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01-16-2018, 06:49 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 11,556
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nube
lol you sure must be a sad man living in your little world!
I'll enjoy my hunting in the USA and in Alberta.
And just so you know you have to pay to play in other parts of Canada as well Pikergolf! But you wouldn't know because I doubt you venture too far from home.
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Yup, I'm a home body, not sure why you would insult me though?
__________________
“One of the sad signs of our times is that we have demonized those who produce, subsidized those who refuse to produce, and canonized those who complain.”
Thomas Sowell
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01-16-2018, 07:02 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 7,064
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nube
Big Dollars eh?
Have you spent the time to talk to outfitters in the USA and other places?
It is probably not as costly as you think.
I know a guy who went antelope hunting last year in Wyoming. He paid $250 for his access and had unlimited amount of antelope to look over...... Is that too much?
The place is full of elk as well with 300" plus bulls and can be hunted for the same price. What do you think it costs you to run around Alberta and shoot a 300" plus bull?
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I was talking about Texas as was the poster(Ditch Donkey) whom I quoted.
Yes I know states like Wyoming and Montana that do have a lot of public land have reasonable hunting costs. There are also a lot of states that have little public land like Texas and decent hunting can be very expensive for residents who don't own land or are not connected to someone who does.
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01-16-2018, 08:36 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 330
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Quote:
Originally Posted by densa44
There have been changes in our society and they have taken away the time available to young people. It used to be the young hunted with the old, more experienced hunters, now many of the old are gone. Hunting is very hard to learn on your own.
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I grew up doing some hunting, and my dad hunts, but I didn't get back into it until I was 24 or so, and then went about it mostly on my own.
I would say that by far the biggest obstacle is just finding somewhere to go. I'm from the country, but have lived in the city for about 10 years now. Knocking on doors cold is not pleasant, and it doesn't get any easier if you aren't a local. I've had fairly good luck around edmonton with permission for birds, haven't tried to get on private for anything bigger than that. Had no luck around calgary the one year I lived there, even just for coyotes.
ACA land has been a huge help, and I've got 2 other first time hunters their first deer on those little quarters in the past few years.
If I had a million dollars to spend on hunter recruitment, opening up land to hunting access would be my first priority. A bushy quarter that is foot access only can soak up a lot of hunters before it feels too crowded.
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01-17-2018, 12:10 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Calgary
Posts: 871
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nube
Well what I have done is finally come to the realization that this province is doomed no matter what happens in my lifetime at least. I've just concluded I will enjoy what I can when I can and have looked to the USA for some things I can't do here as often.
Bios in this province are either dumb as nails or have no muscle anyways so they are useless.
Gov't is messed up in their thinking and choices.
One group wants to make parks with no ATV allowed and the others have their own thoughts on what they want.....
You and I will not win to get what we want. Heck, u and I probably don't even think the same lol
This province could be amazing in so many ways but ........
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I've seen posts you recently put up, I'm kinda surprised that you're so doom and gloom about the state of things here in Alberta. How many rams have you harvested in Alberta? and your daughter drew a bison tag this year too?
So just how good do you want it? Because the way I see it, you've had some pretty tremendous hunting opportunities over the years.
And you don't want to join any conservation groups because they might not have exactly the same views as you.
Reminds me of the people who don't vote but still complain steady about the government......
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01-19-2018, 06:15 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 509
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To many hunters with the heads in the sand
Anyone here a member of aba?pm me if you want
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01-19-2018, 09:36 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 772
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nube
Big Dollars eh?
Have you spent the time to talk to outfitters in the USA and other places?
It is probably not as costly as you think.
I know a guy who went antelope hunting last year in Wyoming. He paid $250 for his access and had unlimited amount of antelope to look over...... Is that too much?
The place is full of elk as well with 300" plus bulls and can be hunted for the same price. What do you think it costs you to run around Alberta and shoot a 300" plus bull?
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So the tag is 300+, then you need a guide and then trespass fees of 250 is that per day? Sounds like a real bargain.
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01-19-2018, 09:39 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 772
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pekan
I've seen posts you recently put up, I'm kinda surprised that you're so doom and gloom about the state of things here in Alberta. How many rams have you harvested in Alberta? and your daughter drew a bison tag this year too?
So just how good do you want it? Because the way I see it, you've had some pretty tremendous hunting opportunities over the years.
And you don't want to join any conservation groups because they might not have exactly the same views as you.
Reminds me of the people who don't vote but still complain steady about the government......
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Agreed. Id add that it never fails to amaze me how many experts there are that know more than our bios.
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01-20-2018, 12:07 AM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: In a house
Posts: 7,770
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SLH
So the tag is 300+, then you need a guide and then trespass fees of 250 is that per day? Sounds like a real bargain.
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No guide needed and no I don't think the tag is $300 either.
