Lapp/pensions

[Jimboy]

To all union leaders and union members on this forum , this bill on pension reform has got to be stopped now.
What is happening here is a move to stop pension payments to all who turn 65 in 2016 ,what they are doing is moving up the date to 67 for retirement hoping you die before 67 then they dont have to pay you back your pension that you paid into for 35 years or more .
This is an outrage and all of us should be out in front of govt buildings and city buildings carrying placards protestesting this bill.
They use thease pension funds to invest overseas and into all the best of markets which give a high return and they pocket the interest.
They tell us our pensions are not substainable , BULL CRAP , they are pulling the wool over your eyes (typicle tory crap] they take in billions of our pension monies , the problem is THEY WANT TO KEEP IT , so by raising the retirement age they are hoping your dead before then , your pension stays in their general reveue or gets put into the Torys bank account.
Do not take this sitting down , the NDP party has also got to get up in caucus as they are the working mans friend and make some bludy loud noise against this bill , in fact this is so important to the future of our kids and well being that everyone who works hard for a living should be demaning a stop to this bill or a mass revolution.
lf this bill passes the next step is retirement age will be hiked to 70 and then 75 and up untill the age is reached where they can be assured that all are
dead before they/you can collect , UNION leaders act NOW , lets stop this bill , the pensions are our own money and thease crooks are trying to and are going to take it away if we dont act now.
Do not believe anything a Tory says , the funds they collect from the pension fund is more then substainable if the truth is told, and an RCMP lnvestigation l believe is warranted here.
It is not their money , it is OURS and it is a massive fund , they just dont want to pay it back to us anymore , lets stand up and fight this NOW.

The reason l post here is that this goes on the internet for the world to see ,yes it does , thank you AO.

[Grizzly Adams]

Guess I think of poor old Jim Flaherty. Not unique, but a fitting symbol. I'm sure he paid into CPP and other pension plans all his working life. Died just before he turned 65.

Grizz

[rottie]

CCP is not going to age 67,OAS is. The provincial bill has no say over CPP as CCP is under federal guidelines.
LAPP changes are the 85 factor which would be age 55 plus 30 years service allows you to draw an unreduced pension, to a 90 factor and age 60 to draw an unreduced pension. Which would be age 60 plus 30 years to draw an unreduced pension. The penalty for retiring early under LAPP would go from 3 percent to 5 percnt for every year shy of the 90 factor
Both pay some death benifits to survivors

[Donkey Oatey]

Looks like Bill 9 (Pension Reform) is going to committee for public consultation.

To the OP looks like you have some incorrect information about PPSP/LAPP vs. Old Age Security and CPP.

rottie has the right info as to the purposed changes to PPSP/LAPP. Those changes would only be on pensions earned after Jan 1, 2016.

[missingtwo]

Even if Jimboy has wrong information, his intentions were good. (oh lord please don't be misunderstood).
Thanks for bringing this up. The fight has to start NOW. The witch is gone, now let the party know how unfair this is. Especially for those with27 years in.
Let the wildrose know, and all the MLA's.

[Jimboy]

Originally Posted by Grizzly Adams

Guess I think of poor old Jim Flaherty. Not unique, but a fitting symbol. I'm sure he paid into CPP and other pension plans all his working life. Died just before he turned 65.

Grizz

NOPE , note talking about politicions pensions they give them selfs what they want , a whole diff subject, l,m talking about the pensions of city workers ,govt employees ,bus drivers ,firemen , police officers and any other lapp pension member , they are trying to screw us here , forget about politicion pensions , thats so crooked its a crime.

[Donkey Oatey]

Originally Posted by missingtwo

Even if Jimboy has wrong information, his intentions were good. (oh lord please don't be misunderstood).
Thanks for bringing this up. The fight has to start NOW. The witch is gone, now let the party know how unfair this is. Especially for those with27 years in.
Let the wildrose know, and all the MLA's.

Highway to hell is paved with good intentions.

It is fine to get your dander up, just get it up for the right reasons.

Learn a bit before flying off the handle.

