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04-27-2015, 08:36 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 1,520
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundancefisher
http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showt...ht=Carp&page=2
Sadly it is all too real and a major catastrophe affecting all anglers in Alberta. Like illegally introduced perch destroys the fishing in a trout pond ...so too will carp wreck havoc and harm pretty much all of Alberta and Saskatchewan.
Some idiots will move these to BC next potentially harming salmon fishing and trout fishing throughout the province. Just a matter of time before they spread south into the US.
Sad day when those idiots stocked the first pond.
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At least we don't stalk bass anymore
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04-27-2015, 10:26 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Cowtown
Posts: 770
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Gonna throw up now!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundancefisher
http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showt...ht=Carp&page=2
Sadly it is all too real and a major catastrophe affecting all anglers in Alberta. Like illegally introduced perch destroys the fishing in a trout pond ...so too will carp wreck havoc and harm pretty much all of Alberta and Saskatchewan.
Some idiots will move these to BC next potentially harming salmon fishing and trout fishing throughout the province. Just a matter of time before they spread south into the US.
Sad day when those idiots stocked the first pond.
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I couldn't agree more, very sad altogether and way too late to do anything about it. I find it interesting how some seem to think this INVASIVE species will not have a major impact on our fisheries. Very frustrating the justification going on regarding this whole carp business. To be honest I'm quite pi***d about quite a few of the comments. At the end of the day I guess thanks to ESRD's prompt response to the first report, we just have to enjoy our new wonderful sport fish!
__________________
I have been thinking of three things I would rather do than fishing...
#1 win the lottery (so I could fish everyday)
#2 & 3 still thinking.....
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04-28-2015, 05:20 AM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Calgary
Posts: 3,360
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To be honest I'm quite pi***d about quite a few of the comments.
No one is questioning that there here in AB. It's the comments about "water boiling with them" that has a few scratching there heads. Then some members asked where to go to catch some? You said you attached a map on page 2 of this thread. I have looked at your map and it's does not show anything but a bunch of ponds and marshes over a pretty large area, are all of them "boiling" with Carp?
If you have a spot that you want to keep to yourself for fishing - fair enough. But let's start sharing specific spots so people can go and catch them and feed them to the coyotes. I bet the are many many members with kids that would like to have a crack at these.
My $1.50 again on this topic. Even if it p****s of some.
Dodger.
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Freedom comes with responsibility and integrity. Not stupidity and self entitlement.
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04-28-2015, 08:05 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Cowtown
Posts: 770
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secret spot revealed...again
Quote:
Originally Posted by the local angler
ids i also agree with you that's why i also think this whole Persian carp thing is a hoax. i do believe it is in some of the reservoirs but i find it hard to believe its all over like the rumors are saying.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the local angler
well i hit alot of these lakes and ponds that were mentioned in the first few posts about this issue like dewitts, with the methods mentions along with other's that i met looking to catch some of these carps, no one has gotten a single bite or sign is why i am finding it hard to believe. obviously if the news and trout unlimited are reporting on them there is some truth to this issue i just haven't even seen any sign of them.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jorg
I think this thread is a long running April fools joke. I ran my nets in Weed lake today and it still contains glass worms, which don't live in bodies of water containing fish. Every fall I harvest river shrimp in the exit canals from Chestermere and Dalmead lakes ... lots of fish trapped in them ...still have not seen a carp.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dodger
To be honest I'm quite pi***d about quite a few of the comments.
No one is questioning that there here in AB. It's the comments about "water boiling with them" that has a few scratching there heads. Then some members asked where to go to catch some? You said you attached a map on page 2 of this thread. I have looked at your map and it's does not show anything but a bunch of ponds and marshes over a pretty large area, are all of them "boiling" with Carp?
If you have a spot that you want to keep to yourself for fishing - fair enough. But let's start sharing specific spots so people can go and catch them and feed them to the coyotes. I bet the are many many members with kids that would like to have a crack at these.
My $1.50 again on this topic. Even if it p****s of some.
Dodger.
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No one is questioning they are here?....Hwy#2 North to Hwy #567 East to Hwy#9 North again, First right (East) on Township #273, first right on lease road (South) First Left (East) follow to lake (largest body of water in the area). If you look at all the creeks on the map that come out of this water body and head into various other water body's as well as more larger creeks and irrigation canals. I would think its safe to say they are not in one isolated marsh or pond in the area...specific enough? I don't care to catch these fish at all...so have at it! my $1.50 again on this topic.
https://www.google.ca/maps/@51.2837532,-113.5502505,13z
__________________
I have been thinking of three things I would rather do than fishing...
