Time for a bull trout technique Re-evaluation

[Guitarplayingfish]

Went out to river X on friday. A friend and I were flyfishing, while my other 2 friends were spincasting. After about an hour, I had caught a little cutty, and had a giant rainbow spit out my fly. No one else was getting much luck. We walked a couple more km down the river, and found some deep holes. for the last year, my one friend spincasting has been saying he wants to catch a bull trout. It was all he talked about for a while. We all gear to bull flies/lures. Im casting overtop of a fair size bull, when across the river my friends rod starts screaming (spincast) He was using a 6lb ultralight rod, and that thing was bent in half. I thought he snagged at first, but than I hear a yell "HOLY SH**!, ITS THIS BIG!" and he holds out his hand s to be about 3 feet or so, an unbelievable length for this river. After watching the most intense 10 minute fight of my friend running up and down this river, he finally brings it in. Trophy Bulltrout, Estimated 15lb. It was his first bulltrout ever! I have never ever seen a fish like that one. If i can get a picture from him I will put it up. We had a couple small bulls after that one, but nothing special. It was amazing. So, Next time I head out bull fishing, Im bringin the spincast!!!!

[fishstix]

What bull trout flies were you using?

Fishstix!!

[WaterSkeeter]

Gotta find the right pattern, so far I have outfished every gear fisher whos been targeting bulltrout.

[EZM]

Once you find a spot where Bulls are - cast anything. They are stupider than pike. That's why they are threatened.

We caught, on many occasion, bull after bull while casting for other species on anything and everything. They truly are easy to catch.

[Okotokian]

Just back from holidays, time to start a ruckus!!!!! :sHa_shakeshout:

No, actually this is NOT meant as a criticism of anyone, PLEASE don't take it that way... it's more of a "hmmmm... I never thought of this before... what do you think?" sort of musing. No judgement meant at all. All opinions valued. Just kicking it around.

In the course of fishing you are going to catch fish you can't take, some of them like the Bull are endangered. Happens all the time and is basically unavoidable. But what about specifically targetting and trying to catch that particular fish? Sure you are going to catch and release it, but we all know there is some degree of mortality associated with that. SOOOOO.... ethically, might it be something to avoid?

[Guitarplayingfish]

Just so everyone knows, we were fishing for cutts/rainbows/bulls. Spincasting anyway they were catching cutts and bows on the same hook they were catching bulls on. I only switched when i saw em. There are lots of good flies. They like big ugly things - Double bunny, Streamers of any kind, anything that looks like a cutty. Double bunny ftw.

[ishootbambi]

Just back from holidays, time to start a ruckus!!!!! :sHa_shakeshout:

SOOOOO.... ethically, might it be something to avoid?

NO!

[Guitarplayingfish]

NO!

Also, NO indeed. I fish only catch and release, with the exception of MAYBE 1 fish per year, depending on where I am fishing. Bulls are great targets, but handle them carefully, and get them back in the water quick.

[matt04]

Just back from holidays, time to start a ruckus!!!!! :sHa_shakeshout:

No, actually this is NOT meant as a criticism of anyone, PLEASE don't take it that way... it's more of a "hmmmm... I never thought of this before... what do you think?" sort of musing. No judgement meant at all. All opinions valued. Just kicking it around.

In the course of fishing you are going to catch fish you can't take, some of them like the Bull are endangered. Happens all the time and is basically unavoidable. But what about specifically targetting and trying to catch that particular fish? Sure you are going to catch and release it, but we all know there is some degree of mortality associated with that. SOOOOO.... ethically, might it be something to avoid?
I don't think that there is anything wrong with specifically targeting bulls. With proper handling there should be a zero mortality rate.
And besides every time go fishing in the pass and hook into a nice cutty there is allways a big bull right behind it attacking the cutty.
There are lots of bulls out there.

[ishootbambi]

its probably about time to lift the ban on killing them. every river i have been to that has them has tons of them. dont kill every one possible, but a limit of one per day and 2 possession could be sustained in many waterways.