[Jimboy]

Originally Posted by rottie

CCP is not going to age 67,OAS is. The provincial bill has no say over CPP as CCP is under federal guidelines.
LAPP changes are the 85 factor which would be age 55 plus 30 years service allows you to draw an unreduced pension, to a 90 factor and age 60 to draw an unreduced pension. Which would be age 60 plus 30 years to draw an unreduced pension. The penalty for retiring early under LAPP would go from 3 percent to 5 percnt for every year shy of the 90 factor
Both pay some death benifits to survivors

YEA, thats now , they want to change that , in fact eliminate the 85 factor , they want to make it 67 and thats it , hoping you dead before then .

[Brimo]

I was disappointed that no mention was made of reducing current pension withdrawals. The changes suggested are to strengthen the LAPP...to me that means everyone, even members currently retired should share in the support.

[Ebrand]

Met with mine in early February. He was going to toe the party line and support Bill 9. Despite all the discussion we had that included everything Calgary's mayor and the AMD&C put in their letters to the PCs. And more. He was stuck on the "unfunded" bs that his own government says is not true. It was like trying to talk sense to a very small child or very drunk person. All I really feel I accomplished was wasting 45 minutes of his life.

Bill 9 is theft of my earned benefits. I did not vote for him (PC) and most certainly will not vote for him next time.

I am 26 years in and want to retire at 55 ( nine years from now ) I will have an "89" factor. The reformed plan will keep me till 60 and a "99" factor.

I am not impressed. My wife even less so. Out of the 12 voters that live in our cul de sac 9 of them are affected and will not be voting PC. The MLA did not seem to care. Hope it sucks big time for him and his party after the next election.

[rottie]

Originally Posted by Jimboy

YEA, thats now , they want to change that , in fact eliminate the 85 factor , they want to make it 67 and thats it , hoping you dead before then .

Better do some reading Jim , your heart is in the right place,but your info is not.
Yes the 85 factor will be replaced,with the 90 factor as already stated
I have being checking all this out very close as I have the 85 factor and am planning retirment in the next couple years.
Pre 2016 will be calculated under the old rules, post 2016 under the new rules.
Some good reading for all those affected is in the following link.
http://www.lapp.ca/news/
All members paying into the plans should do their own research and educate them selves of the changes, as all our situations are different it will impact us all differently

[bobalong]

Bill 9 died on the floor today. Second half of the Prentice deal, settle with AUPE and drop Bill 9.........done.


I just got exciting news from our MLAs over at our Caucus offices. Together, we have scored a victory on protecting pensions!

Thanks to the efforts of you, thousands of other regular Albertans, pressure from labour, and our hard working MLAs who have filibustered on Bill 9 the PCs have backed down.

Just moments ago a deal was reached to refer the bill to the Standing Committee on Alberta's Economic Future, who will report back in the fall sitting.

Leader Brian Mason said "this is a real victory for the hundreds of thousands of Albertans whose pension was seriously threatened by this legislation."

Congratulations and thank you for your support!

This victory shows that together, we can affect real change in Alberta politics.


Brian Stokes
Provincial Secretary, Alberta's New Democrats
Thanks again, great work!

[Ebrand]

Originally Posted by bobalong

Bill 9 died on the floor today. Second half of the Prentice deal, settle with AUPE and drop Bill 9.........done.


I just got exciting news from our MLAs over at our Caucus offices. Together, we have scored a victory on protecting pensions!

Thanks to the efforts of you, thousands of other regular Albertans, pressure from labour, and our hard working MLAs who have filibustered on Bill 9 the PCs have backed down.

Just moments ago a deal was reached to refer the bill to the Standing Committee on Alberta's Economic Future, who will report back in the fall sitting.

Leader Brian Mason said "this is a real victory for the hundreds of thousands of Albertans whose pension was seriously threatened by this legislation."

Congratulations and thank you for your support!

This victory shows that together, we can affect real change in Alberta politics.


Brian Stokes
Provincial Secretary, Alberta's New Democrats
Thanks again, great work!

Boy I hope this is true!!!!!!!!

[Deb]

Pity that the ONLY news I could find came out of a B.C. newspaper - but that's typical for Alberta. The public is always the last to know.

That said - here's the link - going to make a lot of folks happy (and relieved).

Thank you, Brian Stokes, for being the bearer of good news.

http://www.princegeorgecitizen.com/n...ings-1.1022429

[Ebrand]

But over to the Fall sitting and to public consultations.
Lots if work left for public service pension plan members if this is to be put to rest.
Still it is good news.

