EI System Collapse

[IronNoggin]

What a complete eff-up!

Two million plus Canadians attempting to access a program that barely functioned at the best of times before this virus came along.

System, both online and on the phones, is COMPLETELY swamped!
No end of that in sight!

Today was Day Six for me. Up and on the phone attempting to make contact at 8:30 am.
Never get into queue before noon. Ever.
When you do get into the on hold situation, they simply leave you sit there.
For hours upon hours.
In fact, when they lock the doors and go home for the day, they simply leave you dangling "on hold".

4.5 hours of that (again) today, only to be left dangling once again.

Now over 3,000 call attempts, and 24+ hours plus "on hold".

Contacted the MP, who actually did try to get them to do something for me.
They basically told him to Get Stuffed.
So much for that angle.

Unfortunately I listened to them when they LIED to me and asked me to drop off the required Medical Certificate at their office when they already knew full well they would be closed that day and every one forward from then.

Leaves me in a damn bad spot.

I MUST deal with the matter "in person" or "over the phone".
No other options.
Neither works.

And folks wonder just why my attitude is somewhat "poor" of late... :mad0100:

Choked,
Nog

[jungleboy]

What a complete eff-up!

Two million plus Canadians attempting to access a program that barely functioned at the best of times before this virus came along.

System, both online and on the phones, is COMPLETELY swamped!
No end of that in sight!

Today was Day Six for me. Up and on the phone attempting to make contact at 8:30 am.
Never get into queue before noon. Ever.
When you do get into the on hold situation, they simply leave you sit there.
For hours upon hours.
In fact, when they lock the doors and go home for the day, they simply leave you dangling "on hold".

4.5 hours of that (again) today, only to be left dangling once again.

Now over 3,000 call attempts, and 24+ hours plus "on hold".

Contacted the MP, who actually did try to get them to do something for me.
They basically told him to Get Stuffed.
So much for that angle.

Unfortunately I listened to them when they LIED to me and asked me to drop off the required Medical Certificate at their office when they already knew full well they would be closed that day and every one forward from then.

Leaves me in a damn bad spot.

I MUST deal with the matter "in person" or "over the phone".
No other options.
Neither works.

And folks wonder just why my attitude is somewhat "poor" of late... :mad0100:

Choked,
Nog

Would it help to keep your line open on hold all night and get the call ?

[IronNoggin]

Would it help to keep your line open on hold all night and get the call ?

I may well try that tomorrow after they close the doors and leave me dangling... again...

Nog

[Smoky buck]

Took me a week just to do it online with all freezing and crashing

[Twisted Canuck]

And this is why I say that all these government promises for money, and new aid programs, are a cruel joke. They can't even operate systems that have been in place for 50 years, never mind something they haven't built yet. They can't even fix their own Phoenix payroll system after throwing a couple billion at it.

But you better believe they are going to waste billions and billions that will accomplish SFA. Like usual.

[1899b]

What a complete eff-up!

Two million plus Canadians attempting to access a program that barely functioned at the best of times before this virus came along.

System, both online and on the phones, is COMPLETELY swamped!
No end of that in sight!

Today was Day Six for me. Up and on the phone attempting to make contact at 8:30 am.
Never get into queue before noon. Ever.
When you do get into the on hold situation, they simply leave you sit there.
For hours upon hours.
In fact, when they lock the doors and go home for the day, they simply leave you dangling "on hold".

4.5 hours of that (again) today, only to be left dangling once again.

Now over 3,000 call attempts, and 24+ hours plus "on hold".

Contacted the MP, who actually did try to get them to do something for me.
They basically told him to Get Stuffed.
So much for that angle.

Unfortunately I listened to them when they LIED to me and asked me to drop off the required Medical Certificate at their office when they already knew full well they would be closed that day and every one forward from then.

Leaves me in a damn bad spot.

I MUST deal with the matter "in person" or "over the phone".
No other options.
Neither works.

And folks wonder just why my attitude is somewhat "poor" of late... :mad0100:

Choked,
Nog

This is terrible. I hope you get through and get some satisfaction soon...

[pikergolf]

I imagine there are a lot of young guys living from pay check to pay check in the same shoes.

[Bigjohn87]

They should just give every adult $2000 a month automatically and work it all out at tax time next year. Would be a lot cheaper then what the red gonna spend updating the system and paying people to monitor it and administer it.


This is a prime example as to why we need a guaranteed income. None of this would be happening

[liar]

They should just give every adult $2000 a month automatically and work it all out at tax time next year. Would be a lot cheaper then what the red gonna spend updating the system and paying people to monitor it and administer it.


This is a prime example as to why we need a guaranteed income. None of this would be happening

have you sent this to your mp? it makes a lot of sense .

[Buckhead]

They should just give every adult $2000 a month automatically and work it all out at tax time next year. Would be a lot cheaper then what the red gonna spend updating the system and paying people to monitor it and administer it.


This is a prime example as to why we need a guaranteed income. None of this would be happening

Yes, this is what would work. The CRA already has a lot of folks Direct Deposit info.
Take it back later if it was not needed or an error.
All these programs aren't going to help much if the people don't get the money for 3 months.

[Cold lake guy]

Or pay it back at 40% tax? Been there done that, it’s a trap what ever your income

[Trochu]

This is a prime example as to why we need a guaranteed income. None of this would be happening

No, no it isn't. This is a prime example of why people should live below their means and not rely on the government. The government, and by association, the tax payer, should not benefit from peoples good choices/luck or suffer from their bad choices/bad luck.

[Buckhead]

Some people end up in certain situations through no fault of their own.

Having compassion for your fellow human is what separates us from the animals.

[Cold lake guy]

I’ve been in a tight spot.... do your best not to get into a corner you can’t sell your self out of.

For those in high debit this is a great opportunity to just walk away

[Trochu]

Some people end up in certain situations through no fault of their own.

Having compassion for your fellow human is what separates us from the animals.

Agreed.

