Quality Trout Fisheries in Alberta - Page 13

Gust · #**361** 03-05-2011, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc

Sundancefisher, you're right. Using the smiley faces is fun.

I think Dave needs one of a sad face back peddling.

sundance needs one that looks like Gaddafi Duck

But seriously,, if SRD hold a roundtable on this issue, I don't think any of us should mention our AOF monikers if we go. Seriously!!!

Sundancefisher · #**362** 03-05-2011, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GustavMahler

sundance needs one that looks like Gaddafi Duck

But seriously,, if SRD hold a roundtable on this issue, I don't think any of us should mention our AOF monikers if we go. Seriously!!!

LOL

I have had a lot of AOF guys out perch fishing over the years. You are all a great bunch. Seriously...if you were to trust one demographic...I know there is a way higher percentage of great folks that fish than say golf...

HunterDave · #**363** 03-05-2011, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc

Oh my, this is way to funny.

Here's my reply...

It takes a special type of person to think that their way of doing things is superior to mine and they know better of what's best for me. Just have a look at what people type about anglers that want to catch larger fish. Somehow, somewhere along the lines, someone decided that they were superior to anglers that want to catch bigger fish because they only want to catch average fish.

We're not asking for all stocked lakes to be quality lakes Dave just a percentage. You're saying we can't have any of the current put and takes.

Hmmm, that kind of backfired on you heh?

You two fellas are hilarious. One fella writes a less than well thought out post and the other fella posts how that really got me.

I don't know how you rationalize that you wanting to enforce your will on people to change the way that they do things to the way that you want them to, compares to me not accepting the change that you are proposing. You see the difference? I'm not forcing anything on anyone but you would like to. You might find that rational a little complex but if you give it enough thought you might understand it.

If you want to establish a hierarchy of anglers I would place anglers that want to create "quality" fisheries where they could catch big fish easier below Joe Angler that only catches small fish in regular stocked trout ponds. At least Joe Angler is being honest about his fishing and not trying to cheat his way into catching a bigger fish. I realize that this might come as a shock to you given your feeling of superiority above Joe Angler but it is what it is.

Correct, if I called the shots at SRD I'd tell all of you guys to get your lazy butts out to one of our regular stocked lakes and put in the effort if you want to catch big fish.

trainerdave · #**364** 03-05-2011, 06:35 PM

Do any of you know if there would be the possibility of splitting some lakes with a geographical boundary? For example - Chain lakes; have the south 1/2 "open season" and the north 1/2 baitless c&r under 50cm. Now what do you think of that scenario or one like it...surely some big fish would survive without wandering - and would provide increased opportunities to everybody-including the "all fish are good small or not crowd",when they wander south.

The C&R 1/2 of the lake could act as a nursery with fish growth in mind while developing stock quality and perhaps an understanding by both sides.It does take time to grow big fish.
Stewardship.You want little stocked bows for you and the kids/etc. Sure. Fish south of point x. You want to tackle the big ones, catch and release. Let em go-let em grow.Sure.Fish north of point x.

Some big fish will go South due to the nature of fish movement and the fact that they will be allowed to develop to that size. The c&r people up north will still have little pests hitting their gear which they can release. Most of these eventually swim south to be kept anyway, as fish do move about. A few may develop in to very large fish and be caught and released several times within the north region before moving on. They would then be replaced by smaller ones-which have moved in to start the whole process up again.

Sort of a FISHTOPIA. Just food for thought- I know it seems simple but will get complicated in a hurry...D.

HunterDave · #**365** 03-05-2011, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GustavMahler

I like Dave, he's sticking to his guns,,, I also like Docs posts and a few of yours and Bigtoads gnashy wit. A really good screenplay would have the four of you guys stuck in a boat, with 3 beers and two fishing rods and one lure and a rabbi,, rabbi's always make it funny.

Well thank you Gustav!

I can hear it now.........

5 minutes into it......

"There are no big fish in here, all we've caught are little ones."

"Fishing here is too hard, let's go to Muir!"
"Frig that! Muir is about an hour and a half from here!"

"Fish would ya. And take off that stupid lookin fishing vest."
"Oh yeah, just because you don't care if you only catch little fish......."

"Yeah, what he said! I only want to catch big ones too!"

