Pointing dogs on wild bird regs Alberta??
 

I have not been able to find the regs on when a guy can run pointing dogs on wild birds in Alberta ?? I looked in the hunting regs and the wild life act and can't seem to find it. I do know in Sask it is after July 15th.

Thanks, Dog_River

You mean outside of hunting season, just for training or fun? Good question. I'm not sure there is any rule. Maybe I haven't read carefully enough.

yes, outside of hunting season. I know the regs in SK and BC and am looking for AB. I don't want to go to jail ! :)

I have never seen an actual government rule. Though I have seen DU sites that are on-leash may 15-july 15 I remember correctly(Frank lake I believe has that restriction.

Though it is counter productive to disturb the birds while the chicks can't fly strongly , personally I don't purposely put mine on birds until end of july at least if there was a nesting failure it could be august before the chicks can fly.

I couldn't locate an actual regulation, but I am doing my best to keep my dog away from wild birds while they are raising their young.

Other than a small area in the south east corner of the province to protect the Sage grouse, there is nothing stopping you from running wild birds in Alberta.
I stay off them May through to the first week of August.

cohod

That good new's. I have got this pup going really good but want t spend some time on the prairies before opening season.

Pay particular attention to the definition of "hunting"
 

1(1)(o) “hunt” means, subject to subsection (6), with reference to a subject animal,
(i) shoot at, harass or worry,
(ii) chase, pursue, follow after or on the trail of, search for, flush, stalk or lie in wait for,
(iii) capture or wilfully injure or kill,
(iv) attempt to capture, injure or kill, or
(v) assist another person to hunt in a manner specified in subclause (i), (ii), (iii) or (iv) while that other person is so hunting;


(6) Where
(a) a person has the intent to hunt, and believes or appears to believe that the person is hunting,
(b) what the person is purporting to hunt is actually a representation of a wildlife animal that has been set out by a wildlife officer or wildlife guardian, and
(c) having regard to the time when, the location where and any other relevant circumstances under which the activity takes place, the activity would, if that representation were a real wildlife animal of the kind represented, constitute an act of hunting that would be an offence against a hunting provision of this Act,
then the person is deemed for the purposes of this Act to be hunting such a wildlife animal and is guilty of an offence against that provision.

You forgot to include this portion of the regulations. :)



"(2) A person shall not be regarded as having hunted a subject animal
(a) for the purposes of subsection (1)(o)(ii), if
(i) the person was not carrying a weapon, and
(ii) the purpose of the person’s activity was restricted to watching, photographing, drawing or painting a picture of the animal,"


Be sure to bring a camera or a crayon.

Are you saying you can only run dogs on wild birds during hunting season in Alberta ?

that is my take on it
 

I beleive Ontario, Manitoba and Saskatchewan have legislation to prevent dog handlers from seeking birds for several months during the summer. I have also been told this became necessary in some areas because US pro trainers were coming to Canadian provinces in summer with truck loads of client dogs because it is much cooler temperatures to train their dogs in.

Although Alberta has not had to legislate "no dogs" during breeding season because many dog owners voluntarily refrain from disturbing habitat during that time I believe a CO could and would charge a dog owner for intentionally training on wild birds. We all unintentionally flush the odd hun during planting of chukars and trapped birds (I did it last week while using remote launching training dummies) but to intentionally seek out wild birds to train a young dog I believe fallls under the definition of hunting and in summer that would be during the closed season. Call your local CO and see how they interpret it for that is what really matters not what we say.

I agree with you and I would never run my dogs and put the birds at risk. i think Sask date of July 15th is a safe date IMO. I guess a guy has to take the year into account as well. I know I have kept my dog off of birds here at home in BC. The BC regs state aug 15th

Interesting thread. My first thought was that you would be "harassing" game birds and quite possibly migratory birds.
Then of course there's that whole "big game hunting with dogs is illegal" regulation. I only bring that up because bird and and big game have a huge overlap. I rarely hunt with a dog, so never really thought about it.
Interesting question Dog.

dog traing Alberta
 

This subject has been discussed before and is available under the thread Pointing Dog Trainer recommendation? in 2013.

The attachment I think covers your questions........Puphood


for those that don't have Adobe reader...

