Pine Coulee Already Restocked with Trout

[calgarygringo]

Maybe I missed it but did not see anywhere posted. I saw a guy in one of my Facebook groups said he saw Pine Coulee has already been stocked with trout. I just had a look and sure enough the stocking list shows that they put in 15,500 rainbows back in October.
I guess the leftover pike and walleye should feed well this winter and you guys that fish it will have to change your tactics if you want to catch anything. May need a while to grow though at stocking only 13.9cm.

[Sundancefisher]

I was hoping they would stock browns brooks rainbow and tigers.

[Sundancefisher]

Claresholm
Pine Coulle Reservoir
RNTR
TLTLJ
AF3N
14,500
8.6
16-Oct-17

Claresholm
Pine Coulle Reservoir
RNTR
TLTLS
AF3N
15,500
13.9

16-Oct-17

https://mywildalberta.ca/fishing/fish-stocking/documents/AlbertaFishStockingReport-Jan02-2018.pdf

[Wes_G]

I don't understand why they wouldn't wait a few more years to get rid of more of the pike and walleye first. At least they have got a forage base for now!

[calgarygringo]

After we chatted that day you said you heard tigers. I was at the Calgary fishing meeting that week after and it came up on a side conversation. Dude said they were going to but backed off with the thought if they make there way out and downstream they will kill the rest of the trout, minnows and anything else they could eat. Hence no tigers there.

I was hoping they would stock browns brooks rainbow and tigers.

[calgarygringo]

Based on what they said at the local meeting rainbows are cheap and easy to raise so just stock them for food.


I don't understand why they wouldn't wait a few more years to get rid of more of the pike and walleye first. At least they have got a forage base for now!

[Sundancefisher]

After we chatted that day you said you heard tigers. I was at the Calgary fishing meeting that week after and it came up on a side conversation. Dude said they were going to but backed off with the thought if they make there way out and downstream they will kill the rest of the trout, minnows and anything else they could eat. Hence no tigers there.

If sterile and a limited number the impact risk is minuscule.

[the local angler]

why does this situation remind me so much of crawling valley? where are all these rainbows we stocked???? everything else was feasting on them lol

[Habfan]

why does this situation remind me so much of crawling valley? where are all these rainbows we stocked???? everything else was feasting on them lol

The rainbows in Crawling Valley were a huge success ! Many of those trout are trophies on people’s walls. They eventually died off and were not restocked which was a big mistake. Rainbows live with pike and walleye in Lake Diefenbaker and do quite well. Pike and walleye are in the Bow River, many examples of trout and pike living in the same bodies of water.

[Evil69]

"Rainbows live with pike and walleye in Lake Diefenbaker and do quite well. Pike and walleye are in the Bow River, many examples of trout and pike living in the same bodies of water. "

McGregor is another good example.....all the rainbows we've caught this year have been shallow near weed beds full of larger pike.

[NSR Fisher]

Everyone who knows walleye fishing has heard about Washington Walleye, some absolutely stud fish in the 15+ pound range are caught every year in the Columbia river system, which also hosts a successful rainbow trout fishery.

Turns out the way the pros get the big girls is rolling up shallow late at night in the fall and throwing giant rainbow trout swimbaits!!!

They can co-exist and yes some will get eaten but the strong survive and turn into beasts! You can catch a nice 10 pound bow and a 15 pound walleye in the same day same river!

[Habfan]

I was hoping they would stock browns brooks rainbow and tigers.

I was hoping they would stock baitfish in it before anything else !

[calgarygringo]

He also "said Lol" that a small percentage get through not being sterile and do spawn. Dont know about that part from a technical point but appeared serious and was a concern to them.

If sterile and a limited number the impact risk is minuscule.

[rem338win]

He also "said Lol" that a small percentage get through not being sterile and do spawn. Dont know about that part from a technical point but appeared serious and was a concern to them.

I didn't know tiger trout could spawn.

[Kyle]

why does this situation remind me so much of crawling valley? where are all these rainbows we stocked???? everything else was feasting on them lol

The rainbows at crawling valley were massive and died of old age due to the fact they could not spawn.

[calgarygringo]

The trout used to gorge on the shrimp which CV has always had pile of them and the trout loved them. Maybe if PCR had a shrimp population like the old days of CV they would grow quick and to a crazy size.

