Hunting by hand ? WT?

[Arn?Narn.]

OK last thread for the night with the youtubes but man oh man, the stuff people post !


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xYIivtJCxlQ

[H380]

Can you believe that anyone could be so stupid as to stick a bear with a knife like that? He's lucky he's not wearing that animal.. an outfitter I work for had guys approach him to try this and he bluntly declined..

[steve]

I'd be more concerned about the lack of penetration there.

[gunner72]

WOW!! That guy either is all nuts or no brains, Maybe both.:scared0015:

[moosehunter3-0]

Jumping on its back with a saddle would have been the cool thing to do...
Seriously though, poor bear never even had a chance, if your going to hunt use something adequate for the job.

[hunter10]

Jumping on its back with a saddle would have been the cool thing to do...


I thought someone was actually gonna jump on it. That would have been awesome :bad_boys_20:

But that guy is retarted. He had a :sign0161: moment.

[TreeGuy]

Thought it was kindda cool actually. How the heck do you think our ancient ancestors got it done?

On the other hand Saskabush is a different world. I know of a couple boys out there that roped a bear years back, hit it with a tranq needle used in their cattle operation, and chained the bugger up in the shed to scare the chit out of their Dad in the morning. It worked! :lol:

Same fools roped a cow moose too and damn near lost a horse out of the deal. I believe the quote went, "Bears are easier!" :lol:

[moosehunter3-0]

Dont try riding a bear, bad news all around.

[Popcan]

I'm not sure what to think of that but it sure is something you don't see every day. I start trembling when I get to within 50 yds of may bait. I really feel like a whimp after watching that. Man oh Man. Talk about stones.

[Calgaryguy1977]

I would like to see that done face to face without bait and a 2 man ambush. then I'd be impressed. The second the bear heard a noise it was startled and ran. If it was cornered then it'd be a different story. Kind of an unfair fight tbh.
I'm not saying just anyone would try to knife a bear but that bear probably suffered which is bull****.
my .02

[FCLightning]

but that bear probably suffered which is bull****.
my .02

That bear will suffer no more than if he was arrowed through the chest.

[Calgaryguy1977]

I think an arrow in the chest would kill him. Not sure about the knife in the hind quarters.

[pottymouth]

Thought it was kindda cool actually. How the heck do you think our ancient ancestors got it done?

:

Rumor has it mine were designed and used, Bows, swords, sheilds, and Catapults! :sHa_shakeshout:But then again we didn't have bears there!:scared0018:

[redranger15]

I think an arrow in the chest would kill him. Not sure about the knife in the hind quarters.


Looks like he punched it in the ribs to me.Don't think that bear is going very v far, that knife was pretty long .Still a little nuts if you ask me.

[rhuntley12]

I'd be more concerned about the lack of penetration there.

It doesn't look to me like he got too deep a stab either? Almost looks like he didn't get it straight in.

[spot and stock]

SOB is nuts, I think he got it up behind the sholder though.

[Calgaryguy1977]

When I first saw it, I thought it looked funny. I laughed hysterically for about 5-10 mins....is that wrong or sadistic or something? LOL

I do feel bad for the bear for some reason though.

[eltorro]

I believe the only wrong thing is our "must" to have a "yes or no" opinion about everything. :snapoutofit:
We don't want our favorite method of hunting to undergo public scrutiny, specially from guys hunting some other way.

I trust the only decent question is :would you do it?

[flint]

Did I miss some of the video? Where is the bear? Was it recovered?

[TheClash]

Did I miss some of the video? Where is the bear? Was it recovered?

that is my question as well.

if the bear was killed and recovered...or at least an attempt was made to track and recover the bear (as you would do with any other means of hunting) then whatever....a hole in you is a hole in you no matter what is used to make it i guess.

however if it was done as a prank for poops and giggles....and they all just stood around and laughed about it later...well then i have a problem with it...as i would with an arrow, bullet etc......

[FCLightning]

however if it was done as a prank for poops and giggles....and they all just stood around and laughed about it later...well then i have a problem with it...as i would with an arrow, bullet etc......

And to speculate such from the video that was shown is just plain poor taste and fostering negativity.

