Mortgage Renewal

[Lefty-Canuck]

Hey All,

What a joyous time to renew a mortgage... or not. Any suggestions? Has anyone used the AO SPONSOR who is a broker? Currently with Scotia and haven’t talked about their rate offerings yet but going to be talking soon before things increase again....

LC

[marky_mark]

I got 2.69 fixed 5 years in December from my broker

[heybert]

Banks actually have raised their 5 year fixed. I got a better rate a year ago. Find yourself a good mortgage broker and let them do the homework for you. Variable rates seems to be better at the moment, but since we’re at rock bottom, prepare for it to rise.

[HyperMOA]

I used Tim Lacroix (the AO sponsor) to purchase our cabin. He and his staff are top notch and worked hard to beat everyone’s rate. I ended up getting that mortgage from Scotiabank and when I contacted Scotiabank directly I wasn’t even in the ballpark of the rate he secured for me.

I just renewed on mar1 before interest fell off a cliff (d’oh) and wanted to go with him and had full intentions to, but ATB stepped up to the plate in a big way.

I live in Edmonton and they made the whole process so simple from their offices in Calgary. I highly recommend Tim and Naomi.

[58thecat]

When we had one we shopped around and made all involved know of the others going rates etc...the ball is In Your park so make them want your business....

[B-radshaw]

I cant give much advice for a broker to use but just renewed one of our houses at 1.99 for 5 years.

[dodgeboy1979]

I just went through Colin Bruce to renew mine as he had better rates than TD. Pretty easy process.

[blgoodbrand1]

Not to divert the thread to much but how soon before the 60 month mark do you start looking to renew?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[reddeerguy2015]

https://www.theplacetomortgage.com/kate/

You'll be hard pressed to find a better broker. She'll work hard to find a mortgage that works for you. Good luck!!

[HyperMOA]

Not to divert the thread to much but how soon before the 60 month mark do you start looking to renew?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You can generally apply about 100 days from your renewal is due. I start shopping about 5 months out and will get approvals 75 days out and sign on the last week or two.

[neznam]

I just renewed my mortgage wit RBC 5 years 2.54%

[Pixel Shooter]

5 yr rates went to 2.99% today. just because rates going down, not reflected on lending rates and ima thinkin has to do with pricing to risk...…. can see rates going up again :thinking-006:

[Lefty-Canuck]

I cant give much advice for a broker to use but just renewed one of our houses at 1.99 for 5 years.

Must be a variable rate?

LC

[Buckhead]

If I was going to renew a mortgage I would wait until this Covid19 issue is behind us if I could. Right now the banks are pricing in risk and trying to move the rates up.
The rates will come down again once things settle down and everyone gets back to work.

[Lefty-Canuck]

If I was going to renew a mortgage I would wait until this Covid19 issue is behind us if I could. Right now the banks are pricing in risk and trying to move the rates up.
The rates will come down again once things settle down and everyone gets back to work.

I have till October... so not sure I should jump on and gets some rates locked now or wait.

LC

[GStyler]

I use Tim Lacroix as my broker, and would definitely recommend him.

During the last downturn, I was worried about my renewal coming up. I saw him on here, so I figured why not ask him an few questions. He replied with good advice.

When my renewal from CIBC came in the mail, their rates were almost insulting (like 3.6% when published rates at the time were like 2.6%). I didn't even bother replying to them, or answering their phone calls.
Tim got me a much better rate, and the whole process was very easy with him and his team.

[Pixel Shooter]

same boat, im waiting.when you figure it out, call me, see what I can do for u , I know a guy LOL!!!

[Buckhead]

Right now the Canadian 5 year bond yield is right around 0.60%
Typically the spread between that and a 5 year fixed mortgage is 150 basis points. So a good 5 year fixed right now should be right around 2.10%
The banks have added an additional 100 to 120 basis points as a risk premium.
It's a tough call. Are things going to get better or worse? Are we going to see a lot of defaults in mortgage payments?
If you want a fixed payment and that helps you sleep at night, maybe lock it in.
If you're a bit of a gambler, and you have an extra cushion, ride it out.
If I knew the answer I wouldn't be on here. I would be pulling up in my yacht to my private island:)

[B-radshaw]

Must be a variable rate?

LC

No 5 year fixed. Started at 2.79 and have been able to work them down over the last few weeks. First National Financial. My actual renewal date is not till June but they have allowed me to re lock in a rate as its come down.

[Lefty-Canuck]

No 5 year fixed. Started at 2.79 and have been able to work them down over the last few weeks. First National Financial. My actual renewal date is not till June but they have allowed me to re lock in a rate as its come down.

