RCMP move to ban semi-automatic rifles

[BRU375]

So, I almost threw up in my coffee this morning. CBC reports that the RCMP is moving agressively under the Criminal Code to ban semi-automatic firearms. They said that they requested the update to the criminal code under the Conservatives they were ignored but the Liberals have confirmed they will go ahead with the update immediately "while undergoing consultations" which means they will arrange to have at least some, (probably all) semi-automatic rifle owners turn in their rifles in or be found in contravention of the criminal code.

I dont think anyone on here will be surprised by this move. next they will probably go after hunting and fishing rights.

From the CBC this morning

The number of military-style firearms that can be temporarily jury-rigged to become automatic weapons has increased "dramatically" in Canada over the last decade — and so has the public-safety risk.

That's the stark conclusion of an internal RCMP laboratory report on improvised methods for upgrading semi-automatic weapons, and for illegally altering magazine clips to allow for rapid continuous fire.


The lab report notes that Criminal Code regulations designed to thwart makeshift upgrades may not apply to newer generations of weapons, creating a legal void.

"The restricted and prohibited firearm provisions of Criminal Code regulations were last updated in 1995, and there are presently numerous models of military and paramilitary firearms on the Canadian market which are outside the scope of the Criminal Code regulations, many being non-restricted in classification," says the 15-page report.

"The Canadian introduction of new types of military and paramilitary firearms not mentioned in the Criminal Code regulations, nearly all with large capacity magazines sizes, started circa 2005 and has accelerated since."

"The public safety threat posed by improvised conversion to full automatic fire has correspondingly increased."


RCMP Commissioner Bob Paulson alerted then public safety minister Steven Blaney last year to potential legislative gaps in Criminal Code gun provisions. (Sean Kilpatrick/Canadian Press)

A heavily censored version of the internal report, dated November 2014, was obtained by CBC News under the Access to Information Act.

CBC News has previously reported on the RCMP's concerns about improvised assault-weapon upgrades, an issue raised by RCMP Commissioner Bob Paulson directly with then public safety minister Steven Blaney last year. But the detailed Mountie lab work documenting the issue was released only in the last week.

Last summer, Blaney rejected legislative changes to close any regulatory gap, saying the current law was sufficient. The Conservative government also passed Bill C-42 giving cabinet — not the RCMP — the final say about which weapons to restrict or ban, after the Mounties were slapped down for trying to get a popular semi-automatic withdrawn from Canada.

Some rifles could be banned

But the new Liberal government has promised to "put decision-making about weapons restrictions back into the hands of police, not politicians," raising the possibility the RCMP may yet be able to get some semi-automatics taken off the market.

A Mountie spokesman, Sgt. Harold Pfleiderer, would not say whether the RCMP is pressing the new Public Safety Minister Ralph Goodale to act on the issue. "The RCMP does not comment on the advice it provides to the minister," he said in an email.

A spokesman for Goodale reiterated the Liberal government's commitment to get "assault weapons off our streets," but said consultations are needed first.

'We will work ... to move forward on this commitment.'
–Spokesman for Public Safety Minister Ralph Goodale
"We will work with all levels of government, our stakeholders and the Canadian Firearms Advisory Committee to move forward on this commitment," said Scott Bardsley.

Among the Liberals' election commitments is to broaden membership of the firearms committee to include representatives of women's groups and public-health advocates. Critics have said the committee is stacked with gun proponents.

The RCMP lab tested 11 models of rifles and one pistol, including the weapon used by Marc Lepine in the 1989 Montreal massacre and the semi-automatic used by Justin Bourque in the 2014 Mountie shootings in Moncton, N.B.

The testing was prompted by Bourque's statement to police that he had considered using an improvised technique to turn his rifle into an automatic weapon.

The report says more than 1,200 test shots were fired between July and November 2014, using a technique that is "widely reported on the internet complete with installation and fitting instructions." The name of the technique is blacked out in the documents, but has been known in gun circles for decades, and information about at least one other technique also circulates.