"I wish that someone would have dumped a few buckets of big trout in here"
"I got one! Look a nice eatin sized 12" one!"

"Throw it back, I don't want anyone seeing us with a 12" trout"
"Has anyone seen my tin foil hat?"
"Gentlemen please! Ach....Mahatnigahndi!"

"Look at that kid that just caught a 9" trout. All excited over a little trout!"
"Yeah, what he said. Stupid kid!"
"His Dad is probably the same way."
LOL............LOL.............LOL!

"Enough with the back patting already."
"I brought my camera in case we catch a big one!"
"There's no big fish in here!"
"Yeah, what he said!"
"Well we won't catch anything unless ya shutup and fish!"

"Allot easier fishing Muir."
"There are no big fish in here anyway."
"It's too hard here."

SPLASH............SPLASH...........SPLASH

Rabbi start the motor and pass me a beer.

Sundancefisher · #**366** 03-05-2011, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HunterDave

I don't know how you rationalize that you wanting to enforce your will on people to change the way that they do things to the way that you want them to, compares to me not accepting the change that you are proposing. You see the difference? I'm not forcing anything on anyone but you would like to. You might find that rational a little complex but if you give it enough thought you might understand it.

If you want to establish a hierarchy of anglers I would place anglers that want to create "quality" fisheries where they could catch big fish easier below Joe Angler that only catches small fish in regular stocked trout ponds. At least Joe Angler is being honest about his fishing and not trying to cheat his way into catching a bigger fish. I realize that this might come as a shock to you given your feeling of superiority above Joe Angler but it is what it is. :

Ahhh...my good Davey...you are trying to think deep but you yourself are not thinking past the obvious to something deeper. Is not by the very premise of trying to prevent change that many wish exerting your own will on the discussion?

Calling someone lazy for wanting bigger fish? Tisk tisk. Kinda of a far reaching argument. You have already stated you like the fisheries the way they are because you state you already catch big fish. As stated before...in case you forgot...catching 9-12 inchers and then your big fish is a 16 incher...is no different than someone wanting to catch 16-20 inchers with a 25 incher. Premise is the same...however your scale is set too low for what fisheries in Alberta can offer. Setting your sights low is a poor use of the resource and a insult to everyone that wants to make things better. If you ran the design and manufacturing of cars...you good sir would be the fine distributor of Ladas. You would now be fighting tooth and nail to protect your Lada as it rusts away... We are trying for Lexus with a smidge of Roll Royce thrown in. You call it elitist...except this idea is offering the value to everyone...which is not elitist.

I think you belittle the Joe Angler by assuming they are getting fair value from the resource. When you expose people to better they want better. It is human nature. Your fear of better is the fear of the unknown. That is why there is so much political unrest in Africa right now. You can offer the the status quo...not accept change and be like Gadaffi...or you can embrace change like the Egyptians.

Till you fish Police or Bullshead or Muir...your negativity is unjust. What the other side has that you don't is a full understanding of the issue...as we have fished tiddler lakes and quality lakes.

The only cheating going on is the system cheating us out of better system and you being fooled by status quo.

HunterDave · #**367** 03-05-2011, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

Ahhh...my good Davey...you are trying to think deep but you yourself are not thinking past the obvious to something deeper. Is not by the very premise of trying to prevent change that many wish exerting your own will on the discussion?

Calling someone lazy for wanting bigger fish? Tisk tisk. Kinda of a far reaching argument. You have already stated you like the fisheries the way they are because you state you already catch big fish. As stated before...in case you forgot...catching 9-12 inchers and then your big fish is a 16 incher...is no different than someone wanting to catch 16-20 inchers with a 25 incher. Premise is the same...however your scale is set too low for what fisheries in Alberta can offer. Setting your sights low is a poor use of the resource and a insult to everyone that wants to make things better. If you ran the design and manufacturing of cars...you good sir would be the fine distributor of Ladas. You would now be fighting tooth and nail to protect your Lada as it rusts away... We are trying for Lexus with a smidge of Roll Royce thrown in. You call it elitist...except this idea is offering the value to everyone...which is not elitist.

I think you belittle the Joe Angler by assuming they are getting fair value from the resource. When you expose people to better they want better. It is human nature. Your fear of better is the fear of the unknown. That is why there is so much political unrest in Africa right now. You can offer the the status quo...not accept change and be like Gadaffi...or you can embrace change like the Egyptians.

