Cop killer in Cal.

[Tactical Lever]

Originally Posted by BeeGuy

Are you suggesting that systemic corruption is not possible and that it is merely "a numbers game"?

It is not a numbers game when entire departments are found to be corrupt and basically operating (TAX PAYER FUNDED) under a protocol of complete mayhem.

Sure, in anything except a pure meritocracy, like begats like.

If you would like to be more specific, tell us the percentage of crooked cops in LA. Or you could give it a ratio, LA vs. other jurisdictions.

[BeeGuy]

I already provided more than you are asking for.

Just go back and follow the links.

Rampart

[Pincherguy]

Originally Posted by BeeGuy

I already provided more than you are asking for.

Just go back and follow the links.

Rampart

Come on, I would have thought you would have loved to say it all again. I think you like hearing the sound of your own voice.

[Tactical Lever]

Originally Posted by BeeGuy

I already provided more than you are asking for.

Just go back and follow the links.

Rampart

Yes I looked at it. 24 were convicted, I believe. How do you think that stacks up against other organisations? Are we to brand the whole 10 000 or however many as criminals?

That would be akin to saying since BeeGuy's Great Great Great Great Grand Dad, robbed a stagecoach, the whole Bee family is a honey of a Mafia.

[BeeGuy]

Originally Posted by Pincherguy

Come on, I would have thought you would have loved to say it all again. I think you like hearing the sound of your own voice.

A little uptight there Pincher?

When was the last time you took a vacation?

[huntingd]

He is a nutcase. Accused other officers of racism. One case proven to be true. Filed a complaint someone p***** on his jacket. Proven false. Accused training officer of kicking a mentally handicapped guy. So far proven false. He hit a fellow officer in the chest and got in another officers face. Sounds like they got rid of what they thought was a trouble maker. He goes nuts. How anyone can call him a revolutionary is beyond me. He is a killer. The LAPD is no better. They have shot innocents in this feud as well. It sickens me that people can take either side.

[Classic_Cool]

Originally Posted by huntingd

He is a nutcase. Accused other officers of racism. One case proven to be true. Filed a complaint someone p***** on his jacket. Proven false. Accused training officer of kicking a mentally handicapped guy. So far proven false. He hit a fellow officer in the chest and got in another officers face. Sounds like they got rid of what they thought was a trouble maker. He goes nuts. How anyone can call him a revolutionary is beyond me. He is a killer. The LAPD is no better. They have shot innocents in this feud as well. It sickens me that people can take either side.

You do realize that everything the LAPD accuses him of is open to question?

I'm not supporting the psycho, I'm just not ignoring him.

[huntingd]

So which killer do you choose to believe? Nothing excuses shooting people. Or his "courageous" act of ambushing 2 officers at a red light. What has he done that could possibly be ok? Charles manson had followers too.

[Okotokian]

Originally Posted by canadiantdi

If there were a whole group of ex-cops who took up arms against LAPD corruption, this might be different. I guess that could still happen though... One lone guy with PTSD and a grudge isn't going to get mainstream understanding or support.. although, I have heard that twitter is kind of exploding with support from people in the LA area who see the corruption first hand.

Whoa LOL Didn't you just take great pains to argue with me that you didn't really mean that this sort of violence would ever be justifiable? Got pretty darn indignant about it as I recall.

Ok, so explain how it "might be different" if a whole group started killing instead of just an individual (your first sentence). You seem to keep suggesting that in certain cases it would be justified, understandable, OK, "different".
.
I certainly don't want to misunderstand you again.

[Classic_Cool]

You know I keep wondering to myself: if some guy ambushed 2 cops in North Korea and claimed he did it because they were corrupt and dangerous, how many people over here would call him crazy?

This particular gunman is unhinged but that doesn't mean he's wrong in his accusations. I'm not rooting for either side. I'm just observing.

[Denny Boy]

Cop killer in Cal.
Nobody and I mean nobody has the right to "KILL ANYONE UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES"
DENNY BOY

[huntingd]

Originally Posted by Denny Boy

Cop killer in Cal.
Nobody and I mean nobody has the right to "KILL ANYONE UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES"
DENNY BOY

He's not nobody. He's a revolutionary. He's justified.