[matt04]

you might be right about that. However I would be curious to know more about how mature these bulls need to be to effectivley spawn. I don't know much about that stuff but i'm sure it would make a huge difference

[DANOMAN]

The bull trout ban went on in 1991 now according to my calculations that's 19 years ago you will never make me believe the bull trout population is threatened. i used to catch bullies like they were going out of style so i think your just being lied to by the government come on seriously 19 years ,,,,,,,:snapoutofit::snapoutofit::snapoutofit:

[Steven Noel]

Just back from holidays, time to start a ruckus!!!!! :sHa_shakeshout:

No, actually this is NOT meant as a criticism of anyone, PLEASE don't take it that way... it's more of a "hmmmm... I never thought of this before... what do you think?" sort of musing. No judgement meant at all. All opinions valued. Just kicking it around.

In the course of fishing you are going to catch fish you can't take, some of them like the Bull are endangered. Happens all the time and is basically unavoidable. But what about specifically targetting and trying to catch that particular fish? Sure you are going to catch and release it, but we all know there is some degree of mortality associated with that. SOOOOO.... ethically, might it be something to avoid?

If that be the case, which I don't believe to be so, then what about fishing in C&R streams. Is that not the same thing? For the record I practice almost exclusive C&R.

[matt04]

If that be the case, which I don't believe to be so, then what about fishing in C&R streams. Is that not the same thing? For the record I practice almost exclusive C&R.

makes sense to me

[whitetail Junkie]

[QUOTE=Guitarplayingfish;643531]Went out to river X on friday. QUOTE]

Highwood River!!!!

[Guitarplayingfish]

[QUOTE=Guitarplayingfish;643531]Went out to river X on friday. QUOTE]

Highwood River!!!!

Negative. Wasn't highwood. It Wasnt any other river you could guess either ;) hehe. A 15lb bull is a fish of a lifetime man, no ones getting the river name.

[whitetail Junkie]

[QUOTE=whitetail Junkie;644498]

Negative. Wasn't highwood. It Wasnt any other river you could guess either ;) hehe. A 15lb bull is a fish of a lifetime man, no ones getting the river name.

Oh Man ,I thought for sure that It was the Highwood,I grew up in Okotoks,and have Caught all my 10 plus pound bulls in the Highwood.Nice clear water,deep holes,little waterfalls,perfect Habitat.However I've caught all my bulls on small deep diver Rapalas.This one hole I go to in the river is about 3o feet deep.you can see right to the bottom when its clear,and at any giventime see up to 40 fish.Very special area,and hard for people to find:sHa_shakeshout:

[ishootbambi]

i dont think its any secret that the castle is full of bulls well over 20. extreme fishing pressure has made them really tough to fool, but to see them is fairly common.....especially when they lay out in the gravel bars in september.

[matt04]

definetley!!!

[1/2 oz Bucktail]

DO NOT lift the zero catch limit. Anyone who has done some research or fished for bulls alot will know some of the reasons why. If a catch and possession limit are re-introduced, I could see a potential population collapse occurring within 5 years or less in some rivers with very strong, stable populations. I know the Grande Cache area rivers would probably be wiped clean in about 3 years and we probably have some of the highest populations of bull trout in Alberta.

1. Bulls typically reach sexual maturity after about 5 or more years
2. Bulls usually inhabit colder less productive watersheds (colder water = slower growth rates)
3. Bulls usually spawn only every other year (usually half or less than half of the mature population are spawning each year)
4. At various points within the summer migration large numbers of very large mature adults can be found at very specific staging points: waterfalls, confluences, etc. It wouldn't be hard for a group of four friends to "legally" wipe out a large percentage of the spawing run for that river within a week. Especially if the very large individuals are kept.

I don't know, I could be wrong, but I just think that it would be very easy to wipeout bull trout populations again. Also I still do not think we are anywhere near historic population levels (Bullies are still absent from NSR towards Edmonton and many other historic ranges).

As for the big fish caught, congrats on the trophy, huge bulls are amazing fish however I would seriously doubt the weight that you estimated.
I have caught a few in the 36" range and none of them would have come close to 15 lbs. Usually a 30" fish I would estimate at about 8 lbs and a 36" at about 10 lbs.

Once again, nice work on the monster.

[Braun]

there is nothing wrong with targetting bulls. like some on here have said, proper handling will result in nearly a 0% mortality. Beside its no different than targetting sturgeon. Sturgeon are in a much worse situation than bulls.

