Quality Trout Fisheries in Alberta - Page 31

DuckBrat · #**901** 03-21-2011, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

The only non stocked rainbow trout in Alberta are found in some small tributaries of the Athabasca River. They don't get much bigger than 12 inches. Hard to say if the genetics would grow bigger rainbows or if they are adapted to the warmer lakes that most rainbows get stocked into now. The type of rainbow is the not the concern...but rather their growth and lifespan based upon harvest and stocking rates.

Sorry to deviate from the main topic...

Sun... I talked recently too a Biologist in Edson, and Atha-B rainbows came up in the conversation. I too thought that these tiny trout were forever tiddler size. The Bio informed that they have done an experiment in the Edson Area using a reclaimed gravel pit to hold some Atha-B rainbows for genetic stock for future reclamation of the creeks in the area that have been raped over by industry. I almost fell off my chair when he told me of 20->24" Atha-B rainbows growing in this Gravel pit. Bigger fish, longer life-span (hardier through natural breeding), Who would have thought??

HunterDave · #**902** 03-21-2011, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc

Lets talk about selfishness for second since this had been brought up in past posts. 42.75% of the voters on this poll have stated that they would like the local lake close to them to be complete C&R with the chance at a trout up to 25". Only 6.11% would like their local lake to stay the status quo (5 trout per day with a chance at a 12"). Dave and a few others actually believe, the only anglers in this province that want change other than the 6.11% are those that voted on the poll, all others want things to stay the same (ya I know, crazy right?). Out of all who voted on this poll, including the C&R voters, how many have said that all the current P&T lakes should be changed to quality lakes? None? Everyone agrees that we should share "some" of the put and take lakes ( a relatively small percentage) especially those lakes that are not seeing a return from the tax payers investment (stunted trout, winterkill, etc). Yet, Dave and a few others believe they speak for every Albertan (except those that voted here) and say all P&T trout lakes should stay just the way they are because they have found a few P&T lakes that are not the status quo with some trout reaching decent sizes. So what do you think? Who's being selfish?

Doc, indeed let's talk about selfishness...........Some local anglers at Police Outpost Lake that regularly fish the lake are not happy with the 3 year old "quality" fishery that was created there and want it to revert back to a regularly stocked lake. They presented their case to SRD and SRD created a proposal to determine what the stakeholder support there is for and against it.

This triggered a letter writing campaign by members of special interest groups such as the Northern Lights Fly Tyers/Trout Unlimited EDMONTON and the EDMONTON Trout Fishing Club to defeat the proposal. YOU even started posting threads on fishing forums calling on people to defeat this proposal although YOU live in EDMONTON!!!!. To what end? To start a province wide campaign to fight a proposal initiated by the users of the lake by a bunch of people that don't fish there, have never fished there, and never will fish there!

Your understanding of what "selfish" means obviously differs from mine.

How can you rationalize and justify forcing your ideals on the users of Police Outpost Lake by organizing a province wide campaign when you don't even fish the lake?

Sundancefisher · #**903** 03-21-2011, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DuckBrat

Sorry to deviate from the main topic...

Sun... I talked recently too a Biologist in Edson, and Atha-B rainbows came up in the conversation. I too thought that these tiny trout were forever tiddler size. The Bio informed that they have done an experiment in the Edson Area using a reclaimed gravel pit to hold some Atha-B rainbows for genetic stock for future reclamation of the creeks in the area that have been raped over by industry. I almost fell off my chair when he told me of 20->24" Atha-B rainbows growing in this Gravel pit. Bigger fish, longer life-span (hardier through natural breeding), Who would have thought??

That is so cool. It would be very cool indeed to catch some quality NATIVE rainbow trout in Alberta's put and take quality fisheries. What is the expected lifespan difference?

huntsfurfish · #**904** 03-21-2011, 05:13 PM

Dave, I dont care if you live a mile from the Alberta Yukon border, Police lake is your lake too. Not just a few locals! I live in Lethbridge and have been fishing Police for 35 years. Just because they live closer does not make it their lake!!
And three years is not a fair shot at it working. I believe Terry and SRD will see that. But I will tell you what. I will fish it when the ice comes off and will let you know how the fishing is this year. Then you can come down and Ill take you out there fishing.

