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08-17-2012, 07:40 AM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Central Alberta
Posts: 21,399
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kale_M
Signed!
You guys that are against this have no clue what these officers do..
You ask any Sheriff, RCMP or city police officer if they would do an unknown traffic stop ANYWHERE without a sidearm, I bet there answer is HELL NO! Because it is dangerous! Peace Officers in the rural county do traffic stops on back rural roads and in most places back up is not all that close. Arming them is long overdue.
I would love to see even half of the people posting in this thread attempt to pass the Peace Officer course that the Solicitor General has for Level 1 peace officers.
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I disagree. This is about as low a level of law enforcement as you can get. They don't deal with much above by law offences and a good part of their job is more about community relations than enforcement. Culprit sounds like another James Rosco type, maybe not on that level, but there was an awareness that he might be a problem and the situation should have been handled accordingly. I guess the part that strikes me the most is that it just was about a bunch of dogs.
Grizz
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"Indeed, no human being has yet lived under conditions which, considering the prevailing climates of the past, can be regarded as normal."
John E. Pfeiffer The Emergence of Man
written in 1969
Last edited by Grizzly Adams; 08-17-2012 at 07:49 AM.
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08-17-2012, 08:09 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: rollyview
Posts: 7,860
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for everyone who says they shouldn't carry i think we need to look at what other professions are allowed to carry firearms. armored truck drivers carry firearms and i honestly believe they have it easier than peace officers.
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08-17-2012, 08:38 AM
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Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Lacombe
Posts: 2,464
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catnthehat
I signed it but I thought that the peace officers already were strapped in Ft.McMurray?
Cat
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I dont think so Cat,I have a friend up your way,he works as a Community Peace Officer( I think its for Wood Buffalo) he isnt allowed to carry a side arm
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08-17-2012, 08:42 AM
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Gone Hunting
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Between Bodo and a hard place
Posts: 20,168
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Where does it say they would be unqualified and untrained? Oh Yeah! nowhere. It's a poll. do you really expect all the details laid out in front of you?
"Besides...where does it stop?"
Maybe when the victims are as well armed as the criminals.
I'm amazed at the number of posters who think anyone except them is too stupid and irresponsible to be armed.
It's a poll. If there is support for arming Peace officers, trust me it won't affect whether it happens or not.
Maybe we should disarm cops.
It's not that far fetched. We all can come in contact with the same criminals. After all don't the criminals depend on the general population for their livelihood? They don't go around robbing cops and stealing cop cars.
and besides if they need a cop, they are one,Much faster than me needing one. They can even ask for a cop in the sky. You try that and see what happens.
We could send them to Glasgow for special training if you feel they would be in danger.
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I'm not lying!!! You are just experiencing it differently.
It isn't a question of who will allow me, but who will stop me.. Ayn Rand
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08-17-2012, 08:43 AM
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Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Lacombe
Posts: 2,464
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kale_M
Signed!
You guys that are against this have no clue what these officers do..
You ask any Sheriff, RCMP or city police officer if they would do an unknown traffic stop ANYWHERE without a sidearm, I bet there answer is HELL NO! Because it is dangerous! Peace Officers in the rural county do traffic stops on back rural roads and in most places back up is not all that close. Arming them is long overdue.
I would love to see even half of the people posting in this thread attempt to pass the Peace Officer course that the Solicitor General has for Level 1 peace officers.
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Kale ,how long is your training to become a CPO ? I know the job you guys do can be dirty/dangerous but unless the traing is equal to what a Police Officer recieves then no,I dont believe they should be carrying.
I have met some of our CPO personel and really wonder if some should even be carrying a baton ,let alone a firearm
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08-17-2012, 08:45 AM
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Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 816
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Exactly. I worked for securicore before and now I am a community peace officer with ahs. I have delt with people with knives, needles, and yes even firearms in the hospitals. With securicore i didn't deal with anyone. I am not saying I need a sidearm in the hospital but I do believe the guys doing traffic stops on rural roads should be armed.
Last edited by Kale_M; 08-17-2012 at 08:52 AM.