Wow that’s amazing!

LC

[Gboe8]

2.49 last week five years.

[mindoutside]

2.49 last week five years.

www.paultgemortgagebroker.ca

[mindoutside]

No 5 year fixed. Started at 2.79 and have been able to work them down over the last few weeks. First National Financial. My actual renewal date is not till June but they have allowed me to re lock in a rate as its come down.

First National is great for competing at renewal

[Big Racks]

My broker got me 5 year variable at prime -.75, so 2.2 currently. Sounds like maybe she could have done better, I was pretty happy though. Evidently discounts were being cut shortly after I got my pre approval.

[daveyn]

To the OP's original question.
What exactly would you be waiting for? rates may come down a little lower but there is really not much more room to go any lower, there is a whole lot of room for them to go up depending on what happens over the next few months. As somebody who remembers mortgage rates in the mid Teens from the 80's my advice would be to lock it in for 5 years at the best rate you can get today and don't lose any sleep over the 1/4% you might leave on the table. The rate you get today , whatever it is, is excellent compared to what it might be down the road. Set it and forget it for about 5 years.

[Glion]

There was just a news article about this. How the central rate has gone down but how banks are raising their rates because they are pricing in more risk... they will also be making more on these mortgages as their spread is larger. Might want to wait a couple months as they might correct and follow the central rate better

[MK2750]

First National has always treated me right. I had agreed to 2.79 last fall as I really didn't want to get involved with calling all over the place. It was early as the renewal wasn't for a month or so.

On the day before the actual date I got a bit of a frantic call from the broker that I needed to resign the documents she had emailed to save an additional 1/2% or something silly. She was more excited than I was but I appreciate her commitment to her work and will not be shopping elsewhere.

[Lefty-Canuck]

First National has always treated me right. I had agreed to 2.79 last fall as I really didn't want to get involved with calling all over the place. It was early as the renewal wasn't for a month or so.

On the day before the actual date I got a bit of a frantic call from the broker that I needed to resign the documents she had emailed to save an additional 1/2% or something silly. She was more excited than I was but I appreciate her commitment to her work and will not be shopping elsewhere.

Good to know! Thanks.

LC

[Lefty-Canuck]

To the OP's original question.
What exactly would you be waiting for? rates may come down a little lower but there is really not much more room to go any lower, there is a whole lot of room for them to go up depending on what happens over the next few months. As somebody who remembers mortgage rates in the mid Teens from the 80's my advice would be to lock it in for 5 years at the best rate you can get today and don't lose any sleep over the 1/4% you might leave on the table. The rate you get today , whatever it is, is excellent compared to what it might be down the road. Set it and forget it for about 5 years.

Solid point! I guess my concern is how much is it likely to increase in the next 6 months.

LC

[Pixel Shooter]

typically the most competitive time for mortgage rates is the next 3mths. so hang in there.

[daveyn]

Solid point! I guess my concern is how much is it likely to increase in the next 6 months.

LC

Nobody knows really, everybody can guess and speculate and some might even guess correctly, but world events change things very quickly in ways nobody could predict.
Its all about the risk/reward scale. Whats the risk of it going up versus the reward of holding out in the hope of something better. In my opinion, and its only my opinion, the risk of waiting far outweighs any potential reward of waiting. So I'd hedge because if I'm wrong today my cost is nominal, if I'm wrong later my cost could be huge, and we are talking about my family home not some speculative stock purchase .

[MK2750]

typically the most competitive time for mortgage rates is the next 3mths. so hang in there.

Risk is very high right now. I am not an expert by any means but people will be defaulting on everything from mortgages to basic monthly service fees. The banks will take every measure to protect themselves and make a profit. The government is offering loan protection so the banks have safe places to invest without risk. It may go lower but I wouldn't expect anything normal this summer.

[eric-kam]

Very high risk? isn't that what CMHC is for? a insurance policy paid by the home owner for the banks protection? lol

[MK2750]

Very high risk? isn't that what CMHC is for? a insurance policy paid by the home owner for the banks protection? lol

Until people can't make their credit card payments, and then they can't make the two car payments and then people can't even pay all those nasty fees where all the bank profits come from and then businesses start to default in spite of government help and then banks up the fees and interest rates to try to cover their loses from those that are still able to pay lol

[Tigger72]

Had a rate-war between a broker and my bank.... RBC.... started looking mid Jan. and started at 3.2 with RBC then the broker got to 2.9 the bank matched it then the broker got 2.54 then eventually down to 2.44.... the closest the bank could get to the broker was 2.54 - going with the broker I would lose the multi-product discount with the bank and when we did the math the amount we saved with the broker didn't amount to much when you add the bank fees over 5 years and with the convenience of having our banking all in one place and easy access it wasn't worth the trouble of swapping over with the broker to Merix. Signed with RBC on Friday....with 2.54% and 5 years..