There was a little bit of stuff in Twitter that matches up with the PG Citizen article.

[3blade]

Correct, not dead. yet. Basically counting on high stress workers (police, fire, nurses etc) getting injured, quitting or dying. Pathetic, disgraceful way of treating people who serve. Seems to be a common malady of today's governments.

Just sent a letter to my MLA, suffice to say the words "voting issue" tend to get the message across. They know where they're at in current public opinion. Keep the pressure on.

[Jimboy]

Originally Posted by Brimo

I was disappointed that no mention was made of reducing current pension withdrawals. The changes suggested are to strengthen the LAPP...to me that means everyone, even members currently retired should share in the support.

NO WAY , our current pensions are a signed document for as long as we live , if they even mention trying to reduce current pensions they will be blasted with lawsuits from every labour union out there.
Can hardly get by now .

[Jimboy]

Originally Posted by rottie

Better do some reading Jim , your heart is in the right place,but your info is not.
Yes the 85 factor will be replaced,with the 90 factor as already stated
I have being checking all this out very close as I have the 85 factor and am planning retirment in the next couple years.
Pre 2016 will be calculated under the old rules, post 2016 under the new rules.
Some good reading for all those affected is in the following link.
http://www.lapp.ca/news/
All members paying into the plans should do their own research and educate them selves of the changes, as all our situations are different it will impact us all differently

l know that , but thats the lapp , did you see the title of my first thread it looked like this LAPP/GOVT PENSIONS,which means both , the feds are talking about raising retirement age to 67 also.

[Freedom55]

I am curious enough to post in this section. Jimboy: are you currently working towards an LAPP pension or are you enjoying languishing on the couch?

Free (and enjoying every second of my premature redundancy)

[Jimboy]

Originally Posted by bobalong

Bill 9 died on the floor today. Second half of the Prentice deal, settle with AUPE and drop Bill 9.........done.


I just got exciting news from our MLAs over at our Caucus offices. Together, we have scored a victory on protecting pensions!

Thanks to the efforts of you, thousands of other regular Albertans, pressure from labour, and our hard working MLAs who have filibustered on Bill 9 the PCs have backed down.

Just moments ago a deal was reached to refer the bill to the Standing Committee on Alberta's Economic Future, who will report back in the fall sitting.

Leader Brian Mason said "this is a real victory for the hundreds of thousands of Albertans whose pension was seriously threatened by this legislation."

Congratulations and thank you for your support!

This victory shows that together, we can affect real change in Alberta politics.


Brian Stokes
Provincial Secretary, Alberta's New Democrats
Thanks again, great work!

HIP HIP HOORAY , thanks to Brian Mason of the NDP and all unions and its members , now you know who to vote for.

[recce43]

Originally Posted by Jimboy

HIP HIP HOORAY , thanks to Brian Mason of the NDP and all unions and its members , now you know who to vote for.

I will never vote NDP

[Jimboy]

Originally Posted by Freedom55

I am curious enough to post in this section. Jimboy: are you currently working towards an LAPP pension or are you enjoying languishing on the couch?

Free (and enjoying every second of my premature redundancy)

l earned every pennie of my small pension , 35 years with the city , l went at 55 ,l am now 71 , and yes l do what l want , couch too , and if any of you are jealous of that , heres what you do ,work only for a union shop ,stay with your job for 35 yrs , then you can enjoy your older years like me , l,m far from rich ,l live on $1,800 a month , thats it , l own my house , no bills , and no credit cards, l did my job ,got up every morning at 4am to do it, bought 2 homes over the years ,raised 2 kids ,took me a lifetime to be deht free , now its my fault that l can relax

[Jimboy]

Originally Posted by recce43

I will never vote NDP

Then you deserve whatever the others throw at you.

[recce43]

Originally Posted by Jimboy

Then you deserve whatever the others throw at you.

OH well Eh by the way my wife isworking towards lapp but would never vote for the commie party i mean NDP that will not hold power in this province in the first place

[rottie]

Originally Posted by Jimboy

l know that , but thats the lapp , did you see the title of my first thread it looked like this LAPP/GOVT PENSIONS,which means both , the feds are talking about raising retirement age to 67 also.

