Lease Land Access Concerns

[grinr]

Originally Posted by Lefty-Canuck

As far as I know....and maybe I don't

If there is a lease holder name on a piece of property that you want to access you MUST make contact with them before entering that property, and tell him when you want access.You must abide by the lease conditions at all times (this is negotiated between the lease holder and the Government).

LC

Eggzakly!!
......but I'm pretty certain that "waiting lists" are not one of those conditions.It's either open to hunting or it's not,no?
Edit:unless of course he is being a dick and keeps a few cows scattered around for the sole purpose of controlling who hunts there,ie;he can then allow friends,family....outfitters to hunt there and the excuse that he trusts only them to not shoot his cows.

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by grinr

Eggzakly!!
......but I'm pretty certain that "waiting lists" are not one of those conditions.It's either open to hunting or it's not,no?

I totally get what you are saying!

Also the conditions state to contact the leaseholder 2 or possibly even 5 days before accessing the property....not sure what happens if you don't reach him?....and then access the property anyway.

LC

[grinr]

I'm only speaking hypothetically anyhow?
A)I don't want to start a conflict and would likely hunt elsewhere anyhow,I don't really want hunt where I'm not wanted,have tires slashed,rad shot out etc.
B)I'd have to want to hunt there pretty damn bad to go to such trouble,contact Settlement Officer etc.,to assert MY RIGHT to access said land.

That said,say for instance from pre-season scouting I know there is a 190 WT Buck living on that section and I WANT HIM BAD!
I follow procedure,contact leasee,he tells me "No,Joe Blow and Bigshot Outfitters are hunting there and there's no room for you."
Well guess what pal,I'm hunting there also,and if you try to run me off or disturb my hunt,I can have you charged with Hunter Harrassment being as I am LAWFULLY engaged in the act of hunting on property that I have every bit as much right to as the next guy....so chew on that.

Sounds to me like some of these control freaks need to be taught a lesson and reminded that they are paying a few measly bucks/section for the privilege of grazing their cattle on Crown Land and nothing else.Pretty sure there's nothing in the lease agreement that includes their right to create private hunting reserves?

[Jordan Smith]

The real problem is that often times one of the access conditions is a limited number of users per day. Eg, "maximum 4 users per day". The lease holder can tell you that he already has every day of the season booked. I had a large ranch that leases a sizeable tract of land tell me in May that they take "applications" from Aug-Oct for positions to hunt each day of November, and there are a limited number of positions because of the daily maximum number of users, as per lease conditions. This was only after I got a dispute resution officer involved after the ranch contact person failed to respond to my emails for a couple of weeks. They were annoyed that I would bother them, saying that it was a busy time of year for them, etc.

A broken system that desperately needs a change.

[Jimboy]

Originally Posted by flygirrl

Letter sent to Joe Anglin MLA for Rimby-Rocky and Sundre, response received this morning from Monica Rosevear, executive assistant to Joe Anglin
"
Thank you for bringing this to Joe's attention. Joe will not be in the office for the next few weeks with the session ongoing in Edmonton. That being said I will bring this up with him when I speak to him next week.

Yup , ya never get a response from the actual MLA , YOU JUST GET A REPLY FROM HIS SECRATARY , and now is the time to write a letter TJ said , yea right , with all the Torys in town from across Canada they wont be reading any letters , they,ll be partying up on the top floor of the best Elite hotels in Calgary and Edmonton , and dining on the finist seafood and beef that OUR tax money can buy.

[sunsetrider2011]

The problems with the majority of lease holder/hunter issues is the entitlement crowds demanding what they think is theirs. Obviously I see the majority here ,,Havent a got a lick of respect. Were you raised this way? did your father and grandfather have any trouble getting permissions. Nope pretty sure they didnt, It is this entitlement atitude that will seal the deal on paid hunting access.

As I said before Please do write all the letters to the powers that be, the more the better. I want to see change too,,maybe teach the entitlement Crowd a lesson in respect.

No Before all the whining starts, there ARE individuals on both sides that try to manipulate the rules to suit their needs. I think All the leases should be wiped out and sold to who ever has the deepest pockets and the problem would be no more.

Keep pushing for what you think you believe in,,Because the end result will not be what you expect, and not just you, will lose out access to leased crownland it will be everyone who hunts will lose out. And inevitably will become A paid hunting access situation. Remember, when that happens you will have no one to blame but yoursleves., So now is the time to start buying hunting opportunites, Because I am, and whoever owns the land controls the access.

[Deer Hunter]

Originally Posted by sunsetrider2011

The problems with the majority of lease holder/hunter issues is the entitlement crowds demanding what they think is theirs. Obviously I see the majority here ,,Havent a got a lick of respect. Were you raised this way? did your father and grandfather have any trouble getting permissions. Nope pretty sure they didnt, It is this entitlement atitude that will seal the deal on paid hunting access.

