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Old 01-15-2020, 07:45 PM
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Default Co-OP refinery strike- why so quiet?

I saw a 'we care about our refinery employees' ad just now on tv, and looked online. Theres a bit of buzz but nothing extraordinary.

Why is it when there is an offshore rig goes down in the gulf of Mexico we see a 20c jump but a refinery strike 3 hours away and nothing changes?
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Old 01-16-2020, 02:59 AM
32-40win 32-40win is offline
 
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The union has radio ads out in Cgy as well, heard them over the last month or so for sure, calling to boycott Co-op gas.
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Old 01-16-2020, 05:14 AM
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Why is it when there is an offshore rig goes down in the gulf of Mexico we see a 20c jump but a refinery strike 3 hours away and nothing changes?
It could be because the refinery is still operating, potentially at a reduced cost.
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Old 01-16-2020, 05:26 AM
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Why is it when there is an offshore rig goes down in the gulf of Mexico we see a 20c jump but a refinery strike 3 hours away and nothing changes?
I am going to presume that the refinery is still operating as usual. There are enough Co-op employees to keep things going. I think the ones on strike are on the maintenance side.
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Old 01-16-2020, 06:31 AM
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I am going to presume that the refinery is still operating as usual. There are enough Co-op employees to keep things going. I think the ones on strike are on the maintenance side.
As I understand it co-op has locked out 700 workers that are under Unifor Local 594, with management staff and replacement workers the refinery is still operating as normal, there was a deal on the news a while back that the union was blocking access to the refinery and co-op got a court injunction against that.

Workers were being transported into the refinery by helicopter to get around the road blocks.

There has not been much on the news about any of this, not sure why, saw some adds by the union on TV back in Dec so googled it.
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Old 01-16-2020, 06:41 AM
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It's been on our local news for awhile now. Sounds like a bitter fight on both sides.
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Old 01-16-2020, 08:19 AM
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Apparently plant reliability has increased since bringing in replacement maint workers. FCL prob not to bothered right now
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Old 01-16-2020, 09:00 AM
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Around Christmas there were some picketers adjacent a Co-op grocery store on Macleod Trail, they were handing out pamphlets. Inside the store there was a very obvious sign placed dead center where you walk in saying ‘What up with the protesters?” Then it went on to note the strike action.

I can relate to people wanting things a bit better, but I have to say when I see strike actions in times like now when so many are completely out of work it seems rather tone-deaf. Being private sector I’m fine with it, they can deal with that themselves. What gets me though is seeing public sector unions striking, like the Ontario Teachers, now there’s a group of oblivious “me, me, me” people who are completely oblivious to the un or under-employed taxpayers who are paying their wage. They live in the province with the highest sub-national debt anywhere in North America yet they think the taxpayers should ante up some more.
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Old 01-16-2020, 01:09 PM
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Apparently plant reliability has increased since bringing in replacement maint workers. FCL prob not to bothered right now
Where would that info come from?
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Old 01-16-2020, 01:23 PM
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Where would that info come from?


From operations


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Old 01-16-2020, 01:27 PM
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From operations
I work in a large refinery here in SJ. I could see operations spewing such propaganda to skew things in their favour.

Reliability increases slowly as things are done better. it's not an over night result.
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Old 01-16-2020, 04:54 PM
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They use scabs to run the plant. COOP was THE most unhealthy, miserable, toxic environment I have ever worked in...and that includes corrections. What a shock they are on strike.
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Old 01-16-2020, 05:43 PM
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Originally Posted by waldedw View Post
As I understand it co-op has locked out 700 workers that are under Unifor Local 594, with management staff and replacement workers the refinery is still operating as normal, there was a deal on the news a while back that the union was blocking access to the refinery and co-op got a court injunction against that.

Workers were being transported into the refinery by helicopter to get around the road blocks.

There has not been much on the news about any of this, not sure why, saw some adds by the union on TV back in Dec so googled it.
If the union is unlawfully blocking the road they should be rounded up and arrested. They are welcome to stand beside the road and wave their signs - lawfully.

If the union picketers begin to become unlawful nuisances, they need to understand, the average joe public person is less likely to support their cause, instead, becoming annoyed with their antics.

And, if these unionized maintenance guys are as valuable to the company as they say they are (and they might be), the company will negotiate a settlement.

