Important Poll: Hunting Draws in Alberta

[Chukar Hunter]

As we all know, in Alberta, our draw priority system allows the tags to go to the folks with the maximum priority points. This is not a favorable system for folks who are just starting to get in to the draws for the first time and it actually discourages them. The correct approach in my opinion is the "weighted" system which allows the folks with even one priority point to draw a coveted tag. This system is used in almost all the States in the lower 48 (Idaho and a couple other are exceptions) with great success. Montana probably has the best system as each year you don't draw, your points get squared going forward.

I am therefore setting up a poll to see what folks think about proposing this as a group to our Fish and Wildlife officials.

If you agree with introducing the new weighted system Press here :

If you think we need to keep the system as is, Press here:

[270hunter]

I’m not sure if it’s just me but there is no polling options.

[Chukar Hunter]

Originally Posted by 270hunter

I’m not sure if it’s just me but there is no polling options.

Try now?

[MountainTi]

I would love to see the same draw system used in much of the lower 48 implemented up here. Too many draws that are unattainable up here now.
Was down in Nevada a couple months ago with a friend who was drawn for desert sheep on year 9. Without the weighted draw, it would have never happened.
And have a deadline to purchase the tag. If you don't buy it in that timeframe, it is redrawn
We could do so much better up here...just look south for guidance when it comes to wildlife management

[DiabeticKripple]

What about abolishing the “999” or priority only option. No fence sitters to drive up points. You either draw the tag and hunt it or don’t put it at all.

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

What about abolishing the “999” or priority only option. No fence sitters to drive up points. You either draw the tag and hunt it or don’t put it at all.

Why?

[jungleboy]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

What about abolishing the “999” or priority only option. No fence sitters to drive up points. You either draw the tag and hunt it or don’t put it at all.

I don’t see the issue with the 999 set up. If I 999 a draw because I know I will not be able to go. I am not taking away from anyone else. If I have been putting in a draw for moose for 10 yrs and this year I know I cannot hunt if I do win, 999 is a better option than flushing 10 yrs of priority. Or do I take a chance and put in anyway rather than risk my priority, I get my draw but cannot go. Then I have robbed someone else of a draw that might have had it if there was a 999 option.

[ditch donkey]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

What about abolishing the “999” or priority only option. No fence sitters to drive up points. You either draw the tag and hunt it or don’t put it at all.

How does waiting until I am confident I’ll be able to have time to set aside and properly hunt a tag equate to fence sitting?

I’m a 6 for Antlered moose, I’ll probably use that priority in a zone that requires 3 points to get get drawn. Is it better if I put in for a draw every year, get drawn twice in that span and not use the tag?

It’s Alberta, not everyone works at the bank. People work odd schedules, shifts change, projects start, and end. Some people have a hard time getting time off. Don’t force them into drawing tags they can’t use. And saying, “If they don’t buy the tag, redraw it.” They can afford to buy the tag, and possibly go. They can afford to buy it, and waste it.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

What about abolishing the “999” or priority only option. No fence sitters to drive up points. You either draw the tag and hunt it or don’t put it at all.

This will have zero affect as has been discussed many times before

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

What about abolishing the “999” or priority only option. No fence sitters to drive up points. You either draw the tag and hunt it or don’t put it at all.

That won't accomplish anything ,as far as shortening wait times. Many people would simply do as we did before the priority only draws existed, which is to apply with low priority people, that have no chance of drawing, in order to build extra priority. And if you think about it, someone like myself that often accumulates several more points than needed to draw, actually makes the wait time shorter for others, by not drawing as often as we could. If I build 7-8 points before drawing, instead of drawing every 4-5 years as I could, I am actually drawing fewer tags in a given time period, which leaves more tags for those that draw as often as they can.

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

What about abolishing the “999” or priority only option. No fence sitters to drive up points. You either draw the tag and hunt it or don’t put it at all.

Then you get a bunch of draws pulled that aren’t used…

The 999 is a good system, I’ve explained it before but I’ll do it again.

Let’s say you are at the grocery store and you are in line, your wife decides she forgot something so you step aside for a short time and let other people behind you go ahead… then when ready you step back into line to take your turn to checkout.

