bigbore,

According to the COs (I inquired about three years ago), treaty indians are actually allowed to shoot mule deer in WMU 936. They are asked not to and, once again from what I've been told by the COs there, the small number of treaty indians that actually hunt in WMU 936 respect the request and do not take any mule deer.

Grandzilla,

WMU 936 is not a provincial park - it is a provincial recreation area and allows many activities that are not permitted in provincial parks - including hunting.

Its history, as explained to me by a CO out there (I think during a hunt in 1989):

•&nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp WMU 936 was originally the Cooking Lake-Blackfoot Grazing Reserve.
•&nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp Like all other grazing reserves, it allowed a large number of recreational activities - including hunting.
•&nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp Because of its proximity to Edmonton, it was heavily used for recreational activities.
•&nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp In about 1986 or 1987 it was re-classified and became the Cooking Lake-Blackfoot Provincial Recreation Area and the management of it was transferred from Alberta Public Lands to Alberta Parks and Recreation.

I’ve also heard (but don’t recall from whom) that WMU 936 was the first provincial recreation area and the “provincial recreation area” public land classification was really created for WMU 936 in an attempt to better manage it given that it was no longer predominantly a grazing reserve with just a little recreational activity.

[jrs]

"Today's Lethbridge Herald, February 10, 2007, has an article about the sheep taken around Pincher Creek. There were three shot in December 2006 and two shot in January 2007. The heads and capes were the only things taken. It says nothing about subsistence hunters doing any of the shooting."

Its not just the poached sheep being removed, theres subsitance hunting as well (on top of those five that were poached). Its compounding variables on the population. There has been no indications those five were shot by any specific group, thats just some dirty good for nothing poachers. Other sheep in the area however have been taken "for food".

[chuck]

A spade is a spade, and the rams have been taken for their heads. It's just some took the meat with them as well in the name of subsistance.

[What about the other 4 rams]

No mention of the other four rams taken in 400 on winter range by the lazy slack ass subsistence hunters who are not ethical enough to leave these sheep alone on their wintering range (who knows how many countless others have been taken under subsistence hunting hunting rights), no mention of the rams taken off the same mountain two years previous, and WHY because no one raised a stink about it.

[bigbore]

Bigbore,

According to the COs (I inquired about three years ago), treaty indians are actually allowed to shoot mule deer in WMU 936. They are asked not to and, once again from what I've been told by the COs there, the small number of treaty indians that actually hunt in WMU 936 respect the request and do not take any mule deer.[/quote[


ah well, i was told when i got my discharge permit for the 2006 season, that it was not allowed by anyone to shoot mulies, Period. thats ok, the whitetails taste better:D


meh, but hey, when are we going sheddin'???? i got some fish for the smok

[grandzillaa]

Thankyou for the correction HuntingDan, I am sorry to you all for giving out wrong imfo.

[59whiskers]

This has been an ongoing problem for years. It may get to the point where these sheep wintering areas will have to become off limits too all the public when the animals are on winter ranges in December. The main road in this area runs through 3 zones, 300, 302, and 400 along the east edge of the mountains and extends from Waterton Park north to Mill Creek and is wintering area for sheep This road is maintained by Shell and used by Shell employees, contractors, ranchers and the public. I would not have any problem seeing the access road that go through this winter range closed to the public after the general hunting season in November. The problem is easy access.

[jrs]

Well, Has anyone heard anything about the investigations or more harvest?

I was up there today and saw many different groups of people spotting up in the grassy slopes and also heard a few rifle shots between Beaver Mines and the ski hill. There were some guys who obviously looked like they were hunting but at least were spending time in deer habitat (at least thats acceptable for filling the freezer). Still frustrating to see so many people up there, i saw more vehicles full of guys than the average day in September. I'm sure most were just out for a drive and looking for animals (kind of like anyone would when out hiking or what not). Didn't see any Co's either, maybe it was my luck but it looked as though there presence was less than the past few trips out. Noted a few vehicles but they moved on after spotting the mineral licks up there. Not sure what they were looking for.....

Good news is the snow is getting deep and as of this evening it would take a lot of work to extract any critter from the mountains. I'm sure hoping they catch those guys who started this whole debate>: !!

[Keith]

you guys keep going on about metis/treaty subsistence hunter I've turn in about 6 poachers and not one was metis/treaty person

[Keith]

you guys keep going on about metis/treaty subsistence hunter I've turn in about 6 poachers and not one was metis/treaty person.