Speckle55 · #**905** 03-21-2011, 05:19 PM

Don,t fish end of april/first 2week May creek mouths 4-5 lb athb rainbows and 32 inch bulls.. rockys /burbot/sucker/grayling.. rainbow are staging..here is where I am going next month fish these too want one like Kathys(25lb bull) or a big Rainbow will doPicture%20731.jpg

Speckle55 · #**906** 03-21-2011, 05:46 PM

[QUOTE=Sundancefisher;875827]Specs...you are fixated on whether the lakes are productive that hold many of the stocked put and take lakes. The science is extremely clear and does not change when it comes to understanding if a lake is eutrophic (ie productive).

Your comparison of hunting would similar to comparing a high mountain lake with a prairie pothole or put and take lake. It is comparing apples to oranges and is not what the discussion is about.

Simple stocking rates and regulation changes are suffice to fix the problem. Your comparison to natural lakes is also a side topic but not relevant to a put and take lake. Again...comparing apples to oranges.

There are no marginally productive prairie lakes...there are no genetics save for triploid versus diploid...that is a concern for growth rates and size. All these current lakes can grow bigger trout no problem. It is a fact based upon clear science.

Ooopppsss

Athabasca Rainbows like i have told the Edson Bio in Meetings gheeee(new ideas) .. Maligne lake was barren stocked lake.. and if you come in June to Maligne stop at lake bridge and look at some of the spawners... a friend(1983) caught a spawner down stream that was over 7# after i stripped out her eggs as he would no
t release fish ..we got river shut down for spawn after that..keeping you informed.. David

PS Kathys bull is from the Kootenays BC

Sundancefisher · #**907** 03-21-2011, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speckle55

Don,t fish end of april/first 2week May creek mouths 4-5 lb athb rainbows and 32 inch bulls.. rockys /burbot/sucker/grayling.. rainbow are staging..here is where I am going next month fish these too want one like Kathys(25lb bull) or a big Rainbow will doAttachment 33737

Don't fish the Athabasca River cause it is polluted with Dioxins from the pulp mills. Very dangerous..rainbows are probably not Athabascan natives.

Also what does this have to do with stocked put and take lakes?

Sundancefisher · #**908** 03-21-2011, 05:56 PM

Specs...what you are confusing everyone with is your continued discussion about Maligne...a self sustaining National Park mountain lake.

If all you want is to discuss Maligne...please feel free to start a thread about Maligne.

Cheers

Sun

Speckle55 · #**909** 03-21-2011, 06:34 PM

Sorry Sun --talking a Alberta Quality lake ,talking stocking Alberta fish in Alberta Lakes .. Athabasca Rainbow as per Northern River Basin Study and other studys are pure.. no gentic cross from stocking programs noted!!! by the way you guys say that there are not enough bigger trout.. are you willing to volunteer to improve this or are you all talk .. don,t look at the substance of post just because you are bias or have your blinders on.. while you have said they are productive ..Maybe wrong type for rainbows/better suited for Perch? oh i forgot you all have GOD on your side

Speckle55 · #**910** 03-21-2011, 06:51 PM

On pulp mills process was change years ago... Opppppsss .. but still do your catch and release.. 4-5# upstream too.. i thought this post was for everone or is it for City folks that have to drive.. or is it for southern city folks? what is the Post name.. gheee sorry .. lots of people read posts and dont say a word ,, they learn where to go how to fish.. when to fish.. etc

HunterDave · #**911** 03-21-2011, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by huntsfurfish

Dave, I dont care if you live a mile from the Alberta Yukon border, Police lake is your lake too. Not just a few locals! I live in Lethbridge and have been fishing Police for 35 years. Just because they live closer does not make it their lake!!
And three years is not a fair shot at it working. I believe Terry and SRD will see that. But I will tell you what. I will fish it when the ice comes off and will let you know how the fishing is this year. Then you can come down and Ill take you out there fishing.

Then I guess that the majority of Alberta anglers ought to get organized and take some "quality" lakes off of you guys then, eh? What's fair is fair, right?

Thanks for the invite but I think that my buddies and I will be eating allot of trout this spring. I hear that there's a lake around here where you are only allowed to keep the big ones.

Sundancefisher · #**912** 03-21-2011, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speckle55

Maybe wrong type for rainbows/better suited for Perch? oh i forgot you all have GOD on your side

Hmmm...now why would you go and say that a put and take rainbow trout lake is better for perch when you know perch would ruin the lake for any fishing period?

Strange...but I am sure you were just kidding.

Sundancefisher · #**913** 03-21-2011, 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speckle55

On pulp mills process was change years ago... Opppppsss .. but still do your catch and release.. 4-5# upstream too.. i thought this post was for everone or is it for City folks that have to drive.. or is it for southern city folks? what is the Post name.. gheee sorry .. lots of people read posts and dont say a word ,, they learn where to go how to fish.. when to fish.. etc

Sorry Specs...you have some interesting things to say...but many thoughts are way off topic. I started a Maligne Lake thread for you as I too am interested in the lake. I have lots of fond memories as a kid...it would be interesting to know if the fishing has improved or gotten worse over the past 30 years...cause it may be worth a camping trip again.