[TheClash]

And to speculate such from the video that was shown is just plain poor taste and fostering negativity.

thanks for ignoring the first part of my post that says it is ok if done like you would in any other hunting situation?...:thinking-006:

[tappen]

i too for some reason feel bad for the bear, yet how should i know that a bullet hurts less then a stab? Ethically im thinking, why would u do that? why would u cause that bear the pain of being stabbed, and at the same time, im sure the bear feels the bullet to.

[FCLightning]

thanks for ignoring the first part of my post that says it is ok if done like you would in any other hunting situation?...:thinking-006:

And that makes it ok to post negative speculation? The second part of your post was very poor taste, regardless of what provisos you want to place on it. You took a perfectly innocent clip of video and cast a very negative light on it for no constructive purpose.

[harryones]

Never mind the bear. Did you see the video link for April Hunter and Her big Red Guns.

[Rantastic]

thats what i saw too... those werenice big red guns lol

[TheClash]

And that makes it ok to post negative speculation? The second part of your post was very poor taste, regardless of what provisos you want to place on it. You took a perfectly innocent clip of video and cast a very negative light on it for no constructive purpose.

i was neither negative or positive i was in fact indifferent in that we have no information before or after the video clip. so my OPINION was that if they treated it like any other hunt..i am ok with it....if they did not i am not ok with it...as i am not ok with anyone harming an animal purely for pleasure. get off your soap box....so you are ok if he just stabbed the animal, let it run off and did nothing about it? what is positive about that?

[hunter10]

Never mind the bear. Did you see the video link for April Hunter and Her big Red Guns.

I saw that coming :sHa_shakeshout:

[flint]

i was neither negative or positive i was in fact indifferent in that we have no information before or after the video clip. so my OPINION was that if they treated it like any other hunt..i am ok with it....if they did not i am not ok with it...as i am not ok with anyone harming an animal purely for pleasure. get off your soap box....so you are ok if he just stabbed the animal, let it run off and did nothing about it? what is positive about that?

I don't call this hunting. With a bullet or arrow there probably would of been a complete pass through with bleeding on both sides and internal soft tissue damage. With the bear directly below the tree stand either weapon would of killed it instantly with a spine shot. I truly feel for the bear. I hope that it died within 30 seconds or less and that these guys recovered it. If this guy tries this again I hope the bear bites his wee nee off.

[FCLightning]

I am OK with what I saw on the video. I am not OK with trying to make something out of nothing. You showed a negative bias towards hunters by throwing out a completely unfounded assertion of animal cruelty. I certainly did not expect you to make a retraction - it would be out of character.

[TheClash]

I am OK with what I saw on the video. I am not OK with trying to make something out of nothing. You showed a negative bias towards hunters by throwing out a completely unfounded assertion of animal cruelty. I certainly did not expect you to make a retraction - it would be out of character.


out of character?? haha..how do you know my character.....

I am ok with what i saw on the video as well..which is what i stated. I also stated that without knowing what else happened i have no opinion on it..good or bad.

i never asserted that they were being cruel to animals..only that if they were then i would not support the action. if they weren't then i do support it.

do you have more information about the actions of the people on the clip? if you do then please share. if not then you have no more information than the rest of us and therefore have no right to tell me what my opinion of the situation should be, nor make assumptions about my character. as for making a retraction, i have nothing to retract. I stand by my statements that IF they made all efforts to recover the animal....i have no problem with it. IF they did not, then i think they caused an animal pain and discomfort for nothing more that a video clip to put online and i do not, and cannot agree with that. obviously you can.

[FCLightning]

I don't call this hunting.

It is not something I would participate in because I am not that brave, but it is a purer form of "hunting" than anything else we do.

http://adventure.howstuffworks.com/outdoor-activities/hunting/traditional-methods/knife-hunting3.htm

http://www.affordablehoghunts.com/

Australia, New Zealand, United States, Germany, Argentina, Russia and probably a whole lot more places where using a knife as your only weapon is still practiced commonly.

[FCLightning]

out of character?? haha..how do you know my character.....

I am ok with what i saw on the video as well..which is what i stated. I also stated that without knowing what else happened i have no opinion on it..good or bad.......

