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08-16-2018, 05:36 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 3,896
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LCCFisherman
Exactly. Lease holders lock them up like they own it... wait a minute... except that they don't!!! Once cattle are out it should be free for all.
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Maybe they should have a user fee, just like the ones that are ok with a provincial park fee. That money could go towards cleaning up the messes, repairing fences, and if there is fire started it could compensate the lease holder for any losses concurred by all the user groups.
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08-16-2018, 05:45 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 11,561
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There is a system in place for lease land, if everyone follows the rules it works well. And yes there are people on both sides that abuse it.
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“One of the sad signs of our times is that we have demonized those who produce, subsidized those who refuse to produce, and canonized those who complain.”
Thomas Sowell
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08-17-2018, 08:04 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 1,786
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LCCFisherman
Crown grazing leases should be abolished plane and simple. Its the 21st century...
All this land should be sold with the lease holder having the first right of refusal and IF this lease holder doesn't have the cash then too bad!!
I'm sorry but Canada is tired of this dog and pony show.
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On the prairies, the Hutterites (or other large commercial agro-op) would buy it all, cultivate the native prairie, and in the end we'd have even less land to hunt on.
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Common sense is so rare these days, that it should be considered a super power.
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08-17-2018, 08:16 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 932
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoytCRX32
On the prairies, the Hutterites (or other large commercial agro-op) would buy it all, cultivate the native prairie, and in the end we'd have even less land to hunt on.
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Don't colonies have to have a provincial approval to erect a new one?
Quote:
Maybe they should have a user fee, just like the ones that are ok with a provincial park fee. That money could go towards cleaning up the messes, repairing fences, and if there is fire started it could compensate the lease holder for any losses concurred by all the user groups.
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Nah the money they make on those cattle every year covers that. We are all very aware at how easy it is to make a dollar on grazing leases. Its almost robbery! And if you're so lucky to have any predation is the easiest money you've ever made!!
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08-17-2018, 08:54 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 1,786
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"Don't colonies have to have a provincial approval to erect a new one?"
Not necessarily...just add to existing colony's land base. There are several colonies near large grazing leases in southern Alberta
I'm not saying anything negative about the Hutterites...it's just that their business model can (usually) out-compete individuals. Large commercial agro-operations work in the same way.
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Common sense is so rare these days, that it should be considered a super power.
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08-17-2018, 08:58 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Foothills
Posts: 2,337
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LCCFisherman
Nah the money they make on those cattle every year covers that. We are all very aware at how easy it is to make a dollar on grazing leases. Its almost robbery! And if you're so lucky to have any predation is the easiest money you've ever made!!
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Oh ya, grazing leases are a licence for farmers and ranchers to print money . What a pile of horse ****, you obviously have no clue.
You want a free for all on grazing leases, it will never happen. Stay in the city where you belong, seriously.
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08-17-2018, 09:03 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 932
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crazy_davey
Oh ya, grazing leases are a licence for farmers and ranchers to print money . What a pile of horse ****, you obviously have no clue.
You want a free for all on grazing leases, it will never happen. Stay in the city where you belong, seriously.
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Ain't no city boy here bud and very much have a clue..
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08-17-2018, 09:04 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Rocky Mnt House
Posts: 936
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I think there is a simple solution to the problem.
Put a date on when cattle can be on and off.
Then put on the website the conditions that each has. Easy.
What ever that date is Nov1 or whatever, then a farmer is not getting 500 calls from people wanting to access. Then charge the idiots that abuse the system
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08-17-2018, 02:23 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: St. Albert, AB
Posts: 1,178
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I was having trouble getting access to a lease. I made arrangements for a face to face meeting with the leaseholder farmer and got access. Turns out he was reluctatnt because quaders had been cutting his fence and throwing parties one lease. Their last onfire got away on them and started a large fire that spread to neighbours land. County fire department had to be called to put it out. Guess who got handed a $9,400 bill for putting out the fire yup the leaseholder.
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08-17-2018, 03:02 PM
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Join Date: May 2009
Location: Okotoks
Posts: 298
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crazy_davey
Oh ya, grazing leases are a licence for farmers and ranchers to print money . What a pile of horse ****, you obviously have no clue.
You want a free for all on grazing leases, it will never happen. Stay in the city where you belong, seriously.
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So do people who own grazing leases generally lose money on them? If so why do they keep them? I don't need a smart alack comment back about staying in the city i'm just curious and don't know the answer.
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08-17-2018, 04:06 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Foothills
Posts: 2,337
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alpinebeers
So do people who own grazing leases generally lose money on them? If so why do they keep them? I don't need a smart alack comment back about staying in the city i'm just curious and don't know the answer.
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No, or they wouldn’t have them. But they are not getting added to the Fortune 500 list because they have a grazing lease either, as some would want you to believe.
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08-17-2018, 08:21 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 1,553
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So farmer pickles wants to keep 2 cows on a quarter, can you hunt anyway or would a person get charged?