[Big Racks]

Think my broker just screwed up and cost me some $$. Asked for a pre approval for 2 properties, a house and a condo. She came back with a single pre approval, and said it was good for both properties up to the approved maximum $$, combined.
Discount rates are now drying up and I had locked in at a variable rate of prime -.75, so about 1.7% currently. I finalized offers on both a house and a condo in the last 2 days, sent her the docs for final approval, and now she's evidently waiting to hear back from the district manager or somebody from First National to see if they'll cover both under the same pre-approval. According to her, she was told "verbally" by whoever she deals with to submit it that way, but now she's all of a sudden concerned they will only honour one of the mortgages on the pre-approval, and I'll have to get another approval on the other mortgage. Sounds like she dropped the ball and I may end up with a higher rate on the condo mortgage. Think she mentioned a 5 year fixed at 2.64 so not horrible, but I wasn't very pleased.

[Twisted Canuck]

Well, I tried Scotia again today to see where things were at, they finally gave me something that I was happy with. 5 year variable closed and convertible, at 2.44%. I don't see that going up any time soon (and could go down another .25 if BofC moves to zero, which is still a strong possibility).... but if things do start moving up in a hurry I can lock it in for balance of term. I was hoping for something at 2.25% or less but I can live with that.

[Big Racks]

Well, I tried Scotia again today to see where things were at, they finally gave me something that I was happy with. 5 year variable closed and convertible, at 2.44%. I don't see that going up any time soon (and could go down another .25 if BofC moves to zero, which is still a strong possibility).... but if things do start moving up in a hurry I can lock it in for balance of term. I was hoping for something at 2.25% or less but I can live with that.

Nice snag!! Looks like you got Prime -.01 then? The best they'd give me on a variable last week was Prime +.10, which would be at 2.55% currently. I needed to talk to your guy, lol. First National wouldn't honour my pre-approved rate of Prime -.75 (currently at 1.7%) for more than one property, so I placed the house with them (duh), but refused to give them the mortgage on the second property just out of principle. Placed it with TD at 2.79% 5 yr fixed.

So, I'll have one at 5 yr variable, currently 1.7%, and the other at 5 yr fixed of 2.79%. Figured it gives me a bit of a balanced exposure considering the uncertainty of the next few years, the variable at +.10 would save me money immediately, and I generally like variables over fixed, but I'd had it with First National by that point.

My mortgage broker IS however kicking me back her commission to help compensate for the loss of the excellent variable rate on the second property. Sounds like she probably made an assumption on her part, and it was wrong. She still claims she was told she should submit it that way, but should have confirmed it when I voiced concern over the way it was written rather than just ran with it and told me it was good.

[Twisted Canuck]

That's too bad you didn't get them both at a the variable rate, that's a killer rate. I just did a renewal over phone today, pretty painless. Last renewal I went to broker and spent weeks submitting paperwork for personal and business, and finally just said screw it and renewed with Scotia over phone in 5 minutes.

Having funds to pay off your small mortgage 5x over apparently means nothing, as does having 75+% equity in your home, or having a credit rating over 800. Nope. They just look at income and get testy. When you are self employed not showing a big income is the name of the game.....but anyway. Mortgage renewals can be such a hassle. Glad Scotia gave me that rate. It is only a point under prime, but still good. Much better than the 13% on my first home!

[270person]

https://www.theplacetomortgage.com/kate/

You'll be hard pressed to find a better broker. She'll work hard to find a mortgage that works for you. Good luck!!



How do we know YOU aren't Kate Racz though? Could be doing the shameless plug thing.

I'd definitely hunt moose with you tho Kate.

[Soakers]

I'm with Scotia Bank with one of my properties. My other properties I using a broker. Funny thing is I've moved all my properties to my broker (Dominion) which was cheaper in the past, However I was moving a condo I own this last month and Scotia cut the rate lower than my broker.

I feel they are getting hungry and seems that they finally willing to deal.

[edmsmith]

Other then the one variable rate none of the rates discussed are any good. You could get 2.49 locked in over 5 years last december. If you shop around now its available with some lenders.

I locked in this december and ended up with 2.59. One of my other properties is also with scotiabank. When it comes to renewals they are the worst to deal with.

I can renew with them now but im holding off closer till summer to see how rates go.