Till you fish Police or Bullshead or Muir...your negativity is unjust. What the other side has that you don't is a full understanding of the issue...as we have fished tiddler lakes and quality lakes.

The only cheating going on is the system cheating us out of better system and you being fooled by status quo.

You do understand what the word elitist means don't you? It's only elitist if you feel that your ideas are superior to those of other people. Not only do you need to be able to rationalize that, you also need to have an understanding of what elitist means and how to use the word in context. You see, when you state things like "insult to everyone that wants to make things better." you are insinuating that your ideology is superior to other people's. That is "elitist".

When you say, "You call it elitist...except this idea is offering the value to everyone...which is not elitist." that's actually ironic.

The reason being is that you made an elitist statement that implied that you knew what was best for everyone and then said that it was not elitist.

Like I said, it might be a little too complex for some people to understand.

As far as remembering what I have previously stated concerning what size of fish that I catch, I don't need to remember what I wrote. The only reason that someone would was because they were telling lies. Since I haven't lied, all that I have to remember is what I've caught. Pretty simple eh?

One thing that I do know for sure is that I never stated that I was, "catching 9-12 inchers and then your big fish is a 16 incher". Now why would you want to go ahead and say that I previously stated that?

It's one of two things IMO, either it is an attempt to trick people into thinking that I said that or you are confusing what goes on in your mind with reality. Either way, I find it a little creepy.

I guess if you say it enough it becomes fact........

I guess that your theory about people wanting quality fisheries after they have been exposed to them didn't quite work out as expected at Police Lake eh? Well, based on the resolution to shut it down anyway.

Sundancefisher · #**368** 03-05-2011, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HunterDave

You do understand what the word elitist means don't you? It's only elitist if you feel that your ideas are superior to those of other people. Not only do you need to be able to rationalize that, you also need to have an understanding of what elitist means and how to use the word in context. You see, when you state things like "insult to everyone that wants to make things better." you are insinuating that your ideology is superior to other people's. That is "elitist".

When you say, "You call it elitist...except this idea is offering the value to everyone...which is not elitist." that's actually ironic.

The reason being is that you made an elitist statement that implied that you knew what was best for everyone and then said that it was not elitist.

Like I said, it might be a little too complex for some people to understand.

As far as remembering what I have previously stated concerning what size of fish that I catch, I don't need to remember what I wrote. The only reason that someone would was because they were telling lies. Since I haven't lied, all that I have to remember is what I've caught. Pretty simple eh?

One thing that I do know for sure is that I never stated that I was, "catching 9-12 inchers and then your big fish is a 16 incher". Now why would you want to go ahead and say that I previously stated that?

It's one of two things IMO, either it is an attempt to trick people into thinking that I said that or you are confusing what goes on in your mind with reality. Either way, I find it a little creepy.

I guess if you say it enough it becomes fact........

I guess that your theory about people wanting quality fisheries after they have been exposed to them didn't quite work out as expected at Police Lake eh? Well, based on the resolution to shut it down anyway.

LOL

I knew you have been reading wikipedia. That is where you got your Average Joe wording from LOL.

Quote:

Originally Posted by HunterDave

Was it average Joe angler or a bunch of guys belonging to elitist fishing organizations. Even then the support was divided if I recall correctly. SRD recognized this and that is why their documents all read something like: some anglers would like to see "quality" fisheries while the general angler wants harvest opportunities and higher catch rates.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elitism

Elitism is the belief or attitude that some individuals, who form an elite — a select group of people with intellect, wealth, specialized training or experience, or other distinctive attributes — are those whose views on a matter are to be taken the most seriously or carry the most weight or those who view their own views as so; whose views and/or actions are most likely to be constructive to society as a whole; or whose extraordinary skills, abilities or wisdom render them especially fit to govern.[1]

The actual definition does not actually deduce if anyone is wrong...just that some have the expertise etc. Regardless of if someone is right or wrong...when the masses demand change and it reflects so obviously in polls etc... yet you yourself wish to attain lesser and demand all bow to that demand...you invoke an elitist attitude that you are in fact right on your own belief. You are elitist in assuming the best way is the small way. So all definitions aside that is but another attempt to diverge on the facts and the actual topic.