The vast majority though, buy cars they can't afford, have a $900 phone, 55" TV, internet,/netflick/disney plus, eat out 2 or 3 times a week, etc. then when thet get let go, have no money, and expect someone to bail them out. I have alot of compassion for those in a legitimate tough spot. Most, I have the same compassion you do regarding the abroad traverls complaining the government isn't bringing them back from their holiday even though they left after it was a problem.

[gevarm guy]

the EI system starts in Quebec and works its way here....lol
if any left over....

[ram crazy]

No, no it isn't. This is a prime example of why people should live below their means and not rely on the government. The government, and by association, the tax payer, should not benefit from peoples good choices/luck or suffer from their bad choices/bad luck.

Well said.

[bobtodrick]

No, no it isn't. This is a prime example of why people should live below their means and not rely on the government. The government, and by association, the tax payer, should not benefit from peoples good choices/luck or suffer from their bad choices/bad luck.

x2
Yes, they're are some who truly need help...single parents and such.
But there are a lot of people who are applying, because they are broke...yet have a new a 2200sqft house, a new truck and quad in the driveway and a slew of other toys.
I work with a fellow who brags about the trips he takes every year to Europe and has a roomful of NHL 'memorialize' who is freaking since he was temporarily laid off last week because he figures he can't survive more than two weeks.

[Bigjohn87]

No, no it isn't. This is a prime example of why people should live below their means and not rely on the government. The government, and by association, the tax payer, should not benefit from peoples good choices/luck or suffer from their bad choices/bad luck.

And people shouldn’t murder, rape, drive drunk, beat their wives. However we live in a society where these things do happen therefor we have procedures in place to deal with it.

A guaranteed Income would save Canada money, and that is what I am about. It gets rid of EI, Welfare, AiSh, Workers Comp, and whatever other payment systems are out there. You cut out ALL of that overhead and administration.


Guaranteed income was a right wing idea before the left supported it, then the right abandoned it.

[Bigjohn87]

x2
Yes, they're are some who truly need help...single parents and such.
But there are a lot of people who are applying, because they are broke...yet have a new a 2200sqft house, a new truck and quad in the driveway and a slew of other toys.
I work with a fellow who brags about the trips he takes every year to Europe and has a roomful of NHL 'memorialize' who is freaking since he was temporarily laid off last week because he figures he can't survive more than two weeks.

Should people work simply to survive? If we teach people to not strive to do better to acquire more goods, would the incentive to do better still be there for those people?

[Trochu]

And people shouldn’t murder, rape, drive drunk, beat their wives. However we live in a society where these things do happen therefor we have procedures in place to deal with it.

A guaranteed Income would save Canada money, and that is what I am about. It gets rid of EI, Welfare, AiSh, Workers Comp, and whatever other payment systems are out there. You cut out ALL of that overhead and administration.


Guaranteed income was a right wing idea before the left supported it, then the right abandoned it.

$2,000/month to who? Canadian citizens 18+? Thats about $770B a year, approx. half Canada's GDP. Spending half the countries GDP on one program isn't going to work for long, unless they are taxing it, which is efficiency at it's finest.

[liar]

whether people deserve the money or not is going to be debated till they lock down this thread . the part that i said was a good idea is to just send the money out and deal with it at tax time . our bureaucratic nightmare that we call government will pill away millions trying to manage this up front . may as well give it to the tax payers . one way or the other , the money will disappear .

and for the record , i am not a big fan of " social hand outs " . when i see people on the six oclock news in foreign countries demanding the the government goes and gets them it gets my blood pressure up a bit . the government has no money . they take my tax dollars and then reallocate my money to where they see fit . so it does get me going when i see waste .

[Bigjohn87]

$2,000/month to who? Canadian citizens 18+? Thats about $770B a year, approx. half Canada's GDP. Spending half the countries GDP on one program isn't going to work for long, unless they are taxing it, which is efficiency at it's finest.

They will reclaim it at tax time next spring. It would be around 250b, for the 5 months. I’d like to see how much the economy is going to lose with no real revenue being generated by anyone.

[bobtodrick]

Should people work simply to survive? If we teach people to not strive to do better to acquire more goods, would the incentive to do better still be there for those people?

There's an age old saying...put 10% of your takehome pay into savings for something unexpected...whether it be Covid-19 or your roof springs a leak and you have to replace it.
Of course you should strive to do better....but doing better isn't necessarily about having a bunch of junk you don't really need...it's about quality of life.
As many here know I'm in retail...not the biggest money making career in the world. But I have a great life, have all the things I need (and more than a few that I don't)...but by being smart I'm also not freaking out that with my wages cut in half because I've been cut to 1/2 time because I actually put some of my money away and can survive awhile on those savings.
I can do it on retail wages....and I'm amazed when I hear of people who make twice what I do freaking out because they don't know how they are going to make next months rent.

[Bigjohn87]

There's an age old saying...put 10% of your takehome pay into savings for something unexpected...whether it be Covid-19 or your roof springs a leak and you have to replace it.
Of course you should strive to do better....but doing better isn't necessarily about having a bunch of junk you don't really need...it's about quality of life.
As many here know I'm in retail...not the biggest money making career in the world. But I have a great life, have all the things I need (and more than a few that I don't)...but by being smart I'm also not freaking out that with my wages cut in half because I've been cut to 1/2 time because I actually put some of my money away and can survive awhile on those savings.
I can do it on retail wages....and I'm amazed when I hear of people who make twice what I do freaking out because they don't know how they are going to make next months rent.


How long do you feel you can survive on your savings? Do you have any dependants ?

[KGB]

Same thing here, applied almost two weeks ago, got a confirmation and the code via mail but cant see the status or whatever progress is.... and no money as of today...I’m out even gonna try calling them, it’s pointless I think...

[Talking moose]

Same thing here, applied almost two weeks ago, got a confirmation and the code via mail but cant see the status or whatever progress is.... and no money as of today...I’m out even gonna try calling them, it’s pointless I think...
I applied on the 17th, got my code in the mail. But if you go on the Canada service website you can track your application progress.... received, under review, etc.....
Mines been “under review” for about a week.
The site says it can take up to 28 days before you receive.

[mediumrare]

What a complete eff-up!

Two million plus Canadians attempting to access a program that barely functioned at the best of times before this virus came along.