[Kanonfodder]

Good job on that if you did, my question is why you would pull a thread from such a long time ago to tell us this fact, do you by chance have an agenda?

[pika]

you guys keep going on about metis/treaty subsistence hunter I've turn in about 6 poachers and not one was metis/treaty person

Are you sure it was 6 poachers maybe it was only 5 I guess it's hard to keep track after "about" 5 well maybe it was 6. seems to me you would clearly remember 6 poachers not a very high number to remember.

There were 7 confirmed sheep kills on those mountains down in WMU 400 from November 2006 to mid January 2007, not about 7, definetly 7, one was shot with a 270 win, remington brass not winchester brass and it was a legal subsistence kill which is absolute Bull SHi#. Facts a fact.

[SNIPER]

and it was a legal subsistence kill which is absolute Bull SHi#. Facts a fact.

Well, what was it? Bull**** or fact:D

[pika]

Well, what was it? Bull**** or fact:D:lol: :lol: too funny

FACT, two other rams were harvested in the area by Metis from Medicine Hat , the total is 9.

[pika]

At any rate this unregulated harvesting should have put a good dent in the sheep population in WMU 400 this year. My guess its been this way for 30 years as the last Boone and Crockett ram in wmu 400 was shot in 1984 taken by a subsistence hunter ( who would have guessed!!)


It's bad when the legal harvest of full curl rams is only 25 percent of the total known sheep harvest from WMU 400. The legal harvest percentage could be much lower as subsistence hunters do not have to register their sheep if it does not meet "trophy" criteria according to SRD.

SO WHAT DID SRD do to prevent slaughter of sheep on WMU 400 winter range, basically nothing. Three gates were needed to prevent poachers from accessing the area, one gate was installed but access by motor vehicle remains unchanged. It boggles my mind when people who hunt sheep in 400 think it needs to be a draw zone when only 1/4 of the harvest is by legally licensed hunters harvesting full curl rams.

Shell agreed there was a problem and would of foot the bill to close the roads during winter months but they needed SRD approval, the poachers are using Shell roads to facilitate poaching.

[raised by wolves]

One of the first rumors I heard on the sheep and subsistence hunting was the first day of the Metis harvest. Apparently 9 trophy Rams were taken out of the Westcastle area, near the ski hill. I used to hunt that area and not once did I ever see 9 trophy rams in one day. There are good rams up there but not in significant enough numbers for that many to be taken so quickly.

Someone knocking off a few whitetails or moose throughout the year would seem to be legitimate subsistence hunting. Dragging one's ass up and down mountain slopes for a chance at a ram is far from subsistence hunting. Sheep carcasses found without heads is poaching.

Too many rumors and not enough info from the province, nor controls in effect to monitor legitimate subsistence hunting. Monitoring the wildlands, especially the mountains requires a huge work force. Unfortunately it is impossible to put an end to poaching due to the terrain, costs, and the potential for greed in some of our fellow citizens.

[jrs]

I noticed this old post was pulled back to the top. Anyone know if charges were laid? Or did they end up getting away with it?

[SNIPER]

I noticed this old post was pulled back to the top. Anyone know if charges were laid? Or did they end up getting away with it?

Who is/are they?

[jrs]

"Who is/are they?"

Last winter some sheep carcasses minus the head and cape were found in WMU 400 (believe that's all that was missing). I seem to remember some ewes where shot and left as well (nothing taken). I understood they had leads but i never heard if they caught the scum that did it. It was on TV, in the papers, i remember being fairly angry about the whole ordeal. I was down in WMU 300 for a late season cow elk hunt and remember having a chat with the fish and wildlife officers about it. We were recording all licence plates and vehicle descriptions in sheep country when out ice fishing or hiking last winter. There was also some subsistence harvest which added to the impacts on the herd. I'm not around the south this year to hear if any further poaching has occurred (so far anyway). I saw about 20 sheep down there last week including a full curl ram and a little 4/5, hope they stay where they were as they're in a pretty safe spot right now.

[SNIPER]

I probably misread. I seemed by the post that there was a suspect(s) and
"they" got away with it.

( I do remember the reports )

[jrs]

Sorry for the confusion, not sure if there was suspects, i was just hoping they would find and persecute the poachers.