You could of been referring to the definition as:
"Elitism may also refer to situations in which an individual assumes special privileges and responsibilities in the hope that this arrangement will benefit humanity or themselves." In fact no one is assuming special privileges...just some people trying to help facilitate what others are demanding. I call that social activism...

Cheers

Sun

HunterDave · #**369** 03-06-2011, 12:33 AM

Well I'm glad that you looked it up.

I guess that it shows that you didn't know what it meant in the first place. Geez, how did I know that?

Well, hopefully you can find a few examples of how the word is used correctly and learn how to use it effectively in your vocabulary......LMFAO!

Ya see what ya did there? You posted the definition of "elitism" which means that you looked it up because you weren't sure of what it meant!

No wonder you're lining up to drink the "quality" fishery kool-aid! You haven't a clue of what I'm posting do ya?.

Aw man, I got a full out loud belly laugh out of that one!

michaelmicallef · #**370** 03-06-2011, 06:12 AM

What is the purpose of all this web bitching at each other. If we really want quality fisheries we have got to bitch to the right people. Maybe the odd person from F & W looks at this site once and every blue moon. But those of use who think things could be better have got to focus our energy where it will make a difference. I am sure some people already do. And maybe some of the "elitist" government thinking may change. I am also betting this tread will cool of when things warm up and we can all get out on the water and catch some freaking fish! Time to send a link of this site to my M.P.

Sundancefisher · #**371** 03-06-2011, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HunterDave

Well I'm glad that you looked it up. I guess that it shows that you didn't know what it meant in the first place. Geez, how did I know that? Well, hopefully you can find a few examples of how the word is used correctly and learn how to use it effectively in your vocabulary......LMFAO!

Ya see what ya did there? You posted the definition of "elitism" which means that you looked it up because you weren't sure of what it meant!

No wonder you're lining up to drink the "quality" fishery kool-aid! You haven't a clue of what I'm posting do ya?.

Aw man, I got a full out loud belly laugh out of that one!

You have to laugh out loud cause based upon your responses to date you are most likely crying inside.

your problem is you don't know what you say from post to post. You do not understand the topic.

There is no elitism...but rather populism. That is what you failed to grasp last post. You kind sir are preaching elitism...those that make the regulations in the past were right and should continue to lead and define our fisheries. The populist ideal is that we need to try something different cause the rulers of the past did not keep up to speed with the will of the people.

While you continue to ignore this and every other poll...due to paranoia

that an "elitist" group in your mind has taken over AOF...

the facts speak for itself. You are not in the majority but in the minority and trying to rule. Define that again?

Still...keep treading water and back peddling on the topic...or just continue what you do best...ignoring the facts and creating side topics rather than addressing the current one.

The topic is do people want better fishing...not the status quo...the results so far speak very clearly on that topic... So as to the world you are currently living in...

Fact is and sorry to point this out...most people want better fishing that you seem to want.

Sundancefisher · #**372** 03-06-2011, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by michaelmicallef

What is the purpose of all this web bitching at each other. If we really want quality fisheries we have got to bitch to the right people. Maybe the odd person from F & W looks at this site once and every blue moon. But those of use who think things could be better have got to focus our energy where it will make a difference. I am sure some people already do. And maybe some of the "elitist" government thinking may change. I am also betting this tread will cool of when things warm up and we can all get out on the water and catch some freaking fish! Time to send a link of this site to my M.P.

LOL

One persons bitch is another persons debate. I like Davey boy...I like his style. It is entertaining to debate with him. What is wrong with that?

As for warming weather...fishing is more fun that watching fishing on TV for sure...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ssZIIA7eLAk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktoMYb_Q9HI go to 1:08

Speckle55 · #**373** 03-06-2011, 09:53 AM

Remember people most these trout lake's were barren because Mother Nature made them that way.. example little or no Plankton or zoology meaning no potential.. but hey good luck on getting big fish from a un productive lake.. if you want big fish go to East of Edson Rv Park trout pond they have 5 to 15 lbers enought to get your arms sore, they feed their fish... then u won't stop a child or a first time fisher from catching a trophy 10 incher that is close to there home.. if you want big fish please do your research History of Lake River/ Potencial is the genetics there/are your in the right lake for your size requirment.. alittle homework will pay off.. or get SRD to put more aerators and feeders on your lake..Big Lake /Big Fish if you are big whats the chance you kids will be big// good lakes have lots of food ie Plankton etc all the way up the food chain=big fish.. just a Red Neck Albertan.. ps check my profile I did some homework..

