Draw system overhaul

[OL_JR]

Originally Posted by FortMac

Where is the Squeeze out? The $40 for an application for the year is a deal breaker but the 100's in Gas is no sweat?

How many guys in the Edmonton and further north area applying for Turkeys? That zone is 4 hours + from Edmonton, even if I had the Turkey in a cage ready for you to shoot, that's 8 hours Highway driving. There's a tank of Gas at one time. Majority of people don't live where they hunt, if they did 150 Moose tags for 532 wouldn't be gone on opening morning and the Chinchaga or Swan Hills wouldn't be like a Walmart. People are willing to spend all sorts of money to go Hunting, won't bat an eye, But increase the draw price and it's like your trying to get a date with the Farmers daughter.

You are right some people making hunting really expensive, all the power to them. Those aren't the people that are going to be effected. Frankly I might fit into that category a bit. Make a good living, relatively low cost of living/debt load, put on a lot of miles to hunt and fish. Could stomach a pretty good increase but I'll wait my darn turn so those that can't can have the same shot at getting into the draws. I'll never forget where I came from or where I could be down the road. Life is a bugger sometimes and you never know.

Once again, what is the point of upping the application costs if the objective isn't to price people out. It's either it stays cheap, or get's really, really expensive. So expensive that if it ever did happen I'm damn sure some of you are going to be wondering why you punched yourself in the nuts for no reason.

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by OL_JR

You are saying squeeze out. You absolutely are.

If you aren't squeezing out people than what is the point of upping the application cost? You want change to shorten wait times yet somehow everyone should be able to afford more expense. Just gotta get their life together eh lol...

OK...

A lot of people are obviously willing to pay a little more in order for a more opportunities. No one is forcing anyone to buy every draw application if this were to happen.. and this is alllllllll theoretical and it’s pretty funny how people over react.

There is a ton of different options available to people if they want to apply for non resident draws in the states. I apply on a few. The reason why I don’t apply on more is 100% due to price and cost. You could put up $10000 applying for draws. Here if split it between 4 people your only out $10 each

[OL_JR]

Originally Posted by marky_mark

A lot of people are obviously willing to pay a little more in order for a more opportunities. No one is forcing anyone to buy every draw application if this were to happen.. and this is alllllllll theoretical and it’s pretty funny how people over react.

There is a ton of different options available to people if they want to apply for non resident draws in the states. I apply on a few. The reason why I don’t apply on more is 100% due to price and cost. You could put up $10000 applying for draws. Here if split it between 4 people your only out $10 each

No one is forcing anyone to buy the applications yet theoretically forcing people out is fun.

As to the latter half of your post, sounds like we have it pretty good here no?

[ram crazy]

Originally Posted by marky_mark

A lot of people are obviously willing to pay a little more in order for a more opportunities. No one is forcing anyone to buy every draw application if this were to happen.. and this is alllllllll theoretical and it’s pretty funny how people over react.

There is a ton of different options available to people if they want to apply for non resident draws in the states. I apply on a few. The reason why I don’t apply on more is 100% due to price and cost. You could put up $10000 applying for draws. Here if split it between 4 people your only out $10 each

Apple meet the orange! Comparing non resident with resident, that’s rich!

[DirtShooter]

I think we should just take out loans to go on hunts and ever hunt should be with a guide. I am going to write the government with this idea. I know it works for some in here.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by DirtShooter

I think we should just take out loans to go on hunts and ever hunt should be with a guide. I am going to write the government with this idea. I know it works for some in here.

How inappropriate.

Raising a draw entry to $10, or even $20 does not require a loan nor does making a trophy moose, elk, pronghorn or mule deer tag $150. But what it does do is make people prioritize. I know it would mean a hard look for me.

[ram crazy]

Originally Posted by Pathfinder76

How inappropriate.

Raising a draw entry to $10, or even $20 does not require a loan nor does making a trophy moose, elk, pronghorn or mule deer tag $150. But what it does do is make people prioritize. I know it would mean a hard look for me.

And just where do you think this money will go? Then why not a 2 draw limit then.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by ram crazy

And just where do you think this money will go? Then why not a 2 draw limit then.

Where does the draw money go now?

Regarding the two draw limit. Please tell me how you implement that.

