Ali#1, you were right about Arizona.

[Donkey Oatey]

Originally Posted by canadiantdi

I agree that science is moving forward.. I don't know how much better off we are though.. medicine is amazing, but a lot of our problems are from abusing our bodies..

We are fat and lazy now! Our smarts are located on a server somewhere. Our food comes from a store.

Technology is great I admit.. PS4 looks amazing compared to my old intellivision..

And yet you still didn't answer the question. Would any of those change your mind? Or would faith be stronger?

I like Penn Jillette, very good speaker on the subject and very knowledgeable. Basically says that once you have absolution to your sins you take away responsibility. Atheists don't that option. The only absolution we have is from friends, family and fading memories so we have to do it right the first time around

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by ali#1

Do you believe that Allah is god ?

Allah is the Islamic name for God. So yes.

One of the biggest differences between Islam and Christianity is Mohamed was a prophet, Jesus is the son of God.

[ali#1]

Originally Posted by Donkey Oatey

And yet you still didn't answer the question. Would any of those change your mind? Or would faith be stronger?

I like Penn Jillette, very good speaker on the subject and very knowledgeable. Basically says that once you have absolution to your sins you take away responsibility. Atheists don't that option. The only absolution we have is from friends, family and fading memories so we have to do it right the first time around

Wanting to believe is partially the want to be a slave.

[ali#1]

Originally Posted by rwm1273

Allah is the Islamic name for God. So yes.

One of the biggest differences between Islam and Christianity is Mohamed was a prophet, Jesus is the son of God.

I know the historical text but do you believe Allah is god or do you believe Jesus is god ?.

[ali#1]

Originally Posted by rwm1273

Really? You want to use that as an argument? Pathetic.

There is no evidence either exhisted. Even if Jesus did exhist and it can be proven he did that still doesn't prove he was god or the reincarnation of god not does a virgin birth nor a resurrection.

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by ali#1

Yeah caring about human rights makes me a cry baby, get a grip on your life your argument must be weak. Gay people are people and deserve love an respect too bad Jesus didn't say love your neighbour or anything.

Actually Jesus did say that, as well as many other similar things.

What you still can't accept, is that religious people have rights too.

[Winch101]

A thread with over 500 posts should have a theme song that depicts
The essence of the information.....

I submit one such song that should cover it. Enjoy



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_6KuYtc0Z8

[ali#1]

Originally Posted by rwm1273

Actually Jesus did say that, as well as many other similar things.

What you still can't accept, is that religious people have rights too.

The right to discriminate isn't a right I respect.

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by ali#1

I haven't abdicated for harm against anybody in this thread. I get it
You don't like gay people and any excuse you can find against them is good enough for you. But me I like freedom and not lumping my fellow humans together In groups.

Again you still can't get it through your thick head. It is not an issue of not liking gay people, it is an issue of deciding if their rights trump a person's religious rights.

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by connexion123

Is your main goal to hate God or abuse Christian's rights?

It appears they seem to be the same goal.

[canadiantdi]

Originally Posted by Donkey Oatey

And yet you still didn't answer the question. Would any of those change your mind? Or would faith be stronger?

I like Penn Jillette, very good speaker on the subject and very knowledgeable. Basically says that once you have absolution to your sins you take away responsibility. Atheists don't that option. The only absolution we have is from friends, family and fading memories so we have to do it right the first time around

I wish I had an answer for you... sorry..

I don't think that true Christianity involves a free pass to do whatever because our sins are taken away.

Romans 2:4
Or do you presume on the riches of his kindness and forbearance and patience, not knowing that God's kindness is meant to lead you to repentance?

[ali#1]

Originally Posted by rwm1273

Again you still can't get it through your thick head. It is not an issue of not liking gay people, it is an issue of deciding if their rights trump a person's religious rights.

In a country with a supposed wall of separation between church and state I say no. In Iran or Saudi Arabia then yes go ahead and discriminate on religious bigotry.