#1 win the lottery (so I could fish everyday)
#2 & 3 still thinking.....
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04-28-2015, 08:49 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 821
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Everyone agrees that any kind of control is out of question now.
I'm just trying to look at the positive side, and clear up few miss conceptions on the topic. No need to be angry at anyone, we're on public forum, different opinions are to be expected.
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04-28-2015, 10:33 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,351
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeprli
Everyone agrees that any kind of control is out of question now.
I'm just trying to look at the positive side, and clear up few miss conceptions on the topic. No need to be angry at anyone, we're on public forum, different opinions are to be expected.
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There is no positive side when it comes to invasive species!
But we will have to deal with it and learn to live with it.
__________________
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eat a snickers
made in Alberta__ born n raised.
FS-Tinfool hats by the roll.
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04-28-2015, 05:28 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Calgary Perchdance
Posts: 19,285
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeprli
Everyone agrees that any kind of control is out of question now.
I'm just trying to look at the positive side, and clear up few miss conceptions on the topic. No need to be angry at anyone, we're on public forum, different opinions are to be expected.
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Positive side? A fast growing, highly prolific predator in ecosystems that have not evolved to work in harmony? The whole saskatchewan system had been infested. They harm habitat and eat the same food as existing species.
In turn what effect they will have on spawning survival is scary.
This is a public forum. Therefore why not support the protection of our sport versus destruction?
__________________
Observing the TIGSCJ in the wilds of social media socio-ecological uniformity environments.
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04-28-2015, 06:01 PM
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Join Date: May 2009
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fishslayer99 this body of water and directions you posted is there a name for this lake/pond? is this a public lake/pond or do we need to get land owners permission? thanks for the directions.
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04-28-2015, 07:30 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Sibbald Flats
Posts: 1,120
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Troubling news no doubt, that said is there research on the impacts we may see? I found one link below and one take away from it is that while crucian carp flourish in some waters they do not do well in waters with abundant predators.
http://www.fws.gov/injuriouswildlife...EB_9-15-14.pdf
So what I am trying to see is what impacts they will have on the different types of water bodies we have. Will they hurt trout fisheries but be negligible on pike and walleye waters?
Please share links to any impact studies you come across.
I am not trying to down play potential impacts just trying to discuss really what we may see. I know several people that swear Blood Indian is producing bigger trout the last couple years. (Strictly second hand info)
Please do not cite studies on the asian carp-apples and oranges. How real is the issue vs fear mongering? Eg the snakehead issue or even wild boar in Alberta(that should stir pot)
Btw I believe the people responsible should be prosecuted.
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04-28-2015, 08:11 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Calgary
Posts: 1,720
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If they are in this area then they will get into Bruce lake, which has many small pike in it, good way to find out who wins the battle will be the size of the pike in the near future, or the depletion !
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04-28-2015, 09:13 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Cowtown
Posts: 770
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the local angler
fishslayer99 this body of water and directions you posted is there a name for this lake/pond? is this a public lake/pond or do we need to get land owners permission? thanks for the directions.
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local angler,
There is no name for it, there is a lease road that goes right to the water body, so no you don't need permission as it is not a private road or water body. Catch and kill...good luck fishin!
__________________
I have been thinking of three things I would rather do than fishing...
#1 win the lottery (so I could fish everyday)
#2 & 3 still thinking.....
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04-28-2015, 09:22 PM
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Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,595
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cool thanks
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04-28-2015, 10:19 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 821
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Sunndance are you talking snake heads, don't remember Prussian carp predating on other fish.
I think your perch problem is getting to you.
Positive side, yes there has to be a positive to every negative.
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04-28-2015, 10:31 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 1,520
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeprli
Sunndance are you talking snake heads, don't remember Prussian carp predating on other fish.
I think your perch problem is getting to you.
Positive side, yes there has to be a positive to every negative.
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Well they don't outright eat the other gamefish, but they compete and deplete resources (food, space,oxygen,etc) that other (native) organisms - fish, inverts, plankton, plants - would consume. This consumption of resources travels up the food chain and unbalances of its original, native state. Which in turn will effect gamefish.
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04-28-2015, 10:56 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Cowtown
Posts: 770
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundancefisher
Positive side? A fast growing, highly prolific predator in ecosystems that have not evolved to work in harmony? The whole saskatchewan system had been infested. They harm habitat and eat the same food as existing species.
In turn what effect they will have on spawning survival is scary.
This is a public forum. Therefore why not support the protection of our sport versus destruction?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeprli
Sunndance are you talking snake heads, don't remember Prussian carp predating on other fish.