The rainbows at crawling valley were massive and died of old age due to the fact they could not spawn.

[Habfan]

The trout used to gorge on the shrimp which CV has always had pile of them and the trout loved them. Maybe if PCR had a shrimp population like the old days of CV they would grow quick and to a crazy size.

You are correct, but one lake is full of structure and vegetation, the other not so much. I don’t think the rainbows will do much better than the walleyes but at least a12 inch trout is good on the smoker versus nothing at all.

[aulrich]

At least with the pike in there, undesirables like suckers or bucket brigade perch won't have a chance to ruin it. it would be nice if pcr could produce it would be nice to have it set to trophy fishery like Bullshead. With Chainlake so close we don't really need another numbers lake in the area.

[Joe Black]

Mmmmmmmmm. Trout flavored walley

[Xbolt7mm]

The rainbows at crawling valley were massive and died of old age due to the fact they could not spawn.

Those were Gerrard Rainbows and the purpose was to have a short lived, extremely fast growing trout until the pike and walleye population could grow. I have not heard what species they planted at pine but the situation is completely different than crawling valley. I would gues that they are normally stocked rainbow and not gerrards, which by the way are amazing to catch due to their size.

[the local angler]

i personally would prefer brook trout instead of the rainbow for some reason.

[wildbill]

With the amount of scuds in that lake, the trout that do survive will get big fast, to bad they don’t stock it like they did at Tyrrel in 2009, 450,400 rainbow! Never understood why they wasted them rainbows in that brine lake.

[kinwahkly]

Is there a goid scud population in the lake ?

[raw outdoors]

Could somebody explain the different breeds of stocked rainbows. I realize there is some fast growing ones some that get big some that stay small and some that cannot spawn. Can somebody name these different types?

[goldscud]

They put in Trout Lodge triploid (non-reproducing) rainbows of two strains. One type is probably a Kamloops strain, and the other is a "silver" (very few spots).

The hatchery buys triploid eggs from a company called Trout Lodge in the States and then rears the fish here

[Sundancefisher]

He also "said Lol" that a small percentage get through not being sterile and do spawn. Dont know about that part from a technical point but appeared serious and was a concern to them.

My counter to him would be I have caught brook trout Chain Lakes and Browns below chain lakes. So as to the Oldman drainage who cares about the odd brown/brook cross?

[Sundancefisher]

Could somebody explain the different breeds of stocked rainbows. I realize there is some fast growing ones some that get big some that stay small and some that cannot spawn. Can somebody name these different types?

Rainbow trout are one species however you can have different strains that have evolved separate from one another. Different traits help them to survive better in their home range and were selected for via natural selection. Who knows...over time they may evolve into different species.

So long as the fish could reproduce still if in the same area...they are a species. Essentially a species is the largest exposure of individuals that could still biologically reproduce.

There are Pennask, Kamloops, Gerrard, Blackwater, Fraser Valley and more

Some are more insectivorous...others piscivorous. Some jump more and some get bigger.


https://www.gofishbc.com/stocked-fish.aspx?region=LOWER%20MAINLAND&start=6/01/2016&end=6/29/2016&type=detailed

[mapleleafman3]

Boo for trout in Pine Coulee.

:sign0080:

[aulrich]

OK did read it correctly, they stocked triploid. And don't triploid have the potential to grow big?

[The Spank]

OK did read it correctly, they stocked triploid. And don't triploid have the potential to grow big?

Yes and quickly.

[The Fisherman Guy]

Disappointing amount of bureaucracy surrounding this action. We have an incredible opportunity to create a trophy catch and release Brown Trout fishery, in which many people could enjoy, nonetheless travel from far and wide to fish.

It seems that there is no end to the stocked rainbow, put and take lakes. Hasn't this idea run it's course? There's a nearly identical put and take lake 30 kilometers directly west, Chain lakes, and now we have another with Pine Coulee becoming one.

This argument surrounds the majority of anglers wanting to fish for a meal, and the majority of those anglers living in urban centers - Calgary in this instance.

Generally, people start fishing so that they can catch and keep. Following this theory, the more catch and keep opportunities that are created, should promote an increase year over year of licenses sold. Running the numbers, more licenses are in fact being sold at a higher rate of increase compared to Alberta's population increase. Thus, this theory is proven to work.

Yet, Alberta's fisheries are in trouble. Our governing bodies have admitted and proven this. Fish populations are crashing, and opportunities are fleeting.

