Quote:
Originally Posted by boot
The give and take is happening and both parties are trying to find some common ground. Like it or not, natives have special rights according to Canadian law. It's funny how you whine about how I come off sounding as if I'm some sort of expert and then you come up with paragraph after paragraph and finally this... "give and take"? Best interests of people and environment?
Natives in our country are a broken people. There's only 1 reason for their brokenness (please do not tell me it's genetic!!). You talk about natives as if they're priveleged... priveleged?!? WTF?!?
Braun, I've never called you a racist (because I don't think you are one), but you don't have the compassion nor the clarity of thought to truly understand the problems. Then again, maybe we all just need thicker skin... that'll solve everything.
Looks like this thread is never going to die.
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I think the give and take statement part went over your head a little. I mean give and take in terms of CHANGING some of the current laws. No I was not coming off as an expert, unlike your posts. Following almost every statement I made in my post I made sure to clearly state that this was in my opinion. which does 2 things. legally This forum, anyone on this forum including myself is protected from misinterpretation and any legal consequences resulting from the misinterpretation of my statement. 2. is to imply that it is not of an expert, scientific, or any other opinion and by no means a statement of fact.... just an individual opinion. Furthermore, the examples I gave are personal accounts with people around me and in no way an accusation, generalization, or a stereotype of the native race.
However, nice try trying to call me out and turn me into a "bad guy". Unfortunately the part of me that loves debating is engaging in this pointless discussion with you although I know you are only going to listen to things that prove you right instead of considering the arguments I present. This is also apparent by you inaccurately throwing comments I made to you back at me (thicker skin, etc.).
You say natives in the country are broken. Yet we provide tax breaks, free education and *post secondary education*. Free counselling services to help them find the right track. Free lawyer services to help them when they so need it. Subsidized housing. Land to build houses. The list can go on.
For decades we as tax payers have been providing the means for native peoples to help themselves (can lead a horse to water but you cant make him drink). As previously stated, some actually use these means to do well for themselves. however some attempt to abuse the system. you can find individuals in every race where this can be explained. However, in my experience in talking to some first nations people, this is quite often abused. In no way do I believe it is genetic. However, I believe there is a major cultural distortion in play. In conversation with the mentioned first nations people, He himself says that the reservations, quite often, are the world place for a native individual to be because of the cultural attitude is easy to be sucked in. He went on to provide me vivid example of some of the actions he witnesses on a regular basis and stated that that is the reason he chooses to live in the city and for a period of time chose to live in the drop in center in calgary when he could have lived in housing on the reservation.
Also I clearly stated the government should not take away all programs designed to help native status individuals. I had said I believe it is time that certain programs should be rethought to eliminate abuse of the system. I think the post secondary education, education, housing programs are all invaluable. Heck, I would not have met the gentlemen I had the above mentioned conversation with if it wern't for those programs. They truly are great. However, I believe that changes could be made to make these programs more effective, and also defend them against abuse by those who would choose to abuse them. Additionally, I believe some changes could be made to align the interests of the entire population of this nation as well as native status individuals.
If one were to apply the "here first" policy to other aspects of life it just wouldn't work. I got my drivers licence when I was 18. therfore I should pay the price of what it cost for gas at that time for the rest of my life. Or when I first started fishing as a kid, I was allowed to keep 2 bulltrout in my favorite waterway. I should be allowed to do that and the changes should only be applied to those who come after me. It just doesn't work. Political, societal, and economical changes force changes in our laws, rights and privileges. not one single nationality or race should be completely exempt to these changes. What happens if the world were to start running out of food. "as long as we have enough to feed the first nations first". Sorry. Not that I am insensitive as you claim me to be, It is just not "fair" in my opinion. And Because I can guess what you will say in rebuttle..... you will disregard everything I say except the word "fair" and then list " is it fair that we take all their land, drive them from their homes, ect." Lets just cut the BS right now. That was hundreds of years ago. It is unfortunate. And no it wasn't fair. But today is today and not hundreds of years ago. We still have several great programs to help these people. If we met on the river and you shot me dead. Would you think it logical that your great grandchildren Must pay for my great grandchildren to goto college even if they lived in harmony on the same street in the same neighborhood? I highly doubt it.
oh and by the way. you are definitely the first person to claim I have a lack of compassion...... whatever you need to say to make yourself feel better bud.