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07-21-2018, 12:21 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 15,961
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The 223 as a viable big game round volume 2.
To belabour the point and because this place slows to a crawl in the summer here it goes.
Even though I apparently will shoot less in my lifetime than some here will shoot in a year I was out again this morning. I had zero intention of running my phones video capabilities but thought what the heck. The video is only for sound (I’m going to buy a phone Skope now) so please have no expectation of a Warner Brothers movie.
Yes, I know I’m not shooting deer. Yes I know steel does not bleed. But a deer at 250 yds could not, in seven lifetimes, win this battle. And I wouldn’t have wanted to be a deer standing at the distances illustrated either.
https://youtu.be/kn5VfOXG8sQ
https://youtu.be/nB55NuE6PjM
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
Last edited by Pathfinder76; 07-21-2018 at 12:36 PM.
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07-21-2018, 01:42 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Calgary
Posts: 1,544
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What was wrong with your first thread?
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07-21-2018, 01:45 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 15,961
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Any thread on these forums loses all sanity after page three.
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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07-21-2018, 02:07 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Calgary
Posts: 1,544
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I applaud your passion for the sport as well as trying to give info on capabilities of your enjoyment with your 223. In the right hands in the right circumstances it will kill. But the regulations are designed to control the general population's activities. I disagree that 223 would be effective on a regular basis by the more general population of people who want to get out for their 1 or 2 days of being involved in the sport and go be "hunters" so they can go back to their other lifestyle and brag about their amazingness to their non-hunter friends. A skilled trained person who loves the hobby and spends a large number of days every year would be better at deciding the right situation where 223 capabilities are appropriate, but average guy would not. That is why the regulations require more powerful cartridges for big game hunting.
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07-21-2018, 02:22 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Parkland County, AB
Posts: 4,258
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck
Any thread on these forums loses all sanity after page three.
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..and yet you start another one.
Nice shooting, but it didn't prove a thing. Touting the .223 as a Deer cartridge to 200yds might cut it but promoting it as an acceptable general Big Game ctdge has less chance of success than the probability of a .223 reliably and consistently taking Deer at 300 yds... except, of course, if you're doing the shooting. Now, keep it sane please.
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When applied by competent people with the right intent, common sense goes a long way.
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07-21-2018, 02:27 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 15,961
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Can we all agree that Alberta is fairly unique in imposing this restriction as far as North America goes?
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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07-21-2018, 02:32 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 3,665
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No
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07-21-2018, 02:39 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 1,920
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Norwest Alta
No
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Have to agreex2
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07-21-2018, 02:40 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 15,961
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Norwest Alta
No
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According to Cat, 40 states allow it. How many are there?
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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07-21-2018, 02:43 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 3,665
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck
According to Cat, 40 states allow it. How many are there?
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40 states allow a lot of things. Last time I checked we had provinces. I will look on the map to make sure though because a lot of things have changed from the last election.
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07-21-2018, 02:46 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Jun 2016
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Yep still provinces. Hmmmm what do we do now?
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07-21-2018, 02:46 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Parkland County, AB
Posts: 4,258
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck
Can we all agree that Alberta is fairly unique in imposing this restriction as far as North America goes?
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No Way. Many of the States (not all) that allow use of a .223 for hunting
do not have much more than very small whitetails, some exotics and feral hogs available to hunt. Normal shooting ranges are often short as well.
The wide variety and size of our available Big Game in Alberta is totally different. As usual, there are exceptions. I think we have some excellent smaller cartridges available. Why push the absolute minimum agenda?
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When applied by competent people with the right intent, common sense goes a long way.
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07-21-2018, 02:47 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 15,961
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What about the two most comparable? One immediately east and one West?
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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07-21-2018, 02:48 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 15,961
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Salavee
No Way. Many of the States (not all) that allow use of a .223 for hunting
do not have much more than very small whitetails, some exotics and feral hogs available to hunt. Normal shooting ranges are often short as well.
The wide variety and size of our available Big Game in Alberta is totally different. As usual, there are exceptions. I think we have some excellent smaller cartridges available. Why push the absolute minimum agenda?
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What about Montana? Idaho?
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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07-21-2018, 02:52 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 15,961
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How about Alaska? Utah?
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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07-21-2018, 02:58 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Ft. McMurray
Posts: 38,661
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Norwest Alta
40 states allow a lot of things. Last time I checked we had provinces. I will look on the map to make sure though because a lot of things have changed from the last election.
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The Inuit use the .223 in Nunavut as well as BC , Manitoba , New Brunswick and I believe some parts of Ontario as well .