On the other hand, If, in fact, the "management and scabs" who are supposedly doing a better job of running maintenance .....actually are ..... well guess what ..... the union may not get a deal and needs to take at look at itself and may need to stop protecting "sub standard performing, high seniority, trouble makers" whom they have protected for far too long.

Who knows what the case is here, but sometimes strikes serve to make long overdue corrections, either from the company, or from the union.
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Old 01-16-2020, 06:33 PM
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They were running those ads during the World Juniors at intermissions. I saw an ad and was surprised I hadn’t heard anything about it before (or since).
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Old 01-16-2020, 07:19 PM
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In these hard times in the west there are literally 100's of thousands of people out of work and not because they want to be either, many have run out of EI benefits and are struggling to feed their families and pay their bills.

If some of them are working for the co-op refinery during this lock out good for them, it's very hard for me to think of them as scabs but rather as desperate people doing what they have to in order to survive.

And lastly they are locked out and not on strike, there is a huge difference, however they did unanimously vote to go on strike and had served strike notice when the company decided to lock them out.

I do not know the details or the reason they voted to strike, but can assume it is money, pension contributions etc. it's a tough economy out there maybe they could have chosen their timing better, don't know.

I do know that lots of people I have talked to have little sympathy for workers that have good jobs and are making a good living to be going on strike for more during these tough times.
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Old 01-16-2020, 08:25 PM
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They strikers are members of Unifor. This is the union who’s leader campaigned in the last election. He wanted the oil, gas, and mining shut down. He ran adds wanting to stop all pipeline construction stopped. He stood beside Trudeau and kissed his but. They are not getting any support in Sask for their cause.
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Old 01-16-2020, 08:36 PM
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Originally Posted by waldedw View Post
In these hard times in the west there are literally 100's of thousands of people out of work and not because they want to be either, many have run out of EI benefits and are struggling to feed their families and pay their bills.

If some of them are working for the co-op refinery during this lock out good for them, it's very hard for me to think of them as scabs but rather as desperate people doing what they have to in order to survive.

And lastly they are locked out and not on strike, there is a huge difference, however they did unanimously vote to go on strike and had served strike notice when the company decided to lock them out.

I do not know the details or the reason they voted to strike, but can assume it is money, pension contributions etc. it's a tough economy out there maybe they could have chosen their timing better, don't know.

I do know that lots of people I have talked to have little sympathy for workers that have good jobs and are making a good living to be going on strike for more during these tough times.
What I read was the management was moving to a defined contribution and cancel the defined benefit plan. This is the way things are moving as defined benefit plans are a thing of the past. Hard to feel sorry for people with good jobs in the current economy. Live within your means, find some financial advice and you will be fine.
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Old 01-16-2020, 09:26 PM
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Originally Posted by dgl1948 View Post
They strikers are members of Unifor. This is the union who’s leader campaigned in the last election. He wanted the oil, gas, and mining shut down. He ran adds wanting to stop all pipeline construction stopped. He stood beside Trudeau and kissed his but. They are not getting any support in Sask for their cause.
That seems like a bad idea ...... to be against any industry where his unionized laborers pay dues into his union?

The same dues that pay him his exorbitant wages? If this is true, This guy sounds like he is a moron - that makes zero sense.

In 25+ years of dealing with unions I have never heard any senior union person ever say a bad thing about any industry .... that seems like it would be counter perpetuating based on organized labors primary objectives.

Clearly this guy is something special.

Last edited by EZM; 01-16-2020 at 09:36 PM.
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Old 01-16-2020, 09:30 PM
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Originally Posted by dgl1948 View Post
They strikers are members of Unifor. This is the union who’s leader campaigned in the last election. He wanted the oil, gas, and mining shut down. He ran adds wanting to stop all pipeline construction stopped. He stood beside Trudeau and kissed his but. They are not getting any support in Sask for their cause.
Unifor was opposed to trans mountain, and Dias the leader was involved in the media funding nonsense by Trudeau. Dias was working with Trudeau against Scheer in the last election.
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Old 01-17-2020, 06:13 AM
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Default Unifor

A bit of info about Unifor and it’s members.

TORONTO, May 19, 2016 /CNW/ - Unifor is disappointed with the National Energy Board's (NEB) short-sighted decision to support the Trans Mountain Expansion Project, one that poses risks for the economy, Canadian jobs, and food security.