Aside from the failure of our legal system to adequately punish poachers for contributing to this problem - see: The Oldman River fiasco, and the lack of respectable resources allocated to Alberta's wildlife enforcement, Biology and Management sectors - an Alberta voter would sure like to see more action from our provincial government to rectify these recurring issues. Seems like a great way to pot an empty netter with the outdoors community - and promote an increase in public sector jobs. You'd think the NDP would be all over it.

Plain and simple, we need to provide a more diverse variety of catch and release opportunities for trophy quality fish. One can only hope that with all the closures of Southern Alberta reservoirs, trophy quality will return to our waters, providing excellent fishing opportunities for new and advanced anglers alike. At the very least, our current teams who manage this are asking for more public feedback before they move forward. For that we can be thankful, but it sure is a drop in the ocean compared to what we are up against.

Which angler generates more revenue, and in turn, spends more on fishing year over year:

Put and take fisherman

or

Catch and release fisherman

A look into the tackle box and garage of each should prove this point fairly quickly.

[Habfan]

I think a lot of people want put and take walleye lakes, not rainbows, we have enough of those. This post was about walleye and pike stocking lists. The Bow river has trophy Browns and people do come from all over to fish for them. Pine will never be a trophy lake for anything, it lacks food and Fish need to eat lots of it to grow big, especially minnow sized food. I don’t think the problem with Pine Coullee was the fishery itself, just the way it was managed. I would like to see a trophy trout lake as much as the next guy, but that lake is a bad choice in my opinion ! If you witnessed the the popularity of Pine C, once it was opened to retention you would have noticed how popular catch and keep walleye fisheries are. I’m mostly catch and release, my issue is this stocking the lakes and closing them garbage that everyone knows is ruining lakes, except the people in charge, that has gotten my anger peaked ! Sorry !

[Habfan]

Sorry about the walleye and pike stocking comment as well ! I’m following that as well. :angry3:

[ericlin0122]

i hope it has proper regulation and doesn't turn into another chain lakes.

[The Fisherman Guy]

The Bow river has trophy Browns and people do come from all over to fish for them.

The Bow river, while a great fishery with an abundance of above average fish, does not have sustainable populations of trophy quality brown trout. Trophy quality meaning fish over 32 inches. Heck, I've lived in Calgary nearly 40 years and I have seen only a few brown trout that would push the 30" mark which were caught in the Bow river.

You are correct about one thing, anglers come from far and wide to fish the Bow. Adding trophy opportunities is good for everyone; less pressure on existing quality fisheries, and more interest and money into our system.

Pine will never be a trophy lake for anything, it lacks food and Fish need to eat lots of it to grow big, especially minnow sized food.

There is an abundance of food in and around Pine Coulee. Surrounded by prairie grassland and agriculture fields, nutrient levels are relatively high. Remember the resident population of burbot, once in abundance? Stickle backs, a variety of sucker fish, and rocky mountain whitefish are present in the lake.

Difference between walleye and trout? Walleye don't regularly eat insects off the surface of the water. Gerridae (all the water striders), grasshoppers, caddis, mayfly, moths, are all food not on a walleyes menu. Trout however, these are main courses when the seasons offer them. The amount of biomass a trout can put on during these abundant seasons by taking advantage of this abundant food source is off the table for walleye.

Long story short, I think you and I are on the same page Habfan. We are tired of the put and take rainbow trout strategy, catering to only a small facet of our angler population. Especially since Chain Lakes, is so close.

If I were to guess, I would say 8/10 Alberta anglers would rather catch a 6lb brown trout, than a 15 inch rainbow trout.

[jesse34567]

I would rather catch some LMB's but that is for another topic.

[tallieho]

Disappointing amount of bureaucracy surrounding this action. We have an incredible opportunity to create a trophy catch and release Brown Trout fishery, in which many people could enjoy, nonetheless travel from far and wide to fish.

It seems that there is no end to the stocked rainbow, put and take lakes. Hasn't this idea run it's course? There's a nearly identical put and take lake 30 kilometers directly west, Chain lakes, and now we have another with Pine Coulee becoming one.

This argument surrounds the majority of anglers wanting to fish for a meal, and the majority of those anglers living in urban centers - Calgary in this instance.