Would you pay $250 for a hundred thousand acres of land to hunt full of antelope and elk?
If farmers could get a little compensation like that from hunters I bet you would see a whole lot more land open up in Alberta for people to hunt on.
I'm not saying I want to go that route but that really isn't a whole lot to pay for something like that I don't think.
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01-20-2018, 12:10 AM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: In a house
Posts: 7,770
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SLH
Agreed. Id add that it never fails to amaze me how many experts there are that know more than our bios.
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And it doesn't surprise me that some think what our Bio's are doing is just hunky dory as well! Lots of people with their heads up their arse
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01-20-2018, 12:30 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,996
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pekan
I've seen posts you recently put up, I'm kinda surprised that you're so doom and gloom about the state of things here in Alberta. How many rams have you harvested in Alberta? and your daughter drew a bison tag this year too?
So just how good do you want it? Because the way I see it, you've had some pretty tremendous hunting opportunities over the years.
And you don't want to join any conservation groups because they might not have exactly the same views as you.
Reminds me of the people who don't vote but still complain steady about the government......
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Guys like this take and take and it's never enough ,but are the first to say things are finished and it will never be the same,boo whooo.
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01-20-2018, 03:23 AM
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Gone Hunting
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: North of Peace River
Posts: 11,343
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When my dad moved to Alberta in the early 1930s there were few conservation laws few game guardians (game wardens), few hunters and tons of game.
He saw that change to the system I grew up with, minimal conservation laws, one or two game wardens in every town and plenty of game.
I saw that change to the system we have now. Hundreds of thousands of hunters, hundreds of thousands of conservation laws, no more game wardens then before and less game then there has ever been in the recorded history of this province.
Change is inevitable. The speed and extent of that change is up to us.
Will hunting as we know it end? It has to. Will it end altogether? It doesn't have to.
Will anti hunting sentiment bring about an end to hunting? I doubt it.
Will bull headed selfish hunters bring about the end of hunting, maybe.
The enemy is not out there gentlemen. The enemy is here, it is us.
So long as we hunt because we can, so long as our primary goal is to put a trophy on the wall, so long as our interests are more important to us then the health of the planet and the rights of others, then hunting will end.
So long as we can not express our true thoughts, without resorting to insults and personal attacks, we can never face the issues that will bring about an end to hunting for ever, for everyone.
But it doesn't have to be that way. We can have trophy hunting, we can have bow hunting, we can have opportunity for all, if we give a little for the sake of the other guy.
See it's not over hunting, it's not trophy hunting, it's not special hunting rights, it's not even too many hunters or poor conservation laws or the lack of conservation law enforcement enforcement that will end hunting.
It is our inflexibility. Our refusal to even consider the other guys position.
It is this infighting that we do that is our greatest enemy.
Hunting will change with or without our approval. If it continues there will come a time when fenced hunting may be all that will be available for many hunters. The human population is rapidly expanding and our resources are diminishing. If we can not discuss that possibility rationally and civilly we will fail.
At some point we will have no other choice other then to adapt or see hunting come to an end.
The ball is in our court gentlemen.
__________________
Democracy substitutes election by the incompetent many for appointment by the corrupt few.
George Bernard Shaw
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01-20-2018, 07:55 AM
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Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 772
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nube
No guide needed and no I don't think the tag is $300 either.
Would you pay $250 for a hundred thousand acres of land to hunt full of antelope and elk?
If farmers could get a little compensation like that from hunters I bet you would see a whole lot more land open up in Alberta for people to hunt on.
I'm not saying I want to go that route but that really isn't a whole lot to pay for something like that I don't think.
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Ok I just quickly looked at the regs and the guide thing I'll pass on as I cant quite figure that out although from the regs "Nonresident big and trophy game hunters are required to obtain a professional outfitter or resident guide while hunting in any federally designated wilderness area. All outfitters must be licensed by the Wyoming Board of Outfitters and Professional Guides." So there is something else going on private land I guess.
Non resident antelope tag, $326, non resident antelope landowner $326, non resident antelope special $614. You can get doe and fawn for less. Plus hunting permits...
This is antelope only in the highest density antelope population jurisdiction anywhere. Looks like you could get drawn virtually every year but not every year in the best zones.
Also a quick calculation. They have more quota than we have antelope.
Elk draws are way tuffer to get.
So for the trespass fee. My quick look around is $250 a day. But you had the freind so. A quick google shows some trespass fees to be higher than that in the "trophy " zones.
All that said there are areas of public land that are free.
Sort of like our white tail.
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01-20-2018, 07:59 AM
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Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 772
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nube
And it doesn't surprise me that some think what our Bio's are doing is just hunky dory as well! Lots of people with their heads up their arse
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Considering the constant pressure from half witted arm chair bios I'd say they are doing very well. You want them to do more send them more money. That would be a political thing not a department thing.