[Classic_Cool]

I move for people to stop using selective memory when quoting me

All in favor say Aye.

[Denny Boy]

Why isn't any body talking about the 2 innocent women that were killed by the over zealous cops?? Are the taught to shoot first then ask questions? Does this situation make it ok?? Why is the reward of $1,000,000.00 so much??? Would it be the same amount if he was treating to kill ordinary people.
Denny Boy

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by Classic_Cool

You know I keep wondering to myself: if some guy ambushed 2 cops in North Korea and claimed he did it because they were corrupt and dangerous, how many people over here would call him crazy?

This particular gunman is unhinged but that doesn't mean he's wrong in his accusations. I'm not rooting for either side. I'm just observing.

Your saying he has the right to his opinion that someone wronged him but that it did not give him the right to murder.

[huntingd]

Originally Posted by Classic_Cool

You know I keep wondering to myself: if some guy ambushed 2 cops in North Korea and claimed he did it because they were corrupt and dangerous, how many people over here would call him crazy?

This particular gunman is unhinged but that doesn't mean he's wrong in his accusations. I'm not rooting for either side. I'm just observing.

Even if he is right in his accusations it doesn't give him the right to start shooting people. Unhinged is not even close. He is a homicidal maniac that is mad he lost his job. He is upset he feels there was racism. He isn't trying to save the world from the LAPD. He wants his "honour". They will eventually find him and kill him. Then all he will be is a dead killer. Not a hero. It will be interesting to see if they try to take him alive.

[Classic_Cool]

Originally Posted by huntingd

Even if he is right in his accusations it doesn't give him the right to start shooting people. Unhinged is not even close. He is a homicidal maniac that is mad he lost his job. He is upset he feels there was racism. He isn't trying to save the world from the LAPD. He wants his "honour". They will eventually find him and kill him. Then all he will be is a dead killer. Not a hero. It will be interesting to see if they try to take him alive.

That's kinda my point in all of this. They'll eventually kill him and then the world changes the channel. In 10 years will people still be claiming the LAPD is the most corrupt police force on Earth?

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by BeeGuy

A brief history of the Los Angeles Police Department:

Sex Extortion by 12 and 15yr veterans. Jan 2013, investigation ongoing

Assault beating restrained people, including women, to death

Fraud financial transparency policy causes dozens of cops to quit

These are just some recent ones. There is enough to fill a library.

Yes, let us not forget the Rampart Scandal. unprovoked shootings, unprovoked beatings, planting false evidense, framing suspects, stealing and drug dealing, perjury, rape, murder, robbery and so on, the extent of which will never be known

It's not like THIS was an isolated incident.

There should be rewards for those people identifying corruption and criminal behavior within the LAPD.

I certainly don't support Dorner, however, I can not in good conscience support a much more clear and significant threat.

In any statistical population size you will get some nuts and bad guys. Whether catholic priests or cops. The LAPD is likely no exception.

They have 9,247 uniformed cops. Total number of civilian employees: 2,959. Total force...over 10,000. And statistically you are picking on how many incidents over how many years to claim a conspiracy or a police force run amok?

The system seems to be weeding some bad apples out.

[Classic_Cool]

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

In any statistical population size you will get some nuts and bad guys. Whether catholic priests or cops. The LAPD is likely no exception.

They have 9,247 uniformed cops. Total number of civilian employees: 2,959. Total force...over 10,000. And statistically you are picking on how many incidents over how many years to claim a conspiracy or a police force run amok?

The system seems to be weeding some bad apples out.

You're partly right. But I grew up in a town of 30,000 with about 250,000 total in the greater area. If I use the LAPD as a statistical example then alot of the people I know should be dead or in jail

[huntingd]

In 91 they beat the snot out of rodney king. That's more than 10 years and I think since then most people lost a lot of respect for the LAPD. I can't see peoples opinions changing in the next ten years.

[canadiantdi]

Originally Posted by Okotokian

Whoa LOL Didn't you just take great pains to argue with me that you didn't really mean that this sort of violence would ever be justifiable? Got pretty darn indignant about it as I recall.