[Twisted Canuck]

My renewal wasn't due till mid June, but the way things are looking I expect banks to start pricing a lot more risk into their rates, and dont see them going down. More likely if the markets really tank and the covid lockdown continues, rates are going up. That's my Crystal ball Reasoning, maybe I'm wrong, but either way I'm ok with 2.44% variable.

[edmsmith]

Im banking on the opposite. I cant see them going up as the 2.49 to 2.79 to 5 yr rates have been around forever now. I think many of us assumed rates would be more competitive by now but its clear thats not happening.

[Twisted Canuck]

Im banking on the opposite. I cant see them going up as the 2.49 to 2.79 to 5 yr rates have been around forever now. I think many of us assumed rates would be more competitive by now but its clear thats not happening.

In general, I hope you are correct. Back in January I was expecting rate cuts, and I was right on that. A full 100 basis points. But the banks didn't follow suit. If you are correct though, it would mean that the economy isn't on fire and collapsing on itself. But, as we have been hearing ad nauseam, these are 'unprecedented time's....and just because rates have been hanging around forever, doesn't mean they will continue to do so. The global financial situation is fragile, and propping it up with borrowed government money is just adding risk I believe.

I hope you are right though about rates, truly. But the default rate is going to skyrocket with people out of work.

Just an example of what I was saying, and this should alarm anyone who is paying attention....maybe the Canary in the coal mine is already dead.

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/houston-banks-have-huge-problem

[Lefty-Canuck]

Well I still haven’t locked into a renewal... 2.19% fixed 5 year is looking good though.

LC

[TomP]

All bets are off as far as I’m concerned...economy is collapsing..lock it for 5 years and be prepared to pay higher rates in the future..pay down other debts and prepare for inflated prices and taxes..and full digital currency.

[molly]

Well I still haven’t locked into a renewal... 2.19% fixed 5 year is looking good though.

LC

We locked in back in May at 2.39 for five years and it went down to 2.14 in June, so we are happy with that as our new term starts Monday!

P.S. Thanks to Tim Lacroix, our broker (also an AO sponsor)!:)

[Pixel Shooter]

Sent u a pm lefty

[j335]

Keep in mind Brokers don't always get you the best rate anymore, my last mortgage I got better rates going directly to a bank and before that I always went through my broker. HSBC & Tangerine are both below 2% on fixed 5yr mortgages, be sure to read the fine print though as HSBC has a high payout penalty and generally are very slow to deal with... See link below for a good comparison to help with shopping.

https://www.superbrokers.ca/tools/mortgage-rates-comparison/

[AndrewM]

Another props for Tim at Mortgage Made Easy who is a forum sponsor. Great to deal with and got me an awesome rate!

http://outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=237919&page=4&highlight=mortgage+made+easy

[Cement Bench]

Keep in mind Brokers don't always get you the best rate anymore, my last mortgage I got better rates going directly to a bank and before that I always went through my broker. HSBC & Tangerine are both below 2% on fixed 5yr mortgages, be sure to read the fine print though as HSBC has a high payout penalty and generally are very slow to deal with... See link below for a good comparison to help with shopping.

https://www.superbrokers.ca/tools/mortgage-rates-comparison/

consult your local foreclosure lawyer when wanting to pay out a mortgage

the law used to be a decade ago that

BANKS CANNOT CHARGE A PREPAYMENT PENALTY IF YOU LET THE MORTGAGE FALL INTO ARREARS THE LETTER OF DEMAND CAN ONLY ASK FOR THE PRINCIPLE OWED. plus interest of course and costs if you fail to pay it out right away

situation still exists today but the banks official position I s

WE KNOW NOTHING

and to be blunt 95% of lawyers will tell you must pay the 3 months penalty interest because THEY ARE PAID BY THE BANKS AND WILL LOSE THE. ORTGAGE WORK IF THEY TELL YOU NOT TO PAY PENALTY INTEREST


funny how that works, eh. follow the money

[nast70]

Make sure you read the fine print with a broker.
Our last mortgage was through a broker. Long story short, we were not able to get out of the brokered term early (only 6 months) and had to carry 2 mortgage payments for the last 6 months of the previous term. All in the fine print....
The good news was, we were able to spruce up the old place and get a bit more for it when it sold.

[HyperMOA]

I missed this thread but I used Tim Lacroix to purchase my cabin and they were awesome. I was going to use him for my house renewal but I had a chip on my shoulder with ATB and kinda went to war with them and ended up with a rate that was phenomenal. Upon the next renewal and my cabin renewal I’m confident that I will be using Tim though. Great company. Makes things very easy. I’m in Edmonton and they are in Calgary and everything was done easily with no travel.

EDIT: Nevermind I guess I was post #4 and missed it. Now I’m just repeating myself.