Ooooh, the indignant attitude post.

If you had no opinion on what else happened then you would not have posted your opinion on what they may or may not have done. Speculating that the persons in the video had less than honorable intentions shows a negativity toward the sport of hunting.

Next time you see a fire, yell fire. Next time you see smoke, yell fire. But if you see nothing, please don't yell fire.

And it is utter stupidity that because I don't agree with you making baseless negative assertions that I would be in favor of animal cruelty. I hope you get your emotions in check so you can think logically before you reply again.

[TheClash]

Ooooh, the indignant attitude post.

If you had no opinion on what else happened then you would not have posted your opinion on what they may or may not have done. Speculating that the persons in the video had less than honorable intentions shows a negativity toward the sport of hunting.

Next time you see a fire, yell fire. Next time you see smoke, yell fire. But if you see nothing, please don't yell fire.

And it is utter stupidity that because I don't agree with you making baseless negative assertions that I would be in favor of animal cruelty. I hope you get your emotions in check so you can think logically before you reply again.

you missed my point completely...i DO have an opinion on what else happened...i do NOT have an opinion on what we saw in the clip...get that straight. If and only IF they DID NOT try to recover the animal, then my OPINION is that they were cruel to an animal for no other reason than their own pleasure. once again IF they made an attempt to recover the animal then to me it is no different than any other style of hunting.
so once again..i have no opinion on what is in the video because, as i stated, without knowing what happens after i cannot either condone or condemn the actions in the video. If it is legal in that area to hunt with a knife and they made every attempt to recover the animal...more power to them....if it is not and they did not..well then shame on them. once again...just so you get me this time...i have no opinion on the clip or the people in the clip because without further information i cannot form one. if YOU have more information on this particular clip please share. if not then i can turn your words on you...from the clip you make positive and honorable assumptions from just what you see....how can you do that?....would your tune change if you found out that they all laughed after and never went to recover the animal?

[FCLightning]

Hey Clash, I think the readership has a pretty good idea of what I think of your automatically assuming that the hunters in the video may act in a negative manner with no evidence on which to base it. You seem to think it is OK to automatically assume that hunters will be as likely to behave poorly as not. Whatever. I think that is poor taste.

[TheClash]

show me where i assumed they acted in a negative manner? show me where i definitively said i think these guys acted in a way that is unbecoming of a hunter. show me where i didn't allow for there to be two different outcomes after the video clip ends. show where i didn't give just as much leeway for them to act in a positive manner as i did for them to act in a negative manner. and please show me where i condemned these actual men in this actual clip....

answer me this, if these men did not make an effort to recover this animal that they stabbed...are you still ok with it?

[FCLightning]

I am not OK with wanton waste of game or animal cruelty and I am not OK with needless speculation, especially when it's only purpose is the cast a shroud of negativity. The very fact that you made a public speculation that the folks in the video may have acted in that manner is just plain wrong. Since it seems you can't find your original post, it is post #20 where you where you stated it was a possibility that they may have done it for "poops and giggles". But I believe I have stated this a number of times already.

[TheClash]

since i am tired of having this go around in circles i will ask pointed yes or no questions. please answer as such.

so speaking to your first line, if the men in the clip did not try to find and recover the wounded bear would you feel differently about what they have done...yes or no?

I have not made any assumptions or accusations or speculations about the men in the clip. I do not give a lick a bout them. My concern is for the bear.

you say that i have presented them in a negative light....look at my posts and answer me this...have i not presented two different scenarios for what happened after the camera was turned off....yes or no?

have i not proposed that if they r acted like i believe a hunter should and have tracked the bear and hopefully found and used it (positive....and have said i am fine with what they have done...no different than any other hunting) yes or no?

I have also proposed that if the men decided to not track the bear or done and went about their day (negative...an un-needed cruel act against an animal which you have also stated you were against) yes or no??

and did i not make it clear in my first post that i would be against such an action no matter what implement was used? yes or no??

have all my posts offered both possibilities? yes or no?