Generally, people start fishing so that they can catch and keep. Following this theory, the more catch and keep opportunities that are created, should promote an increase year over year of licenses sold. Running the numbers, more licenses are in fact being sold at a higher rate of increase compared to Alberta's population increase. Thus, this theory is proven to work.

Yet, Alberta's fisheries are in trouble. Our governing bodies have admitted and proven this. Fish populations are crashing, and opportunities are fleeting.

Aside from the failure of our legal system to adequately punish poachers for contributing to this problem - see: The Oldman River fiasco, and the lack of respectable resources allocated to Alberta's wildlife enforcement, Biology and Management sectors - an Alberta voter would sure like to see more action from our provincial government to rectify these recurring issues. Seems like a great way to pot an empty netter with the outdoors community - and promote an increase in public sector jobs. You'd think the NDP would be all over it.

Plain and simple, we need to provide a more diverse variety of catch and release opportunities for trophy quality fish. One can only hope that with all the closures of Southern Alberta reservoirs, trophy quality will return to our waters, providing excellent fishing opportunities for new and advanced anglers alike. At the very least, our current teams who manage this are asking for more public feedback before they move forward. For that we can be thankful, but it sure is a drop in the ocean compared to what we are up against.

Which angler generates more revenue, and in turn, spends more on fishing year over year:

Put and take fisherman

or

Catch and release fisherman

A look into the tackle box and garage of each should prove this point fairly quickly.
X2 Catch & Release imo will always generate more revenue & meaningful hours on the water.Hell if you REALLY look at. Put & Take ;Benefit from a C&R QSF ....We only take in some cases,i/3 of the stocking ie Beaver lk.Used to get 20000 fish anually,i think last yr.we got less than 5000.What the put & take guys should be asking is .Where's those 15000 fish.That is but one example.How about Police Outpost prior to it going to a QSF ,it was the normal stocking of at least 100000 +yearly.I think Police got 12500 fish last year So you guys that think QSF, takes away from you i say .The numbers don't lie..It's been a very long time since i have ever seen a parking lot at a Put & Take fishery full.Where as QSF lakes it is,very normal to see overflow on to adjacent roads..
Guys were asking why Dipping Vat still remains void of trout.Pretty simple,the farmer asked nicely,posted signs,put up barricades .To stop vechiles from blocking the road & access to his fields...Nuf said

[iliketrout]

The put and take trout lakes are a joke. I can't imagine the all-in cost to stock trout, only to be fished out within days or weeks for most of the puddles we are talking about, by the same tiny percentage of the fishing population who enjoys eating trout fry that taste like mud. It does not feel like a great use of my license fee.

Put fish in these lakes and give them a real chance to grow to something impressive. In my opinion it's time to stop treating our lakes like the fish market - they just can't handle the pressure any more. I used to love keeping a fish for the table just the same as the next guy, and would regularly do so. But it's clear it's not sustainable any more. I'd much rather C&R a 24" rainbow, and buy a piece of fish on the way home, than catch 20+ 10" trout and keep a few of those. Divert funds from the rainbow stocking program to other fishery management initiatives like more enforcement - something this province actually needs.

PCR was a great opportunity for AEP to show diversity in management and angling opportunity. But, with the decision made on PCR, it appears that the powers that be are happy to continue putting low quality fish on supper tables.

Has anyone seen the results of the survey from last year? I'd love to see what the consensus was and how my line of thinking compares to others.

[WayneChristie]

PCR is already a trophy fishery people are just fishing for the wrong kind of fish :bad_boys_20:

[pinelakeperch]

PCR is already a trophy fishery people are just fishing for the wrong kind of fish :bad_boys_20:

I've seen the piggy girls you're referring to, but haven't put one on land :(

[calgarygringo]

Its all up online if you dig. Text and graphs and all.


The put and take trout lakes are a joke. I can't imagine the all-in cost to stock trout, only to be fished out within days or weeks for most of the puddles we are talking about, by the same tiny percentage of the fishing population who enjoys eating trout fry that taste like mud. It does not feel like a great use of my license fee.

Put fish in these lakes and give them a real chance to grow to something impressive. In my opinion it's time to stop treating our lakes like the fish market - they just can't handle the pressure any more. I used to love keeping a fish for the table just the same as the next guy, and would regularly do so. But it's clear it's not sustainable any more. I'd much rather C&R a 24" rainbow, and buy a piece of fish on the way home, than catch 20+ 10" trout and keep a few of those. Divert funds from the rainbow stocking program to other fishery management initiatives like more enforcement - something this province actually needs.