[ram crazy]

Originally Posted by Pathfinder76

Where does the draw money go now?

Regarding the two draw limit. Please tell me how you implement that.

So what you’re saying is you don’t pay enough taxes now then!

Pick 2 draws and put in for them. I didn’t think it was that hard to comprehend.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by ram crazy

So what you’re saying is you don’t pay enough taxes now then!

Pick 2 draws and put in for them. I didn’t think it was that hard to comprehend.

I think the entire tax system needs to be a pay to play structure already.

Really? You just tell everyone to do that. Laughing. That’s like saying the antidote for inflation is to have everyone on the forced quantity plan. IE food and goods stamps

Economics 101.

[Smoky buck]

The draw system will likely continue to be a mess because even though everyone hates wait times those who have built up priority will fight tooth and nail to not loose it

Slight increase in application fees like $10-$20 each would be good for generating money for the system but would have little to no impact on the number of applicants. Going much beyond theses costs would be morally wrong and pricing people out in my opinion

Making the system too complicated will never fly because govt won’t want to deal with running it. They don’t really care about your wait time they want a simple cost effective system to operate.

Personally I believe the real push should be fix the abuse in the system by tightening resident hunter requirements for starters. Removing non residents from the resident draw pool as well. Either have a small number of non resident draw tags or just no more non residents in the draw. Honestly I can’t believe this mess has not been fixed considering how neighboring provinces are managed

This dead horse has been beaten to mush on this forum. What I am curious about is what proposals are being brought forward by the organizations representing Alberta resident hunters to address theses concerns because this is where change will start

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by DirtShooter

I think we should just take out loans to go on hunts and ever hunt should be with a guide. I am going to write the government with this idea. I know it works for some in here.

Where’s that eye roll emoji???
Ohh here it is
🙄🙄🙄

[ram crazy]

Originally Posted by Pathfinder76

I think the entire tax system needs to be a pay to play structure already.

Really? You just tell everyone to do that. Laughing. That’s like saying the antidote for inflation is to have everyone on the forced quantity plan. IE food and goods stamps

Economics 101.

Isn't it a pay to play system now or am I missing something.


Really? Just tell everyone that it's going to cost them way more to apply and to buy the tag. Laughing. That's like telling people hunting is just going to be for the so called serious hunter.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by ram crazy

Isn't it a pay to play system now or am I missing something.


Really? Just tell everyone that it's going to cost them way more to apply and to buy the tag. Laughing. That's like telling people hunting is just going to be for the so called serious hunter.

Ram Crazy. The tax system also taxes you on what you make.

And have you been shopping lately? By your way of thinking, eating, and driving are a rich man’s sport.

Can you give me an example of another commodity that hasn’t gone up in price in the last ten years?

[ram crazy]

Originally Posted by Pathfinder76

Ram Crazy. The tax system also taxes you on what you make.

And have you been shopping lately? By your way of thinking, eating, and driving are a rich man’s sport.

Can you give me an example of another commodity that hasn’t gone up in price in the last ten years?

You should be over joyed that it hasn't gone up in price!

[Sledhead71]

Originally Posted by ram crazy

And just where do you think this money will go? Then why not a 2 draw limit then.

The limit on applications is the right answer, 3 would be a good start...

Increasing the fees is just going to pad the pockets of the American company that provides the software and support to the system.

The resources belongs to Canadians, not just those who live in this province, we need to allow non-resident Canadians an opportunity to enjoy our great province and some resources they may not have.

Outfitting is not bad either, yes those with deep pockets will have opportunities many don't, but they already do....

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by Sledhead71

The limit on applications is the right answer, 3 would be a good start...

Increasing the fees is just going to pad the pockets of the American company that provides the software and support to the system.

The resources belongs to Canadians, not just those who live in this province, we need to allow non-resident Canadians an opportunity to enjoy our great province and some resources they may not have.

Outfitting is not bad either, yes those with deep pockets will have opportunities many don't, but they already do....

Uhh the idea is to reduce wait times not increase them
I think the rest of canada already gets enough from alberta

[Smoky buck]

Originally Posted by Sledhead71

The limit on applications is the right answer, 3 would be a good start...

Increasing the fees is just going to pad the pockets of the American company that provides the software and support to the system.

