Latest political gem, RE: Abortion from USA

[thirty-30]

Normally I don't post this kind of stuff but this literally made me spit out my water this morning.

From House Bill 206: "Tampering with evidence shall include procuring or facilitating an abortion, or compelling or coercing another to obtain an abortion, of a fetus that is the result of criminal sexual penetration or incest with the intent to destroy evidence of the crime."

So send a woman to jail because she terminated the pregnancy as a result of rape because that is tampering with evidence? Really?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0...?utm_hp_ref=tw

http://jezebel.com/5978664/new-mexic...-with-evidence

[Okotokian]

Like a private members bill here. Will never pass. Don't worry about it.

However, I WOULD be in favour of that bill if they just took out the "procuring or facilitating " part so that it just made compelling or coercing illegal. No one should be compelled to have one.

[Mutter87]

Abortions should be illegal, they are immoral and wrong. They openly state people in the Western World are not having enough children yet they have revolving doors on Abortion clinics. Shut down the clinics!

I am out on this convo!

IBTL

[FishingMOM]

never mind

[thirty-30]

Originally Posted by FishingMOM

never mind

I think I agree O.O

[Big Daddy Badger]

Originally Posted by Mutter87

Abortions should be illegal, they are immoral and wrong. They openly state people in the Western World are not having enough children yet they have revolving doors on Abortion clinics. Shut down the clinics!

I am out on this convo!

IBTL

Or men could learn to keep it in their pants... wrap their weasel.

Let the folks left with the responsability for either having the child or killing it decide for themselves... its their burden.

I do not believe abortion is a substitute for family planning and I also feel it is morally wrong but in the end... it is not for me to impose my morality on people who are often victims.

It is a womans decissions and remains that way until we can make men more accountable for their actions as well.

[Arachnodisiac]

Pesky: Thank you.

You just saved me a lot of grief.

[Albertadiver]

Originally Posted by Arachnodisiac

Pesky: Thank you.

You just saved me a lot of grief.

Missed you Arach! Nice to see you around again.

[Arachnodisiac]

Thanks!

I've been super busy with all my new jobs... just haven't had time lately.

Missed y'all too! <3

[Mutter87]

Originally Posted by pesky672

Or men could learn to keep it in their pants... wrap their weasel.

Let the folks left with the responsability for either having the child or killing it decide for themselves... its their burden.

I do not believe abortion is a substitute for family planning and I also feel it is morally wrong but in the end... it is not for me to impose my morality on people who are often victims.

It is a womans decissions and remains that way until we can make men more accountable for their actions as well.

Nope, It is a living child. Its not their choice to kill a baby.

A decaying society is one that allows the murder of innocent children. Heck, We encourage it.

Give it up for adoption. I could not care less if your social life is ruined.

[CanuckShooter]

From House Bill 206: "Tampering with evidence shall include procuring or facilitating an abortion, or compelling or coercing another to obtain an abortion, of a fetus that is the result of criminal sexual penetration or incest with the intent to destroy evidence of the crime."


This is interesting...the fetus is necessary evidence of the crime?? Hooboy, what next?

[CanuckShooter]

Originally Posted by Mutter87

Nope, It is a living child. Its not their choice to kill a baby.

A decaying society is one that allows the murder of innocent children. Heck, We encourage it.

Give it up for adoption. I could not care less if your social life is ruined.

I agree with you....and I'm thankful I'll never have to face making a decision to abort. If it's legal to kill a fetus....why can't they off some of the scum we are feeding and housing in our jails?

[Mutter87]

Originally Posted by CanuckShooter

I agree with you....and I'm thankful I'll never have to face making a decision to abort. If it's legal to kill a fetus....why can't they off some of the scum we are feeding and housing in our jails?

And I agree with you. Touch children and go to jail, kill a child in a womb and you a civil rights hero .

Man doesn't want a child and he's a deadbeat
Woman doesn't want a child and she is Pro choice.

[BeeGuy]

Originally Posted by Mutter87

Abortions should be illegal, they are immoral and wrong. They openly state people in the Western World are not having enough children yet they have revolving doors on Abortion clinics. Shut down the clinics!

I am out on this convo!

IBTL

Give

Originally Posted by Mutter87

Nope, It is a living child. Its not their choice to kill a baby.

A decaying society is one that allows the murder of innocent children. Heck, We encourage it.

Give it up for adoption. I could not care less if your social life is ruined.

It

Originally Posted by Mutter87

And I agree with you. Touch children and go to jail, kill a child in a womb and you a civil rights hero .