New firearms on market

The Criminal Code regulations in the 1990s effectively protected against any upgrades "by taking the firearms most practical for conversion to full automatic fire off the civilian market," says the document, authored by Murray A. Smith, manager with the RCMP Canadian Firearms Program.

"Thus, the public safety risk posed by improvised conversion techniques was largely negated and rendered moot, and not requiring much police attention."

But the proliferation of new firearms since 2005 has increased the risk to the public, augmented by the availability of new magazines.

Ralph Goodale
Public Safety Minister Ralph Goodale will be reviewing Canada's gun legislation to restore decision-making about restricted weapons to the RCMP rather than leaving it to cabinet. (CBC)

"Large capacity magazines are widely available for the military and paramilitary firearms, and although limited in capacity by law and generally reduced to five shots by a pin or similar modification, the original capacity is typically readily restorable."

"The materials required for improvised full automatic fire are ordinary everyday products."

Upgrading any weapon to fully automatic status is clearly prohibited by Section 102(1) of the Criminal Code, with prison terms of up to 10 years. But Smith's report raises questions about the current effectiveness of 20-year-old Criminal Code regulations as they apply to newer weapons shown in lab tests to be "amenable to the improvised full automatic fire technique."

[OpenRange]

This would need to be voluntary I imagine. Lots of semi's are non restricted and since the gun registry is gone it's almost impossible for the RCMP to track down and collect them. Sounds like the Liberals are trying to appease citidiots again.

[Kim473]

Originally Posted by OpenRange

This would need to be voluntary I imagine. Lots of semi's are non restricted and since the gun registry is gone it's almost impossible for the RCMP to track down and collect them. Sounds like the Liberals are trying to appease citidiots again.

Registry is gone but do you really think that all the information it had was distroyed ? I don't think so.

[Lefty-Canuck]

I guess the SBE2 will all need to be turned in, they have "super" "black" and "eagle" in the same name....they must be a scary instrument of death! And semi-auto too!

Hold onto your hats kids...many declared a victory after the Registry was abolished, the Libs promised no registry....so they go straight to bans and confiscation instead.

We haven't "won" a damn thing yet.

LC

[BRU375]

I would agree with you except when we all buy rifles we have to give our PALS, If you buy at Cabela's or Bass Pro they are coying that Pal info down on a sheet and that is registered with the stores..wouldnt take anything for the RCMP to demand that the stores provide them that information if they make it a criminal offense to own a semi-automatic rifle. I dont think they will keep it limited to Restricted rifles, they will definately re-classify non-restricted semi's to fall under the criminal code. Its a slippery slope and now that they have the power back they will accelerate the process.

[BRU375]

Of course they will move to ban semi rifles and shotguns from law abiding citizens because we are easy pickings. When was the last time you heard our RCMP or city police make a tangible raid and bust on real organized crime? hardly ever.

[wolf308]

Dunno what to say. Great. Those morons. **** the police. Comes to mind.

[dmcbride]

The hypocrisy of the Liberals is amazing. The refugee's pose more of a risk than this fear mongering article.

[BuckCuller]

There is a link in the CBC article to another article where a Judge wants tighter gun laws because a southern Alberta man was shot for pointing a black umbrella at police. They some how knew there was five guns in his house. The registry is still out there and they are scratching for anything to punish legal gun owners instead of making tougher punishments on criminals and sickos. Property gets stolen every day in criminal activity to support larger criminal activity and all the cops say is you have insurance right so what's the big deal. There was clearly prints all over my bros sled when they found it and would not print it because it was a waste of their time. It seems like criminals have more rights than you and I we are not aloud to protect our own property or ourselves.
I would love to quote Charltin Hesston right about now.

[Twisted Canuck]

Yup, taking the power of firearm classification out of the hands of politicians (that are elected) and putting it in the hands of police (who have no agenda whatsoever )....sounds like a good Liberal plan. But let's not act surprised, we knew this was coming. Doesn't matter how many sign the AR petition (and I did and my family has), we are officially on the brink of the slippery slope.