....if they have then i have presented exactly as much positive speculation as i have negative. you have chosen to focus on the negative and argue with someone who most likely agrees with you. there have been others that have flat out called these men out and discredited them...but you chose to attack my posts where my concern from my first post has been on what they did after. my only concern is for that bear, period. and you call into question my character? please.

[ksteed17]

I am OK with what I saw on the video. I am not OK with trying to make something out of nothing. You showed a negative bias towards hunters by throwing out a completely unfounded assertion of animal cruelty. I certainly did not expect you to make a retraction - it would be out of character.

well for being around for only a couple months you sure seem to know alot about someone youve only met over a keyboard, but judging by your character your probably the same guy who post a pic of brad pitt on your online dating saying its you and then its no real surprise that when you finally meet face to face you look nothing like the picture. Your arguments are the same in every post, Clash said nothing negative about any of the hunters. If anyones speculating and spreading negative conotations its you, and to me it seems like this is not your regular username but thats just me guessing at your character again, my bad.

[FCLightning]

You are right Clash, that was circular. And true to the character I have read on your previous posts I could continue in pointless drivel for quite a few pages. But that is neither here nor there to the original topic.

If there was anything more to the original video there would be something more to comment on, but there wasn't so there isn't.

[geo]

The fact that they posted a video of it on YouTube makes me question their motives. This likely wasn't a hunt but an attempt to get a widely watched clip on YouTube. Hmmm....

There are quicker ways to dispatch a bear with it suffering less. Would I stab a bear, risking that I could injure it and have no hope in hell of finding it? No. That's all I've got to say on this.

[FCLightning]

Sent via PM

[Canadiandad]

FCLightning you are such a doofus. Your posts here were nothing more than silly trolling. Maybe you would be more comfortable on another website forum where nitpicking about every word printed is encouraged?? But here all you have done is demonstrated abuse and stupidity towards someone who made a general comment that most all of us were thinking as well. I am with TheClash on this one.

Hopefully we as hunters will ALL be respectful hunters. But unfortunately there are some bad apples in all barrels. Hopefully these guys weren't some of those. Posting a video like this one without showing the results of the action (posing with the dead animal to show that the kill was completed and not a waste or cruel act) would at the very least show those who are "squeamish" already about hunting that at least the end result was the same as if the animal had been shot with a rifle or a bow. After all, MANY people (hunters and non-hunters) care about a quick and efficient kill with minimal suffering by the animal. We do not have evidence to support this or deny this with this video. It might have been beneficial. If I know human nature then I am sure MANY will watch this video and immediately say..."look, the bear ran away, he will suffer for days in agony. And those awful hunters didn't do anything but sit there and laugh". However, the truth MIGHT have been that the bear dropped dead just 50 yards from there...but we will never know that.

That is all that TheClash was saying with his comments. Most of us that are reasonable thinkers and who know TheClash clearly understood that from his comments.

I think you owe TheClash an apology. Just my opinion.

[fish-man]

Blade didn't look like it went in pretty far, I bet the bear got away clean with a big gash along the side of the ribs.

If shooting a bear from the safety of a tree is ethical, then walking right up to it and stabbing it's gotta be ok too. Can't get much more "fair chase" than that.

[geo]

If shooting a bear from the safety of a tree is ethical, then walking right up to it and stabbing it's gotta be ok too. Can't get much more "fair chase" than that.

It's certainly not a fair chase ethical problem. I don't think it could be any more fair chase than going hand-to-hand with a bear. It's whether it's causing undue suffering.

I can probably kill a bear with a .22 if I shot it right in the eyeball. Or even a .223 if you wanted to make it legal. That doesn't mean that's ethical. There is a reason why we use large calibres on big game. It's to quickly finish the animal so it doesn't needlessly suffer.

What was shown in this publicity stunt causes needless suffering.

That's my opinion. It's not the law so do whatever you want. Just saying I wouldn't do that as it's outside of what I view as ethically and morally acceptable.

[ishootbambi]

It's certainly not a fair chase ethical problem. I don't think it could be any more fair chase than going hand-to-hand with a bear. It's whether it's causing undue suffering.

I can probably kill a bear with a .22 if I shot it right in the eyeball. Or even a .223 if you wanted to make it legal. That doesn't mean that's ethical. There is a reason why we use large calibres on big game. It's to quickly finish the animal so it doesn't needlessly suffer.