As I said before Please do write all the letters to the powers that be, the more the better. I want to see change too,,maybe teach the entitlement Crowd a lesson in respect.

No Before all the whining starts, there ARE individuals on both sides that try to manipulate the rules to suit their needs. I think All the leases should be wiped out and sold to who ever has the deepest pockets and the problem would be no more.

Keep pushing for what you think you believe in,,Because the end result will not be what you expect, and not just you, will lose out access to leased crownland it will be everyone who hunts will lose out. And inevitably will become A paid hunting access situation. Remember, when that happens you will have no one to blame but yoursleves., So now is the time to start buying hunting opportunites, Because I am, and whoever owns the land controls the access.

I wont normally even acknowledge a post like this but here goes...

Respect and entitlement works both ways. Im sure glad most hunters and landowners have alot more respect than you do.
Your "no access" threats are getting real old.
And your bigshot "go buy it because I am... or else" attitude is sickening.

Have a nice day.

[sunsetrider2011]

Originally Posted by Deer Hunter

I wont normally even acknowledge a post like this but here goes...

Respect and entitlement works both ways. Im sure glad most hunters and landowners have alot more of it than you do.
Your "no access" threats are getting real old.
And your bigshot "go buy it because I am... or else" attitude is sickening.

Have a nice day.

Really? You wouldnt have the foggiest Idea,,on What i do when it comes to access. But obviously you are 1 of the entitlement folks I speak of. There are quite a number of AO individuals that have hunted my land and have and will be successful, That includes lease land as well. So keep throwing the daggers and pulling the triggers because it is really helping your cause.

[ksteed17]

Originally Posted by Deer Hunter

I wont normally even acknowledge a post like this but here goes...

Respect and entitlement works both ways. Im sure glad most hunters and landowners have alot more respect than you do.
Your "no access" threats are getting real old.
And your bigshot "go buy it because I am... or else" attitude is sickening.

Have a nice day.

X2!

[pickrel pat]

Originally Posted by sunsetrider2011

Really? You wouldnt have the foggiest Idea,,on What i do when it comes to access.

ummmm, you have stated numerous times on previous threads....... lmao.

[flygirrl]

Quote:The problems with the majority of lease holder/hunter issues is the entitlement crowds demanding what they think is theirs. Unquote.
It's my understanding that crown land is held in trust for all the people of Canada, so, if I ask for permission to access crown land (lease) I don't think I own it, I own my house and don't ask for permission to go in but if I'm at you house i will knock and ask for permission, you have the right to refuse me entry into your home it's yours. Leased land is just that you don't own it , I don't own it, we all own it calling and asking is just respect. I've only asked once for access on a lease, the farmer I talked to was very nice, only wanted to know why I didn't stop in, saw his big dog and didn't get out of truck.. Went home and called him that evening. He was surprised I even asked. This is not something I usually do, hunt private or leased land. Don't need to be policed every time I access and leave. The only leases i will hunt is the Hutterite colony in Debolt ,Just me. So sad , just so sad, but I will be dead by than so I guess for me it won't matter as I have no family here and no one in my family hunts. I understand your points as leasers and I understand the hunters standpoint, the few make it bad for the whole, both leaseholders and slobs because I refuse to call them anything else.

Originally Posted by sunsetrider2011

The problems with the majority of lease holder/hunter issues is the entitlement crowds demanding what they think is theirs.

Yes, I totally agree. It's amazing how some people have come to believe that they own crown land and can do as they please with it when they simply lease it. The sense of entitlement is unbelievable. Hopefully not for much longer.

[pottymouth]

Originally Posted by sheephunter

Yes, I totally agree. It's amazing how some people have come to believe that they own crown land and can do as they please with it when they simply lease it. The sense of entitlement is unbelievable. Hopefully not for much longer.

X2

Beauty..

[pickrel pat]

Originally Posted by sheephunter

Yes, I totally agree. It's amazing how some people have come to believe that they own crown land and can do as they please with it when they simply lease it. The sense of entitlement is unbelievable. Hopefully not for much longer.

lol, I see that you see the irony in that post....hee hee hee...

[sunsetrider2011]

Originally Posted by sheephunter

Yes, I totally agree. It's amazing how some people have come to believe that they own crown land and can do as they please with it when they simply lease it. The sense of entitlement is unbelievable. Hopefully not for much longer.

So do you Say That I personally do not allow access on lease land that i pay the taxes and maintain Sheep Hunter?

Originally Posted by sunsetrider2011

So do you Say That I personally do not allow access on lease land that i pay the taxes and maintain Sheep Hunter?

never said any such thing......the key word was "some" I'm not a fan of painting with broad brushes. You sound like one of the responsible leaseholders that does permit access.....kudos to you.