And once all the banning is done, and our scary guns are all confiscated and we are all safe, we can sleep better at nights knowing criminals will no longer have access to all these scary guns that were taken from the hands of law abiding citizens. Such a crock of liberal social engineering crap.

[bat119]

The only way such a "ban" could work is what they did in Australia buy the guns from the owners at +50% of retail. Most owners were happy with the compensation they received.
One Aussie told me his Dad left home pizzed off with his favorite semi auto shotgun, came home happy as a clam with two over and unders. The registry was only a ploy to take an inventory of all the firearms in peoples possession so they could confiscate them for free it had nothing to do with public safety or law enforcement.

Down under the guys are not happy about giving up their semi's however the hunting and shooting is still going strong.

[Savage addict]

Let's just not forget one of the most recent mass killings in Canadian history..... It happened in Calgary...... Anyone? It was a police officers son..... Yeah that's right. Killed 5 people I seem to recall. With a KNIFE!!! People are resilient. Gun, knife, rock, stick. Doesn't matter. A predator wants its prey dead, it's gonna happen. Why is the one thing I love so much, SO controversial? I hope this never goes through. Mostly because I'd hate to lose a few thousand I spent on my tavor. Though they might give $200 for all guns turned in.

[ForwardBias]

Originally Posted by Savage addict

Let's just not forget one of the most recent mass killings in Canadian history..... It happened in Calgary...... Anyone? It was a police officers son..... Yeah that's right. Killed 5 people I seem to recall. With a KNIFE!!! People are resilient. Gun, knife, rock, stick. Doesn't matter. A predator wants its prey dead, it's gonna happen. Why is the one thing I love so much, SO controversial? I hope this never goes through. Mostly because I'd hate to lose a few thousand I spent on my tavor. Though they might give $200 for all guns turned in.

X2

[Bergerboy]

This doesnt directly affect me as I am pretty much a Fudd. What does bother me is that its one step closer to my hunting guns.

[darren32]

Originally Posted by BRU375

I would agree with you except when we all buy rifles we have to give our PALS, If you buy at Cabela's or Bass Pro they are coying that Pal info down on a sheet and that is registered with the stores..wouldnt take anything for the RCMP to demand that the stores provide them that information if they make it a criminal offense to own a semi-automatic rifle. I dont think they will keep it limited to Restricted rifles, they will definately re-classify non-restricted semi's to fall under the criminal code. Its a slippery slope and now that they have the power back they will accelerate the process.

That is not what I have been told for non restricted. At Cabela's I bought a rifle a couple of weeks ago and told the guy that he should have me on file because I had bough several rifles from them. He told me they DO NOT retain the record (of who bought which rifle) because of the privacy act. He seemed knowledgeable and said he was ex-RCMP. Actually had a pretty good chat with the guy. Can anyone confirm?

[Stinky Buffalo]

Here's a link to the article.

Some good comments so far.

[5Lgreenback]

I wasn't aware of all these crimes being committed in Canada with these make shift "automatic assault rifles".

What a bunch of fear mongering crap.

Its interesting the difference in law enforcements attitude towards legal firearm ownership in Canada vs US. You would think the police are dealing with shootouts with licensed firearm owners constantly up here to justify their attitudes.

[elkhunter11]

This should be a reality check for the gullible people that didn't want to accept the fact that the Liberals and the RCMP want to take our firearms.

[rugatika]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

This should be a reality check for the gullible people that didn't want to accept the fact that the Liberals and the RCMP want to take our firearms.

Lever actions next. Just watch.

Pretty sad to be seeing this happen in Canada.

[Newview01]

Anytime a new firearm is purchased, it gets written down in the store records, which they are required to keep by law. The police are not allowed to waltz directly in and look at them, they first need a warrant. So it is a matter of a few hours and they can then waltz in. If anyone thought that the registry and all its data was gone, think again. Quebec for one still has all the info. And every gun purchased is still recorded. And should confiscation become a reality, you will not be able to simply say that you sold all of your firearms. There is technology that can detect trace amounts of gunpowder and explosive residue, even if you had contact with said materials several days prior.