[DarkAisling]

In the course of fishing you are going to catch fish you can't take, some of them like the Bull are endangered. Happens all the time and is basically unavoidable. But what about specifically targetting and trying to catch that particular fish? Sure you are going to catch and release it, but we all know there is some degree of mortality associated with that. SOOOOO.... ethically, might it be something to avoid?

I agree with you in theory. But, I think it depends on the species, its population in the waterbody, and the skill of the angler.

Would I target Bulls? Yes. I feel the population can handle the occasional loss. My fish handling skills are good enough that I wouldn't be much of a risk to them. I don't normally take photos with/of my fish. I don't even typically measure or weigh them. My release time is very quick: get 'em close to me and get 'em off the hook and back in the water. If I'm in the water they don't even normally come out of the water.

I might target SSR sturgeon. Might. I'm not 100% decided. I would have to be fishing with an experienced sturgeon hunter. There is no way I would fish for them otherwise. I wouldn't target NSR sturgeon (nothing against those how do, just my personal preference).

[Guitarplayingfish]

DO NOT lift the zero catch limit. Anyone who has done some research or fished for bulls alot will know some of the reasons why. If a catch and possession limit are re-introduced, I could see a potential population collapse occurring within 5 years or less in some rivers with very strong, stable populations. I know the Grande Cache area rivers would probably be wiped clean in about 3 years and we probably have some of the highest populations of bull trout in Alberta.

1. Bulls typically reach sexual maturity after about 5 or more years
2. Bulls usually inhabit colder less productive watersheds (colder water = slower growth rates)
3. Bulls usually spawn only every other year (usually half or less than half of the mature population are spawning each year)
4. At various points within the summer migration large numbers of very large mature adults can be found at very specific staging points: waterfalls, confluences, etc. It wouldn't be hard for a group of four friends to "legally" wipe out a large percentage of the spawing run for that river within a week. Especially if the very large individuals are kept.

I don't know, I could be wrong, but I just think that it would be very easy to wipeout bull trout populations again. Also I still do not think we are anywhere near historic population levels (Bullies are still absent from NSR towards Edmonton and many other historic ranges).

As for the big fish caught, congrats on the trophy, huge bulls are amazing fish however I would seriously doubt the weight that you estimated.
I have caught a few in the 36" range and none of them would have come close to 15 lbs. Usually a 30" fish I would estimate at about 8 lbs and a 36" at about 10 lbs.

Once again, nice work on the monster.


--- It was a cool 13-15lb. I guarantee it, and I have the picture to prove it. There were 4 of us, and we all fish almost everyday... we have all handled 10+ fish, and we are fairly close when it comes to guessing weight. It was a pig, and thats all there is too it. I doubt I will ever see another one like that. As for bulls over 20 --- Isn't the alberta record 17lb?

I Definately agree with you though, keep Bulls protected. They are tons of fun to catch, and if everyone was allowed to keep 1, there would be no bulls left. Let them keep growing, so a different fisherman can catch him in the future =)

[1/2 oz Bucktail]

Cool, I can always be wrong. I am pretty used to long lean fish but yeah, I never saw the pic.

Also i never mad any mention about a 20 lb fish, I would think those would really only exist within lakes and reservoirs.

Anyways, I love hearing about the big Bulls.

[birchy]

I think he meant over 20, as in over 20 inches long..

[hunter49]

DO NOT lift the zero catch limit. Anyone who has done some research or fished for bulls alot will know some of the reasons why. If a catch and possession limit are re-introduced, I could see a potential population collapse occurring within 5 years or less in some rivers with very strong, stable populations. I know the Grande Cache area rivers would probably be wiped clean in about 3 years and we probably have some of the highest populations of bull trout in Alberta.

1. Bulls typically reach sexual maturity after about 5 or more years
2. Bulls usually inhabit colder less productive watersheds (colder water = slower growth rates)
3. Bulls usually spawn only every other year (usually half or less than half of the mature population are spawning each year)
4. At various points within the summer migration large numbers of very large mature adults can be found at very specific staging points: waterfalls, confluences, etc. It wouldn't be hard for a group of four friends to "legally" wipe out a large percentage of the spawing run for that river within a week. Especially if the very large individuals are kept.