System, both online and on the phones, is COMPLETELY swamped!
No end of that in sight!

Today was Day Six for me. Up and on the phone attempting to make contact at 8:30 am.
Never get into queue before noon. Ever.
When you do get into the on hold situation, they simply leave you sit there.
For hours upon hours.
In fact, when they lock the doors and go home for the day, they simply leave you dangling "on hold".

4.5 hours of that (again) today, only to be left dangling once again.

Now over 3,000 call attempts, and 24+ hours plus "on hold".

Contacted the MP, who actually did try to get them to do something for me.
They basically told him to Get Stuffed.
So much for that angle.

Unfortunately I listened to them when they LIED to me and asked me to drop off the required Medical Certificate at their office when they already knew full well they would be closed that day and every one forward from then.

Leaves me in a damn bad spot.

I MUST deal with the matter "in person" or "over the phone".
No other options.
Neither works.

And folks wonder just why my attitude is somewhat "poor" of late... :mad0100:

Choked,
Nog
My EI medical leave just got approved March 24.apparently you have to wait for paper forms to be mailed to you then you mail them back for your biweekly reporting !no online reporting or telephone reporting if it’s medical leave?!If you do get a live body on the phone ASK THEM ABOUT THIS!still waiting for paperwork to do my biweekly filing since March 24.been off work since March 1.best of luck hope u fare better

[LKILR]

And people shouldn’t murder, rape, drive drunk, beat their wives. However we live in a society where these things do happen therefor we have procedures in place to deal with it.

A guaranteed Income would save Canada money, and that is what I am about. It gets rid of EI, Welfare, AiSh, Workers Comp, and whatever other payment systems are out there. You cut out ALL of that overhead and administration.


Guaranteed income was a right wing idea before the left supported it, then the right abandoned it.

Sounds like communism.

[ram crazy]

How long do you feel you can survive on your savings? Do you have any dependants ?

I could survive 2 years, but then again I live within my means. The problem with the younger generation is they feel they should be given everything and not have to work to hard to obtain it.

[trophybook]

I applied on the 17th, got my code in the mail. But if you go on the Canada service website you can track your application progress.... received, under review, etc.....
Mines been “under review” for about a week.
The site says it can take up to 28 days before you receive.

You don't need the code, I applied and in 4 hours I had a etransfer. This was 3 days ago. Got the code in the mail yesterday

[Jim Blake]

Trudeau's announcement of multiple programs is in my opinion intended to cause confusion and he knows the systems will be overwhelmed, crash and fail.

He announces multiple billions of dollars in aid most of which are deferrals and the actual cash aid is tied up in bureaucracy and system failure.

I wonder at the end of the day how much actual cash aid will reach those who need it???

That being said Nog don't give up and I wish you the best getting through and your application processed ASAP.

[ward]

No, no it isn't. This is a prime example of why people should live below their means and not rely on the government. The government, and by association, the tax payer, should not benefit from peoples good choices/luck or suffer from their bad choices/bad luck.

I just read a post somewhere in AO that stated it was the government’s fault people were not living within their means.

[jpohlic]

I was laid off March 10 and applied right away for the first time ever in my working life. What a gong show... Multiple reviews, decisions made, then re-evaluated, more reviews, more decisions... still haven't seen a nickle.

The issue with my claim seems to be that in addition to formerly being employed full time (my primary source of income) I also have a small business on the side. Even though that business did only 5% of what I made as an employee it's caused incredible grief dealing with EI - and that's with having a small loss on the books last year!

I've never thought to rely on the government for anything but since I've paid into it for 30 years you'd think they might throw a few scraps my way.

[Lamburt]

I just read a post somewhere in AO that stated it was the government’s fault people were not living within their means.
The government punishes people who live within their means (taxing them more and giving them less handouts) and rewards people who live outside their means (giving them more handouts).

The government has also helped inflate and perpetuate a big housing bubble (to make our GDP appear big, to increase taxes, to skim money off the top, to perpetuate the status quo). This puts the younger generation in the position of either living beyond their means, or bumming off their parents for 10+ years.

I would say the government does everything it can to encourage people to live beyond their means. It can't force people, but based on the level of debt Canadians have I'd say they have been very successful.

[Talking moose]

You don't need the code, I applied and in 4 hours I had a etransfer. This was 3 days ago. Got the code in the mail yesterday

You applied for ei and 4 hours later got money in the bank? Dam maybe I screwed up somehow.

[JohninAB]

Think trophybook is talking about the Alberta aid package. EI when you first apply will take darn near the full 28 days.

[58thecat]

I imagine there are a lot of young guys living from pay check to pay check in the same shoes.

Everyone who is in need of this financial aid is in the same boat.
The system as with many others is overloaded so that being said will take time to get everyone processed.
Stay positive which will make things easier on your noodle and all will come together soon enough....pandemic situations you will not get first world immediate attention that we are accustomed too....

[trophybook]

Think trophybook is talking about the Alberta aid package. EI when you first apply will take darn near the full 28 days.

Yes correct, wrong post....dam balieys and coffee

[58thecat]

I just read a post somewhere in AO that stated it was the government’s fault people were not living within their means.

That too adds up over time and when poop hits the fan it surfaces real quick...I know people that have lived a very outrageous lifestyle and others that kinda laid low but could have gone out and spent money they didn't have as in credit but put a money away....they now are riding this money until the EI kicks in etc while others are scrambling and yup it is everyone else's fault....I hope people learn from this cuz it is way worse than the collapse of the oil patch and yup I was in that mix too....as I am now with you In this pandemic.

[marky_mark]

They will reclaim it at tax time next spring. It would be around 250b, for the 5 months. I’d like to see how much the economy is going to lose with no real revenue being generated by anyone.

How can you reclaim money that was spent on dumb things?
If you think everyone deserves $2000/month for nothing all your doing is giving the lazy people motivation to do less. If you need more money to get the things that you want outta life, I have the solution. Get a part time job! No one owes you anything.

[Bigjohn87]

Sounds like communism.

I would suggest you spend 5 minutes reading about Communism to understand how it is you came to the wrong conclusion.