Man doesn't want a child and he's a deadbeat
Woman doesn't want a child and she is Pro choice.

A Rest

[Arachnodisiac]

Originally Posted by Mutter87

And I agree with you. Touch children and go to jail, kill a child in a womb and you a civil rights hero .

Man doesn't want a child and he's a deadbeat
Woman doesn't want a child and she is Pro choice.

Pesky? Pesky?? Where are youuuuuu??

Mutter: Really? You see no difference in a born child versus an unborn one in the first trimester of development?

It's funny - so many people who are opposed to abortion are the same ones opposed to a social safety net. Many of the abortions are from young women who aren't in a position to have a child yet. Sometimes, these women are living high risk lifestyles including drugs and prostitution.

If you forced these women to have these babies, are you prepared to open a foster home, adopt them or feed and clothe them?

I don't know if you're aware, but placing FAS babies into adoptive homes is difficult. It's even more difficult once they are toddlers or over, when they are finally removed from their homes and their ill-equipped birth family.

Seriously. I am a single mom, two boys, educated and employed - and it takes everything I have to keep everyone happy, fed and clothed.

I can absolutely guarantee you that if I became unexpectedly pregnant, there's no way I'd carry it to term. I'd be risking our tenuous hold on stability, and instead of independently and adequately looking after two children, I'd be inadequately be looking after three.

But I guess in your world, I just shouldn't have sex again until menopause on the off chance preventative measures fail.

Awesome.

[Donkey Oatey]

Originally Posted by Arachnodisiac

Pesky? Pesky?? Where are youuuuuu??

Mutter: Really? You see no difference in a born child versus an unborn one in the first trimester of development?

It's funny - so many people who are opposed to abortion are the same ones opposed to a social safety net. Many of the abortions are from young women who aren't in a position to have a child yet. Sometimes, these women are living high risk lifestyles including drugs and prostitution.

If you forced these women to have these babies, are you prepared to open a foster home, adopt them or feed and clothe them?

I don't know if you're aware, but placing FAS babies into adoptive homes is difficult. It's even more difficult once they are toddlers or over, when they are finally removed from their homes and their ill-equipped birth family.

Seriously. I am a single mom, two boys, educated and employed - and it takes everything I have to keep everyone happy, fed and clothed.

I can absolutely guarantee you that if I became unexpectedly pregnant, there's no way I'd carry it to term. I'd be risking our tenuous hold on stability, and instead of independently and adequately looking after two children, I'd be inadequately be looking after three.

But I guess in your world, I just shouldn't have sex again until menopause on the off chance preventative measures fail.

Awesome.

Well said. I am pretty sure there is a member here that must have hit the M in his name when he should have hit N.

[Arachnodisiac]

Originally Posted by Donkey Oatey

Well said. I am pretty sure there is a member here that must have hit the M in his name when he should have hit N.

Best. Line. Ever.

[vcmm]

Originally Posted by Arachnodisiac

Pesky? Pesky?? Where are youuuuuu??

Mutter: Really? You see no difference in a born child versus an unborn one in the first trimester of development?

It's funny - so many people who are opposed to abortion are the same ones opposed to a social safety net. Many of the abortions are from young women who aren't in a position to have a child yet. Sometimes, these women are living high risk lifestyles including drugs and prostitution.

If you forced these women to have these babies, are you prepared to open a foster home, adopt them or feed and clothe them?

I don't know if you're aware, but placing FAS babies into adoptive homes is difficult. It's even more difficult once they are toddlers or over, when they are finally removed from their homes and their ill-equipped birth family.

Seriously. I am a single mom, two boys, educated and employed - and it takes everything I have to keep everyone happy, fed and clothed.

I can absolutely guarantee you that if I became unexpectedly pregnant, there's no way I'd carry it to term. I'd be risking our tenuous hold on stability, and instead of independently and adequately looking after two children, I'd be inadequately be looking after three.

But I guess in your world, I just shouldn't have sex again until menopause on the off chance preventative measures fail.

Awesome.

Look up^ What she said.

[jkav]

Woman's body = woman's choice.

Everything else is just peripheral noise.

J.

[bessiedog]

Yup
With ya on this one spidey.

You go girl

[Big Daddy Badger]

Originally Posted by Arachnodisiac

Pesky? Pesky?? Where are youuuuuu??

Mutter: Really? You see no difference in a born child versus an unborn one in the first trimester of development?

It's funny - so many people who are opposed to abortion are the same ones opposed to a social safety net. Many of the abortions are from young women who aren't in a position to have a child yet. Sometimes, these women are living high risk lifestyles including drugs and prostitution.