I don't know, I could be wrong, but I just think that it would be very easy to wipeout bull trout populations again. Also I still do not think we are anywhere near historic population levels (Bullies are still absent from NSR towards Edmonton and many other historic ranges).

As for the big fish caught, congrats on the trophy, huge bulls are amazing fish however I would seriously doubt the weight that you estimated.
I have caught a few in the 36" range and none of them would have come close to 15 lbs. Usually a 30" fish I would estimate at about 8 lbs and a 36" at about 10 lbs.

Once again, nice work on the monster.

No offense, but a 36" bull weighing in at only 10 lbs would be pretty darn skinny and not the average. Most 3 foot pike weigh more than 10 and I'd say most bulls are built up more than a pike. I see you are up north and as mentioned the bulls could be skinnier, but for a bull to grow 6 inches and only 2 lbs seems crazy.

Also, let us see the pics of that bull trout "guitarplayingfish". I'm sure everyone would love to see it!

[matt04]

DO NOT lift the zero catch limit. Anyone who has done some research or fished for bulls alot will know some of the reasons why. If a catch and possession limit are re-introduced, I could see a potential population collapse occurring within 5 years or less in some rivers with very strong, stable populations. I know the Grande Cache area rivers would probably be wiped clean in about 3 years and we probably have some of the highest populations of bull trout in Alberta.

1. Bulls typically reach sexual maturity after about 5 or more years
2. Bulls usually inhabit colder less productive watersheds (colder water = slower growth rates)
3. Bulls usually spawn only every other year (usually half or less than half of the mature population are spawning each year)
4. At various points within the summer migration large numbers of very large mature adults can be found at very specific staging points: waterfalls, confluences, etc. It wouldn't be hard for a group of four friends to "legally" wipe out a large percentage of the spawing run for that river within a week. Especially if the very large individuals are kept.

I don't know, I could be wrong, but I just think that it would be very easy to wipeout bull trout populations again. Also I still do not think we are anywhere near historic population levels (Bullies are still absent from NSR towards Edmonton and many other historic ranges).

As for the big fish caught, congrats on the trophy, huge bulls are amazing fish however I would seriously doubt the weight that you estimated.
I have caught a few in the 36" range and none of them would have come close to 15 lbs. Usually a 30" fish I would estimate at about 8 lbs and a 36" at about 10 lbs.

Once again, nice work on the monster.

Great info 1/2oz Bucktail! The most important thing is that our native fish populations are kept safe.

[Guitarplayingfish]

Hopefully this works. Ive never put a picture up on here before. Behold, the trophy Bull.

[whitetail Junkie]

Hopefully this works. Ive never put a picture up on here before. Behold, the trophy Bull.

Great Fish\picture,thanx 4 Sharing!!!

[1/2 oz Bucktail]

That fish is a fat PIG. Nicely done..

[fishstix]

I don't think that there is anything wrong with specifically targeting bulls. With proper handling there should be a zero mortality rate.
And besides every time go fishing in the pass and hook into a nice cutty there is allways a big bull right behind it attacking the cutty.
There are lots of bulls out there.

How about a no keep limit an all fish for a few years to really boost the populations?
You can tell when a river is catch and release, the fish are more plentiful.

fs!!

[buckslayer1]

Hopefully this works. Ive never put a picture up on here before. Behold, the trophy Bull.Nice fish. I dont want to be the one to tell you but that is not 15lbs.I have caught and weighed them on a digitil scale and yours is not that big.

[Sundancefisher]

Nice fish. I dont want to be the one to tell you but that is not 15lbs.I have caught and weighed them on a digitil scale and yours is not that big.

I have weighed hundreds of bulls that size and bigger. I would say yours is closer to 7-8 lbs. Still not belittling the catch. 99.5% of anglers would love to have one on that size. There are very few bulls left in Alberta that probably top 10 lbs south of the Athabasca system.

[Guitarplayingfish]

Nice fish. I dont want to be the one to tell you but that is not 15lbs.I have caught and weighed them on a digitil scale and yours is not that big.

1. This is not my fish, it is my buddys. He caught it right beside me.
2. Its not that big? Whats wrong with you dude?
3. Get some new eyes.

[dennisb]

Nice fish, 6lbs...maybe

[TUFFBUFF]

That's a hellva fish anywhere in Ab. He may not be 15 but I'm guessing 10-11, most bigger bullies are wide and solid.

