Swap Hunt?

[lynx]

APOS is only against the host system because it takes future customers from them.

We have the host system so USE it.

They use it themselves , and I am sure that because they are in the guiding business they get get paid with it. One of his hunters told me he was hosted by the outfitter when I stumbled over him sitting on a cutline and chatted with him.

My feeling is APOS wants to control it all when it comes to hunting

[packhuntr]

Well really.... If everyone is saying ""whoa, dont mention the host program on AO, someone could get mad and say something to the minister to shut it down"", there is a problem. If Fish and Wildlife cant be relied on to make sound unbiased judgment calls on something as simple as this,,,,?? This isnt a complex thing were talking about here, and when folks are presumed to be doing something illegal while using a program laid out for our use by Gov. there is a pretty big problem. Ive never used it, but if I took the "grilling" that Dick284 did, that Fish and Wildlife officer woulda been front row to see me go up one side of him and down the other. If someone wants to make a call and run at someone on a personal level, they ought to have their feet braced. Its no different than afew years back, folks wanting to use cross bows that had disabilities. Some could get permited, other couldnt, just depended on which office you walked into. Sheit like that is just not good. These guys need to be doing the same thing,, and quit f*in around.

[Tatonka]

I didn't realize there was even a possible issue when I posted this thread.... Just looking to expand my hunting opportunities and make a new friend or two..

I completely understand Canadians wanting to protect their hunting opportunities, which requiring a guide in most provinces for hunters from the U.S. does, but on the other hand a Canadian can come to every state in the U.S. and hunt without being required to hire a guide. Some states have a quota as far as the number of nonresidents allowed to purchase a license, but at least the nonresidents are not required to fork over several thousand dollars for a guide. A nonresident can come to Montana and hunt elk, moose, sheep, goats, antelope, mule deer, whitetail, bear, and all upland game without being required to hire a guide if they are lucky enough to draw a permit. I see a lot of vehicles from Alberta and Saskatchewan around her in the fall hunting pheasants and antelope.....we are a popular destination as we are do close to the border. The ones I have talked to have been great people.....very ethical and responsbile hunters. Friends who own a motel in town have said the same thing.....wish I could say the same about people who come here from Western Montana to hunt.

It would be nice if the Canadian Provinces would offer a limited number of hunting licenses on a drawing basis for those U.S. hunters who are not rich but who love to hunt (like myself!!!!)... It would give a little boost to the local ecomomies (motels, cafe's, gas stations, etc.), would provide some additional revenue for the Provincial Fish & Game Departments, etc. Your provinces are so huge that even if 1,000 additional nonresidents were allowed in it would have almost a zero impact on game numbers and I doubt if people would even notice.

Oh well......I'm sure this will never happen. It's your country and you all have the right to run things however you see fit.

[Dick284]

Originally Posted by lynx

APOS is only against the host system because it takes future customers from them.


My feeling is APOS wants to control it all when it comes to hunting

Little does APOS know many folks from out of Canada who use the Hunter Host system would probably never use an APOS outfitter in the first place. They simply don't have the financial resources available.

My buddy skrimps and saves to make it up here every third year. He stays at my place, and chips in his share of the fuel, and puts a few $$ towards groceries. He loves hunting, and loves coming to Alberta. But if he could only hunt up here with an outfitter, he'd never pay their price.

APOS wanting it all, is pretty spot on, as far as I'm concerned.

[double gun]

Originally Posted by Dick284

Little does APOS know many folks from out of Canada who use the Hunter Host system would probably never use an APOS outfitter in the first place. They simply don't have the financial resources available....But if he could only hunt up here with an outfitter, he'd never pay their price...

Dick is dead on. My buddy who comes would NEVER hunt with a outfitter - he just doesnt have the money. Its a stupid rule, that we cant swap hunts..... swaping hunts would be a great way for the guys who cant afford a outfitter - to get to go hunt somewhere or something that otherwise wouldnt be affordable.

[elkhunter11]

I do like the idea of swap hunts,and I wish that all, provinces would allow non residents to hunt more species while being accompanied by a resident.However,the way that our regulations are written,a person has to be careful how we word things,as being able to hunt without having to hire an outfitter would most certainly be considered gaining a type of reward or compensation to me,even if no money or property changes hands.As for APOS,as long as they continue to allow outfitters that have been convicted of both criminal acts and violations under the game act,to be members,I have very little respect for the organization.