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08-17-2012, 08:52 AM
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Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 816
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rottie
Kale ,how long is your training to become a CPO ? I know the job you guys do can be dirty/dangerous but unless the traing is equal to what a Police Officer recieves then no,I dont believe they should be carrying.
I have met some of our CPO personel and really wonder if some should even be carrying a baton ,let alone a firearm
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Community peace officer Level 1 training is 6 weeks. The exact same training as sheriffs only they do 9 weeks. They do alittle more on some legal stuff, emergency vehicle operator course (EVOC) and firearms. So they get a week of training to carry.
I worked with securicore before and I had 4 days of training and I could carry.
Last edited by Kale_M; 08-17-2012 at 09:01 AM.
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08-17-2012, 08:54 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Edmonton, AB
Posts: 1,805
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ebrand
A thanks to all who signed.
To those who feel proper training is required. You are quite correct. Just like it was for them to get appointed as Peace Officers by the Albera government. Just as was required to carry handcuffs OC spray and batons.
A man was murdered because he was doing his job dealing with an animal complaint. A sidearm may have saved him. It may not have saved him. His grandchildren have no grandpa. His wife has no husband. His kids have no father. His friends and coworkers have do not have him around any more.
Everyone seems to forget the real issue is that Officer Lazenby is dead because he was doing job for the people in his community. Hopefully your community strives for the safety of its employees as well.
The are many Peace Officers who should not have sidearms. There are also many RCMP and municipal police officers and sheriffs who should also not have sidearms. Just as there are mechanics who should not have wrenches. And accountants who should not have pencils etc.
I bet there are people who do what Insurgus does that should not be doing what he does. He may even be one of them. Or he may not.
Everyone has a Right to be safe at work. Qualified ( I am not able to bold... Darn phone) QUALIFIED Peace Officers should be armed. The Province should set a standard for qualification.
I wonder who was the last officer before the murder to contact the suspect? I bet it was not a sheriff or a Mountie. I bet it was poor old dead Rod Lazenby.
I bet he carried a sidearm for his 35 years as a Mountie. If he was not qualified who would be?
Sign the petition.
Rest In Peace Officer Lazenby
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Well said....... signed.....
__________________
Don't ever utter the words "idiot proof" in regard to anything, as upon your reflection........the world will immediately get going on building a better idiot thereby making your proclamation mute
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08-17-2012, 09:06 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2011
Location: down by the river
Posts: 11,428
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Not before I can carry one myself.
Will they get a pair of jackboots with their firearm?
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08-17-2012, 09:06 AM
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Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Lacombe
Posts: 2,464
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kale_M
Community peace officer Level 1 training is 6 weeks. The exact same training as sheriffs only they do 9 weeks. They do alittle more on some legal stuff, emergency vehicle operator course (EVOC) and firearms. So they get a week of training to carry.
I worked with securicore before and I had 4 days of training and I could carry.
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I dont think 6 weeks is enough to qualify for the carrying of a side arm,unless civilians can take the same course ,and pass the same screening to carry.
You are right about Securicore,thats way to short of a training course to be carrying a side arm.
I do find it kinda stupid that our government will allow armed guards tp protect someone else money,yet not to proctect our or our loved ones lives
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08-17-2012, 09:31 AM
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Turner Valley
Posts: 2,922
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeGuy
Not before I can carry one myself.
Will they get a pair of jackboots with their firearm?
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That is my opinon too, right on my friend
nuff said:
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08-17-2012, 09:38 AM
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Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 816
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rottie
I dont think 6 weeks is enough to qualify for the carrying of a side arm,unless civilians can take the same course ,and pass the same screening to carry.
You are right about Securicore,thats way to short of a training course to be carrying a side arm.
I do find it kinda stupid that our government will allow armed guards tp protect someone else money,yet not to proctect our or our loved ones lives
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Sheriffs carry after 9 weeks of training. With only a week of training in firearms. Is that long enough? RCMP and city officers have 6 months of training. You really think they do firearms training everyday? I don't think so.