I'm 100% leaving the bull trout the way they are, it's not their fault you fellas down south feed them our stocked cuts, brooks and the odd brown.

Someday some of the river systems or K lake may be able to handle some sort of draw tag with a slot limit like 15-18" to let the little ones grow up and protect the big ones.

Again - wicked fish !!!

[DuckBrat]

Nice 8 pound Bull probably run 26-29". Good job.

Just a thought I wouldn't get caught trying to Weigh a Bull trout you may get charged. Take a quick pick and measurement and let her go before you get busted and before the fish is hurt. Nothing like watching some clown hang a fish from its gill on a scale and then attempting to release it (Seen that one too many times at Wabamun). If you absolutely must weigh it for the hero shot then hang it in a soft mesh cradle like the biologists use when collecting data.
Just a thought folks.

Nice fish though.

[Guitarplayingfish]

I never bring scales or tape measures, I always get the fish back in the water as soon as possible. Im sure it was over 10lb... 3 people who held it said it was over 10, and we fish all the time. Anyway, Regardless what it was, it was a beauty. A fish like that doesnt come around too often. Hopefully he can grow and someone else can catch him or he can live a peaceful life in the future=)

[tbone616]

The safest way i have found to weigh a fish is to use a net, no harm to the fish at all. Just hook your scale into the handle eyelit, get the weight of the empty net, weigh it with a fish in it and subtract the difference and there is your weight. That is as long as the fish will actually fit in the net which unfortunatly is hardly ever been a problem for me :sign0161:

[ishootbambi]

I think he meant over 20, as in over 20 inches long..

no, he meant over 20 pounds......the castle river is loaded with them. if you could kill one and weigh it the AB record would topple.

[buckslayer1]

1. This is not my fish, it is my buddys. He caught it right beside me.
2. Its not that big? Whats wrong with you dude?
3. Get some new eyes.

I dont care who caught it.It is NOT anywhere nere what you say due to you and your bud needing to go to the gym to feel what a 15lbs weight feels like.Like I said nice fish. I HAVE caught them that big and bigger and Yours or whom evers fish thiat is is not that big. Thanks for you negitive comments.Read message board rules......

[Guitarplayingfish]

I dont care who caught it.It is NOT anywhere nere what you say due to you and your bud needing to go to the gym to feel what a 15lbs weight feels like.Like I said nice fish. I HAVE caught them that big and bigger and Yours or whom evers fish thiat is is not that big. Thanks for you negitive comments.Read message board rules......

Shut up, and don't reply to my posts anymore. The fish was over 10, and that much i am sure of. Regardless, I don't want to hear anymore from you. Thank YOU for the negative comments. Also, learn to spell. *****.

[buckslayer1]

Shut up, and don't reply to my posts anymore. The fish was over 10, and that much i am sure of. Regardless, I don't want to hear anymore from you. Thank YOU for the negative comments. Also, learn to spell. *****.
You are correct I cant spell but I can tell you again you dont know what a 10+ lbs bull trout looks like.So go out and catch another 8 lbs fish and say it is 20 lbs next time.:fighting0074:

[Guitarplayingfish]

You are correct I cant spell but I can tell you again you dont know what a 10+ lbs bull trout looks like.So go out and catch another 8 lbs fish and say it is 20 lbs next time.:fighting0074:

Did I not tell you to stop replying to my posts?

[deltravers]

Nice work, well done!

[buckslayer1]

Did I not tell you to stop replying to my posts? Open your ears and shut your fking mouth dude.You want my address to make me? You dont know jack and you come on here and make yourself look extra smart.Grow up.:fighting0030:

[Guitarplayingfish]

You want my address to make me? You dont know jack and you come on here and make yourself look extra smart.Grow up.:fighting0030:

You know, Im a fisherman not a fighter. Not only that, but your a waste of time. Don't talk to me anymore.

[BrownBear416]

Guitarplayingfish-Great fish and thx for sharing the pic.You gotta have thick skin if you are going to post fish pics online and guess at weights as not everyone is going to agree with you..

buckslayer1-You have a right to your opinion as much as anyone but there is lots of ways you could have done it without being so rude.

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