Sundancefisher · #**374** 03-06-2011, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speckle55

Remember people most these trout lake's were barren because Mother Nature made them that way.. example little or no Plankton or zoology meaning no potential.. but hey good luck on getting big fish from a un productive lake.. if you want big fish go to East of Edson Rv Park trout pond they have 5 to 15 lbers enought to get your arms sore, they feed their fish... then u won't stop a child or a first time fisher from catching a trophy 10 incher that is close to there home.. if you want big fish please do your research History of Lake River/ Potencial is the genetics there/are your in the right lake for your size requirment.. alittle homework will pay off.. or get SRD to put more aerators and feeders on your lake..Big Lake /Big Fish if you are big whats the chance you kids will be big// good lakes have lots of food ie Plankton etc all the way up the food chain=big fish.. just a Red Neck Albertan.. ps check my profile I did some homework..

seriously?

You telling us that a eutrophic pothole lake has low productivity?

Unfortunately...that is far from correct.

The reason why many of these lakes were barren had zero to do with productivity and 100% to do with glaciation. Glaciers left the lakes behind without tributaries. Therefore no immigration occurred. Simple.

Cheers

Sun

Speckle55 · #**375** 03-06-2011, 11:47 AM

Please check with the studys done on lakes that produce Big Fish .. example Alberta Rainbow record Maligne lake suppose to be(could be Big lake lots of area) , some say 1st lake valley of five , study done on first lake ..most lakes have half a page of diff speices Plankton etc .. 1st lake has a page and three quarters(4 rainbows netted over 20lbs 1980 Parks Canada).. Bow river why so good has Calgary dump in treated sewer and plants .. added food source.. Diefenbaker lake has so much farming in area lots of runoff.. food for lake.. example Kootenay Lake plant(industry) shut down on lake.. losing big gerrard.. BC gov now seeding lake.. if a lake in growing season has so much food produced and it takes x amount for a fish to grow, most trout lakes in alberta will have a tough time getting a Rainbow past 6 to 7 lbs unless you change that ratio.. example some lakes have more food or you can add growth hormones to the food chain or u do like you are promoting where there will be 10 big fish in a given lake and they will stock 10 fish every 4 years

Sundancefisher · #**376** 03-06-2011, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speckle55

Please check with the studys done on lakes that produce Big Fish .. example Alberta Rainbow record Maligne lake suppose to be(could be Big lake lots of area) , some say 1st lake valley of five , study done on first lake ..most lakes have half a page of diff speices Plankton etc .. 1st lake has a page and three quarters(4 rainbows netted over 20lbs 1980 Parks Canada).. Bow river why so good has Calgary dump in treated sewer and plants .. added food source.. Diefenbaker lake has so much farming in area lots of runoff.. food for lake.. example Kootenay Lake plant(industry) shut down on lake.. losing big gerrard.. BC gov now seeding lake.. if a lake in growing season has so much food produced and it takes x amount for a fish to grow, most trout lakes in alberta will have a tough time getting a Rainbow past 6 to 7 lbs unless you change that ratio.. example some lakes have more food or you can add growth hormones to the food chain or u do like you are promoting where there will be 10 big fish in a given lake and they will stock 10 fish every 4 years

Your comment that pothole lakes are dead and devoid of life or enough food to feed a certain number of rainbows is what is at odds...not mentioning a bunch of other water bodies that has nothing to do with potholes. You can not make any comparisons between a mountain lake like Maligne, to Dief to Kootenay.

Sorry...but pothole lakes are not oligotrophic. They are not mesotrophic...they are eutrophic.

You are so far off base...no offense...but it is really hard to explain it all to you. This is basic biology 101.

If you added any extra nutrients to a pothole lake you would initiate an algae bloom that if severe enough would cause summer kill...likewise probably lead to a winterkill.