[Bigjohn87]

How can you reclaim money that was spent on dumb things?
If you think everyone deserves $2000/month for nothing all your doing is giving the lazy people motivation to do less. If you need more money to get the things that you want outta life, I have the solution. Get a part time job! No one owes you anything.

Does the Welfare system keep people motivated to do less? Anyone right now can choose to not work and just go on welfare, the mass majority of people choose to want to own things so they get a job and advance themselves. A guaranteed income would save Canada money by getting rid of all the social programs we have and putting them under one heading.

[Talking moose]

Does the Welfare system keep people motivated to do less? Anyone right now can choose to not work and just go on welfare,

Is this a fact or a perception of yours?

[Bigjohn87]

Is this a fact or a perception of yours?

It’s my understanding that is how the welfare system works. Do you believe it works differently?

[marky_mark]

Does the Welfare system keep people motivated to do less? Anyone right now can choose to not work and just go on welfare, the mass majority of people choose to want to own things so they get a job and advance themselves. A guaranteed income would save Canada money by getting rid of all the social programs we have and putting them under one heading.

100% welfare is motivation not to work
So is increasing minimum wage
Guaranteed income would cost this country billions
All it would do is create higher inflation.
Nothing in this world is free

[Bigjohn87]

100% welfare is motivation not to work
So is increasing minimum wage
Guaranteed income would cost this country billions
All it would do is create higher inflation.
Nothing in this world is free

Guaranteed income would save the country money.

[marky_mark]

The only people that want guaranteed income are the ones that are too lazy to work for it

[Talking moose]

It’s my understanding that is how the welfare system works. Do you believe it works differently?

I don’t believe it’s as simple as that. No.
I’d have to check into it before I posted it as fact though. So don’t quote me.

[marky_mark]

Guaranteed income would save the country money.

Tell me, what do you do for a living? Where do you fall in the income bracket?

[marky_mark]

That guaranteed money has to come from somewhere
And it sure isnt going to come from me working harder so you dont have to

[Bigjohn87]

Tell me, what do you do for a living? Where do you fall in the income bracket?

100-125k

That guaranteed money has to come from somewhere
And it sure isnt going to come from me working harder so you dont have to

You don’t seem to understand how the system works or what it replaces.

The guaranteed income system would replace ALL other forms of social assistance. Welfare, AiSh, EI, worker’s compensation. All those programs would be done away with.

[marky_mark]

100-125k



You don’t seem to understand how the system works or what it replaces.

The guaranteed income system would replace ALL other forms of social assistance. Welfare, AiSh, EI, worker’s compensation. All those programs would be done away with.

If you made 100k plus you would not be talking about everyone getting guaranteed income. Your full of it

[marky_mark]

I know 100% what im talking about

[Bigjohn87]

If you made 100k plus you would not be talking about everyone getting guaranteed income. Your full of it

But I do. Because it would save the country money. You seem to not be able to grasp the simple concept that eliminating programs saves in overhead and administrative costs.

I could draw you a diagram with stick figures in little boxes if you would like?

[Map Maker]

If you made 100k plus you would not be talking about everyone getting guaranteed income. Your full of it

Lol. Why ask if you thought you knew the answer?
Take a chill pill dude.

[marky_mark]

But I do. Because it would save the country money. You seem to not be able to grasp the simple concept that eliminating programs saves in overhead and administrative costs.

I could draw you a diagram with stick figures in little boxes if you would like?

Your shift at 7/11 doesnt start for a while so im sure you have plenty of time

So you think giving everyone money for nothing is cheaper than not giving everyone money
You do realize that cra is run by high paid accountants and in order to "collect" all this money back it would require even more of them
Do you realize how many Billions the cra budget is already?
Your not saving any admin costs
How hard is it to get money back after you have given it away?
Try it with the next homeless person you see.
Give them $100 bucks then tell them you want it back
All your doing is shuffling the $ around to make it look like your saving here but its actually costing your triple over there..
Giving people $2000/month just devalues everything in this country.
If you want to see hyper inflation just start printing money

[Bigjohn87]

Your shift at 7/11 doesnt start for a while so im sure you have plenty of time

So you think giving everyone money for nothing is cheaper than not giving everyone money
You do realize that cra is run by high paid accountants and in order to "collect" all this money back it would require even more of them
Do you realize how many Billions the cra budget is already?
Your not saving any admin costs
How hard is it to get money back after you have given it away?
Try it with the next homeless person you see.
Give them $100 bucks then tell them you want it back
All your doing is shuffling the $ around to make it look like your saving here but its actually costing your triple over there..
Giving people $2000/month just devalues everything in this country.
If you want to see hyper inflation just start printing money

Many other countries have done this and it has saved them money.

Can you explain how it worked for them but wouldn’t work for us?

A lot of conservative governments in other western countries have looked at this program as a way to reduce overhead spending.

Can you explain what they don’t know about the program that you yourself understand?

[IronNoggin]

Some people end up in certain situations through no fault of their own.

Having compassion for your fellow human is what separates us from the animals.

This.

In Trudy's War On The West, pipelines and oilfield workers are not the only casualties. His deranged and desperate focus on a UN seat well above and beyond anything "Canadian" has put a lot of families at risk. One such example is his government's savaging of our West Coast Fisheries. As a West Coast Vancouver Island Troller (Area G) we have seen our operating season slashed repeatedly and our quotas handed freely to another sector in the name of "Reconciliation". In short, our fleet is in tatters at this point, and most of us have been struggling to maintain an even keel for a handful of years now. I am directly in that boat.

Then, when something unforeseen comes along, The pressure often becomes a little too much to handle. My case in point: I was recently diagnosed with Deep Cranial Venous Thrombosis. Quite the mouthful to say there is a massive blood clot blocking the main vein which drains the left hemisphere of my brain. Life Threatening. Can't work. Isolated because if I now catch this damn virus, I will die.

We have always lived within our means. I drive a 22 year old truck, and our house is a rather moderate abode. Not much else for toys besides the usual hunting stuff.We have never been extravagant by any means.