It’s the same thing with 999. Without out it (some of us have hunted here long before 999 was a thing) if you are crafty you can up priority without pulling a draw… HOWEVER you may accidentally pull it in an area you don’t know and take that opportunity away.

Why is is a bad thing that people who wait can actually make a plan to pull a draw on a specific year? After all they let others in line before them… and they waited longer?

LC

[jungleboy]

Changing the game now would sure sucked for those who have waited 10 yrs to get drawn based on their priority. Cleaning the slate would essentially turn it into a lottery where you see most would never win, while some would win multiple times.
The bison draw was like that. People applying for years without results while other would get it multiple times.

If you want to go to a lottery type draw, maybe what you need is; if you win your draw you cannot apply for at least 5 years and definitely no draw options for outfitters to give to out of province hunters .

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by jungleboy

Changing the game now would sure sucked for those who have waited 10 yrs to get drawn based on their priority. Cleaning the slate would essentially turn it into a lottery where you see most would never win, while some would win multiple times.
The bison draw was like that. People applying for years without results while other would get it multiple times.

If you want to go to a lottery type draw, maybe what you need is; if you win your draw you cannot apply for at least 5 years and definitely no draw options for outfitters to give to out of province hunters .

Why would you clean the slate? That 10 years priority is now squared. Name goes in 101 times vs. someone starting from scratch who's name goes in once.

[jungleboy]

Originally Posted by MountainTi

Why would you clean the slate? That 10 years priority is now squared. Name goes in 101 times vs. someone starting from scratch who's name goes in once.

If they were to change the draw system they would very likely start everyone back to zero is what I expect would happen.

[Chukar Hunter]

Originally Posted by jungleboy

Changing the game now would sure sucked for those who have waited 10 yrs to get drawn based on their priority. Cleaning the slate would essentially turn it into a lottery where you see most would never win, while some would win multiple times.
The bison draw was like that. People applying for years without results while other would get it multiple times.

If you want to go to a lottery type draw, maybe what you need is; if you win your draw you cannot apply for at least 5 years and definitely no draw options for outfitters to give to out of province hunters .

This is really not a lottery. People with highest priority points will still have a larger chance to draw than the person with just one point. Its like buying tickets; the more tickets you have, the higher your chances are.

[boah]

How about no more nonres applicants for any draws that require more than a 3 priority?
How about any draw that requires more than a 7 priority be split into priority draws and lottery draws. 70/30 split??
How about restricting landowner tags to 20 % of total tags for the wmu, or better yet have landowner tags be non trophy only?
How about re opening the Griz bear season to at least similar to the goat draw?

[1899b]

Originally Posted by 270hunter

I’m not sure if it’s just me but there is no polling options.

I see em..

[270hunter]

Yes good now.

[Chukar Hunter]

Originally Posted by 270hunter

Yes good now.

Perfect!

[eyeflyer]

Originally Posted by Chukar Hunter

As we all know, in Alberta, our draw priority system allows the tags to go to the folks with the maximum priority points. This is not a favorable system for folks who are just starting to get in to the draws for the first time and it actually discourages them. The correct approach in my opinion is the "weighted" system which allows the folks with even one priority point to draw a coveted tag. This system is used in almost all the States in the lower 48 (Idaho and a couple other are exceptions) with great success. Montana probably has the best system as each year you don't draw, your points get squared going forward.

I am therefore setting up a poll to see what folks think about proposing this as a group to our Fish and Wildlife officials.

If you agree with introducing the new weighted system Press here :

If you think we need to keep the system as is, Press here:

Once again a proposal so the younger generation doesn't have to put their time in, just jump to the front without EARNING IT.

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by eyeflyer

Once again a proposal so the younger generation doesn't have to put their time in, just jump to the front without EARNING IT.

How so? Priority can be kept with the implementation of a new system.
The idea of a weighted system is for coveted tags. Not for a doe tag

[Smoky buck]

Originally Posted by eyeflyer

Once again a proposal so the younger generation doesn't have to put their time in, just jump to the front without EARNING IT.