PCR was a great opportunity for AEP to show diversity in management and angling opportunity. But, with the decision made on PCR, it appears that the powers that be are happy to continue putting low quality fish on supper tables.

Has anyone seen the results of the survey from last year? I'd love to see what the consensus was and how my line of thinking compares to others.

[iliketrout]

Its all up online if you dig. Text and graphs and all.

Didn't find the full survey but found this:

"Just over two-thirds of you (67.5%) support depletion of the walleye in Pine Coulee Reservoir and shifting it to a stocked trout lake."

I went back to my emails and found the survey. It only asked if you supported stocking of a sterile salmonid. I don't see in my email or remember if they asked Trophy vs. Put and take. Would be interesting to see those results as well.

[The Fisherman Guy]

"Just over two-thirds of you (67.5%) support depletion of the walleye in Pine Coulee Reservoir and shifting it to a stocked trout lake."

It only asked if you supported stocking of a sterile salmonid. I don't see in my email or remember if they asked Trophy vs. Put and take.

I saw that as well, also disappointing.

The word Trophy might as well be reclassified as a curse word going forward.

You make a great point about the value our public dollars are achieving with the put and take stocking program. Another great point you made, it's time to stop treating our fisheries like a fish market.

I would support the split of half the annual stocking budget, and allocate it to enforcement and increased punishment for poachers. Reducing poaching numbers, immediately puts those fish in contention for legal anglers to catch.

Aerial stocking of high alpine lakes is cool, but greatly out of touch for dollars in - value out.

[Habfan]

Didn't find the full survey but found this:

"Just over two-thirds of you (67.5%) support depletion of the walleye in Pine Coulee Reservoir and shifting it to a stocked trout lake."

I went back to my emails and found the survey. It only asked if you supported stocking of a sterile salmonid. I don't see in my email or remember if they asked Trophy vs. Put and take. Would be interesting to see those results as well.

I didn’t see a survey asking if we supported a put and take walleye fishery over a put and take trout lake either ! The depletion of walleye was inevitable ! The 67.5 % opted for trout, versus nothing at all, in reality.

[Joe Black]

The food source of flying insects and such(airborne) is an interesting angle on a food source for trout.

One problem, wind blows at 60 k 6 days out of 7 down there when these insects are around. Not a lot of surface bugs on a lake when its that windy.

But on the bright side, grasshopper probably do get blown into the water.

[RavYak]

Fisheries like to treat all our trout lakes as put and take because they don't manage the walleye and pike to a point where we can keep any of them... They just want the catch and kill crowd to at least be able to target something.

[The Fisherman Guy]

It's been a very long time since i have ever seen a parking lot at a Put & Take fishery full. Where as QSF lakes it is,very normal to see overflow on to adjacent roads.

This is a great point, lakes such as Policeman Outpost consistently draw large volumes of anglers who are looking to catch quality AND a quantity of fish. Even on busy days, fishing can be very good.


Not a lot of surface bugs on a lake when its that windy.

But on the bright side, grasshopper probably do get blown into the water.

Along with: horse flies, black flies, hover flies, mosquitoes, damselflies, bees, wasps, dragonflies, all matter of beetles, lacewings, midges, butterflies, true bugs.....

Just to name a handful of the bugs that fly, which are present in Southern Alberta. Not to mention the diversity of entomologic insects that live below the waters surface.

[iliketrout]

Anyone know the regional bio contact info for this area? Wouldn't mind dropping an email to see if I can get more info on the decision to make this a put and take with Chain already so close by.

[The Fisherman Guy]

Shane Petry - 403-382-4362

Senior Fisheries Biologist - Southern Alberta

[mapleleafman3]

Some info on Pine Coulee in this study

"THE FISHERIES POTENTIAL OF A NEW PRAIRIE RESERVOIR: A MANAGEMENT PERSPECTIVE. "
https://www.uleth.ca/dspace/bitstream/handle/10133/4608/CAMPEN_MICHAEL_MSC_2016.pdf?sequence=3

[aulrich]

Good read and it seems to confirm what us arm chair fisheries folk knew, without forage the walleye planting was doomed to fail. With the reluctance to put in a forage fish put and take trout is about all you can do