What was shown in this publicity stunt causes needless suffering.

That's my opinion. It's not the law so do whatever you want. Just saying I wouldn't do that as it's outside of what I view as ethically and morally acceptable.

what was shown in this stunt causes needless suffering? how do you know that? that bear could have very well made a quick dash and died 50-100 yards away.....kinda like an arrow kills. from your assumption of what you didnt see, it leads me to believe you would feel the same about bowhunting then. i guess arrows also cause needless suffering?

FC....i gotta side with the clash....he didnt say anything unethical happened....only how he would feel if either of two scenarios played out. there may even be a 3rd option...we will never know i guess.

as for the actual video...looks to me like about a 14 inch blade to the chest....thats pretty bad-ass. from the amount of blood spewing out, i would guess dead bear just inside the trees. too bad the video didnt show the conclusion.

[FCLightning]

geo, download the video and import it to a video editor. Then step through it frame by frame. You will see a 12 - 14 inch blade buried to the hilt in the chest of the bear, then a forward cutting slice within the chest before the blade is withdrawn with a blood stream a foot long trailing it. I think the knife inflicted as much internal hemorhage as an arrow or bullet would create.

You may not agree with the chosen method of hunting, but characterizing it as a stunt shows a lack of respect for fellow outdoorsmen than is all too common. Like it or leave it, but please refrain from trying to denigrate it.

[Tundra Monkey]

It's unfortunate that the vid didn't show the recovered animal.

I think that the foot long knife to the lungs did as much damage as an arrow.

Undue suffering....nahhh, it killed it. Looked no different than a bear taking off after being arrowed or shot for that matter.

That being said it's not my style of hunting :sign0068: but I have kidz and a Wife I'd like to spend a few more years with.

tm

[shorthair ptr.]

Pretty disturbing way to hunt. I saw a video years ago using a spear, I thought that wasn't right also. IMO

[FCLightning]

what was shown in this stunt causes needless suffering? how do you know that? that bear could have very well made a quick dash and died 50-100 yards away.....kinda like an arrow kills. from your assumption of what you didnt see, it leads me to believe you would feel the same about bowhunting then. i guess arrows also cause needless suffering?

FC....i gotta side with the clash....he didnt say anything unethical happened....only how he would feel if either of two scenarios played out. there may even be a 3rd option...we will never know i guess.

Kind of interesting that you would take issue with geo for his assumptions of what he didn't see, yet have no issue with TheClash for his assumptions of what he didn't see.

Here is a collection of video clips that took all of 5 minutes to round up. Do you think it would be respectful of each of these hunters if we were to fabricate a morally repugnant ending for each clip and state "If they did ....... I would be unhappy about it."?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vaBQXP3avU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrZG0dyJLtQ&NR=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgs3cEsAzwg&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKiaFZYrz_Q&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFJLF-qZt8k
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjnMtJeKFgo&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5ZY8q34EBw&feature=related

[geo]

You may not agree with the chosen method of hunting, but characterizing it as a stunt shows a lack of respect for fellow outdoorsmen than is all too common. Like it or leave it, but please refrain from trying to denigrate it.

Recording and publishing such things on YouTube hurt us all.

It's all about balance. Clearly you could use an RPG on a bear and it'd be more effective than a 7mm... does that make it unethical to use a 7mm, absolutely not. That's where it comes down to personal choice and I said I disagree with this guy's choice. What choice he makes is up to him in terms of what weapon he wants to use, within the law.

But publishing marginal decisions like this on YouTube, where there is no evidence he even gave chase or recovered the animal hurts us all. This is why people think hunters are crazy rednecks and why our sport is so heavily regulated and at further risk from legislators.

The video stunt is a little irresponsible to the sport.

[ishootbambi]

Kind of interesting that you would take issue with geo for his assumptions of what he didn't see, yet have no issue with TheClash for his assumptions of what he didn't see.

