Grizz Hunting in Alberta

Jamie · #1 02-05-2008, 06:41 PM

Does anyone have any idea when the 3 year moratoriun is comming to a end?

It seems they didnt have a Grizz hunt in 05/06 or 07. But perhaps my dates are off.

When I did a bit of reaserch on this, I couldnt find any mention of a 3 year Moratorium. but instead they say

"Edmonton... Alberta will suspend the spring grizzly bear hunt while DNA census data is collected throughout the province, which is expected to continue over the next few years."

Jamie

7mm · #2 02-05-2008, 07:46 PM

http://srd.alberta.ca/fishwildlife/w...andAnswers.pdf
The suspended hunt will continue through 2008. The final report is suppose to be released sometime this year.

MathewsArcher · #3 02-05-2008, 08:24 PM

Draft information I have been told (from what I believe are reliable sources) indicates numbers are lower than hoped. Don't expect a season anytime soon.

#4 02-05-2008, 09:01 PM

I don't think they're being honest concerning the amount of error that has the potential to exist in that population estimate. Considering how territorial they are i can definitely see how capture probability would not be equal for all bears in an area. Great try but they need to keep counting. That or everyone i know who spends time outside is a grizzly bear magnet

. They're incredible creatures and i don't support a hunt if they're truly in trouble, but i still have a suspicion anti-hunters are influencing the management decisions. I look forward to reading the actual report.

MathewsArcher · #5 02-05-2008, 09:11 PM

Similar work done in Montana showed extremely reliable population estimates and higher than expected population densities, it will definately be interesting to compare the Alberta work when the final document is available.

30Gibbs · #6 02-05-2008, 09:32 PM

If they give out the real information...I would be surprised if there are a low number of bears. I have spoke with many people from North to South in Alberta and everyone has the same opinion that there are more bears then they have seen in their life time. Many of these people are farmers and hunters or outdoors people at the least and they spend allot more time outdoors than the ones making the decisions.
Don't forget where the money comes from for all of these studies that they think they need to do!! Not to mention the donations to the government parties (anti hunting groups)
There seems to be a trend with our government in Alberta when it comes to taking away hunting rights. We will likely never hunt Grizzlies in Alberta again.

My two cents!

#7 02-05-2008, 09:34 PM

I'm wondering if it will end up working better in southern areas where bear densities are higher and habitats are more comparable to the estimates done in Montana. Was there not a paper out with the initial results? I'm thinking last year i had a pdf copy that went over methods, outcomes in the northern areas etc. I have to search around for it, this string got me thinking about it once again. I seem to remember reading into detail about the baiting grids, hair catchers, and different ideas they included. hmmmmmm?

Rackmastr · #8 02-05-2008, 09:52 PM

One thing makes me wonder about grizz sightings and how everyone seems to think our numbers are high enough to support a hunt....

I'm curious as to whether access has become the issue, and because SO MANY people are running around on quads, OHV's, off-road vehicles, and with the influx of so many new oil/gas roads in grizz country, if thats the reason we are seeing more bears....

Not saying we dont have a large number of bears, but its just something that came up and made me think that it might be a reason why the average sportsman may think we have enough to support a hunt? I'm in full support of a hunt or a closure of the hunt, depending on data gathered.....

30Gibbs · #9 02-05-2008, 10:06 PM

I have been hunting the same areas for 25 yrs and Grizzlies are there full time now. They would show up every now and then before,but now they are there full time.
It sucks when you gotta look over your back in private land for collared grizzlies when your bow hunting!

Win94 · #10 02-06-2008, 07:54 AM

I spent a couple years at Coal Valley Mine and we had Grizz all over. We would have sightings up at the plant of 2 or 3 then at the same time dispatch would get radioed that there were a couple in a certain pit a few miles away. They are all over that area and not the same ones. Our environmentalists said they haven't seen so many as they have in the last 5 years. They were also saying our govt is duping us in regards to the proper numbers and the environmentalists there would welcome a limited entry hunt.

Pathfinder76 · #11 02-06-2008, 07:59 AM

Quote:

I'm curious as to whether access has become the issue, and because SO MANY people are running around on quads, OHV's, off-road vehicles, and with the influx of so many new oil/gas roads in grizz country, if thats the reason we are seeing more bears....

Nothing could be further from the truth.

Copidosoma · #12 02-06-2008, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chuck

Nothing could be further from the truth.

Not sure how you come up with that one.

Actually anecdotal sightings are a really poor way of estimating populations. It TOTALLY depends on how many observers, how much time, how much area covered etc...

Not an easy thing to measure.

Rackmastr · #13 02-06-2008, 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chuck

Nothing could be further from the truth.

Chuck,
How do you know this statement is true? I was only pondering the fact that we as outdoorsmen have so many ways of covering SO much more country than in the past, and with the influx of internet message boards and communication, we can spread the word much easier and share information so much better. I think the huge increase in ATV/OHV use and the giant spread of oil/gas roads definatly can hurt bear populations, but I think its also WHY outdoorsmen seem to be sharing the news of seeing more bears as they are covering so much country and so much more country is opening up...
Just a theory I had on why there seems to be so many more bear sightings...why is that so far from the truth?
I'm just curious...not challenging.....but it seems fair that if people are coveirng more country, and more roads are opening up, that we're going to be seeing more bears....

Huntnut · #14 02-06-2008, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chuck

Nothing could be further from the truth.

Really.

Then come up to the Grande Praire/Grande Cache area and see how much country has been opened up by oil activity. If you think that this doesn't affect a bears territory then your pretty naive.

