To all of you who keep fish

[Robmcleod82]

So I have been doing lots of thinking on this subject lately, and I am sure I will get flamed for it. I can remember a time not so long ago when I was a boy we used to go out and be able to catch our limit just about anywhere in a couple hours (we very rarely kept any fish, the odd walleye and perch). Me and dad would go out and catch numerous pike walleye, perch and trout. I had the time of my life doing it and will be thankful to my father forever for providing me with the gift of the love of fishing.
Alberta's population was substantially smaller in those days. By the time I was around 12 or 13 I had been noticing that many of our good fishing spots were no longer good, Dad figured mostly due to winterkill.

Then at age 14 I noticed something and it made me furious. We were at a lake that we had been having good luck in for a couple years when I saw a family of "New Canadians" fishing. The part that made me angry was that every fish they caught no matter how big or small went into the cooler.
The next time we went to that lake there were 2 families of new canadians, and again the same thing. Every time after that we would see more and more of these people until they were 150 yards from one end of the group to the other. And guess what, they were all keeping everything.
Well within 3 years of seeing that first family you would be lucky to catch 3 or 4 fish in a day. I think many of these people dont know any better because they grew up near the ocean and there were always plenty of fish. I am not saying that "New Canadians" are the only problem.
Most of us all enjoy a good fish fry. And most people think "I only keep a few a year". But I see this mentality as flawed.
I found a survey that said there were 211,000 licensed anglers in alberta in 2005. Now that doesnt count kids and seniors and status natives. I would peg the total number closer to 300,000. If everybody who fishes kept just 2 fish a year that is 600,000.
I dont believe that majority of people keep many fish but it doesnt take that many people to severely deplete our fisheries.
I urge all of you to really think about the next time you keep a fish. Do you really need it? Don't you want your kids and grandchildren to have the same luxury and pleasure that fishing brings?

[John8318]

53 million Walleye were stocked in Lac labiche in 2009, 600,000 fish out of the province every year is not that bad. However, I do understand where you are coming from with some of the smaller lakes.

[Robmcleod82]

I dont know how many places you have fished(im not trying to be rude) where they have put a zero limit in place but it works well to improve the fishery. I have never fished lac labiche.

[Hooker]

I too know where you are coming from but I do have some questions. You say you saw a family of 'New Canadians' taking and keeping fish of every size. Did you get a license number or pass on a description of these people or call in a complaint on your cell phone (assuming you had one and had reception)? If not you have become part of the problem. Also, the number of fishing licenses issued does not reflect the number of fish that have been harvested. I know people who purchase a fishing license every year and never catch a fish. I know people who purchase a fishing license with every intention of going fishing every weekend but never get out. To base your estimate of fish harvested on the number of licenses issued can be misleading. Fish and Wildlife would have more accurate estimates. There is an old addage that is quite true. Ninety percent of all fish caught are caught by ten percent of the fishermen. My brother lives in Saskatoon and fishes a lake north of Prince Albert. Over the years this lake has seen a decline in fish stock. This lake is also surrounded by private cabins. The lake is most heavily fished by the people who live around it and it appears they are the cause of their own misery as I suspect has been the result of the decline of fish stocks in your own favorite lake. That's not to say there aren't outsiders who come and and violate every rule in the book. I don't doubt that strangers would be reported for infractions but would we turn our neighbours in if you saw them committing an infraction? Same difference.

[Robmcleod82]

This was before having a cell phone was common. I do call now. I do partially agree with what you said about the decline in my favorite lake, but it was many lakes. I now choose to only practice catch and release for that very reason.

[mooseknuckle]

Yes this will alwaYs be a touchy subject on this forum I think? But so many variables to factor in. I would like to think that people that work with f&w know alot more than me and therefore I for just do what the book tells me as far as limits and such and will gladly admit that I ve kept an eAten 10-15 fish so far this summer. But does that make me worse than the family who really enjoys fish but doesn't enjoy fishing and purchases say?.... 20 fish a year from Safeway? I'm a bit on the fence myself, I really enjoy the rights given to me as a license holder but I suppose I wouldn't yell and scream if some of the lakes I fish were to all of a sudden have a zero keep system in place.