Here is a collection of video clips that took all of 5 minutes to round up. Do you think it would be respectful of each of these hunters if we were to fabricate a morally repugnant ending for each clip and state "If they did ....... I would be unhappy about it."?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vaBQXP3avU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrZG0dyJLtQ&NR=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgs3cEsAzwg&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKiaFZYrz_Q&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFJLF-qZt8k
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjnMtJeKFgo&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5ZY8q34EBw&feature=related

the difference is that clash didnt make an assumption while geo clearly did. clash merely said that if one thing happened then he would feel one way, and if another thing happened he would feel another way. he didnt say "this is what happened". further, geo is still calling this a stunt. as far as i can see, there is no law against what the video showed, and although there is no proof of date of legal season and tags and such, i will go ahead and assume that this was just another form of legal hunting. if that assumption is correct, then i have no issue with what i saw.

[ishootbambi]

that is my question as well.

if the bear was killed and recovered...or at least an attempt was made to track and recover the bear (as you would do with any other means of hunting) then whatever....a hole in you is a hole in you no matter what is used to make it i guess.

however if it was done as a prank for poops and giggles....and they all just stood around and laughed about it later...well then i have a problem with it...as i would with an arrow, bullet etc......

if you have forgotten what clash's first post here was....here ya go. again....i see no assumption.

i looked at the first 2 clips you posted links for and will assume....there it is again....that all are legal hunting situations. im not sure why someone would even consider an illegal action to have occurred as many of us have seen hunting on tv many times. i suspect the interest in this video is higher simply because way fewer of us would have ever seen a bear huted with only a knife. if you doubt that theory, post one random clip of a random dude shooting a bear and see how little response it generates. im talking a youtube clip....a member here generally gets congrats from many.

[TheClash]

Well even though i know better i will wade into this again, hopefully for the last time.

as i have stated previously i do not care at all about the honor or bravery of these men on the clip. i have no issue or concern with them from what i see on the clip...my concern is and always will be with the bear and i will explain why. I believe that God has created us all and that he has given us animals for our use. As creations of our heavenly father i believe that it is our responsibility to treat the ANIMALS with as much respect and honor as possible, and to me that means not inflicting undue pain and suffering. Now will there be pain and suffering in any type of hunt...yes...and again i think that is for us the hunter to understand the weight of the action we have CHOSEN to do. That we have decided to inflict pain on another living creature...but that it is for the greater good of our families etc. and that we accept that consequence but that we also try to minimize the amount of pain and suffering we inflict by causing the quickest and cleanest kill we can. Does it happen every time that an animal drops dead in it's tracks...no. but is it our responsibility as the hunter and as a creation of God to do all we can to find the animal that we wounded..ihmo yes.

i did not watch the videos you have posted as i am on my phone and it would take too long, but i will...and i will say the same thing. IF the hunters in the clips made every attempt to make a clean efficient kill and made every attempt to recover the animal and it was done in a legal manner...then i have absolutely no issue with it.

IF they did not...if they purposely wounded an animal and did not make an effort to recover the animal, then shame on them.

once again i have not said anything about the actual men on the video, i do not know them, never will nor do i ever care if i do. i have only spoken to the situation...and by doing so i speak to every hunting situation. i have not condemned or condoned the actions of these men because i do not have enough information....as such i have NEVER spoken to their personal credibility etc. only to the situation.

FCL you have chosen to describe the men as brave and honorable, i personally do not judge a man's bravery and honor by what animals he kills and by what manner he does it in. To me a brave an honorable man is one that can be an honest man in the face of temptation, one that can treat his wife and kids with the utmost respect. one that can be counted on at his job to always be there and do do his job well. to me honor and bravery has nothing to do with killing an animal and it never will.

so, once again...i make no assumptions about the men on this clip...or about the animal on this clip. i make a proclamation of my feelings towards causing undue pain. i have never said they have or they haven't...as i mentioned before i do not have enough information, and as you stated FCL neither do you. Do i think the large knife the man used is an effective tool...in the right hands in the right part of the body with enough force....yes. did that happen in this clip...we do not know. do i have an issue with using the knife...no i view it as i do any other hunting tool...a tool. that is all.

[FCLightning]

But publishing marginal decisions like this on YouTube, where there is no evidence he even gave chase or recovered the animal hurts us all. This is why people think hunters are crazy rednecks and why our sport is so heavily regulated and at further risk from legislators.