Cheers

Sun

Speckle55 · #**914** 03-21-2011, 10:27 PM

Sun .. this is for u and Doc/etc to read ..your say that your lake are hyper eutrophic.. my lakes are oligottrophic lakes .. if you look at fish growth rates .. my lakes win .. yours have a 0.002 rate .. mine have 1 % growth rate .. as the proper plankton don,t do good in your lakes .. keeping you informed.. you have to change your lake .. like i mentioned small change will help trees/ big rocks/willows.. but it will take work .. if you plant bigger fish you can get by with out doing much but there is a cost and all us Albertans, we won,t pay for your fishing... and stock less fish as your productivity is less in your lakes.. it takes longer in some of your lakes to grow fish.. sorry to tell u this.. check out Fish Production correlated with primary Productivity not the Morph..

on Maligne Lake Alberta I have 31 years on lake and have been into a 10 plus rainbow losted and a 9 to 11 pound male brookie losted and caught a 12#13 oz female brookie 11 days later i do have some knowledge on that lake .. but hey the POST IS Quality Trout Fishery in Alberta.. am i in the right thread

Also Rawson killed lots of lakes in Alberta in the 30,s to 50,s to stock the prefered fish of choice...

goldscud · #**915** 03-21-2011, 10:44 PM

Here's a little fish from a small prairie lake...it seems it was growing faster than .002%

Lots of scuds/chironomids/boatmen/odonata/caddis/mayflies/leeches on the prairie for fish to eat. Just add some oxygen so the fish make it through the winter and don't kill them before they are 2 years old.

Doc · #**916** 03-21-2011, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HunterDave

. YOU even started posting threads on fishing forums calling on people to defeat this proposal although YOU live in EDMONTON!!!!. To what end? To start a province wide campaign to fight a proposal initiated by the users of the lake by a bunch of people that don't fish there, have never fished there, and never will fish there!

Your understanding of what "selfish" means obviously differs from mine.

How can you rationalize and justify forcing your ideals on the users of Police Outpost Lake by organizing a province wide campaign when you don't even fish the lake?

Because I live in Alberta and my tax dollars pay for the trout that get stocked into that lake! What do you not understand Dave? Do you need everyone to draw you a picture? It's not their lake, it's all of ours!

As far as me starting a province wide campaign, I didn't start it, I was asked to post the existing information by someone that lives near police outpost. And I posted it on my message board which is the "Alberta" Fly Fishing Forum not the "Edmonton" Fly Fishing Forum. Funny how all those (supposedly) local anglers that want it reverted back are the guys e-mailing me to post about who to write about keeping police a quality fishery.

Doc · #**917** 03-21-2011, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goldscud

Here's a little fish from a small prairie lake...it seems it was growing faster than .002%

Lots of scuds/chironomids/boatmen/odonata/caddis/mayflies/leeches on the prairie for fish to eat. Just add some oxygen so the fish make it through the winter and don't kill them before they are 2 years old.

Beautiful trout goldscud, THAT'S WHAT I'M TALKIN' BOUT! We don't have to catch trout like that everytime we wet a line but just knowing there's a chance to hook into a beauty like that is worth putting the time in.

This trout is big for Chickakoo.

Here's Chuck with a trout that's big for Muir (24")

Here's Joe with an average size tiger trout in the Parkland region of Manitoba.

With proper management, we could have these here.

Speckle55 · #**918** 03-21-2011, 11:19 PM

SRD planted 8 hens(retired) from hatchery 2 weeks before fish caught..we have lots caught here .. they put 8 browns in Wildhorse lake,, 1 was 7#10 last year.. ask your local fishery person if they did release(freedom to info) .. i am not saying you can,t .. lots of variables .. they put big Rainbows every year in lakes around province .. not common knowledge!! we have lake up here that grew 20# fish in 5 years .. very uncommon.. you have too have that mix

HunterDave · #**919** 03-21-2011, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc

With proper management, we could have these here.

We already do. I'm not into photo ops but once the ice leaves the lakes maybe I'll post some pictures for you guys that won't go to get to them.

HunterDave · #**920** 03-21-2011, 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speckle55

.. they put big Rainbows every year in lakes around province .. not common knowledge!!

Apparently only in the lakes that I fish in.