If you forced these women to have these babies, are you prepared to open a foster home, adopt them or feed and clothe them?

I don't know if you're aware, but placing FAS babies into adoptive homes is difficult. It's even more difficult once they are toddlers or over, when they are finally removed from their homes and their ill-equipped birth family.

Seriously. I am a single mom, two boys, educated and employed - and it takes everything I have to keep everyone happy, fed and clothed.

I can absolutely guarantee you that if I became unexpectedly pregnant, there's no way I'd carry it to term. I'd be risking our tenuous hold on stability, and instead of independently and adequately looking after two children, I'd be inadequately be looking after three.

But I guess in your world, I just shouldn't have sex again until menopause on the off chance preventative measures fail.

Awesome.

Sorry Arach...welcome back by the way.

Since the heart thing my doctor says I can do anything I want now...but I can't do it when I'm angry.

Like I said.. I do not support abortion but I do support the idea that God gave us all free will and at some point... we need to let folks exercise that and let God decide how He feels about their decisions.

What happens in any womans pants... other than Mrs Peskys is not my business and I can't sit in judgemnt of every woman that decides to do it.
They have their reasons and any laws related to abortion should be geared towards making sure they are darn good ones and the rest should be left to conscience and God.

[airbornedeerhunter]

If abortion is murder, masturbation must be genocide!

This ship has sailed in Canada, there is no appetite for debate on this issue anymore. Any political party that even tried to make it illegal would be performing ritual suicide. Noone has the right to tell a woman what she can or can't do with her own body. Abortions due to pregnancies that will carry to term a severely disabled child, a child that is the result of incest or rape or a mom who is in no state to carry a baby to term, or even a simply unwanted pregnancy are the complete and sole decision of the woman whose body carries it. Noone elses.

The bible thumping on this issue is getting really old.

[catnthehat]

I cannot find it in me to tell a woman to have a child that was the result of rape , and this is just one of the instances against abortion.
Cat

[canadiantdi]

Originally Posted by Mutter87

And I agree with you. Touch children and go to jail, kill a child in a womb and you a civil rights hero .

Man doesn't want a child and he's a deadbeat
Woman doesn't want a child and she is Pro choice.

Bizarre isn't it??

[slough shark]

Originally Posted by Arachnodisiac

Pesky? Pesky?? Where are youuuuuu??

Mutter: Really? You see no difference in a born child versus an unborn one in the first trimester of development?

It's funny - so many people who are opposed to abortion are the same ones opposed to a social safety net. Many of the abortions are from young women who aren't in a position to have a child yet. Sometimes, these women are living high risk lifestyles including drugs and prostitution.

If you forced these women to have these babies, are you prepared to open a foster home, adopt them or feed and clothe them?

I don't know if you're aware, but placing FAS babies into adoptive homes is difficult. It's even more difficult once they are toddlers or over, when they are finally removed from their homes and their ill-equipped birth family.

Seriously. I am a single mom, two boys, educated and employed - and it takes everything I have to keep everyone happy, fed and clothed.

I can absolutely guarantee you that if I became unexpectedly pregnant, there's no way I'd carry it to term. I'd be risking our tenuous hold on stability, and instead of independently and adequately looking after two children, I'd be inadequately be looking after three.

But I guess in your world, I just shouldn't have sex again until menopause on the off chance preventative measures fail.

Awesome.

I'm not saying that I agree or disagree with abortion in all circumstances but you brought up trimesters. It is unacceptable IMHO that abortion is an option until the baby comes out naturally, in some cases having to be outright killed in the womb because the baby would be self sufficient if it was just taken out. Whenever did putting a baby up for adoption become such a hard thing? how many people on here know someone who has adopted a child? I myself know quite a few and in most cases it was incredibly difficult and expensive to be able to adopt and in several cases they went overseas as there wasn't any baby's here in Canada...

[Albertadiver]

I may anger some people, and I'm not sure why I'm posting, but here goes....


I was adopted at birth. My birth mom was 15 years old. My birth father was an 18yr old trucker that was boarding with the family at the time. I was the result.

Thankfully, I was put up for adoption, and I could not have a better family. The people that made me are simply that. Irresponsible kids that resulted in a pregnancy. I'm glad I lived and someone didn't decide to just end my life because I was an inconveniance, or felt I would have a poor life.

A life is a life. To me, how that person is made is irrelevant. A rape is a horrible, traumatic, life changing event for a woman. As a man, I could never appreciate the feelings of violation and pain that a woman would go through. Despite the horrors of the situation, I do not believe rape is a reason to kill another life.