But at this juncture, we are in trouble. If we have to drop to my Lady's income only, our "free" funds will run around 100 clams a month.

At 60 years of age, I have well paid my dues over the years into EI etc etc. Now, when I need some of that support in return, the current circus is preventing me from accessing that.

I am about to go into the daily cycle of calling repeatedly, hoping to eventually get into the queue, and desperately hoping that they don't let the clock run out on me once I get there yet again.

I truly hope none of you ever find yourselves in such a miserable position. It very much SUCKS.

Nog

[marky_mark]

Many other countries have done this and it has saved them money.

Can you explain how it worked for them but wouldn’t work for us?

A lot of conservative governments in other western countries have looked at this program as a way to reduce overhead spending.

Can you explain what they don’t know about the program that you yourself understand?

What countries give people money for free??
Tell me what their tax rates are too

[jungleboy]

Guaranteed income of $2000 a month? Better give that to seniors too then. The average cpp payment is probably $700 per month. But wait. The government can’t afford to pay more cpp so they say. Ever wonder why so many seniors work at Walmart ,McDonald’s, Home Depot etc? It’s because they need grocery money not because they are bored.

[Dean2]

Guaranteed income would save the country money.

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. Paying even 3 million people a $2,000 a month guaranteed income would cost 72 Billion a year, which is almost as much as the whole emergency Covid 19 package. To do that for all adults would be almost 500 billion or half a trillion dollars. Just where the heck do you think the Federal government is supposed to find that money, and it sure won't be from "program" savings for welfare, Aish etc. since the whole Federal Gov annual budget is only 320 Billion.

Quit listening to socialist/communist propaganda from the NDP and their ilk and start exercising your own brain a little.

[marky_mark]

This.

In Trudy's War On The West, pipelines and oilfield workers are not the only casualties. His deranged and desperate focus on a UN seat well above and beyond anything "Canadian" has put a lot of families at risk. One such example is his government's savaging of our West Coast Fisheries. As a West Coast Vancouver Island Troller (Area G) we have seen our operating season slashed repeatedly and our quotas handed freely to another sector in the name of "Reconciliation". In short, our fleet is in tatters at this point, and most of us have been struggling to maintain an even keel for a handful of years now. I am directly in that boat.

Then, when something unforeseen comes along, The pressure often becomes a little too much to handle. My case in point: I was recently diagnosed with Deep Cranial Venous Thrombosis. Quite the mouthful to say there is a massive blood clot blocking the main vein which drains the left hemisphere of my brain. Life Threatening. Can't work. Isolated because if I now catch this damn virus, I will die.

We have always lived within our means. I drive a 22 year old truck, and our house is a rather moderate abode. Not much else for toys besides the usual hunting stuff.We have never been extravagant by any means.

But at this juncture, we are in trouble. If we have to drop to my Lady's income only, our "free" funds will run around 100 clams a month.

At 60 years of age, I have well paid my dues over the years into EI etc etc. Now, when I need some of that support in return, the current circus is preventing me from accessing that.

I am about to go into the daily cycle of calling repeatedly, hoping to eventually get into the queue, and desperately hoping that they don't let the clock run out on me once I get there yet again.

I truly hope none of you ever find yourselves in such a miserable position. It very much SUCKS.

Nog

Sorry to hear about your situation
To me, they should have a question when your applying for benefits
"How long have you been contributing and paying taxes in Canada"
And then rank the calls accordingly

[Ken07AOVette]

There's an age old saying...put 10% of your takehome pay into savings for something unexpected...whether it be Covid-19 or your roof springs a leak and you have to replace it.
Of course you should strive to do better....but doing better isn't necessarily about having a bunch of junk you don't really need...it's about quality of life.
As many here know I'm in retail...not the biggest money making career in the world. But I have a great life, have all the things I need (and more than a few that I don't)...but by being smart I'm also not freaking out that with my wages cut in half because I've been cut to 1/2 time because I actually put some of my money away and can survive awhile on those savings.
I can do it on retail wages....and I'm amazed when I hear of people who make twice what I do freaking out because they don't know how they are going to make next months rent.

I get it Bob, and I agree for the most part, but what about the business owners? They still have to pay rent, utilities, phones, insurance, bonds, accountant, bills not only for their homes but the business as well. Every business deemed non essential is closed, and without income accounts will drain fast. I would be extremely happy as would all business owners with half wage. As it is now, I have to pay everything put of pocket, with zero income.
I am smart with my money, mine is a small business and I pay into the government every year just like everyone else. Telus, county gas, atco property tax, water, sewer, cooperators, the banks etc have a saying; if you dont pay we shut off Services, sue and seize as required.
Your scenario works fine for you, and good on you for having a level head, money in the bank and a boss that appreciates you, but the business down the street may not be there in a couple months.
It's not all about putting 10% away.

[bobtodrick]

How long do you feel you can survive on your savings? Do you have any dependants ?

Two dependents...about a year, no problem.
But again, I'm able to do that because I have a modest 1200sqft home and have always driven used vehicles that I have paid cash for. The vehicle thing is what did it. While all my friends were buying new or leasing...I was taking what they were paying for vehicle loans and putting it in a savings account. So while I'm driving a low mileage 12 year old Acura MDX that gets me around just fine...I put about $350 (a lease payment) into savings. Have done that for 15 years now and it adds up.
This is my rainy day fund, which if I don't have to use will get turned into my retirement fund once that day comes.

[bobtodrick]

I get it Bob, and I agree for the most part, but what about the business owners? They still have to pay rent, utilities, phones, insurance, bonds, accountant, bills not only for their homes but the business as well. Every business deemed non essential is closed, and without income accounts will drain fast. I would be extremely happy as would all business owners with half wage. As it is now, I have to pay everything put of pocket, with zero income.
I am smart with my money, mine is a small business and I pay into the government every year just like everyone else. Telus, county gas, atco property tax, water, sewer, cooperators, the banks etc have a saying; if you dont pay we shut off Services, sue and seize as required.
Your scenario works fine for you, and good on you for having a level head, money in the bank and a boss that appreciates you, but the business down the street may not be there in a couple months.
It's not all about putting 10% away.