[great white whaler]

Not a big eater of fresh water fish,mostly catch and release,but when i go to the rockies i carry the frying pan,them little creek brookies to me r the best eating fresh water fish ,i try to do it twice a year,i eat fish 6 days a week from the super market its cheaper,the rockies r 2 1/2 hours away from me.:bad_boys_20:

[fishnut9]

new canadian really. You know i come from an immigrant family. Im an immigrant myself and i pinch my barbs and return undersized fish. How do you know they are new canadians. FOr all you know they could have come to canada 10 years ago and just refused to learn english. You know how many "canadians" i see breaking the rules. My father in law who is born in canada is always trying to get me to do illegal things. Not pinching my barbs, getting me to pretend to be him and sharing a salmon tag. Yeah its us new immigrants we are all bad. Usually people like you are too busy looking at the "new canadians" to see the scumbag culling fish behind you. man im mad! I really hate this crap. THATS 3 THREADS NOW ATTACKING IMMIGRANTS. Particularly asians.

[Geezle]

I like fish :bad_boys_20:




(wow this thread went sideways fast :scared:)

[DarkAisling]

So jimboy sent me this messages [snip]

Jimboy sent you a private message and you have placed the contents of said message on a public forum?

Am I understanding this correctly?

I wouldn't worry about the ethics of others if I were you . . . I think I'd focus on getting your own straightened out.

[Krisrf]

I began fishing in the mid 80s and fishing was pretty good. Limits, when applicable were significantly higher and at that time there were often no size restrictions. Pike were 5 to 10 fish per person depending on lake with no size. Walleye were 3 to 5 with no size limit. I don't ever recall a perch limit less than 15 to 30. With that said, by the early to mid ninetys the fishing had slowed. A bit later the limits were looked at, barbless implemented, and sizes were added. Now since the early 2000s fishing has improved from where it go in the early and mid ninetys. I see some lakes with stunted growth and very skinny fish that perhaps the harvest should be increased. I think one of the bigger contributing factor to the returning fisheries is the severe reduction of commercial fishing in some of our lakes. In most lakes I don't believe taking home a fish or two, even if every legal angler that fishes that lake, within the size limits, would significantly harm the lake. Bring back heavier commercial fishing, even for whites (which is a food source for our beloved pike and walleye) and you'll see a steep decline again in fishing.

As for this year, I had some of my best days I've ever had on the water in terms of numbers and sizes, and some slower days. Those slower days were much like those 90s on a regular basis. However, I believe the screwed up seasons had more to do with the off days this year than anything.

Now, given the 'new canadians' and 'asian' thing, I've seen a lot of others taking more than they ought to and call if undersized or too many. Part of the issue here is that there is simply not enough f n w around.

Just another rant... Haha

Kris

Btw - I'd suggest that the number of anglers fishing is at least double those that are licensed based on the number of kids and seniors.

[ericlin0122]

this thread should be locked...
yes! oh yes! blame on new canadian(i.e. asian).

[Braun]

i forsee this thread getting closed quickly due to escalation. havent read all your posts cause of lack of time but i will but in regards to the original message. i see your point but i think you are overlooking alot as well. your not counting the millions of fish that are bread every year. alot more than 600,000 fish are probably harvested every year as well but combined with efforts of the fish stocking and restrictions on waterways during spawning season, most of the fisheries in alberta are stable. i dont think it is fair or right to presure other anglers who follow the rules into feeling guilt for keeping fish every once in a while. why crusify us for the actions of those who do not follow the rules. i think the solution for the frustration surrounding this issue is hiring more CO officers handing out more tickets as opposed to those who follow the rules keeping less.

[boot]

Jimboy sent you a private message and you have placed the contents of said message on a public forum?

Am I understanding this correctly?

I wouldn't worry about the ethics of others if I were you . . . I think I'd focus on getting your own straightened out.

Why would you reprimand fishnut9 for saying this? It's not like he violated some sacred intimate trust between himself and Jimboy. All he did was point out how hateful and ignorant some people can be. What really pains me here is not Jimboy (because there's always going to be a handful of idiots), but the fact that someone would actually think that Jimboy is the victim here. Just think about it for a minute or two...

[Albertadiver]

Why would you reprimand fishnut9 for saying this?

Because it's a forum rule not to post PM's. If Fishnut was smart, he'd report the PM to the mods and it'd be dealt with appropriately.


I am largely catch and release, but when I have an opportunity to keep some perch or the odd nice panfry trout I will do so, and continue to do so.

I caught some really nice ones at 4 different backcountry lakes in the rockies about 3 weeks ago, all of which were catch and release since the limit was zero. If there was a limit of 1, I would have kept 1.

Just my thoughts.

[boot]

Anyhow, to get back on topic, I'd like to see more C&R lakes/rivers. There are a lot of people who enjoy C&R and having a few more places to go would be a good thing.