These are my own personal beliefs and values that I hold very close to me. Me being adopted has nothing to do with these beliefs, but does reinforce some of my values. I'm not militant with them by any means, by forcing my opinions and values on others.

So, just an opinion on the matter. Many dissagree with me, but with respect, I'm not flaming or arguing with you, just posting my beliefs.

[Donkey Oatey]

Originally Posted by Albertadiver

I may anger some people, and I'm not sure why I'm posting, but here goes....


I was adopted at birth. My birth mom was 15 years old. My birth father was an 18yr old trucker that was boarding with the family at the time. I was the result.

Thankfully, I was put up for adoption, and I could not have a better family. The people that made me are simply that. Irresponsible kids that resulted in a pregnancy. I'm glad I lived and someone didn't decide to just end my life because I was an inconveniance, or felt I would have a poor life.

A life is a life. To me, how that person is made is irrelevant. A rape is a horrible, traumatic, life changing event for a woman. As a man, I could never appreciate the feelings of violation and pain that a woman would go through. Despite the horrors of the situation, I do not believe rape is a reason to kill another life.

These are my own personal beliefs and values that I hold very close to me. Me being adopted has nothing to do with these beliefs, but does reinforce some of my values. I'm not militant with them by any means, by forcing my opinions and values on others.

So, just an opinion on the matter. Many dissagree with me, but with respect, I'm not flaming or arguing with you, just posting my beliefs.

I don't disagree with you at all Diver. Where I disagree is when that opinion or belief is forced on everyone.

Everyone can have an opinion on the subject. The line gets drawn where one group is forcing their opinion on someone else.

I don't think abortion is right. I would never council my wife or my children to ever get one. I won't tell the woman down the street she can't have one. I agree with pesky, up until the point about god, but that is another discussion altogether.

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by Mutter87

Abortions should be illegal, they are immoral and wrong. They openly state people in the Western World are not having enough children yet they have revolving doors on Abortion clinics. Shut down the clinics!

I am out on this convo!

IBTL

I am not for unregulated abortion, but I am also not for abolishing it either. There needs to be a happy medium. However with people with strong opinions such as you on this subject, there will always be discussion and problems.

[CNP]

Originally Posted by airbornedeerhunter

If abortion is murder, masturbation must be genocide!

This ship has sailed in Canada, there is no appetite for debate on this issue anymore. Any political party that even tried to make it illegal would be performing ritual suicide. Noone has the right to tell a woman what she can or can't do with her own body. Abortions due to pregnancies that will carry to term a severely disabled child, a child that is the result of incest or rape or a mom who is in no state to carry a baby to term, or even a simply unwanted pregnancy are the complete and sole decision of the woman whose body carries it. Noone elses.

The bible thumping on this issue is getting really old.

If abortion is murder, masturbation must be genocide!

Point not taken. Your sperm is nothing by itself.

This ship has sailed in Canada, there is no appetite for debate on this issue anymore

Wrong again.

The bible thumping on this issue is getting really old.[/

There hasn't been any bible thumping.....yet. The conversation so far is courteous, limited to opinion and personal experience.

Yayyyyyyyyyyyyyyy for Alberta Diver.

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by Albertadiver

I may anger some people, and I'm not sure why I'm posting, but here goes....


I was adopted at birth. My birth mom was 15 years old. My birth father was an 18yr old trucker that was boarding with the family at the time. I was the result.

Thankfully, I was put up for adoption, and I could not have a better family. The people that made me are simply that. Irresponsible kids that resulted in a pregnancy. I'm glad I lived and someone didn't decide to just end my life because I was an inconveniance, or felt I would have a poor life.

A life is a life. To me, how that person is made is irrelevant. A rape is a horrible, traumatic, life changing event for a woman. As a man, I could never appreciate the feelings of violation and pain that a woman would go through. Despite the horrors of the situation, I do not believe rape is a reason to kill another life.

These are my own personal beliefs and values that I hold very close to me. Me being adopted has nothing to do with these beliefs, but does reinforce some of my values. I'm not militant with them by any means, by forcing my opinions and values on others.

So, just an opinion on the matter. Many dissagree with me, but with respect, I'm not flaming or arguing with you, just posting my beliefs.

There are too many strict regulations making it very difficult and expensive for good people to adopt children. You were one of the lucky ones. Many are not, and lots of children end up growing up in dysfunctional situations, and this is a burden on our society, not just those irresponsible parents who made the child.