Speckle55 · #**921** 03-21-2011, 11:29 PM

Tiger Trout is like a triploid is it not..Manitoba does a lot of triploid stocking right.. also Sask..... I have a few pics of nice Alberta trout on my profile.. more in album not shown

Doc · #**922** 03-21-2011, 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HunterDave

We already do. I'm not into photo ops but once the ice leaves the lakes maybe I'll post some pictures for you guys that won't go to get to them.

So now you're telling us the lakes you fish have 26" trout on average?

Liar

HunterDave · #**923** 03-21-2011, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc

So now you're telling us the lakes you fish have 26" trout on average?

Liar

When did I say that the lakes that I fished have 26" trout on average?

Doc · #**924** 03-21-2011, 11:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HunterDave

When did I say that the lakes that I fished have 26" trout on average?

Look back at the post where you quoted me Dave. I wrote "Here's Joe with an average size tiger trout in the Parkland region of Manitoba. With proper management, we could have these here."

You replied, "We already do. I'm not into photo ops but once the ice leaves the lakes maybe I'll post some pictures for you guys that won't go to get to them."

So, we do? Really Dave?

goldscud · #**925** 03-21-2011, 11:47 PM

The fish I posted is not an old brood stock fish..,this fish was planted as a tiddler and grew with lots of prairie invertebrates to eat (not my fish just showing what happens when you don't kill them at age 1-2. Sorry Dave, I'm not here to brag). I'm not interested in catching worn out, fin damaged old hatchery hens.
Tiger trout are not triploid, just a brown X brook trout.

It would be nice Dave if there was more lakes south of Red Deer for us lazy guys in the south to fish for some bigger fish. Ten hour drive to the lakes NW of you is long trip.
Escaped triploids that Tosh catches 5 minutes from Calgary are from an accident, not government planning or good management.

HunterDave · #**926** 03-21-2011, 11:51 PM

With proper management, we could have these here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by HunterDave

We already do. I'm not into photo ops but once the ice leaves the lakes maybe I'll post some pictures for you guys that won't go to get to them.

Nope, I don't see where I said that the lakes that I fish averaged 26" trout....

Waffle......waffle.........waffle..........

Doc · #**927** 03-21-2011, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HunterDave

With proper management, we could have these here.

Nope, I don't see where I said that the lakes that I fish averaged 26" trout....

Waffle......waffle.........waffle..........

So, Dave, in my post I said "we could have these here". What am I referring to when I say "these" Dave?

1st, it's an average size trout at 26", 2nd it's a stillwater trout and 3rd it's a tiger trout. So you tell me Dave, where do we already have "these"?

And if you're not fishing these lakes why show us pictures of fish not relevant?

You're right you are waffling but it isn't working.

HunterDave · #**928** 03-22-2011, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goldscud

It would be nice Dave if there was more lakes south of Red Deer for us lazy guys in the south to fish for some bigger fish. Ten hour drive to the lakes NW of you is long trip.
Escaped triploids that Tosh catches 5 minutes from Calgary are from an accident, not government planning or good management.

I guess that you missed the post with the trout of the year that was caught in the Glenmore Reservoir.....

Where in Alberta would you have to live to have to drive 10 hours to find decent trout fishing? I've heard the same song and dance throughout this thread.......Doc claims there are no good trout lakes up here but I know different because I live just north of Edmonton. Sunshine claims that there are no good trout lakes in the Calgary area yet the trout of the year was caught there. Just look at the lakes an hour or two west of Calgary.......c'mon, who are you trying to kid here?

Speckle55 · #**929** 03-22-2011, 12:01 AM

By the way Goldscud very nice Rainbow !!! we had a 11#3 caught from Swan Lake north of Hinton 3 years ago its aerated ice fishing.. the one in the reg book this year 12# nice rainbow.. 2 or three Rainbows 30 lbs caught in thanksgiving weekend Kootenay Lake last year.. Adam and Sean Konrad will be at Dief looking for another line class.. we don,t have lakes like them BC/Sask those are BIG lakes.. but we do have a awesome fishery and if you want to key in on a species we have World Class fish(if you are hunting records).. Lake Trout/Rocky Mountain Whitefish/Pike/Brook Trout/Yellow Perch/Bull Trout .. i may have miss some but the others are nice fish too

HunterDave · #**930** 03-22-2011, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc

1st, it's an average size trout at 26", 2nd it's a stillwater trout and 3rd it's a tiger trout. So you tell me Dave, where do we already have "these"?

So now you're saying that you want to create tiger trout fisheries as well!