Don't get me wrong...the business owners I feel for. Whilst the government is giving money away to people who should be able to save, the business owner is stuck with a crappy economy that has been ongoing for four years now, and with Covid a population that can't afford to spend money.
Them I feel for. Many business owners go without so they can stay in business and maybe even employ someone.
The ones I'm talking about are the people who (and of course this is not all of them) work in the oilsands, make a ton of money, whose driveways have at least two new vehicles, a couple of quadsa and snowmobiles and yet are two paycheques away from not making their rent.
My beef is that there are more of them out there than there should be...and they are the ones that are most desperate to get the government help.

[Buckhead]

Don't get me wrong...the business owners I feel for. Whilst the government is giving money away to people who should be able to save, the business owner is stuck with a crappy economy that has been ongoing for four years now, and with Covid a population that can't afford to spend money.
Them I feel for. Many business owners go without so they can stay in business and maybe even employ someone.
The ones I'm talking about are the people who (and of course this is not all of them) work in the oilsands, make a ton of money, whose driveways have at least two new vehicles, a couple of quadsa and snowmobiles and yet are two paycheques away from not making their rent.
My beef is that there are more of them out there than there should be...and they are the ones that are most desperate to get the government help.

Well it's hard to get away from that. For the past 75 years we have been subjected to social engineering to turn this into a consumer driven society.
The only way you could get rid of that is to let the economy go into a complete crash and bankrupt all the debtors and creditors. That won't happen. And if it did you and I and possibly everyone on this board would be out of a job. And not for 3 months, maybe 10 years.

[Ken07AOVette]

Don't get me wrong...the business owners I feel for. Whilst the government is giving money away to people who should be able to save, the business owner is stuck with a crappy economy that has been ongoing for four years now, and with Covid a population that can't afford to spend money.
Them I feel for. Many business owners go without so they can stay in business and maybe even employ someone.
The ones I'm talking about are the people who (and of course this is not all of them) work in the oilsands, make a ton of money, whose driveways have at least two new vehicles, a couple of quadsa and snowmobiles and yet are two paycheques away from not making their rent.
My beef is that there are more of them out there than there should be...and they are the ones that are most desperate to get the government help.

Gotcha.
I am constantly dealing with people in that exact position, can't pay their accountant because their monthly payments are over $10,000.00 per month, and I am not exaggerating at all. It's crazy.

Also all over the place online the ones demanding free everything are the unemployed ones living in rental units with no real expenses, but by damned they are entitled to it!! Drives me crazy.

[Hadji Ramjet]

Many other countries have done this and it has saved them money.

Can you explain how it worked for them but wouldn’t work for us?

A lot of conservative governments in other western countries have looked at this program as a way to reduce overhead spending.

Can you explain what they don’t know about the program that you yourself understand?

Which countries have done this?
What evidence exists for the claim that, "it has saved them money?"
Can you explain "how it worked for them?"
Can you enumerate which of the "lot of conservative governments in other western countries have looked at this program" favorably?

No, probably not.

[Bigjohn87]

Which countries have done this?
What evidence exists for the claim that, "it has saved them money?"
Can you explain "how it worked for them?"
Can you enumerate which of the "lot of conservative governments in other western countries have looked at this program" favorably?

No, probably not.

Do a google search. I have no desire to carry on this discussion so my time in this thread is done. We waste too much with government overhead, very inefficient. Need to reduce manpower substancially and throw a lot of programs together. Would like to see more protection for people that want to work and less protection for those with no desire to work. We need a complete overhaul of the System from top to bottom, a 100% rebuild. Good day to you

[Dean2]

Which countries have done this?
What evidence exists for the claim that, "it has saved them money?"
Can you explain "how it worked for them?"
Can you enumerate which of the "lot of conservative governments in other western countries have looked at this program" favorably?

No, probably not.

Just ignore this guy. He is so full of it his eyes are brown. Typical of the legion of people that talk through their hat. They read stuff and don't think critically about it and then just regurgitate it somewhere else. People wonder why fake news is so prevalent and spreads so fast.

P.S. Check post 62, I easily showed him how his math is so far out to lunch his claims of saving money are complete hogwash. Now in his latest post he says he doesn't want to discuss this anymore, but still contends we would save money. You can't fix that level of oblivion.

[bobtodrick]

Do a google search. I have no desire to carry on this discussion so my time in this thread is done. We waste too much with government overhead, very inefficient. Need to reduce manpower substancially and throw a lot of programs together. Would like to see more protection for people that want to work and less protection for those with no desire to work. We need a complete overhaul of the System from top to bottom, a 100% rebuild. Good day to you

Just so we know who we're dealing with...what name did you go under when you were last banned?

[Wild Bounty]

What a complete eff-up!

Two million plus Canadians attempting to access a program that barely functioned at the best of times before this virus came along.

System, both online and on the phones, is COMPLETELY swamped!
No end of that in sight!

Today was Day Six for me. Up and on the phone attempting to make contact at 8:30 am.
Never get into queue before noon. Ever.
When you do get into the on hold situation, they simply leave you sit there.
For hours upon hours.
In fact, when they lock the doors and go home for the day, they simply leave you dangling "on hold".

4.5 hours of that (again) today, only to be left dangling once again.

Now over 3,000 call attempts, and 24+ hours plus "on hold".

Contacted the MP, who actually did try to get them to do something for me.
They basically told him to Get Stuffed.
So much for that angle.

Unfortunately I listened to them when they LIED to me and asked me to drop off the required Medical Certificate at their office when they already knew full well they would be closed that day and every one forward from then.

Leaves me in a damn bad spot.

I MUST deal with the matter "in person" or "over the phone".
No other options.
Neither works.

And folks wonder just why my attitude is somewhat "poor" of late... :mad0100:

Choked,
Nog

My MP here went to bat for me and Canada service called me last Monday, otherwise, I was in the same boat , could not get through on the phone lines, same scenario as you

[CanuckShooter]

I could survive 2 years, but then again I live within my means. The problem with the younger generation is they feel they should be given everything and not have to work to hard to obtain it.

