Smokin Joe NOT GUILTY!!! - Page 3

Cowtown guy · #61 05-06-2009, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okotokian

How would a crown prosecutor have even known about the incident if the CO's didn't bring it to him/her? I have to believe they thought it was warranted. If they didn't they would have just said "fine, you did the right thing, see you later" and that would be the end of it.

The guy was found not guilty. That doesn't mean the CO's were negligent. Happens all the time in lots of criminal cases. The judge just saw it a different way. It's just that when it's a non-hunting case we usually criticize the judge for letting the "criminal" off, and don't berate the police.

Well I for one am glad to say that I have kept my nose clean and have no experience with anything criminally or trial wise. That was why I was asking. I don't know if the CO's have to report this type of thing to the Crown or not. Just wanted to know how the charges get laid.

Cowtown guy · #62 05-06-2009, 08:49 AM

I am glad that Joe is clean of this whole thing. I can really see how this can sour ones views of "the system".
I know a guy that 6 or 7 years ago took his young son hunting. He walked into a cut block and a WT buck stood up. He shot the deer and it fell over dead. Walked up to it and there was a second deer that wasn't noticed dead also. He still doesn't know what happened, but he thinks the bullet mad a weird turn when it came out of the animal and smacked a second one that was still lying down. Having his son there, he "did the right thing" and cleaned the animals, tagged his legal one, took pics and left everything there. He drove into town to report it to the CO's because that is what you should do if you make a mistake. Told fur and feathers what happened and they charged him with a bunch of stuff, took his gun and he was set to lose his hunting priveledges for a while.
Do you think he will ever report anything like this again?

I realize and so does he that he did something wrong. Why be so ridiculous about it? He wasn't poaching. He was also in an area that nobody would have ever found that second deer had he not said anything.
I can see forfeiting the deer and handing in your licenses for the remainder of the year. There should be some repercussions on an act like this. But to have a guy spend a couple thousand dollars on legal bills plus the fines he ended up paying because he "did the right thing" and reported a mistake?
I know what I'll do. You guys do what you would do.

Mountain Guy · #63 05-06-2009, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by duffy4

I thought permoting breaking the law was against board rules here.

"well said" and "X10" would be accessories to the offence.

I just learned somthing today..... I didn't know that it was '' breaking the law'' to kill a bear in self defence

It's funny how the prosecution felt they had sufficient evidence to prosecute.
I don't know a lot about the case , but the facts I hear: 1) that he rode 5 hrs to get cell coverage to make the call about the incident.
2) That he is obviously a well respected , law abiding citizen.
Should have weighed ''as heavy'' for this case to never have gone to the extent it did.

Also , ( assumption ) that he and his fellow were hunting guides does ( to me ) indictate that they probably know bears well enough to determine that this bear was a threat.
Just glad that nobody has to worry about their kids hiking in K country and having to come across this bear.

joeti7 · #64 05-07-2009, 03:57 AM

I sure don't understand how some people look at this, it seems that they are more interested in sparing an animals life as opposed to saving a human life(a persons own child at that). Myself, without a doubt would have done the same thing. Some suggestions are also far fetched, myself, I sure am NOT going into the bush with packs with "electric fences and bear spray" that are going to weigh the same as my trusty 270WSM. Because lets face it, when the bear runs through your fence and bear spray, there wont be much left of you. Me on the other hand will go to court at the end, because as much as I respect wildlife, I cherish my life a little more than theirs. I also think that it is horrible that he had to "waste" time out of his life because some CO got PO'd because his "problem pet" got what it needed. Maybe it should come directly out of his cheque to pay for what Joe had to deal with. Its just a shame that all the people with real common sense don't have the patience to deal with the ones that don't.

duffy4 · #65 05-07-2009, 05:36 AM

"Its just a shame that all the people with real common sense don't have the patience to deal with the ones that don't. "

joeti7 I read that line about 6 times and can not figure out what it means.

Maybe I don't have "real common sense" or maybe I "don't have the patience" or maybe I'm just one of the "ones that don't".

" just learned somthing today..... I didn't know that it was '' breaking the law'' to kill a bear in self defence"

Mountain Guy

I believe you have not followed this whole thread. My comment about breaking the law was not directed at anyone killing a bear in self defence and following throught with their legal responcibility to report it as Mr. Lucas did. Some other posters were saying in effect that they would shoot shovel and shut up. Is that what you would do?

Cowtown guy · #66 05-07-2009, 07:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by duffy4

Some other posters were saying in effect that they would shoot shovel and shut up. Is that what you would do?

Before this whole thing reared it's ugly head I would have done exactly as Joe did. After all of this crap........NO WAY!

Keeleclimber · #67 05-07-2009, 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeti7

I sure don't understand how some people look at this, it seems that they are more interested in sparing an animals life as opposed to saving a human life(a persons own child at that). Myself, without a doubt would have done the same thing. Some suggestions are also far fetched, myself, I sure am NOT going into the bush with packs with "electric fences and bear spray" that are going to weigh the same as my trusty 270WSM. Because lets face it, when the bear runs through your fence and bear spray, there wont be much left of you. Me on the other hand will go to court at the end, because as much as I respect wildlife, I cherish my life a little more than theirs. I also think that it is horrible that he had to "waste" time out of his life because some CO got PO'd because his "problem pet" got what it needed. Maybe it should come directly out of his cheque to pay for what Joe had to deal with. Its just a shame that all the people with real common sense don't have the patience to deal with the ones that don't.

Well said!

Duff,
SSS only way to go bud.

joeti7 · #68 05-07-2009, 07:36 PM

[QUOTE=duffy4;316501]"Its just a shame that all the people with real common sense don't have the patience to deal with the ones that don't. "

joeti7 I read that line about 6 times and can not figure out what it means.

Maybe I don't have "real common sense" or maybe I "don't have the patience" or maybe I'm just one of the "ones that don't".

What I meant with that statement is that it is a shame that people would resort to "shoot, shovel and shut up", as opposed to doing the right thing which is to report it, because all that it means when you report it is that you would have to waste your time and money going to court because someone without common sense(realizing that it was done to save a life, possibly lives) thinks that the animal should have been "spared". I'm not trying to point fingers at anyone and maybe should have explained it more on how I was thinking.

TreeGuy · #69 05-07-2009, 10:54 PM

Quote:

I agree with everything you said, but the charges were from the investigation by the CO that happens to be the director of the Bear conditioning. He was pi***d cause one of his "lab rats" got killed.

Would this not constitute 'Conflict of Interest'?

There is no way an impartial Crown Prosecutor would chance taking this case to trial. No wonder the judge was pizzed. These two individuals should be severly taken to task on this one.

Personal agendas should NEVER hijack the justice system. Combine this with the 'aversion' techniques and embedded collars...........

Anyone know a good lawyer looking to work 'pro bono' to set a prescedent of his/her own? This case has that potential.

Tree

carpediem4570 · #70 05-13-2009, 01:51 PM

Shoot, Shovel and Shut-up was mentioned.

Who said anything about shovelling?

Seriously, I have never shot a bear never mind seen one up close. How big of a hole would you have to dig to cover a grizz? Christ, I'm thinking you'd need a back hoe to do a proper job.

Carpediem