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08-17-2012, 09:40 AM
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Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 816
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Why do you need a weapon? Are you arresting people? Are you in fear for your life cause of a sketchy hobby you have? If you need to protect yourself with a gun on a daily basis you should probably leave the country. Go live in Somalia, seems to be more your style
Last edited by Kale_M; 08-17-2012 at 09:47 AM.
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08-17-2012, 09:54 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2011
Location: down by the river
Posts: 11,428
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kale_M
Signed!
You guys that are against this have no clue what these officers do..
You ask any Sheriff, RCMP or city police officer if they would do an unknown traffic stop ANYWHERE without a sidearm, I bet there answer is HELL NO! Because it is dangerous! Peace Officers in the rural county do traffic stops on back rural roads and in most places back up is not all that close. Arming them is long overdue.
I would love to see even half of the people posting in this thread attempt to pass the Peace Officer course that the Solicitor General has for Level 1 peace officers.
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What is the prerequisite? Highschool education? or is that not required?
What if like, my uncle or something knows somebody?
Don't you need like a university degree to use a weapon against a civilian?
Those who wish to further militarize the state against it's own populace should look to the past to see where that inevitably leads.
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08-17-2012, 01:07 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Lacombe
Posts: 2,464
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kale_M
Why do you need a weapon? Are you arresting people? Are you in fear for your life cause of a sketchy hobby you have? If you need to protect yourself with a gun on a daily basis you should probably leave the country. Go live in Somalia, seems to be more your style
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Before making statements like above Kale maybe you should have a bit more life experiences.
Yes I have been in a position where a means of defending ones self would have been appreciated,have you yourself lived through death threats,bullet holes in cars,poisened (dead dogs) the list goes on and on.
Well I have,the wifes ex did all of the above and more,he made our life a living he!! for years ,so you can take your life style insinuattions and pound them up the same place your Somalia comment can go.You would be suprised at the numbr of people who have gone through the same.
I would feel better being able to defend myself,than having to wait for what could be a long response time
My point is after a grand total of 6 weeks training I dont think anyone should be packing,if they need to carry maybe they should be real Police Officers with full powers
Theres a big difference between six weeks and six months trainig
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08-17-2012, 01:15 PM
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Gone Hunting
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Between Bodo and a hard place
Posts: 20,168
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How long is the course that allows us to own and carry a rifle capable of shooting a KM.?
How much actually range time does the course require?
How many rounds and what level of expertise is required before you get your PAL, Wildlife certificate.
OMG it's a handgun. I can't believe you haven't shot up the whole dang neighborhood as a matter of fact I'm totally amazed the handgun didn't go berserk and shoot up the neighborhood while you were sleeping.
__________________
I'm not lying!!! You are just experiencing it differently.
It isn't a question of who will allow me, but who will stop me.. Ayn Rand
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08-17-2012, 01:44 PM
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Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 90
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Next theyl want cabbies bus drivers and commisionares carting guns spray and stun guns what's next
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08-17-2012, 02:43 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Central Alberta
Posts: 2,430
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HELL
Next theyl want cabbies bus drivers and commisionares carting guns spray and stun guns what's next
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Yeah, I severly doubt that.
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08-17-2012, 03:19 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HELL
Next theyl want cabbies bus drivers and commisionares carting guns spray and stun guns what's next
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School principals ...frequently deal with threatening parents ... undesirables tresspassing in school to sell drugs to kids. Hang on, been there - done that, but I didn't feel the need to pack a gun. One of my collegues, did keep a baseball bat handy
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08-17-2012, 03:43 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Lloydminster
Posts: 176
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armed peace officers
I find this whole thread very interesting.
I am guessing there are a large number of CCW supporters on here. How many people who signed the CCW petition would not sign this one I wonder? If you support CCW generally, how many weeks of training do you think ought to be required for such a license? In excess of 6 months? Doubtful.
I think it is logical that a peace officer may run into more potentially dangerous situations as a result of his or her job description. Is it not then logical that he or she be armed in the event that things go really bad?