I think your perch problem is getting to you.
Positive side, yes there has to be a positive to every negative.
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I don't think Sundance has a problem at all, and I would like to think that 95% of the people on this forum would agree there is absolutely no positive side to invasive species!
__________________
I have been thinking of three things I would rather do than fishing...
#1 win the lottery (so I could fish everyday)
#2 & 3 still thinking.....
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04-29-2015, 12:03 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 821
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Yet we're all enjoying pretty, spotted beauties, that is brown and rainbow trout which 95 % of anglers like to catch and devote time. I'm a landed immigrant, you should like me too.
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04-29-2015, 10:21 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 1,520
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeprli
Yet we're all enjoying pretty, spotted beauties, that is brown and rainbow trout which 95 % of anglers like to catch and devote time. I'm a landed immigrant, you should like me too.
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Bonk the brookies, Browns and non-native bows. I don't have a problem with that of its legal
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04-29-2015, 10:39 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2007
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The US Fish and Wildlife Service Summary for Crucian Carp was posted a couple posts up. The species here is Prussian Carp and this is the link to the FWS summary for that species. It includes many references to impact studies in Europe where it has had major impacts on native species and habitats.
http://www.fws.gov/injuriouswildlife..._8-14-2012.pdf
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04-29-2015, 12:53 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Calgary
Posts: 882
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Based on the size people are catching this problem happened 10-15 years ago. Way to late to do anything now. Might as well get used to Prussian carp being here.
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I intend to live forever. So far so good
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04-29-2015, 02:11 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Cowtown
Posts: 770
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Facts or Observation?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Long Shot
The US Fish and Wildlife Service Summary for Crucian Carp was posted a couple posts up. The species here is Prussian Carp and this is the link to the FWS summary for that species. It includes many references to impact studies in Europe where it has had major impacts on native species and habitats.
http://www.fws.gov/injuriouswildlife..._8-14-2012.pdf
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Long Shot that is a great read it just reinforces what many of us have been afraid of.... That is if you want to believe biologists and long term studies over "facts based on observation and communication with local fishermen that hang out there"
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeprli
Silvers are filter feeders and much larger, Prussian carp is omnivorous and does not grow as large, they don't dig up bottom sediment like common carp.Biggest danger is competition for spawning structure with other non predatory species.
Depleting lakes of oxygen? That's science fiction, not a fact.
This is like comparing tiny lemon sharks to a great white.
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Quote from the study
“The Prussian carp is a prolific fish species [that] is believed to be responsible for the decline of native fish, invertebrate and plant populations in different areas. Furthermore, it is notorious for increasing water turbidity because of its habit of stirring up bottom sediments during feeding. C. gibelio has the potential to hybridi[z]e with other Carassius species and Cyprinus carpio.”
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeprli
Prussian carp has never displaced or stunted any predator species. If it were so, all of southern/central Alberta reservoirs would be full of them. These carp did not show up yesterday, some of the earliest catches are from 95/96 caught NE of Strathmore in farm dugouts and irrigation ponds.
These ponds are fine examples that Prussian carp is not as dangerous to Alberta waters as everybody wants to think. It is populated by perch, Prussian carp, lake whitefish, tulibee, suckers and pike (some very large pike for given size of waterbody). All these fish have different age classes within species. Yes perch and carp seem to be in biggest number, after them would be tulibee and then whitefish and last pike.
Lower number of pike is due to greedy fisherman keeping every one they can catch, same goes for whitefish.
So my point is after 20 years of their known existence in a fairly small body of water(about 6 meters deep and size of a football field) they have not been able to overtake the ecosystem, nor did perch. I've never witnessed a winterkill at this location so oxygen levels must be fine.
These are facts based on observation and communication with local fisherman that hang out there. Something that very few of you if any can claim. That is why I don't believe in Internet studies and bs videos. First hand experience tells me a different story.
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Quote from the study
“Established in natural waters. Migrated from the Danube to the confluence of the Dyje and Morava rivers after 1975. Has competed heavily for food and space with C. carassius populations, Tinca tinca, Leucaspius deliniatus, and other native cyprinids thereby decreasing their populations".
"Presently the most dominant fish species in lentic and slowly running aquatic habitats.”
“Amongst the most invasive species of introduced freshwater fish is the gibel (or Prussian) carp"
“The expansion of gibel carp populations in Estonia and the surrounding Baltic Sea is worthy of concern"
"Reproduces efficiently, and competes with native fishes for food and space. In some parts of central Europe, it has affected the range of other indigenous and commercially more valuable fish species.”
__________________
I have been thinking of three things I would rather do than fishing...