Cheers

Sun

GaryF · #**377** 03-06-2011, 12:34 PM

HunterDave, honest answer pls. Why do you not fish the morinville pond? By your logic all stocked waters contain large(20"+) fish. So why not fish the pond? They are in there, right?

gl2 · #**378** 03-06-2011, 12:56 PM

sun.....

are the kananaskis lakes "quality" yet? or is this plan so fool proof that you want to tackle trout province wide in one shot? i supported the changes in k lakes but do not support these changes in my favorite trout lake. I would absolutly not support a bait ban of any kind at the exspense of kids ect to make ego stroking of grown men easier.

Speckle55 · #**379** 03-06-2011, 01:38 PM

Hey Sun ..you missed the point.. if you want bigger fish fast get Triploid rainbows.. or get them to put in hatchery fish at age 7 .. other than that our growth rates are not good enough to get what you want/size of lake/food source etc or you would have seen in our records some bigger fish in each lake and i do not promote adding food ..those other lakes I mention are rivers ...if you want good size rainbows go to the lakes that have them in now ..Swan , Millers.. the 2 Pitt lakes on Coal Valley Edson south lease(50cm size limit) although i would not eat Selenium... they can go to 10# + in any those lakes.. the only thing it takes x number of hours to catch 1 fish.. people go to lake and say there are no fish it is more likley they are fishing wrong or expect that for 1 hour of fishing you should get 1 big fish.. granted some times a lake is dead .. such is the life of our Alberta lakes all 200.. just joking

HunterDave · #**380** 03-06-2011, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

While you continue to ignore this and every other poll...due to paranoia

that an "elitist" group in your mind has taken over AOF...

the facts speak for itself. You are not in the majority but in the minority and trying to rule. Define that again?

I don't ignore every poll that is posted on AO, I accept them for their worth. If you want to proclaim that this or any poll on AO is representative of what the majority of Alberta anglers want then that's entirely up to you. However, if you took the results of a push-poll (Thanks Gustav for teaching me that word) with a little over 200 votes on it to SRD as proof that the majority of Alberta anglers want "quality" fisheries, they will laugh you out the front door.

You can dismiss that as hogwash but I'm pretty sure that allot of people understand the reality of it.

I don't know when "quality" fisheries came into vogue on the AO fishing forums but if you take the same ideology out to Joe Angler I'm certain that it won't be as welcomed as it is here. My opinion is that Joe Angler would not be as willing to line up to drink the "quality" fishery kool-aid. They go out and enjoy their fishing whether they catch a big fish or not.

HunterDave · #**381** 03-06-2011, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speckle55

Hey Sun ..you missed the point.. if you want bigger fish fast get Triploid rainbows.. or get them to put in hatchery fish at age 7 .. other than that our growth rates are not good enough to get what you want/size of lake/food source etc or you would have seen in our records some bigger fish in each lake and i do not promote adding food ..those other lakes I mention are rivers ...if you want good size rainbows go to the lakes that have them in now ..Swan , Millers.. the 2 Pitt lakes on Coal Valley Edson south lease(50cm size limit) although i would not eat Selenium... they can go to 10# + in any those lakes.. the only thing it takes x number of hours to catch 1 fish.. people go to lake and say there are no fish it is more likley they are fishing wrong or expect that for 1 hour of fishing you should get 1 big fish.. granted some times a lake is dead .. such is the life of our Alberta lakes all 200.. just joking

I tried that approach Speckle and it won't work.

You see, there are no big fish in any lakes and "quality" fishery fellas don't want to travel the distance to get to them if there were, but there aren't.

The bottom line is that the "quality" fishery guys want to make catching big fish as easy as possible for themselves. A lake that is in their backyard loaded with only big fish would be ideal.

Sundancefisher · #**382** 03-06-2011, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speckle55

Hey Sun ..you missed the point.. if you want bigger fish fast get Triploid rainbows.. or get them to put in hatchery fish at age 7 .. other than that our growth rates are not good enough to get what you want/size of lake/food source etc or you would have seen in our records some bigger fish in each lake and i do not promote adding food ..those other lakes I mention are rivers ...if you want good size rainbows go to the lakes that have them in now ..Swan , Millers.. the 2 Pitt lakes on Coal Valley Edson south lease(50cm size limit) although i would not eat Selenium... they can go to 10# + in any those lakes.. the only thing it takes x number of hours to catch 1 fish.. people go to lake and say there are no fish it is more likley they are fishing wrong or expect that for 1 hour of fishing you should get 1 big fish.. granted some times a lake is dead .. such is the life of our Alberta lakes all 200.. just joking

Sorry...I see you thought now.