[Donkey Oatey]

Originally Posted by rwm1273

Again you still can't get it through your thick head. It is not an issue of not liking gay people, it is an issue of deciding if their rights trump a person's religious rights.

Like the song, wheels go round and round.

Sorry what religious rights were trumped? Where they stopped from practicing their religion? Thrown in jail for practicing their religion? Nope they were stopped from singling out a group of people by sexual orientation and refusing to serve them. Much like has been said over and over and over, exactly the same as the Jim Crow laws and slavery.

There was no agenda until they were discriminated against. Much like many here would be making an issue out of not being served because of being hunters, gun owners etc.

[fish gunner]

Originally Posted by connexion123

And what makes that the accurate way of dating?

Light speed answers all things time wise. we look back in recorded history, roughly 5000yrs in this history we find super nova perhaps even the star of Bethlehem . Now we do backwards math to ascertain where in the modern present sky this anomaly should be , most times a nebula is visable . Now we know when and where. It is rrlitivly simple ot measure the distamce the nebula has expanded in the time period from the recorded witness . When we compare this to other nebula we understand how much time we are recording today eg if the Bethlehem nova is x wide it can be suggested 2000 yrs to attain x . Nebula b is x(x10) it can be said to have expanded 20000 yrs . Neat how math and the universe work so well till we start down the quantum mechanics of the universe.

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by ali#1

So if the earth is 10000 years old you believe people were murdering as raping and killing each other freely before Jesus came along ?. 8000 of indifference toward humans ?.

And how do you lump me into the idea that the earth is only 10,000yrs old? You don't know me. You don't know my beliefs other than what I have said here, and that is that I believe people have religious rights as well.

I wrote an article today about the 3.2 million yr old humanid named Lucy found in Ethiopia. So if I believe in such things, then I can't believe in the earth only being 10,000yrs old now can I.

So who is the one twisting people's statements, or inferring statements to others? Oh right, that would be you doing that. Do you always talk from both ends?

[ali#1]

Originally Posted by rwm1273

And how do you lump me into the idea that the earth is only 10,000yrs old? You don't know me. You don't know my beliefs other than what I have said here, and that is that I believe people have religious rights as well.

I wrote an article today about the 3.2 million yr old humanid named Lucy found in Ethiopia. So if I believe in such things, then I can't believe in the earth only being 10,000yrs old now can I.

So who is the one twisting people's statements, or inferring statements to others? Oh right, that would be you doing that. Do you always talk from both ends?

Maybe I got confused I am talking to 3 or 4 people at the same time.

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by Donkey Oatey

Like the song, wheels go round and round.

Sorry what religious rights were trumped? Where they stopped from practicing their religion? Thrown in jail for practicing their religion? Nope they were stopped from singling out a group of people by sexual orientation and refusing to serve them. Much like has been said over and over and over, exactly the same as the Jim Crow laws and slavery.

There was no agenda until they were discriminated against. Much like many here would be making an issue out of not being served because of being hunters, gun owners etc.

One was taken to court and ordered to violate his religious morals in support of a gay marriage. The other risked having his business shut down.

So does that not appear to be risking your rights? Their religious rights were trumped over the rights of a woman wanting to get her hair cut, and a gay couple having a cake baked.

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by ali#1

Maybe I got confused I am talking to 3 or 4 people at the same time.

More like arguing.

I accept you have an opinion, I just have a hard time understanding why you can't accept others have an opinion.

You seem to hate religion so much that you are willing to ignore religious rights are also enshrined in law.

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by ali#1

In a country with a supposed wall of separation between church and state I say no. In Iran or Saudi Arabia then yes go ahead and discriminate on religious bigotry.

But aren't you being a bigot if you force someone to violate their religious rights?

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by winch101

a thread with over 500 posts should have a theme song that depicts
the essence of the information.....

I submit one such song that should cover it. Enjoy



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_6kuytc0z8

lol.