And 2 years from now you and the spendthrifts will both be in the same spot financially. :thinking-006: At least with scrimping and saving you wouldn't have been a burden on society.

[KGB]

I applied on the 17th, got my code in the mail. But if you go on the Canada service website you can track your application progress.... received, under review, etc.....
Mines been “under review” for about a week.
The site says it can take up to 28 days before you receive.

Mine doesn’t even show up on my screen..... it’s blank! :argue2:

[ram crazy]

And 2 years from now you and the spendthrifts will both be in the same spot financially. :thinking-006: At least with scrimping and saving you wouldn't have been a burden on society.

Highly unlikely I would be in the same spot financially as you!

[IronNoggin]

My MP here went to bat for me and Canada service called me last Monday, otherwise, I was in the same boat , could not get through on the phone lines, same scenario as you

My MP tried. He was basically told to Get Lost and do not call with this kind of request again. CLICK. :mad0030:

So much for that theory...

On hold after finally getting through to queue at 1:00pm.
Think I'll simply let it cycle all night after they leave me dangling and shut their doors for the day again.
Their dime, and perhaps, just perhaps I might get an actual Two-Legs in the am...

Nog

[KGB]

After my latest experience with EI, I’m wondering if I can just opt out of it....

[jungleboy]

My MP tried. He was basically told to Get Lost and do not call with this kind of request again. CLICK. :mad0030:

So much for that theory...

On hold after finally getting through to queue at 1:00pm.
Think I'll simply let it cycle all night after they leave me dangling and shut their doors for the day again.
Their dime, and perhaps, just perhaps I might get an actual Two-Legs in the am...

Nog

Good luck to you!

[IronNoggin]

Well, they did it once again. Left me on hold and went home for the day.

Going to leave the damn phone on hold all night.

Their sheer incompetence is affecting a lot more than me. Complete *****holes:

https://business.financialpost.com/executive/careers/trudeaus-real-scandal-shuttering-service-canada-centres-when-our-unemployed-need-them-most

[Ken07AOVette]

I got a call back, specifically I got voice mail because my phone didn't ring, they called from a Private caller, which I had blocked. Real handy. He said they would try one more time between 8AM and 4PM tomorrow. Sure.

[Dean2]

Well, they did it once again. Left me on hold and went home for the day.

Going to leave the damn phone on hold all night.

Their sheer incompetence is affecting a lot more than me. Complete *****holes:

https://business.financialpost.com/executive/careers/trudeaus-real-scandal-shuttering-service-canada-centres-when-our-unemployed-need-them-most


Most of the people working at Service Canada basically abandoned their jobs and our pusie government let them and their union get away with it. They should fire everyone of them.

Try not to take your frustration out on the 300 out of 3000 that actually showed up for work to try and help you out. I get it's frustrating but maybe try putting yourself in their shoes a little.

[IronNoggin]

... Try not to take your frustration out on the 300 out of 3000 that actually showed up for work to try and help you out. I get it's frustrating but maybe try putting yourself in their shoes a little.

I won't be. As is usually the case, the front line troops are never responsible for the bull that is occurring.

Nog

[Dean2]

I won't be. As is usually the case, the front line troops are never responsible for the bull that is occurring.

Nog

True that and figured u would see it that way because you are usually a real balanced and level guy. Unfortunately not everyone does. Had to unsocial distance myself from a buttwipe that was yelling at some poor clerk in superstore because they were out of bananas. Funny how much more polite they get when someone gets all up in THEIR face. Don't seem to enjoy getting it near as much as giving it.

[zabbo]

The government punishes people who live within their means (taxing them more and giving them less handouts) and rewards people who live outside their means (giving them more handouts).

The government has also helped inflate and perpetuate a big housing bubble (to make our GDP appear big, to increase taxes, to skim money off the top, to perpetuate the status quo). This puts the younger generation in the position of either living beyond their means, or bumming off their parents for 10+ years.

I would say the government does everything it can to encourage people to live beyond their means. It can't force people, but based on the level of debt Canadians have I'd say they have been very successful.

I would suggest you spend 5 minutes reading about Communism to understand how it is you came to the wrong conclusion.

Why do I get the feeling these two identities are one and the same person? :thinking-006:

[Dean2]

Why do I get the feeling these two identities are one and the same person? :thinking-006:

There is a good reason Bighorn87 got banned again.

[zabbo]

I may well try that tomorrow after they close the doors and leave me dangling... again...

Nog

i know a couple other people caught in the same quagmire. Don't envy any of you. :budo:
Hope you get it sorted out quick! :)

[IronNoggin]

i know a couple other people caught in the same quagmire. Don't envy any of you. :budo:
Hope you get it sorted out quick! :)

Don't think that is going to happen.
They hung up at 7:15pm last night. So much for the overnight attempt.
Over 400 call attempts today. Got into queue much later than "normal" at 2:30pm. I pretty much know they will now let the clock run out on me, having done so for seven straight days.

Today is the last day I can convert the claim. Run out of medical days on the standard claim. Means it simply sucks to be me I guess.
Going to go directly against their rules and apply online for the medical claim.
Believe they will deny that, and tell me to phone one of the numbers I have been so diligently trying the past two weeks.

End of two weeks of effort.
Giving up...

Nog

[IronNoggin]

Well... they broke me. Literally.

Kicked me off EI without making the switch to a Medical Benefits Claim. They did so stating I had "plenty of time to contact them and do so" and as a result of me not doing so I am not qualified. Complete BS.

Not qualified for any of the other virus related programs.

Not qualified for welfare and I wouldn't go there even if I was.

Doctor suggesting to go on CPP Disability, and given no other choice I may have to. Current backlog with that process is in excess of five months.

Going to be a long & broke haul for quite the spell it seems.

Frustrated...

Now today they have the unmitigated gall to DEMAND that I call them asap (via My Service Canada account).

Of course the provided number is the same one I have been trying for weeks.