[DarkAisling]

Because it's a forum rule not to post PM's. If Fishnut was smart, he'd report the PM to the mods and it'd be dealt with appropriately.

But beyond that, it is just really poor manners. Tacky, tacky, tacky.

[boot]

Because it's a forum rule not to post PM's. If Fishnut was smart, he'd report the PM to the mods and it'd be dealt with appropriately.


Hmm, I didn't know this. Could you show me where this rule is?

[Private Ear]

I think one of the bigger contributing factor to the returning fisheries is the severe reduction of commercial fishing in some of our lakes.

You may have something here. It would be good to have some actual numbers from SRD.

[aulrich]

Depending on the fishery C&R will not nessesaraly raise the quality of the fishery, Though I guess it would depend on how you defined quality. Low fertility systems like streams on the eastern slope it could work. But C&R would not have Spray produce a 30 lb lake trout ever,unless they fixed the forage fish issue, same could be said for PCR and walleye if it was not for the mercury and not spawning thing I would say in a heart beat that it needs some fish killed to make room to grow them bigger.

Limit your catch, and kill the right size class for sure but match the rules to the water.

[boot]

But beyond that, it is just really poor manners. Tacky, tacky, tacky.

This is where I guess we'll agree to disagree.

If someone were to send you unsolicited and hateful messages (pm, email, phone or whatever) and you brought it up on a forum, the first thing I would feel is empathy for you. I would hope that others would do the same. I personally would not think it tacky of you.

After all, didn't you recently post about your experience at the Fishin Hole and how the salesperson suggested you were shopping for the men and not for yourself? Wasn't that a private conversation? Anyhow, the main difference with your experience is that it wasn't hateful. Imagine how you would have felt if the salesperson had made those remarks with a hateful tone?

[boot]

Depending on the fishery C&R will not nessesaraly raise the quality of the fishery, Though I guess it would depend on how you defined quality. Low fertility systems like streams on the eastern slope it could work. But C&R would not have Spray produce a 30 lb lake trout ever,unless they fixed the forage fish issue, same could be said for PCR and walleye if it was not for the mercury and not spawning thing I would say in a heart beat that it needs some fish killed to make room to grow them bigger.

Limit your catch, and kill the right size class for sure but match the rules to the water.

Good point. Maybe some alternating years of C&R would help? Anyhow, I was thinking more along the lines of the Muir Lake project. A few more fisheries scattered around Alberta with C&R regs would be nice.

[Albertadiver]

Hmm, I didn't know this. Could you show me where this rule is?

There's a sticky on forum rules, and I can't seem to locate it at present. I'll keep digging and if I find it I'll let you know.

http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=10693

There's the above link, but there's another one somewhere too....

[boot]

There's a sticky on forum rules, and I can't seem to locate it at present. I'll keep digging and if I find it I'll let you know.

http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=10693

There's the above link, but there's another one somewhere too....

Yes, I read that one, but there's no PM rule there. Please post any links to additional rules that we need to be aware of. Maybe the admins can sticky those as well.

[DarkAisling]

fter all, didn't you recently post about your experience at the Fishin Hole and how the salesperson suggested you were shopping for the men and not for yourself? Wasn't that a private conversation? Anyhow, the main difference with your experience is that it wasn't hateful. Imagine how you would have felt if the salesperson had made those remarks with a hateful tone?

Go into the Fishin' Hole and identify the salesman I was talking about. Can you do it? Nope.

Apples to oranges. Nice try though. You'll have to try a lot harder than that.

[nicemustang]

Boot and Albertadiver, why don't you use the PM function to deal with this.

[Albertadiver]

Boot and Albertadiver, why don't you use the PM function to deal with this.

Because there would be benefit to other forum members with respect to clarification of the forum rules.

I still can't seem to find the rule where it says not to post PM's, but if someone knows where it is, or if I'm wrong, would appreciate the update / correction.

[boot]

Go into the Fishin' Hole and identify the salesman I was talking about. Can you do it? Nope.

Apples to oranges. Nice try though. You'll have to try a lot harder than that.

It is apples to oranges, but not due to identification. It's apples to oranges, because Jimboy spews hate and the salesperson does not.

And are you actually trying to say that identifying a small locally run store with limited staff is your way of shielding the salespersons privacy? That's absurd (and I now realize my argument is pointless with you). That's more private than some anonymous handle on the Internet like Jimboy? Outside of the people that know Jimboy, 100% of the people on this forum would have an easier time finding/identifying the salesperson over Jimboy.