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01-20-2018, 10:02 AM
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 1,920
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Quote:
You want them to do more send them more money.
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I Like That .
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01-20-2018, 10:39 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 863
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nube
No guide needed and no I don't think the tag is $300 either.
Would you pay $250 for a hundred thousand acres of land to hunt full of antelope and elk?
If farmers could get a little compensation like that from hunters I bet you would see a whole lot more land open up in Alberta for people to hunt on.
I'm not saying I want to go that route but that really isn't a whole lot to pay for something like that I don't think.
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$250 is not going to change the minds of landowners in Alberta.
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01-20-2018, 12:48 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: In a house
Posts: 7,770
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SLH
Ok I just quickly looked at the regs and the guide thing I'll pass on as I cant quite figure that out although from the regs "Nonresident big and trophy game hunters are required to obtain a professional outfitter or resident guide while hunting in any federally designated wilderness area. All outfitters must be licensed by the Wyoming Board of Outfitters and Professional Guides." So there is something else going on private land I guess.
Non resident antelope tag, $326, non resident antelope landowner $326, non resident antelope special $614. You can get doe and fawn for less. Plus hunting permits...
This is antelope only in the highest density antelope population jurisdiction anywhere. Looks like you could get drawn virtually every year but not every year in the best zones.
Also a quick calculation. They have more quota than we have antelope.
Elk draws are way tuffer to get.
So for the trespass fee. My quick look around is $250 a day. But you had the freind so. A quick google shows some trespass fees to be higher than that in the "trophy " zones.
All that said there are areas of public land that are free.
Sort of like our white tail.
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Nice you took the time to look at tag cost.
Price of $250 was not per day it was a one time trespass fee per hunter and yes you can hunt public free. I'd say pretty good cost for being able to hunt antelope every year and have a bunch of land to hunt....
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01-20-2018, 12:49 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: In a house
Posts: 7,770
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boah
$250 is not going to change the minds of landowners in Alberta.
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You don't think $250 PER HUNTER would get some landowners interested lol
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01-20-2018, 01:09 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Copperhead Road, Morinville
Posts: 19,289
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Nube, I don't think that paid access is the route to go. I've lived in countries where that was the norm and the end result was that only the wealthy could afford to hunt. Once paid access becomes a free enterprise, supply and demand will dictate what landowners would charge for access. In other words, wealthy people who are willing to pay more would effectively out price the average fella. Not a good idea at all IMO.
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01-20-2018, 01:27 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nube
You don't think $250 PER HUNTER would get some landowners interested lol
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LOL $250 per hunter. Just speaking for myself, not even remotely worth the hassle or liability.
That being said SOME people will do anything for a bit of pocket change.
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01-20-2018, 02:08 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: In a house
Posts: 7,770
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HunterDave
Nube, I don't think that paid access is the route to go. I've lived in countries where that was the norm and the end result was that only the wealthy could afford to hunt. Once paid access becomes a free enterprise, supply and demand will dictate what landowners would charge for access. In other words, wealthy people who are willing to pay more would effectively out price the average fella. Not a good idea at all IMO.
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I am not for it as stated earlier Dave..... Just saying for those that have issues with draw wait times and want to go hunt there are lots of options and they are not that expensive
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01-20-2018, 02:52 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,909
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pekan
I've seen posts you recently put up, I'm kinda surprised that you're so doom and gloom about the state of things here in Alberta. How many rams have you harvested in Alberta? and your daughter drew a bison tag this year too?
So just how good do you want it? Because the way I see it, you've had some pretty tremendous hunting opportunities over the years.
And you don't want to join any conservation groups because they might not have exactly the same views as you.
Reminds me of the people who don't vote but still complain steady about the government......
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So much truth in this post. Far too many "experts" that are so willing to take, take, take...but when it comes to putting something back, whether it's money or their time, forget it.
__________________
Never say "Whoa" in a mud hole.
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01-20-2018, 02:58 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 863
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nube
You don't think $250 PER HUNTER would get some landowners interested lol
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NO lol.
I thought for $250 you would have a 100000 acres to yourself, I guess not.
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01-20-2018, 02:59 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: In a house
Posts: 7,770
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Quote:
Originally Posted by albertadave
So much truth in this post. Far too many "experts" that are so willing to take, take, take...but when it comes to putting something back, whether it's money or their time, forget it.
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Well i hope you boys aren't just pointing a finger at me. You have no idea what I have contributed and guess what you don't have to belong to a group to do that either.
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01-20-2018, 04:04 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 933
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pekan
I've seen posts you recently put up, I'm kinda surprised that you're so doom and gloom about the state of things here in Alberta. How many rams have you harvested in Alberta? and your daughter drew a bison tag this year too?