It’s called looking out for the future of hunting and improving the system for long term benefit for all. It’s not about anyone jumping the line it’s about addressing the problem of increasing wait times for all

The present system is not improving and point creep is just getting worse. The weighted system suggested in this thread at least is an attempt to utilize priority hunters have built up and is definitely not helping new people jump to the front of the line as you suggest

Personally would not hurt my feelings to loose the priority I built up even if it was going to create a realistic solution

[st99]

I think the system should be changed a bit. 80% of tags for the current system and 20% go to a random draw.

[waldedw]

The biggest change I would like to see is the removal of non residents from the draw system or at the very least have a small pool that they can partake in, as it stands no someone from Saskatchewan or BC can draw a moose tag with the same priority as a resident, it would probably cut 2 years off a residents wait time without the non residents applications.

I like the priority only draw as you can get your priority up then decide when and where you want to pull your tag, as a resident that's a good thing.

Non resident wolf / coyote license should only be issued to non residents after they have purchased a wildlife cert. and a non res big game tag.

[CBintheNorth]

Would love to see an option in your Poll for only certain draws to go weighted.

The "999 causes a backlog" argument holds no water.
Rising population with diminishing game populations causes a backlog.

I'm sure someone will be along shortly to tell us how increasing the cost of things will shorten up wait times...

[Smoky buck]

Originally Posted by CBintheNorth

Would love to see an option in your Poll for only certain draws to go weighted.

The "999 causes a backlog" argument holds no water.
Rising population with diminishing game populations causes a backlog.

I'm sure someone will be along shortly to tell us how increasing the cost of things will shorten up wait times...

You are correct it’s simply a supply and demand issue

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by CBintheNorth

Would love to see an option in your Poll for only certain draws to go weighted.

The "999 causes a backlog" argument holds no water.
Rising population with diminishing game populations causes a backlog.

I'm sure someone will be along shortly to tell us how increasing the cost of things will shorten up wait times...

The current system is fine for doe tags and such. There is a handful of draws where it would work very well though. I like to call them a "coveted" tag. A coveted tag should indeed cost more once drawn. Even more yet for a non-resident

[CBintheNorth]

Post #44

Originally Posted by CBintheNorth

..........

I'm sure someone will be along shortly to tell us how increasing the cost of things will shorten up wait times...

And here we are.
It's pretty sad that the only solution for some, in regards to wait times, is to price others out of the market.

What if we did this with healthcare?
I'm willing to bet you would hear all the reasons why that is a bad idea.

I for one, am not willing to spend more than the cost to cover managing and growing the resource. I don't think anyone honestly knows what that number is?
Increasing draw costs is stupid in my opinion. That fee is there to cover the costs associated with running the draw. As far as I'm aware, it is run by a company in the states so most of those dollars don't even stay here in the end.

If the reason we can't have good enforcement and sound management is because license fees are too low, then by all means, they need to go up.
However, there's so much waste in government that increasing fees will only serve to penalize the few while not benefiting the many. I would need to know where those extra dollars are going, and how they're going to benefit wildlife and hunting, before agreeing to a license cost increase.
Just doing so to price some out of the market is as ridiculous as it is asinine.

We older Hunters need to also look out for the next generation. If they lose interest in the sport, it won't be long before it's all over.
Not saying they need to jump the queue, but if a 12 year old has dreams of hunting a trophy antelope in his home province in his lifetime, I don't think that's unreasonable.
We just need to figure out how to make that happen without making it a sell-out to the highest bidder.

[Edmonton resident]

As we all know, in Alberta, our draw priority system allows the tags to go to the folks with the maximum priority points. This is not a favorable system for folks who are just starting to get in to the draws for the first time and it actually discourages them.

iT DISCOURAGE THEM where the info for that i like to see it !!!!
they have to waite like the rest of us i don't see the urge to change it so someone with kids can have a better chance then the ones who have been waiting years no i don't agree .

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by Edmonton resident

iT DISCOURAGE THEM where the info for that i like to see it !!!!
they have to waite like the rest of us i don't see the urge to change it so someone with kids can have a better chance then the ones who have been waiting years no i don't agree .

Do you realize the amount of priority some of these draws take? Don't think you do.
Some of these draws you're waiting for people to die to gain any ground on getting drawn