The video stunt is a little irresponsible to the sport.

What is irresponsible to the sport is to show so little respect for a fellow hunter who has not been shown to do anything wrong.

[FCLightning]

Clash you did make an assumption. Posting "however if it was done as a prank for poops and giggles....and they all just stood around and laughed about it later..." in direct reference to the video shows you fostered the idea that they would/could have behaved in such irresponsible behavior. This was not some random musing on the conduct of hunters in general, but was directed specifically towards the situation presented in the video. To me, the implication was disrespectful to the people in the video. And that is harmful to the image of hunters when we disrespect each other.

So, IMO, save the commenting for the next time you see a video clip of animal abuse by a hunter and when you see nothing, say nothing.

[TheClash]

Yawn.

[FCLightning]

So, you really have posted for the last time?

[mulecrazy]

It's certainly not a fair chase ethical problem. I don't think it could be any more fair chase than going hand-to-hand with a bear. It's whether it's causing undue suffering.

I can probably kill a bear with a .22 if I shot it right in the eyeball. Or even a .223 if you wanted to make it legal. That doesn't mean that's ethical. There is a reason why we use large calibres on big game. It's to quickly finish the animal so it doesn't needlessly suffer.

What was shown in this publicity stunt causes needless suffering.

That's my opinion. It's not the law so do whatever you want. Just saying I wouldn't do that as it's outside of what I view as ethically and morally acceptable.

So... Do you just make stuff up at random as you go along with your day. You assume no follow up has happened. many hunting videos on youtube show the shot only. Are all those guys not following up? Pretty ignorant to suggest something with ZERO proof of wrongdoing. Also, since when is hunting black bear with a .223 legal????? man, for a guy who spouts off you really should stick to the basics and learn them. It is illegal to hunt any big game with a calibre less than .23. meaning the .22 calibre 223 round is totally ILLEGAL.

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So... Do you just make stuff up at random as you go along with your day. You assume no follow up has happened. many hunting videos on youtube show the shot only. Are all those guys not following up? Pretty ignorant to suggest something with ZERO proof of wrongdoing. Also, since when is hunting black bear with a .223 legal????? man, for a guy who spouts off you really should stick to the basics and learn them. It is illegal to hunt any big game with a calibre less than .23. meaning the .22 calibre 223 round is totally ILLEGAL.

You completely missed my point. My point was legality and ethics are too different things. Fine, you can hunt a grizzly or moose or bison even legally with a .243 but you don't. Why? Because it's not going to dispatch the animal quickly. I'd argue a random swing with a knife does the same.

Again, like I said, it's just how I see it. There is nothing legally wrong with what these guys did. I'm just saying as hunters we have an ethical obligation to ensure the least suffering possible, within reasonable limits.

Your pretty ignorant of suggesting something with ZERO proof of them following up. Same deal, just I'm on the other side of the coin. I have as much evidence that they didn't chase as you do for the other side of the argument. Grow up already. I'm not suggesting they broke the law. But they didn't show what happened, nor is there any information from the source. More just like a "hey, look I stabbed a bear! Wicked!" movie than a hunting scene in my view.

My point still stands that stuff like this posted on YouTube hurts our sport.

I'm not sure the need to tell the world that you're so tough that you took on a bear. Tell your hunting buddies and share the video with them. Posting it on YouTube just makes us all look bad, encourages further laws when stupid legislators see this stuff paraded around.

Again, nothing illegal. I don't think it's ethical though. And I don't think we should be putting this stuff on YouTube as it sends the wrong message about our sport.

[fish-man]

Given the size of the blade (that's almost a sword) and the target area (rib cage) it seems like the knife would either bounce off the ribs, creating a nasty scratch but no serious damage, or go right through and kill the bear pretty quickly.

I agree with other posters that it's difficult to judge the ethics of the situation based only on that video clip, but I don't think putting a big knife through a bear's rib cage is inherently less moral putting an arrow or a bullet through it.

Finally, that's either a really tame bear or a really dumb one, to allow a guy to walk that close without paying attention.