FACT SHEET-DOG TRAINING REGULATIONS
Items in bold type represent new regulations.
DOG TRAINING
1. Individuals who, for gain or reward, train dogs to hunt or rt;trieve game birds (commercial dog
trainers) are required to annually obtain a commercial dog training permit. Applications for a
commercial dog training permit are available at any Fish and Wildlife Service office.
2. Commercial dog training is prohibited at all times of the year within the area of Alberta
encompassed by Townships 1-8, Ranges 1-11, W4M (sage grouse range).
3. An individual training his/her own dog to hunt or retrieve game birds does not require a dog training
permit.
4. An individual dog trainer (non-commercial dog trainer) training his/her own dog is prohibited from
training his/her dog on all public land within the area of Alberta encompassed by Townships 1-8,
Ranges 1-11, W4M during the period of April1 through July 31 each year.
DOG FIELD TRIALS
I. A person shall not, in a prescribed area, hold field trials for dogs for the purpose of hunting wildlife or
retrieving game birds without a permit authorizing him to do so.
• The 'prescribed area' identified in #1 refers to all of Alberta except privately owned land, land under the
control of the Department of National Defence (Canada), public land held under a grazing lease issued
under the Public Lands Act, and, land in a Metis settlement or on an Indian reserve.
• A person who wishes to operate a dog test or trial on privately owned land, land under the control of the
Department ofNat!ob.iu Defence (Canada), public land held under a grazing lease issued under the Public
Lands Act, or, land in a M~tis settlement or on an Indian reserve, may do so without a dog trialing permit.
2. The Minister may issue a dog trialing permit to a person who wishes to operate a dog test or trial
sanctioned by an organized group of persons involved in dog training or trialing.
3. Field trials for dogs are prohibited at all times of the year on all public land within the areas of
Alberta encompassed by Townships 1-8, Ranges 1-11, W4M.
4. As a matter of policy, persons wishing to hold a 'shoot -to-kill' field trial, during which birds are shot, have
three options:
• Conduct the field trial on a licenced game bird shooting ground,
• Conduct the trial using animals that are neither classed as wildlife nor controlled-animals under regulations
(chukar partridge, bobwhite quail, pigeons), or
• Conduct the field trial during the open hunting season for the species being shot, with shooters confined by
hunting regulations pertaining to licences and bag limits.
OTHER RELATED REGULATIONS
1. Individuals who, without killing birds, train a dog to locate live, wild upland game birds as a part of
dog training are exempt from the strict definition of 'hunting.'
2. Organizations who retain legally harvested game birds for dog 'training events (field trials) and
. individuals who use thes.~ legally harvested game .birds for dog training purposes are exempt from
the regulations prohibiting wastage of the edible portion of game birds.

cohod


Attached Files
File Type: pdf img-719132847.pdf (34.6 KB, 14 views)

Not that I go out running my dogs on wild birds out of season but I would think that predators put way more pressure on wild birds then a guy running his pointer out of season.
just saying

Another great point.

It is all about frequency
 

Predators tend to have a range of 5 or so square miles while dog trainers tend to go back to the same place or several places they have permision or public land all the time.

During nesting season hens have very little scent as nature has provided them with the ability to turn the scent off to make finding the nest harder for predators. No scent also makes them a poor choice for dog training. Hens will return to a nest after being disturbed and flushed.
They will abandon a nest if this occurs frequently so we are cutting off our nose to spite our face training during nesting season. NO legislation should have to exist as dog owners by their very nature own dogs to ensure they dont lose a wounded bird so why any one would risk a hen abandoning a nest full of eggs or young for preseason training is beyond comprehension. Chukars pigeons and quail are cheap and readily available for training rather than additional pressure on wild birds.

Great counterpoint WW. Very informative thread.

It looks to me like we are good to go Aug 1.

Dog_River

When I trained we began on the 15th of July.

I would contact one of the directors of your local pointing dog club

running dog
 

I have pics of a hatched nest of 17 Hun eggs from my back yard and they hatched June 19th. 2016 if you put 6 weeks on those chicks you have roughly Aug. 1 and those young birds will fly. I usually plan on starting to run on wild birds about Aug 1st. to the 10th. depending on what I find the first couple times out on Sharpetail and they are usually a little older Huns.
Most chicks are good in my opinion to be run on from after the first week of Aug.
Also I don't continue to run in one area for any continued length of time and the area I use is very large and the continual contacts with the same coveys is not common.
Unlike a flusher or retriever which the bulk of the training is focused on the retrieve the pointer groups concern is to find birds and in my case I have the privileged of running on wild birds which are the ultimate training bird......

There is some really good sensible input here guy's and I appreciate it. Whatever the regs say for an area, the responsibility falls on the guy running his dogs to use common sense.

Dog_River

They dont all survive so why add any pressure
 

Best I can offer is a 2015 hen pheasant nest that had 14 eggs in our yard. Only 9 hatched and 2 weeks after the hatch we could only find 5 with the hen (natural predation suspected or even hypothermia after a steady rain kills many chicks before they can regulate their own body temperature).
They are also offered somewhat of protection with the hen offering to shelter them from danger and rain with her own body. Separating the hen from chicks (as in flushing them) results in the chicks and the hen calling to reunite which can draw more attention from predators in the area.

We saw the two remaining surviving chicks early in August and while flying to get off the ground they were not strong enough for long flights (20 yards max). Saw the hen in September but no chicks appear to have survived.