All that aside, I still happily purchase firearms on occasion..

[KGB]

I have nothing to fear, I don't have any guns left at my house.

[Bergerboy]

Waiting for the flood of SKS's to hit the market in light of this news.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by Newview01

Anytime a new firearm is purchased, it gets written down in the store records, which they are required to keep by law. The police are not allowed to waltz directly in and look at them, they first need a warrant. So it is a matter of a few hours and they can then waltz in. If anyone thought that the registry and all its data was gone, think again. Quebec for one still has all the info. And every gun purchased is still recorded. And should confiscation become a reality, you will not be able to simply say that you sold all of your firearms. There is technology that can detect trace amounts of gunpowder and explosive residue, even if you had contact with said materials several days prior.

All that aside, I still happily purchase firearms on occasion..

Of all of the firearms that I still own, I believe two were purchased when the registration was in place, so for the most part, the RCMP have no clue as to which firearms I have in my possession.

Waiting for the flood of SKS's to hit the market in light of this news.
Reply With Quote

Apparently I made a good decision to sell my non restricted ACR before the Federal election. I solid it for a profit, and now the prices will likely plummet.

[raab]

Sounds like they're looking at only taking a few semi autos off the market. I'll reserve judgement until something actually happens.

[rugatika]

Originally Posted by raab

Sounds like they're looking at only taking a few semi autos off the market. I'll reserve judgement until something actually happens.

I don't care if they're only taking one gun away. It's a waste. Quit letting criminals roam the streets before you worry about a non-existent problem, just because it fits your ideology.

[ArtG]

Even if the RCMP demand for the PAL record of everyone who bought a semi-automatic gun that really means nothing. The gun could have been gifted or sold privately and there is no way of tracking that. My first gun was a gift from the in-laws.

[BuckCuller]

Originally Posted by raab

Sounds like they're looking at only taking a few semi autos off the market. I'll reserve judgement until something actually happens.

Only a few is too many! Where do you think Europe and Australia started?

[raab]

Originally Posted by rugatika

I don't care if they're only taking one gun away. It's a waste. Quit letting criminals roam the streets before you worry about a non-existent problem, just because it fits your ideology.

Depends on the gun, if there are semi autos that can easily be made fully automatic with simple modifications, and you can get high round magazine for. I think we absolutely have to look at those rifles.

[HunterDave]

Originally Posted by bat119

The only way such a "ban" could work is what they did in Australia buy the guns from the owners at +50% of retail. Most owners were happy with the compensation they received.
One Aussie told me his Dad left home pizzed off with his favorite semi auto shotgun, came home happy as a clam with two over and unders. The registry was only a ploy to take an inventory of all the firearms in peoples possession so they could confiscate them for free it had nothing to do with public safety or law enforcement.

Down under the guys are not happy about giving up their semi's however the hunting and shooting is still going strong.

I don't know where you are getting your info but this is NOT what I was told by a firearm owning Aussie that I'm friends with. He never got paid for one firearm that he turned in and had to fight for a couple of others. He also told me that the appraisal value placed on the firearms was ridiculous with people receiving $500 for $1000 rifles. The only people that made anything were people that had old, rusted pieces of junk that were basically worthless but they got something for them. Justin isn't going to give you $1K for a mini 14, no way. $500 maybe.

I'm glad that I sold all of mine.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by raab

Depends on the gun, if there are semi autos that can easily be made fully automatic with simple modifications, and you can get high round magazine for. I think we absolutely have to look at those rifles.

And if you are gullible enough to believe that an AR-15 can be easily converted to fully automatic, with a simple modification, then you are the kind of person that the Liberal/RCMP propaganda is targeting. If their propaganda results in enough gullible people believing their nonsense, then it won't be long before the Liberals/RCMP are able to disarm all Canadian civilians.