The resources belongs to Canadians, not just those who live in this province, we need to allow non-resident Canadians an opportunity to enjoy our great province and some resources they may not have.

Outfitting is not bad either, yes those with deep pockets will have opportunities many don't, but they already do....

Nothing wrong with sharing with non resident Canadians but show me another province that allows non residents in the same draw as residents? Most have tightened up on non resident Canadians on what they can hunt even if it’s general opening. Not really a two way street

I fully support sharing the general season opportunities with our fellow Canadians and use the host program every year for whitetail. I don’t believe residents should be competing with non residents for draws. At the minimum it should be a small number of tags for a non resident draw separate from the resident draws.

This is be far more generous then other provinces/territories

Outfitters kept at reasonable tag numbers is a positive because of the money contributed to conservation

[Sledhead71]

Originally Posted by marky_mark

Uhh the idea is to reduce wait times not increase them
I think the rest of canada already gets enough from alberta

And how would limiting the number of applications increase the wait times

[Sledhead71]

Originally Posted by Smoky buck

Nothing wrong with sharing with non resident Canadians but show me another province that allows non residents in the same draw as residents? Most have tightened up on non resident Canadians on what they can hunt even if it’s general opening. Not really a two way street

I fully support sharing the general season opportunities with our fellow Canadians and use the host program every year for whitetail. I don’t believe residents should be competing with non residents for draws. At the minimum it should be a small number of tags for a non resident draw separate from the resident draws.

This is be far more generous then other provinces/territories

Outfitters kept at reasonable tag numbers is a positive because of the money contributed to conservation

Nothing is perfect in life, and we can't control what other provinces do with their system... I do agree with the competing with non-residents though, be nice to have segregation and finite allotment for this demographic.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by ram crazy

You should be over joyed that it hasn't gone up in price!

If one gas station in town is selling gas for 73 cents a litre. They will never have fuel.

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by Sledhead71

And how would limiting the number of applications increase the wait times

Making more opportunities for non residents will definitely increase wait times

[pikeslayer22]

Originally Posted by marky_mark

Uhh the idea is to reduce wait times not increase them
I think the rest of canada already gets enough from alberta

Exactly!!!!

[ram crazy]

Originally Posted by Pathfinder76

If one gas station in town is selling gas for 73 cents a litre. They will never have fuel.

Costco never runs out and they're always cheaper. A intelligent person wouldn't be crying about the price of draws and tags unless you're only wanting to cut wait times for personal gain. It's all about the me crowd. I see why one works where they do sometimes!

[Pathfinder76]

Here is an interesting change in Colorado

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by ram crazy

Costco never runs out and they're always cheaper. A intelligent person wouldn't be crying about the price of draws and tags unless you're only wanting to cut wait times for personal gain. It's all about the me crowd. I see why one works where they do sometimes!

1/2 price?

Let me get this straight. This is all about me, but you want to set your own price? Got it.

This argument is becoming embarrassing.

[crazy_davey]

Originally Posted by ram crazy

Costco never runs out and they're always cheaper.

Ya, and almost 99% of times I drive by Costco there are huge lineups to save a few cents on fuel.

Myself and many, many others will put in every draw we can at $3 even if we have no intention of ever using some of them. Make them $15-$20 to enter and I will start putting a lot more thought into which ones I really want and which ones I don’t. Betting many others would do the same.

Why wouldn’t we enter as many draws we can and keep building priority when it is basically free and 100% legal?

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by Pathfinder76

Here is an interesting change in Colorado

Colorado changed their laws and they give you 30 days now to come up with the funds instead of pre paying when you apply
A lot of residents are ****ed at this idea and it’s flooded their draw pool
A non resident moose tag is around $2300 also
I know a non resident antelope tag is $500

[Smoky buck]

Originally Posted by marky_mark

Colorado changed their laws and they give you 30 days now to come up with the funds instead of pre paying when you apply
A lot of residents are ****ed at this idea and it’s flooded their draw pool
A non resident moose tag is around $2300 also
I know a non resident antelope tag is $500

An increase in non resident tag cost would not be a bad idea in Alberta

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by Smoky buck

An increase in non resident tag cost would not be a bad idea in Alberta

For sure that needs to go up
People will still come and hunt because it still a bargain and your not waiting til your 70 for your once in a lifetime tag