Cat
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Anytime I figure I've got this long range thing figured out, I just strap into the sling and irons and remind myself that I don't!
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07-21-2018, 02:59 PM
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I think a 223 is allowed in many of the state's due to its limitations. I can't say for sure but many of the state's have quite a bit higher density of hunter per area then we see here so a rifle with a limited effective range might be more welcome then a more capable gun for safety reasons.
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07-21-2018, 03:00 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 15,961
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Norwest Alta
I think a 223 is allowed in many of the state's due to its limitations. I can't say for sure but many of the state's have quite a bit higher density of hunter per area then we see here so a rifle with a limited effective range might be more welcome then a more capable gun for safety reasons.
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Nice try.
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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07-21-2018, 03:03 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 3,665
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catnthehat
The Inuit use the .223 in Nunavut as well as BC , Manitoba , New Brunswick and I believe some parts of Ontario as well .
Cat
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I know people that hunt in bc and I can say none of them use a 223. Going to guess probably because it is not as effective as a 30 cal
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07-21-2018, 03:07 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 3,665
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck
Nice try.
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Well what's your answer smart guy?
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07-21-2018, 03:07 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Ft. McMurray
Posts: 38,661
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Norwest Alta
I know people that hunt in bc and I can say none of them use a 223. Going to guess probably because it is not as effective as a 30 cal
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I know lots that do as well as those that don't .
I also know many that use both depending on their mood
Cat
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Anytime I figure I've got this long range thing figured out, I just strap into the sling and irons and remind myself that I don't!
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07-21-2018, 03:08 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Calgary
Posts: 1,544
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just because there is a lack of government control over choices doesn't mean that every choice is a good one. i love to hear that people are allowed to make their own choices... as long as people are smart then there is no need for government control. its when common sense flies out the window that the government has to start making laws to control the populations decisions. stupidity is a big reason that laws are created. i still think that in the hands of the common man, 223 is not a sound choice for most hunting. if someone cant handle the recoil of a proper hunting cartridge, then they need to change the setup. either get a heavier gun and have an adult carry it for them, or change the recoil pad, or get a muzzle brake, or keep shooting until they are comfortable moving up to a proper cartridge. Why do we keep asking for more and more leeway to allow for lesser and lesser hunters.
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07-21-2018, 03:11 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Jun 2016
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catnthehat
I know lots that do as well as those that don't .
I also know many that use both depending on their mood
Cat
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I suppose it would mostly depend on what they're hunting. Island deer? I'm pretty sure we got bigger coyotes. Interior moose? Probably not many that use a 223.
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07-21-2018, 03:27 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 6,498
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nyksta
What was wrong with your first thread?
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Some guys just like to be the focus of attention and hear themselves talk I guess.
Yawn.
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You matter. Unless you multiply yourself by the speed of light squared... ...then you energy.
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07-21-2018, 03:28 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 6,498
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck
Can we all agree that Alberta is fairly unique in imposing this restriction as far as North America goes?
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Be unique. The world needs more niques.
__________________
You matter. Unless you multiply yourself by the speed of light squared... ...then you energy.
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07-21-2018, 03:29 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 1,920
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 270person
Some guys just like to be the focus of attention and hear themselves talk I guess.
Yawn.
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I like it
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07-21-2018, 03:33 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 15,961
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Norwest Alta
Well what's your answer smart guy?
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Restrictions on the other side. Which some states have.
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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07-21-2018, 03:37 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 3,665
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck
Restrictions on the other side. Which some states have.
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Good riddle. Not into riddles. Carry on
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07-21-2018, 03:40 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 6,498
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I can put 5 inside a loonie at 100yds with my 17 HMR, so being basically a sniper with this gun, I think I should be allowed to use it for CP2 and CP3 game animals.
I'll only take headshots at 100 yds and under....I promise....because... I'm a 17 machine. 150 fpe at 50 yds be damned. More than enough to put the smack down.
It's all about ME and I would like to use my 17 HMR for everything. That way I can sell all my other rifles, buy cheap ammo, and I'm betting I can get down to 5 inside a dime if I practise with it enough. TYVM.
P.S. I think I should be able to use it for waterfowl as well.
__________________
You matter. Unless you multiply yourself by the speed of light squared... ...then you energy.
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07-21-2018, 03:45 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 15,961
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Norwest Alta
Good riddle. Not into riddles. Carry on
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That’s not a riddle for crying out loud. If a state wants to restrict something because of human population concerns they will restrict cartridges. And they do.
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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