[ali#1]

Originally Posted by rwm1273

But aren't you being a bigot if you force someone to violate their religious rights?

Was someone forced to stop practicing their religion ?

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by ali#1

I know the historical text but do you believe Allah is god or do you believe Jesus is god ?.

Why can't they both be for those who believe?

[ali#1]

Originally Posted by rwm1273

More like arguing.

I accept you have an opinion, I just have a hard time understanding why you can't accept others have an opinion.

You seem to hate religion so much that you are willing to ignore religious rights are also enshrined in law.

One opinions based in fact and the others needs the suspension of belief. Would you respect my opinion on something if I had absolutely no evidence just that an invisible man only available to my eyes told me so ?.

[ali#1]

Originally Posted by rwm1273

Why can't they both be for those who believe?

Is it possible that their is more than one truth ? I mean can the earth be both flat and round at the same time depending on what you believe ?

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by ali#1

Was someone forced to stop practicing their religion ?

Yes. They were forced to violate their religious beliefs. One person because a gay couple wanted a gay marriage cake depicting an act that the baker felt was illegal according to his religious beliefs, and the other because a woman demanded he cut her hair.

Both the gay couple and the woman could have gone anywhere else for their services, but they demanded to force others to violate their religious tenants. So in my opinion it was the woman and the gay couple who were forcing their rights at the expense of the other's religious rights. How much longer will it be before other people's rights get trumped over someone else's selfish demands?

[Donkey Oatey]

Originally Posted by rwm1273

One was taken to court and ordered to violate his religious morals in support of a gay marriage. The other risked having his business shut down.

So does that not appear to be risking your rights? Their religious rights were trumped over the rights of a woman wanting to get her hair cut, and a gay couple having a cake baked.

Really? He baked a cake. Sorry don't remember that verse in the bible, can you help out a bit? And this business what did they do for a service, bake cakes. Does he not bake cakes for the jews and Bar Mitzva cakes because the Zionists control the world? So baking a cake for a wedding would be supporting gay marriage?

It was rightfully struck down. Still didn't answer the part of would you make a scene if you were denied service because of being a hunter, gun owner, fisherman?

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by ali#1

Is it possible that their is more than one truth ? I mean can the earth be both flat and round at the same time depending on what you believe ?

No, because the earth has been proven to be round.

God has not been proven to be non existent. There are some things that just can't be explained, and that is where faith comes in.

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by Donkey Oatey

Really? He baked a cake. Sorry don't remember that verse in the bible, can you help out a bit? And this business what did they do for a service, bake cakes. Does he not bake cakes for the jews and Bar Mitzva cakes because the Zionists control the world? So baking a cake for a wedding would be supporting gay marriage?

It was rightfully struck down. Still didn't answer the part of would you make a scene if you were denied service because of being a hunter, gun owner, fisherman?

I am sure that if a Jewish family came in, which I doubt would happen unless he baked his cakes in a kosher way, then I am sure he would have an issue with doing a proper job for them. However since Jesus was a Jew, I suspect the baker would not have that much of an issue baking a cake for a Jewish ceremony.

Your suggestion of linking the religious issues to hunting issues is without merit.

Now it is written in several sections of the bible as well as the Qur'an and numerous other religious books that homosexuality is a sin, so that is the issue for the baker. I never said I had an issue with gays, I just understand the baker's religious rights.

[fish gunner]

Originally Posted by rwm1273

No, because the earth has been proven to be round.

God has not been proven to be non existent. There are some things that just can't be explained, and that is where faith comes in.

Perhaps close ,cause he's not visable 13 billion yrs in any direction. Sooo we start down the road of alternative dimensions to find a place for god dude to exist.

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by ali#1

One opinions based in fact and the others needs the suspension of belief. Would you respect my opinion on something if I had absolutely no evidence just that an invisible man only available to my eyes told me so ?.

What you still can't grasp is the fact that we have religious rights in this country that are enshrined in law. It makes no difference if I believe in religion or not.