So just how good do you want it? Because the way I see it, you've had some pretty tremendous hunting opportunities over the years.
And you don't want to join any conservation groups because they might not have exactly the same views as you.
Reminds me of the people who don't vote but still complain steady about the government......
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A++ would read again.
Basically he's crapping on AB hunting without mentioning the trophies he's taken, also I remember a post of his in the elk island park elk cull thread "open it up for the tags to be auctioned, and take a $10000 line of credit for the tag" yup gonna get right on that!
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01-20-2018, 04:05 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 933
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mistermoosealberta
LOL $250 per hunter. Just speaking for myself, not even remotely worth the hassle or liability.
That being said SOME people will do anything for a bit of pocket change.
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$250, maybe $500 for 2 guys hunting and one of them throws their back out on your land hauling out their kill and now you're slapped with a lawsuit. All for an extra $500 lol. No thanks.
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01-20-2018, 04:58 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nube
Well i hope you boys aren't just pointing a finger at me. You have no idea what I have contributed and guess what you don't have to belong to a group to do that either.
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Your initial sentence makes me think you have some doubts about yourself and really why you are attempting to manage an RFMA . But I'm not Frasier Crane and don't have a PhD so I'll leave speculation at that.
I'll step out there and say from my point of view from what I have seen of you on this Forum you are a taker and not a giver but enlighten us. Maybe communication skills are being misinterpreted.
Just putting in some effort on your trapline controlling fur bearing predators counts for what should be EXPECTED of you..not portraying it like a big service to mankind and the hunting fraternity.
Most REAL trappers I know do that without fan fare or pumping themselves up on a public Forum. That in my opinion is what an RFMA holder signs on for as part of the Steward of the Land title. Goes with the job is what I would say is best fitting.
Just had to say it.
Flame away!!
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01-20-2018, 05:13 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: In a house
Posts: 7,770
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mistermoosealberta
Your initial sentence makes me think you have some doubts about yourself and really why you are attempting to manage an RFMA . But I'm not Frasier Crane and don't have a PhD so I'll leave speculation at that.
I'll step out there and say from my point of view from what I have seen of you on this Forum you are a taker and not a giver but enlighten us. Maybe communication skills are being misinterpreted.
Just putting in some effort on your trapline controlling fur bearing predators counts for what should be EXPECTED of you..not portraying it like a big service to mankind and the hunting fraternity.
Most REAL trappers I know do that without fan fare or pumping themselves up on a public Forum. That in my opinion is what an RFMA holder signs on for as part of the Steward of the Land title. Goes with the job is what I would say is best fitting.
Just had to say it.
Flame away!!
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says the guy with a post count of 10 and been around since November lol
I wasn't even thinking of my trapping practices either. But whatever.....
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01-20-2018, 05:25 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 4,130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mistermoosealberta
Your initial sentence makes me think you have some doubts about yourself and really why you are attempting to manage an RFMA . But I'm not Frasier Crane and don't have a PhD so I'll leave speculation at that.
I'll step out there and say from my point of view from what I have seen of you on this Forum you are a taker and not a giver but enlighten us. Maybe communication skills are being misinterpreted.
Just putting in some effort on your trapline controlling fur bearing predators counts for what should be EXPECTED of you..not portraying it like a big service to mankind and the hunting fraternity.
Most REAL trappers I know do that without fan fare or pumping themselves up on a public Forum. That in my opinion is what an RFMA holder signs on for as part of the Steward of the Land title. Goes with the job is what I would say is best fitting.
Just had to say it.
Flame away!!
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You have him figured out pretty quick
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01-20-2018, 05:56 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 455
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I have quit hunting due to lack of time and access and as some may have seen or will see all my gear on the buy and sell section. I never bothered joining a club as i didnt see any value in it. But i think hunters should start their own conservation efforts just like ducks unlimited for example.
Time to pool our money together and stsrt buying rural land and bring back the wetlands. Maybe give access to ppl to hike and camp during summer and just allow hunters in during hunting season. The more land hunters own the more conservation they can do and no one can deny that .
If we continue the way we are now, then i expect hunting to be obselete within 20 od so years as the antis pressure is loud and being heard everywhere and in all places of power
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01-20-2018, 06:38 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nube
says the guy with a post count of 10 and been around since November lol
I wasn't even thinking of my trapping practices either. But whatever.....
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Sorry for the low post count and a new member. If that is a criteria for expressing one's thoughts about issues YOU are probably in the wrong forum..or maybe not?
I have had many PM's saying I'm done here because I was forward in what I said. I would hope not the case but if it is so be it. If I ever posted like you did to Pikergolf I would gladly surrender membership. That was totally rude!!
See what the management does. Definately will be indicative of a go forward on how people view this Forum.
Aside from that you never addressed any of the issues. Just emotional crappola.
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