“ More than 10% of Unifor’s members work in an oil- and gas-related sector and yet the union is fighting to shut many of those jobs down.”

Last edited by dgl1948; 01-17-2020 at 06:28 AM.
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Old 01-17-2020, 07:41 AM
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This situation could get interesting. I believe the Co-op has a turn around scheduled for this spring. I doubt that union workers will cross a picket line to work at the Co-op.
Maybe they will re-schedule the turn around.
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Old 01-17-2020, 07:55 AM
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Default Unions Are Outdated - I'll buy Co-Op Gas Today!

Unions had a time and place when labor laws, workmen's comp and OH&S rules were weak or non-existent; they did a good job advocating for workers rights where none existed. Some of what we benefit from today spurned from lobbying they did to governments at all levels. Now fast forward to present times and I would believe the publics attitude towards them has waned greatly. I grew up in a heavily unionized family of auto workers. My father was a president of a local for many years and I can remember picket lines, threating phone calls to the house, all the melodramatic stuff you see on TV; it happens! The ironic part is he eventually took a seat with management shedding his union cloak after he seen a culture change from unions advocating for workers rights to protecting slugs who should be fired for sub-standard performance. Even though this is 50 years ago, I can remember when this event happened in his life. It's been said earlier, I don't think todays public has much sympathy for folks with good, stable jobs wanting more when they're listening to adds driving to the food bank.
Anyone know if there's a trend showing if more unions are being formed or being collapsed in this day and age?
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Old 01-17-2020, 08:03 AM
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Unifor is a prime example of how an organization created to protect the workers has evolved into a a business designed to benefit the people running that business. It has become a political pawn for our PM, and no longer works for the benefit of the workers.
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Old 01-17-2020, 08:05 AM
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Originally Posted by silver View Post
This situation could get interesting. I believe the Co-op has a turn around scheduled for this spring. I doubt that union workers will cross a picket line to work at the Co-op.
Maybe they will re-schedule the turn around.
Lots of qualified, non union people looking for work.
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Old 01-17-2020, 08:24 AM
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Lots of qualified, non union people looking for work.
Good luck coming up with 50 crane operators and equipment.
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Old 01-17-2020, 09:06 AM
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Good luck coming up with 50 crane operators and equipment.
https://myshakgroup.com/

Done.

If there is money to be made private industry will fill it. The union operators will get hungry and work for the privateers.
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Old 01-17-2020, 09:14 AM
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I just heard the advertisement on the radio. Well it's a little bit misleading. "Co-op promised us a pension, now they want to take it away" well that's not what's going on. Years ago when it was a smaller operation, the employee's portion of their pension contributions was paid by FCL. Now that the company has grown, and every other FCL employee has to pay their own portion of the contributions, these employees aren't happy and are not wanting to pay their own portions. Every other employee has to pay, so why shouldn't these people have to? I think it isn't fair to every other employee that these people are getting outdated special treatment.

I'd tell them to all come inside, where it's nice and warm, and clean your stuff out of your lockers.
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Old 01-17-2020, 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by EZM View Post
That seems like a bad idea ...... to be against any industry where his unionized laborers pay dues into his union?

The same dues that pay him his exorbitant wages? If this is true, This guy sounds like he is a moron - that makes zero sense.

In 25+ years of dealing with unions I have never heard any senior union person ever say a bad thing about any industry .... that seems like it would be counter perpetuating based on organized labors primary objectives.

Clearly this guy is something special.
The Public Service Unions don't seem to have any problem ignoring their members wishes, or collecting their dues if they disagree with policies.

Grizz
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Old 01-17-2020, 09:16 AM
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Good luck coming up with 50 crane operators and equipment.
Capitalism fulfills all needs, if there is a vacuum it gets filled. Anyone supporting that nut job Unifor president can picket all they want, they will soon find out they’re not as irreplaceable as they’ve convinced themselves they are.

If company cranes are idle long enough, they’ll be working again right away after the receivership auction.
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Old 01-17-2020, 09:19 AM
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Capitalism fulfills all needs, if there is a vacuum it gets filled. Anyone supporting that nut job Unifor president can picket all they want, they will soon find out they’re not as irreplaceable as they’ve convinced themselves they are.

If company cranes are idle long enough, they’ll be working again right away after the receivership auction.
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I have heard the same rhetoric from union buddies, only to be proven wrong.
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