[sunsetrider2011]

Originally Posted by sheephunter

never said any such thing......the key word was "some" I'm not a fan of painting with broad brushes. You sound like one of the responsible leaseholders that does permit access.....kudos to you.

But from your post you are lumping them all in the same? interesting how that works.

As you say "Some" your right some idiots ruin it for everyone else. Hunters and lease holders alike,,however lease holders at some point were either pushed or have had enough of damage to livestock,fences land and so forth that the entitlement crowds have done. In all honesty so be it..Like i said vacate all leases and sell them off to the highest bidder.. end of problem.

Originally Posted by sunsetrider2011

But from your post you are lumping them all in the same? interesting how that works.

LOL....."Some does not equal "all" Interesting how that works.

Please don't put words in my mouth that I never said nor intended....

[sunsetrider2011]

Originally Posted by sheephunter

LOL....."Some does not equal "all" Interesting how that works.

Please don't put words in my mouth that I never said nor intended....

You are right you said "some", as for others that believe "all" is the problem.

Originally Posted by sunsetrider2011

however lease holders at some point were either pushed or have had enough of damage to livestock,fences land and so forth that the entitlement crowds have done. .

Missed your edit....I guess that's one possibility and steps need to be taken to mitigate that abuse.

The other side of the entitlement coin is the entitlement crowd is operating lucrative outfitting businesses or family hunting retreats off this crown land at the exclusion of responsible Alberta citizens.

It's interesting how your coins only ever seem to have one side.

Originally Posted by sunsetrider2011

You are right you said "some", as for others that believe "all" is the problem.

Painting with a broad brush typically shows a pretty poor understanding of an issue.....

[dkalin]

came across some leased land today with a large buck on it , says use respect so I went to ask politely if I can foot access the land to hunt, he said no he only allows friends and family, I asked is it not leased land he replied yes it is and I say who goes on it, that made me so mad, these people need to lose their right, makes you want to shoot a cow!! Respect he needs respect!! I see what others are mad about ,they have a right,wonder what would happen if i walked on and shot that deer , will find out Monday

[elkhunter11]

came across some leased land today with a large buck on it , says use respect so I went to ask politely if I can foot access the land to hunt, he said no he only allows friends and family, I asked is it not leased land he replied yes it is and I say who goes on it

It sounds like you need to write a letter to your MLA with those details. Posting about it here, may make you feel better, but it won't change anything.

[flygirrl]

Originally Posted by dkalin

came across some leased land today with a large buck on it , says use respect so I went to ask politely if I can foot access the land to hunt, he said no he only allows friends and family, I asked is it not leased land he replied yes it is and I say who goes on it, that made me so mad, these people need to lose their right, makes you want to shoot a cow!! Respect he needs respect!! I see what others are mad about ,they have a right,wonder what would happen if i walked on and shot that deer , will find out Monday

Please do not go on this lease if that is your intent, don't get mad get even, get hold of the proper people and lodge a complaint. If your interested in hunting lease land go to the SRD site, look up the lease you want to hunt. The conditions of the lease are all there. Make sure you print out a copy of the lease conditions if it says access after nov 1st , no permission needed and carry that with you on the lease.

[trouty]

Originally Posted by dkalin

came across some leased land today with a large buck on it , says use respect so I went to ask politely if I can foot access the land to hunt, he said no he only allows friends and family, I asked is it not leased land he replied yes it is and I say who goes on it, that made me so mad, these people need to lose their right, makes you want to shoot a cow!! Respect he needs respect!! I see what others are mad about ,they have a right,wonder what would happen if i walked on and shot that deer , will find out Monday

Contact the local land manager, have him deal with it. If he is a pushover, go to the Local Settlement Officer. It's his job to represent fairness and the legislation. I have attached the contact info for the provincial offices.

[flygirrl]

Originally Posted by trouty

Contact the local land manager, have him deal with it. If he is a pushover, go to the Local Settlement Officer. It's his job to represent fairness and the legislation. I have attached the contact info for the provincial offices.

Thanks for the link..... Lodge the complaint, write your letter and be done with that lease holder, he is not worth your aggravation .

[ruttnbuckcojack]

I sure hope that the lease holder gets the right to allow and denie who ever he or she pleases.

[flygirrl]

Originally Posted by ruttnbuckcojack

I sure hope that the lease holder gets the right to allow and denie who ever he or she pleases.

That would be 'deny' , honestly if you don't have anything other than bad grammar or trying to stir the pot so to speak to the thread, start your own.

[elkhunter11]

I sure hope that the lease holder gets the right to allow and denie who ever he or she pleases.

Have you ever bothered to read the rules concerning access to these leases?

[flygirrl]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Have you ever bothered to read the rules concerning access to these leases?

Obviously not Elkhunter, it's a shame really that there are so many uninformed people out there and that is the main problem. I really feel that post was to stir the pot. It sure as heck didn't bring anything to the table that was useful.