Doc will tell you as will others...there are many lakes that can grow big fish. You just can't over stock them and/or kill them before they get bigger.

For sure...stocking triploids will help. Also stocking them in big also helps. The idea of stocking them big however comes with a cost. If that is feasible...why not augment some fisheries accordingly but protect the big ones for repeated catching.

For the time being the idea is delaying harvest in SOME lakes to create a quality fishery. The idea of trophy (i.e. > 10 lbers) will require a different approach...and will certainly apply to a much smaller subset of the lakes.

Growing trout to 20 inches in most lakes is not hard...if the lakes are managed correctly.

Cheers

Sun

Sundancefisher · #**383** 03-06-2011, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tosh

sun.....

are the kananaskis lakes "quality" yet? or is this plan so fool proof that you want to tackle trout province wide in one shot? i supported the changes in k lakes but do not support these changes in my favorite trout lake. I would absolutly not support a bait ban of any kind at the exspense of kids ect to make ego stroking of grown men easier.

UKL and LKL have not been changed to "quality fisheres" as in a delayed harvest.

As for bait ban...some lakes will remain tiddler catch and kill...others like Bullshead however proved that bait fishermen can catch a mess on a bobber and fly. In fact often catching more than they ever did before.

Don't underestimate the power of doing it differently. My kids from the age of 3 onwards caught a mess of fish on a bobber and fly...no bait.

As for thinking this is about making ego stroking...LOL...you clearly are on the wrong side of the fence insofar as trying to improve fishing overall. Trying to simply increase the average size of trout in a lake has nothing to do with egos...but everything to do with common sense. Why expect less when you can expect more out of the resource. Why artificially impose limits and regulations on purpose that detracts from the fishery? The fish are small because we make them small on purpose. It just does not make any sense and is the old approach. The old is no longer working on its own merits.

What lake are you concerned about improving the fish size on?

Sundancefisher · #**384** 03-06-2011, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HunterDave

I don't ignore every poll that is posted on AO, I accept them for their worth. If you want to proclaim that this or any poll on AO is representative of what the majority of Alberta anglers want then that's entirely up to you. However, if you took the results of a push-poll (Thanks Gustav for teaching me that word) with a little over 200 votes on it to SRD as proof that the majority of Alberta anglers want "quality" fisheries, they will laugh you out the front door.

You can dismiss that as hogwash but I'm pretty sure that allot of people understand the reality of it.

I don't know when "quality" fisheries came into vogue on the AO fishing forums but if you take the same ideology out to Joe Angler I'm certain that it won't be as welcomed as it is here. My opinion is that Joe Angler would not be as willing to line up to drink the "quality" fishery kool-aid. They go out and enjoy their fishing whether they catch a big fish or not.

How about for fun...start your own poll and make it generic and clear without the bias you assume all the other polls are showing. It never hurts and could be interesting.

If the 10,000 members of AOF wanted put and take tiddler fisheries...why not a higher for the last option? That option seems pretty clear...it is the only option allowing for 5 a day harvest.

Gust · #**385** 03-06-2011, 02:29 PM

Some years back a stat came out putting Albertas fishing population as 1 in 3. If that stat still stands, about 750,000 fisherfolk are in the Province.

I'm in Calgary and there are an abundance of fisheries within a 5 minute drive where I can frequently catch trout of a sizeable nature, 24"+. My familiarity of trout lakes Edmonton way is nill. If AOF can be regarded as a poll, the majority of threads from up that way tend to lean into Coarse fish (pike, walleye, burbs and Perch).

Is there a stewardship program available where some fisherfolk can adopt a pond or two or six and manage them on behalf of SRD? I'll gladly assist in seeking grants and people for you guys to put teams and funds together. I know someone who doesn't fish and has a private pond in Spruce Grove, and I'm sure with the right persuasion would be more than glad to have some of you fishers manage a small adultcentric fishery. There is a public pond near me that's a blast to flyfish on and has some beauts in it and is not only well maintained and gorgeous to be at but is only an acre in size. And is C&R, takes the edge off a fishin need when work eats up time to go further out.

Lets get on the positive side and start hammering out ideas to keep all us Spring Crazy fishermen happy.