Cordur · #15 02-06-2008, 11:13 AM

All I can say is that I saw more grizzlies this year than I saw black bears. 1 black bear and 5 grizzlies. Maybe just not in the right areas.

Pathfinder76 · #16 02-06-2008, 12:12 PM

In my situation, I spend a lot less time in areas I’ve historically spent time in over the years. A job, family, and other responsibilities make it impossible to roam around like I used to. Yet I’m seeing, and my family is seeing more grizzlies all the time. Not only that, but we are seeing grizzlies in places that we’ve never seen them before. Why? Cause there is more of them. As an aside to it all, these bears, without question, are becoming more and more bold displaying no concern for human presence or even fairly populated areas.

Keep in mind that these areas I describe are private property and are in reality seeing no more, and maybe even less human traffic due to access restrictions.

Rackmastr · #17 02-06-2008, 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chuck

In my situation, I spend a lot less time in areas I’ve historically spent time in over the years. A job, family, and other responsibilities make it impossible to roam around like I used to. Yet I’m seeing, and my family is seeing more grizzlies all the time. Not only that, but we are seeing grizzlies in places that we’ve never seen them before. Why? Cause there is more of them. As an aside to it all, these bears, without question, are becoming more and more bold displaying no concern for human presence or even fairly populated areas.

Keep in mind that these areas I describe are private property and are in reality seeing no more, and maybe even less human traffic due to access restrictions.

Yep fair enough Chuck...makes sense in that situation, as well as quite a few others. It sure does seem like more guys are seeing more grizz out there just as in your situation.

Maybe my assumption is wrong....I'd love to know the numbers of grizz in Alberta...hopefully they do it right and get solid numbers that we can rely on...

Pathfinder76 · #18 02-06-2008, 01:09 PM

Trev, that is the problem. These numbers are hard to disprove or prove no matter what.

Chuck

Huntnut · #19 02-06-2008, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chuck

In my situation, I spend a lot less time in areas I’ve historically spent time in over the years. A job, family, and other responsibilities make it impossible to roam around like I used to. Yet I’m seeing, and my family is seeing more grizzlies all the time. Not only that, but we are seeing grizzlies in places that we’ve never seen them before. Why? Cause there is more of them. As an aside to it all, these bears, without question, are becoming more and more bold displaying no concern for human presence or even fairly populated areas.

Keep in mind that these areas I describe are private property and are in reality seeing no more, and maybe even less human traffic due to access restrictions.

Or maybe these are grizzlies that have been pushed out of their regular area due to oil and gas exploration. Just a thought.

Rackmastr · #20 02-06-2008, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chuck

Trev, that is the problem. These numbers are hard to disprove or prove no matter what.

Chuck

Yea definatly a good point.....

Pathfinder76 · #21 02-06-2008, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Or maybe these are grizzlies that have been pushed out of their regular area due to oil and gas exploration. Just a thought.

Not in this area.

#22 02-06-2008, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MathewsArcher

Draft information I have been told (from what I believe are reliable sources) indicates numbers are lower than hoped. Don't expect a season anytime soon.

I heard the same from a member of the team.

Pathfinder76 · #23 02-06-2008, 04:42 PM

I really don't know why anyone expected different.

lazy ike · #24 02-06-2008, 05:03 PM

Here is where the bad science used to close the hunt will come back to bite us.

If the numbers come back too low (Whatever that figure is) no hunt.

If it comes back way above the 1000 or so they used to close the hunt, they will claim that it was obviously hunting that put the population in jepordy and the hunt ban is and was successful.

#25 02-06-2008, 05:11 PM

From the person I spoke with, hunting was not blamed for anything and that was spelled out in the report but that all the other things going on in Alberta have worked together to reduce numbers to and unacceptable low. Unfortunately hunting is much easier to stop than oil and gas development and is indeed just a Bandaid on a gaping wound.

Rook · #26 02-07-2008, 02:20 PM

"I heard the same from a member of the team."

Interestingly I had a chat with a couple of members of the study team and head something quite different. They indicated the overall numbers are higher than anticipated but that the bears are found in pockets throughout the province.....that is the sow bears. This accounts for some saying there are no bears and others saying there are more than before.

Their boar collared bears are real travellers. One was reported to have travelled from Alberta into BC and back to the same spot in one season...covering over 1000 km. Again this throws some confusion into the statistics. Seeing the bear in an area is somewhat dependant on the season and the travel patterns of the bears. So as some have said accurate numbers are somewhat hard to obtain however there is a statistical significance attached to their findings.

The team members I spoke to were concerned about how their findings would be interpreted and suggested we probably would not see the raw data and the resultant numbers from a gov't published report might be skewed to be interpretted the way the political wind is blowing.

Jamie · #27 02-07-2008, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rook

"I heard the same from a member of the team."

Interestingly I had a chat with a couple of members of the study team and head something quite different. They indicated the overall numbers are higher than anticipated but that the bears are found in pockets throughout the province.....that is the sow bears. This accounts for some saying there are no bears and others saying there are more than before.

Their boar collared bears are real travellers. One was reported to have travelled from Alberta into BC and back to the same spot in one season...covering over 1000 km. Again this throws some confusion into the statistics. Seeing the bear in an area is somewhat dependant on the season and the travel patterns of the bears. So as some have said accurate numbers are somewhat hard to obtain however there is a statistical significance attached to their findings.

The team members I spoke to were concerned about how their findings would be interpreted and suggested we probably would not see the raw data and the resultant numbers from a gov't published report might be skewed to be interpretted the way the political wind is blowing.

Rook.. I think that is one of things we are all afraid of right now..
GRIZZLY BEARS FOR VOTES

Makes me puke
Jamie