BS Jimboy they are talking about raising OAS not CPP ,yes I did read your title and your still wrong. Read the following links
http://www.servicecanada.gc.ca/eng/s...on/index.shtml

http://www.servicecanada.gc.ca/eng/s.../pensions/cpp/

Your staements are staight out BS,again your hart is in the right place,your satements arent

[tchammer]

I might get the hounds barking, but I decided at 20 that to rely on any pension plan, especially government was the riskiest move I could make. I believe the government should honour current pensions to all those who have been with them for a set amount of time, possibly 18-20 years or more. But any who have less than that it should be drastically changed. If you don't like the changes than leave, just as you would in a private company. I have been self-employed for close to twenty years, and through a lot of sacrifice and NOT trying to attain happiness through toys and keeping up with the Jones, my wife and I will be able to attain semi-retirement by about 45. It can be done, but it takes about 12-15 years of very disciplined money management.

[Sushi]

Originally Posted by Jimboy

l earned every pennie of my small pension , 35 years with the city , l went at 55 ,l am now 71 , and yes l do what l want , couch too , and if any of you are jealous of that , heres what you do ,work only for a union shop ,stay with your job for 35 yrs , then you can enjoy your older years like me , l,m far from rich ,l live on $1,800 a month , thats it , l own my house , no bills , and no credit cards, l did my job ,got up every morning at 4am to do it, bought 2 homes over the years ,raised 2 kids ,took me a lifetime to be deht free , now its my fault that l can relax

On a personal level, you expected it as part of your total compensation, you earned it, and I trust you enjoy it....thats great.

Unfortunately, this pension model is now outdated and it's sustainability is challenged by low interest and bond rates, global competition, longer lifespans, etc. You should know that despite 35 years of contributing, your benefits are likely highly subsidized. This is only the beginning of this fight.

[Donkey Oatey]

Jimboy your heart is in the right place to bad the head is lodged somewhere else.

No one will take anything you say seriously if you don't have your facts straight. You are fighting the wrong fight with the wrong people.

Learn about what you are protesting about. The attack on pensions is a serious one. One that we can't give up on. Glad to see Bill 9 deferred to committee, now to get it abolished or changed in such a way that it doesn't impact those that have been paying in to it for years with a goal in mind. Shouldn't change the distance to the goal line mid game.

BTW OAS and CPP federal, LAPP/PSPP provincial. Barking up the wrong tree won't get you where you want to go.

[Freedom55]

Originally Posted by Jimboy

l earned every pennie of my small pension , 35 years with the city , l went at 55 ,l am now 71 , and yes l do what l want , couch too , and if any of you are jealous of that , heres what you do ,work only for a union shop ,stay with your job for 35 yrs , then you can enjoy your older years like me , l,m far from rich ,l live on $1,800 a month , thats it , l own my house , no bills , and no credit cards, l did my job ,got up every morning at 4am to do it, bought 2 homes over the years ,raised 2 kids ,took me a lifetime to be deht free , now its my fault that l can relax

...is a 21st century game. I asked a simple question so I could get a handle on where you are coming from.

As for the $21,600.00, that would be an LAPP number only. We can presume that you are also collecting CPP and OAS, so you are doing okay.

If the thousands of ungrateful children of the Boomers are having a little trouble adjusting to the growing demands on the system that was put in place to protect the people who worked hard to give their families everything they wanted, then let them do the heavy lifting to guarantee their own happy future.

I too am a 85 points guy. Had 87 actually when I pulled the pin and relinquished my position to a younger man who needed a big salary to feed his family and buy them all the iPads they want, just so long as Daddy (and Canada Pension) leaves them a bundle. I wisely saved a lot of money, bought real estate and for the last five years I have wandered the West, looking for another big walleye.

I am also going to presume that you are offended by the term "languish". Perhaps you would be less offended if I used a word that fits your vocabulary; I didn't. All the guys that I knew that retired from "The City" in 1988 were cranky, lazy fat guys. You are clearly the exception in a crowd of overpaid whiners always looking for an excuse to be angry. I am also going to guess that for some period of your time I was your foreman and found it impossible to dislodge your peers and give those jobs to someone who was looking for results.

Freedom55 (in case you missed it earlier)

[Homesteader]

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/Provi...854/story.html