HunterDave · #**386** 03-06-2011, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GaryF

HunterDave, honest answer pls. Why do you not fish the morinville pond? By your logic all stocked waters contain large(20"+) fish. So why not fish the pond? They are in there, right?

Honest reply..........I didn't say that I don't fish the Morinville Rez, I said that I go to it after supper occasionally but if I'm going out for the day I likely would drive by it to go to a different lake. The same as I would drive by Muir Lake. If there is no winter/summer kill then I suppose that it's reasonable to think that there are big fish in there. I don't know if the Rez could grow 20" trout but I do know that they'll grow bigger than the 6" size that they are when they are put in. Right about now, they should be about the right eatin size so, yeah, maybe I will head out there for the day soon.

I understand the point that you are trying to make but besides what I've already typed, some rocket dentist decided to dump a load of small perch in there as well.

It's not as big of a problem if you are fishing open water with lures but if you are ice fishing with bait then it's a pain in the butt.

It's not all about only catching big fish for me. I like catching all sizes of fish and if I happen to catch a big one then great.

HunterDave · #**387** 03-06-2011, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

How about for fun...start your own poll and make it generic and clear without the bias you assume all the other polls are showing. It never hurts and could be interesting.

If the 10,000 members of AOF wanted put and take tiddler fisheries...why not a higher for the last option? That option seems pretty clear...it is the only option allowing for 5 a day harvest.

EXACTLY. It is the only option available on this poll.

Here, you start it with this as one of the options............

Limit of 5 trout with a chance of catching one up to 20"

Are you starting to see how a poll can be skewed?

Speckle55 · #**388** 03-06-2011, 02:57 PM

We have a trout pond in Hinton and there is one in Edson by Millers lake they do put in some hens(5 to 9 lbers) every now and then. they just put some Browns in Wildhorse lake 2 falls ago 5 to 8 lbers so if the lake is dead and you catch some big ones SRD put some hens in , they are retiring some from the hatchery every now and then :-} those lake still get the stocking they normally get .. Check out www.Hintonfishandgame.ca then trout pond for ours

Sundancefisher · #**389** 03-06-2011, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GustavMahler

Some years back a stat came out putting Albertas fishing population as 1 in 3. If that stat still stands, about 750,000 fisherfolk are in the Province.

I'm in Calgary and there are an abundance of fisheries within a 5 minute drive where I can frequently catch trout of a sizeable nature, 24"+. My familiarity of trout lakes Edmonton way is nill. If AOF can be regarded as a poll, the majority of threads from up that way tend to lean into Coarse fish (pike, walleye, burbs and Perch).

Is there a stewardship program available where some fisherfolk can adopt a pond or two or six and manage them on behalf of SRD? I'll gladly assist in seeking grants and people for you guys to put teams and funds together. I know someone who doesn't fish and has a private pond in Spruce Grove, and I'm sure with the right persuasion would be more than glad to have some of you fishers manage a small adultcentric fishery. There is a public pond near me that's a blast to flyfish on and has some beauts in it and is not only well maintained and gorgeous to be at but is only an acre in size. And is C&R, takes the edge off a fishin need when work eats up time to go further out.

Lets get on the positive side and start hammering out ideas to keep all us Spring Crazy fishermen happy.

The same results occur on another forum as well. It is not unique to AOF.

Excluding the Bow which is not a lake...for rainbows in publically stocked lakes within 5 mins of Calgary...I have to call you on that. There are no public rainbow trout lakes with 24 inch rainbows within 5 minutes of Calgary. If you are changing the discussion from is the Bow River a quality fishery...yes. But what we are lacking is quality trout fisheries for rainbows in lakes.

Your licence count is probably a ways off. BC had 345414 licences last year. They spread out over tons more water however. Our anglers are concentrated on fewer water bodies.

Spring...when does Spring come. Please let it be soon. The ice is soooo thick...it is going to take weeks longer to melt if we don't get a few good rains.

Cheers

Sun

Sundancefisher · #**390** 03-06-2011, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HunterDave

EXACTLY. It is the only option available on this poll.

Here, you start it with this as one of the options............

Limit of 5 trout with a chance of catching one up to 20"

Are you starting to see how a poll can be skewed?

LOL but few took that option on this poll...obviously...that is what is confusing you.

Having that as the only option is the ONLY way you will get the results you want...

Poor fella... It must drive you nuts...