Has anyone ever been charged hunting grazing leases?
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08-19-2018, 11:14 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crazy_davey
Oh ya, grazing leases are a licence for farmers and ranchers to print money . What a pile of horse ****, you obviously have no clue.
You want a free for all on grazing leases, it will never happen. Stay in the city where you belong, seriously.
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This
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08-19-2018, 01:17 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 3,896
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alpinebeers
So do people who own grazing leases generally lose money on them? If so why do they keep them? I don't need a smart alack comment back about staying in the city i'm just curious and don't know the answer.
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Well they pay taxes on the lease land to use it, do you? And before all you yahoo’s say you pay taxes. Do you pay taxes to use the land for recreation like the rancher does to use the land for the grazing, because that rancher then essentially would pay double the taxes then. Because even if the rancher didn’t have the lease he still pays taxes right?
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08-19-2018, 01:20 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Drumheller
Posts: 27
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I think that they only have to give permission to so many people per year as well. So maybe they have given out all the permission that they are required to.
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08-19-2018, 08:57 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Fort McMurray
Posts: 59
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Lots of silly remarks, and flawed reasoning from both sides on here,... this is us fulfilling the objectives of those that would see us never hunt again period.
Divided we fall,...!
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08-19-2018, 09:39 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 540
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reddeerhunter
So farmer pickles wants to keep 2 cows on a quarter, can you hunt anyway or would a person get charged?
Has anyone ever been charged hunting grazing leases?
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If he only wants to graze two cows on that quarter, it’s his perogative. He pays to have the lease and can graze as many cows as he wants. If he is grazing any cows, he can deny hunting access. However him and his friends/family also legally can’t hunt that quarter if they are denying access to others due to cattle being on the land.
No you can’t just go hunt it anyways because you feel there aren’t enough cows.
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08-20-2018, 11:13 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 509
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dustinjoels
If he only wants to graze two cows on that quarter, it’s his perogative. He pays to have the lease and can graze as many cows as he wants. If he is grazing any cows, he can deny hunting access. However him and his friends/family also legally can’t hunt that quarter if they are denying access to others due to cattle being on the land.
No you can’t just go hunt it anyways because you feel there aren’t enough cows.
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That’s not all true. When the grazing lease contract is written up the government gives the lease owner a carrying capacity the recommended amount to head for one month of grazing that’s how they figure it out. There is a special name for it but I can’t think of it right now. If the leases are overgrazed or under grazed it can be reported and I would be put on the leaseholders record ,after the lease contract is up the new one is written these things are reviewed the lease holder can lose his leases .Those livestock depending on the contract have to be off the lease at a certain time of the year I talk to some people and there’s our October 1 mine are November 1 any livestock on the lease after that the lease owner could get reported
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08-20-2018, 11:24 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,006
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why isnt there a sticky for this topic that people can refer to that has all relevant info in one post. Lock any thread like this and refer them to the stickied post.
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08-20-2018, 12:10 PM
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Join Date: May 2010
Location: The Forgotten Corner
Posts: 807
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MugEye
That’s not all true. When the grazing lease contract is written up the government gives the lease owner a carrying capacity the recommended amount to head for one month of grazing that’s how they figure it out. There is a special name for it but I can’t think of it right now. If the leases are overgrazed or under grazed it can be reported and I would be put on the leaseholders record ,after the lease contract is up the new one is written these things are reviewed the lease holder can lose his leases .Those livestock depending on the contract have to be off the lease at a certain time of the year I talk to some people and there’s our October 1 mine are November 1 any livestock on the lease after that the lease owner could get reported
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It's called an AUM (Animal Unit Month). The government is never going to fault a leaseholder for "undergrazing" a quarter. The responsible hunter will always get the shaft with this system I'm afraid.
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08-20-2018, 12:35 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 540
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MugEye
That’s not all true. When the grazing lease contract is written up the government gives the lease owner a carrying capacity the recommended amount to head for one month of grazing that’s how they figure it out. There is a special name for it but I can’t think of it right now. If the leases are overgrazed or under grazed it can be reported and I would be put on the leaseholders record ,after the lease contract is up the new one is written these things are reviewed the lease holder can lose his leases .Those livestock depending on the contract have to be off the lease at a certain time of the year I talk to some people and there’s our October 1 mine are November 1 any livestock on the lease after that the lease owner could get reported
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There are many year round grazing leases as well. If someone doesn’t want hunting they’ll just leave cows in there until the season is over. Go ahead and report someone for under grazing and see how that goes.
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08-20-2018, 01:41 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 509
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I’m not saying that your complaints will be heard I’m saying you can complain it’s your right. Just sharing a little information. Don’t be scared to talk to the leaseholder about his contract and the terms of. I just got permission on mulie country on some lease land and only by asking him the conditions and time frames was I able to negotiate my permission sometimes it just takes some talking getting comfortable with somebody
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