I am guessing that should they be armed there would be a sudden flood of applications to become a peace officer as the profession becomes more "legitimate" Would this not result in stiffer competition and an increasingly more professional and top notch group of peace officers?
Devils advocate...
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08-17-2012, 04:50 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2011
Location: down by the river
Posts: 11,428
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How much authority does a meter maid require?
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08-17-2012, 04:50 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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I don't think the standard for deciding who can carry should be the possibility of encountering a potentially dangerous situation ...if it was, I dare say, cab drivers should be among the first to be armed. Teachers, and in particular principals would not be far down the list.
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08-17-2012, 05:25 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 591
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nah, I trust myself more than some random half cop on the street so until I am allowed to carry a gun neither should they, maybe they could have a taser instead. In my view peace officers are there to keep the peace, not restore it through the use of deadly force that is a police officers job.
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08-17-2012, 05:33 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 1,155
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not a chance, either change their duty responsibilities or give them much more training than they get, either that or scrap them altogether and hire more rcmp/ city police force. no way i want those guys carrying pistols at their current level of training
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08-17-2012, 05:44 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Calgary
Posts: 19,421
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kale_M
Why do you need a weapon? Are you arresting people? Are you in fear for your life cause of a sketchy hobby you have? If you need to protect yourself with a gun on a daily basis you should probably leave the country. Go live in Somalia, seems to be more your style
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The point is that no persons life is more important than any other law abiding person. How come we don't see a poll calling for sidearms for wives after a horrible news incident of a woman being killed by her abusive husband? The lives of many murder victims are no less important than any LEO, Peace Officer, teacher or Starbucks barista for that matter (I'll exclude the criminal lifestyle murders from the comparison, as they are less important). No polls are being started to arm cab drivers or bank tellers, both of whom are frequently robbed. Nobody's calling for CCW for prostitutes, who arguably get murdered more than any other identifiable group. The double standard is what we're getting at; don't go getting all huffy that you protecting yourself at work is any more important than the rest of humanity protecting themselves in their day to day lives. Every citizen is the police and the police are all citizens; police are empowered by the public, not self-empowered (those are the last kind we want as LEO's).
Save for criminal scum-bags; everyone deserves to get home safe, and be safe while there. The more good people that are armed, the less bad people succeed in their criminal endeavors.
__________________
"The trouble with people idiot-proofing things, is the resulting evolution of the idiot." Me
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08-17-2012, 06:48 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 1,576
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kale_M
Sheriffs carry after 9 weeks of training. With only a week of training in firearms. Is that long enough? RCMP and city officers have 6 months of training. You really think they do firearms training everyday? I don't think so.
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I understand it's a day in the class room, a fair bit of time in the gym and on the mats a week on the range, a day of shoot dont shoot sim training scenarios.
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08-17-2012, 07:09 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,604
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Signed. Dealt with enough possible dangerous and unstable idiots and scum in regulatory sevices to see a need for personal firearms. "Police are only minutes away" right ??(just about learned that one the hard way).
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08-17-2012, 07:13 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Calgary, Ab
Posts: 2,835
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#1340
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08-17-2012, 07:17 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Calgary, Ab
Posts: 2,835
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kale_M
Exactly. I worked for securicore before and now I am a community peace officer with ahs. I have delt with people with knives, needles, and yes even firearms in the hospitals. I am not saying I need a sidearm in the hospital but I do believe the guys doing traffic stops on rural roads should be armed.
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As a co-worker of Kale's, I'll agree 100% with his statement.
The Peace Officers pulling people over on the side of the road, or going to rural areas alone, should be armed for their own protection.
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08-17-2012, 07:29 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Calgary, Ab
Posts: 2,835
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grizzly Adams
I disagree. This is about as low a level of law enforcement as you can get. They don't deal with much above by law offences and a good part of their job is more about community relations than enforcement.
Grizz
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Perhaps you have been misinformed. Before jumping to conclusions do your research. Maybe stop by your local RCMP detachment, hospital, provincial corrections facility, bylaw office, the list goes on - and ask them what they do for a living - see how many of them tell you ' i write by law tickets and solve neighbor problems '
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