#1 win the lottery (so I could fish everyday)
#2 & 3 still thinking.....
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04-29-2015, 02:54 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Calgary, AB
Posts: 973
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overreaction....just injoy.....
don't we have any other issues to spend money on??????
__________________
Ask-hole: Someone who constantly asks for advice then does the opposite of what you told them.
Last edited by kostianych; 04-29-2015 at 03:01 PM.
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04-29-2015, 03:30 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: McBride/Prince George
Posts: 14,932
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kostianych
overreaction....just injoy.....
don't we have any other issues to spend money on??????
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Like the invasive to Alberta walleye?
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04-29-2015, 03:34 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Calgary, AB
Posts: 973
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right on )))
__________________
Ask-hole: Someone who constantly asks for advice then does the opposite of what you told them.
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04-29-2015, 04:16 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fishslayer99
local angler,
There is no name for it, there is a lease road that goes right to the water body, so no you don't need permission as it is not a private road or water body. Catch and kill...good luck fishin!
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It is private land and you do need permission to be there. All the talk about it has driven up interest and the landowner will undoubtedly get upset and start pressing trespassing charges.
Respect the landowners and get permission!
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04-29-2015, 05:38 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Cowtown
Posts: 770
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clueless
It is private land and you do need permission to be there. All the talk about it has driven up interest and the landowner will undoubtedly get upset and start pressing trespassing charges.
Respect the landowners and get permission!
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Clueless,
That's news to me... there were no gates at the entrance and the only sign there was to some oil company, im sure it is a lease road that was made for well site access. There are no farms anywhere near there that I could see or I would have at least banged on a door.
__________________
I have been thinking of three things I would rather do than fishing...
#1 win the lottery (so I could fish everyday)
#2 & 3 still thinking.....
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04-29-2015, 05:44 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Calgary
Posts: 1,720
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AK47
Based on the size people are catching this problem happened 10-15 years ago. Way to late to do anything now. Might as well get used to Prussian carp being here.
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Are you saying that it takes that long to get to a pound and a 1/2 ? Or are people catching 5 lbers ?
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04-29-2015, 05:53 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Calgary, AB
Posts: 973
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for this type of fish 1lb is a good size, same as 20 lbs for a pike.
How long does it take for a pike to get to 20lbs?????
__________________
Ask-hole: Someone who constantly asks for advice then does the opposite of what you told them.
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04-29-2015, 05:59 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 37
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[QUOTE=Fishslayer99;2817232]Clueless,
That's news to me... there were no gates at the entrance and the only sign there was to some oil company, im sure it is a lease road that was made for well site access. There are no farms anywhere near there that I could see or I would have at least banged on a door.[/QUOTE
It's owned by the local Hutterite Colony.
If it truly is a great place close to town to catch some fish, and possibly help the ecosystem at the same time I would hate to see it ruined for everyone by an uninvited few.
It's only my opinion and it's worth what you paid for it but I think it's in everyone's best interest to respect the land owners and get permission.
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04-29-2015, 06:05 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Cowtown
Posts: 770
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[QUOTE=Clueless;2817250]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fishslayer99
Clueless,
That's news to me... there were no gates at the entrance and the only sign there was to some oil company, im sure it is a lease road that was made for well site access. There are no farms anywhere near there that I could see or I would have at least banged on a door.[/QUOTE
It's owned by the local Hutterite Colony.
If it truly is a great place close to town to catch some fish, and possibly help the ecosystem at the same time I would hate to see it ruined for everyone by an uninvited few.
It's only my opinion and it's worth what you paid for it but I think it's in everyone's best interest to respect the land owners and get permission.
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Clueless,
Agreed 100% im glad you cleared that up...good information to know!
Thanks
__________________
I have been thinking of three things I would rather do than fishing...
#1 win the lottery (so I could fish everyday)
#2 & 3 still thinking.....
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04-29-2015, 06:50 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Calgary Perchdance
Posts: 19,285
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeprli
Sunndance are you talking snake heads, don't remember Prussian carp predating on other fish.
I think your perch problem is getting to you.
Positive side, yes there has to be a positive to every negative.
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http://www.fws.gov/injuriouswildlife..._8-14-2012.pdf
You need to think about it. How many fish eggs will they eat? His much will they eat and in turn harm other species survival?
I think you are belittling the issue and coming across subtly and/or strongly supporting the fact some idiots made decisions that will impact all anglers in Alberta.
Puts you in a totally un defendable position yet either don't see it of are laughing because you are happy about it.
__________________
Observing the TIGSCJ in the wilds of social media socio-ecological uniformity environments.
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