Un-Effing-Real! http://storage.forums.net/6981147/images/wGBxZaObcjZFRHPWQGYx.gif
Nog

[IronNoggin]

I am FAR from alone. Best guesstimates are that in excess of 700,000 Canadians are slipping through the cracks just as I have:

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/no-job-and-no-more-ei-%E2%80%94-but-she-cant-access-the-new-covid-19-benefit/ar-BB12hTzi

What a complete mess they are making of this matter.
And what a complete mess that is making of one hell of a lot of lives...

Nog

[Bigwoodsman]

I am FAR from alone. Best guesstimates are that in excess of 700,000 Canadians are slipping through the cracks just as I have:

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/no-job-and-no-more-ei-%E2%80%94-but-she-cant-access-the-new-covid-19-benefit/ar-BB12hTzi

What a complete mess they are making of this matter.
And what a complete mess that is making of one hell of a lot of lives...

Nog

The liberals couldn't run a lemonade stand, let alone a fund that they say is set up to help Canadians now!

The only thing Trudum did well was.... um er ah....ah...ah NOTHING!

BW

[BlackHeart]

So doesn't it sound like the Turdeau govt is doing things to help those affected or laid off due to Covid-19.

Every day announce a new program. New money for this, new money for that, help this group, help that group, and make sure to help those others....BLAH BLAH BLAH BS BS.
Even got to do a little stage drama sound bit: "Now I going to talk to the kids for a momment....blah blah...I know its tough...but the liberal have got some help for you...blah F blah!!!!.remember the liberal donation line...oops mean the kids help line. Now kids, I want to talk to your grandparents.........WHAT A F JOKE!!!!" Straight out of a badly done skit. Ever see someone do such a badly done presentation, so ackward, that is soooo corn-ball that, you feel the embarrassment yourself...or that is so condescending that its sickening......that was this.

But the real truth is that this federal govt has no clue and no way to do what they are announcing. They are announcing programs without a single guideline written. BUT.....KEEP ANNOUNCING PROGRAMS. That what they want you to remember......the announcement......not the actual program or lack there of.

The company I work for was still trying to find anything about how to apply for any of these programs as our division has laid off 80% of our staff.
We've held off on the next round of layoffs hoping to get some details on these fancy programs....We consulted with a big national accounting firm and their advice was that there is such a cluster-f that its not worth pursuing. So the conclusion is that by the time this is sorted out we'd be bankrupt......and most of these are pie-in the-sky programs that we might/might not qualify for....but in the mean time cash is burning up. So next round of lay offs....till me and a few of the last ones are laying ourselves off.

By the time this govt gets its act together, we will be over this by one way or another.

But want to bet that the companies that are getting their funds all are on their donators list.....starting with SNC and Bombardier.

Does anybody remember the sponsorship scandal.....small potatoes....but envelopes of cash passed around......to save Confederation.....it was a good cause....don'tcha know!! AND nobody knows where all the money went....unaccountable

WELL.........This is a really crisis.....with 100X the money being thrown at it........and even more difficult to track and account for.......guaranteed that big chunks of this will flow to their freinds and some flow back to their campaign funds. Watch!!!

So IRONNOGGIN.......make a $50 donation to the liberal party of canada....THEN CALL a Liberal MP.......you then will have to decide which piles of money you want.

[35 whelen]

So doesn't it sound like the Turdeau govt is doing things to help those affected or laid off due to Covid-19.



Every day announce a new program. New money for this, new money for that, help this group, help that group, and make sure to help those others....BLAH BLAH BLAH BS BS.

Even got to do a little stage drama sound bit: "Now I going to talk to the kids for a momment....blah blah...I know its tough...but the liberal have got some help for you...blah F blah!!!!.remember the liberal donation line...oops mean the kids help line. Now kids, I want to talk to your grandparents.........WHAT A F JOKE!!!!" Straight out of a badly done skit.



But the real truth is that this federal govt has no clue and no way to do what they are announcing. They are announcing programs without a single guideline written. BUT.....KEEP ANNOUNCING PROGRAMS. That what they want you to remember......the announcement......not the actual program or lack there of.



By the time this govt gets its act together, we will be over this by one way or another.



But want to bet that the companies that are getting their funds all are on their donators list.....starting with SNC and Bombardier.



Does anybody remember the sponsorship scandal.....small potatoes....but envelopes of cash passed around......to save Confederation.....it was a good cause....don'tcha know!! AND nobody knows where all the money went....unaccountable



WELL.........This is a really crisis.....with 100X the money being thrown at it........and even more difficult to track and account for.......guaranteed that big chunks of this will flow to their freinds and some flow back to their campaign funds. Watch!!!



So IRONNOGGIN.......make a $50 donation to the liberal party of canada....THEN CALL a Liberal MP.......you then will have to decide which piles of money you want.Maybe you should run for office and do a better job

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk

[BlackHeart]

Maybe you should run for office and do a better job

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk

Probably wouldn't even have to get out of bed and into my pajamas to do a better job.

Ever know somebody who does an DIY project that would have been easier to fix if they had done nothing. Thats this govt.

Do a better job!!!!.......put me in a coma and I still will end up doing a better job.

[IronNoggin]

Maybe you should run for office and do a better job


A snail, a bullfrog and an average rock could do an outstandingly better job.

Reality.

Nog

[IronNoggin]

After a total of 42 hours "On Hold" over the past two weeks, I finally got a Two-Legs to speak to just shortly ago.

I did not rant at him, in fact expressed my gratitude that he and his colleagues on the front line are doing what they can in the face of these unfortunate times. He must have been barked at a LOT of late from the genuine thanks he proffered to that statement.

Long and short - nothing he / they can do from their end at the moment.

The ONLY folks that can deal with Fishing Claims and any transfers related to them are in their Processing Department.

From what he could determine I am more than qualified, and should be getting the "lost" weeks back down the road as well as going on Medical.

Let's hope so...

He flagged my case for their Processing Department and informed me they will actually call me (wonder about that...) within 5 to 7 business days.

So, some of the tension wanders a little...

Now HOPING they stick to their word and do what is right by my case.

Going to be right thin for a spell, but maybe, just maybe we're back on track...

Cheers,
Nog

[HVA7mm]

Good to hear that you're actually in the system, and hopefully things are on track. It's getting pretty desperate for a lot of people right now.