Why does everyone think APOS is opposed to the Hunter Host....I've never heard anything like that from them. It's a great system that allows friends to go hunting with friends and relatives to hunt with relatives and as Dick pointed out, I doubt APOS members are losing any money as these likely aren't potential clients anyhow. Only complaining I've ever heard is from resisidents saying that these non-residents are taking opportunity away from them in some of the high odd draws. I like the system and can't see why outfitters would be opposed to it. Heck, many utilize it.

[whitetailsheds]

Originally Posted by Tatonka

I didn't realize there was even a possible issue when I posted this thread.... Just looking to expand my hunting opportunities and make a new friend or two..
.

It's those that are looking outside the box (grey area), Tatonka. If there were more to this issue than the fear mongerer's would have you (us) believe, there would not be a Hunter Host program.
Those that have been hosted (me) in Alberta, and I have hosted myself here in BC are doing just what you have described, TRADING experiences and opportunities.
I would like to think that anyone looking into such a venture, would fully realize that no $$$ (or gain as it's been put) is to be exchanged.
While it may happen, those that do this will eventually (hopefully) be caught and dealt with.
And to finish, I'd like to think that most on here are just that...honestly looking for the TRADING of an experience and opportunity.
Dick284, say hi to Tavis.

It's those that are looking outside the box (grey area), Tatonka. If there were more to this issue than the fear mongerer's would have you (us) believe, there would not be a Hunter Host program.

Of course there would be...for those that utilze it for no gain or reward as stated in the Wildlife Act. If they shut down everything that was subject to abuse, there's be no hunting season, driving of cars or drinking in a bar. A lot of you place a lot more faith in non hunting and in some cases anti hunting judges than I do. Not hard to look at two strangers trading hunts and say there is gain....especially by a non hunting judge concerned with nothing else than intereting the law. The Wildlife Act is very specific in saying that gain does not have to be monetary. Having seen some of the crazy cases that have gone to court over the years, I just don't see the point of flaunting this in public. But I don't see the point of a lot of things.....

[eric2381]

Did I get this right? Guides in the NWT cannot legally collect money from hunters?

I'm reading this incorrectly, I'm sure.

[eric2381]

Originally Posted by DiggsNWT

Excellent points Tatonka.

I wish they had host/companion hunts in the NWT! They just re-did the wildlife act and there is NO WAY the govt here would ever allow a companion hunt. You gotta live here for 2 years before you can even get a resident big game license!

DiggsNWT

He's talking about hosting. Not a paid guided hunt. Right?

[packhuntr]

Ok, if gain isnt nessesarily seen "legally, in the wildlife act" as strictly monetary, then that changes things, for me and what I thought anyways. Is that really true in this instance??

From the regs...

"may not provide services for gain or reward, or accept remuneration, directly or indirectly, for such services."

As remuneration specifically means money and it is proceeded with "or" between "gain or reward", I would take that mean that gain and reward do not necessaily mean money. Pretty easy to see how a judge could view it that way. If it just said remuneration, it would be one thing but as gain or reward are listed additionally, it seems pretty clear that gain and reward could mean a multitude of things. Clear enough that I wouldn't post about doing it on a public messageboard that F&W routinely reads. Clear enough that I wouldn't want it left to the discretion of a judge.

[packhuntr]

Thanks for that Sheep. More on that thought... So, if hunting has in essence been broken down by the powers that be, and is an assumed "gain" for any hunter, (the act of persueing/harvesting any animal) in province or out, where does the gain actually become illegal or implied as such. We purchase these tags, legally from government approved outlets. The government takes our money, the tag is ours, the wildlife maybe not, least not until its tagged anyways. So what Im getting at and wondering is, how can a logistically legal hunt be an assumed illegal act,,,, no matter why or whom I may do it with as long as they are legally able, and as long as all applicable licencing is paid for and in good order?? Again,,, If one has purchased the tags to legally hunt and therefore, legally "gain",, pick any place on earth, how can it be an illegal act? Know what Im getting at?? I also am not sure why some here are voicing opposition to even discussing this legal hunting related topic "in public in an open forum". If there are problems with the system surrounding this, maybey someone ought to fix em,,, so those of us that abide the law dont have to run around hiding in dark alleys. If there is a problem, abolish it, or institute the nessesary changes to repair it. That is assuming there is a problem?? I have yet to hear of any issues with this. Lotsa guys scared to talk about this one apparently.....

Edit, add and make easier to read.