Ok, so explain how it "might be different" if a whole group started killing instead of just an individual (your first sentence). You seem to keep suggesting that in certain cases it would be justified, understandable, OK, "different".
.
I certainly don't want to misunderstand you again.

I said "it might be different", not because I felt that murder is ok if there is a large group of murderers. I am pointing out that he is getting no mainstream support because he is just one guy and the general public doesn't agree with him. If there were a large % of the force or population who claimed that corruption was running rampant, if there were a huge group of these guys, they would receive more support, ya know, things would be different.

Read the rest of the thread! I am discussing the differences between a revolutionary and a lunatic, what is required to be labeled as either etc.. I guess if I say it again, you might get it... I don't condone the killing of innocent people!

If you need to pick apart my other posts, just PM me instead of clogging up this thread with your need to argue.

[Ken07AOVette]

Bottom line the guy went krankenstein and needs to be stopped asafp.

$1,000,000.00 is justified.

It does not say dead or alive, it says 'for information leading to'

All this other fluff is ridiculous.

[canadiantdi]

Originally Posted by Classic_Cool

You know I keep wondering to myself: if some guy ambushed 2 cops in North Korea and claimed he did it because they were corrupt and dangerous, how many people over here would call him crazy?

This particular gunman is unhinged but that doesn't mean he's wrong in his accusations. I'm not rooting for either side. I'm just observing.

Good point... A lot of people on this side of the globe would assume that police forces over there are highly corrupt and have less issue with this kind of behavior..

I think maybe it has to do with the fact that anything you hear about the forces over there are terrible. Over here, the vast majority of people have no issues with our police forces.. It would be extremely hard to support any action against a police force that in general, keeps the peace, we have no personal issues with, and only a relatively small portion of the population has problems with..

[Classic_Cool]

Originally Posted by huntingd

Even if he is right in his accusations it doesn't give him the right to start shooting people. Unhinged is not even close. He is a homicidal maniac that is mad he lost his job. He is upset he feels there was racism. He isn't trying to save the world from the LAPD. He wants his "honour". They will eventually find him and kill him. Then all he will be is a dead killer. Not a hero. It will be interesting to see if they try to take him alive.

I'm also going to disagree about the homicidal maniac part. Given everything, it seems more likely that he's gotten into the dangerous mindset that the ends justify the means. Considering his military background, that's not too surprising. Civilians die all the time during military operations and are deemed acceptable losses. That's probably how he views that woman and her fiance.

Is that a defense for him? God no. If anything it makes him worse because he knows what he's doing. It's coldblooded.

[canadiantdi]

Originally Posted by Classic_Cool

That's kinda my point in all of this. They'll eventually kill him and then the world changes the channel. In 10 years will people still be claiming the LAPD is the most corrupt police force on Earth?

I don't think that the corruption will get bad enough anytime soon, to cause the average person to want to protest or even take up arms. It's almost as if a certain amount is tolerable by the average person. If we only see police brutality towards homeless, drunks, resisters, protesters etc, we live with it. As long as it's only happening to a relatively small portion of the population, it will be tolerated.

[Classic_Cool]

Originally Posted by canadiantdi

I don't think that the corruption will get bad enough anytime soon, to cause the average person to want to protest or even take up arms. It's almost as if a certain amount is tolerable by the average person. If we only see police brutality towards homeless, drunks, resisters, protesters etc, we live with it. As long as it's only happening to a relatively small portion of the population, it will be tolerated.

Seems that way doesn't it? I forget where I heard this saying, but it goes that if you throw a frog in boiling water, he'll jump back out again. But if you put him in cold water and turn up the temperature slowly, he'll sit there until he cooks.

[huntingd]

Originally Posted by Classic_Cool

I'm also going to disagree about the homicidal maniac part. Given everything, it seems more likely that he's gotten into the dangerous mindset that the ends justify the means. Considering his military background, that's not too surprising. Civilians die all the time during military operations and are deemed acceptable losses. That's probably how he views that woman and her fiance.

Is that a defense for him? God no. If anything it makes him worse because he knows what he's doing. It's coldblooded.

"That woman" was the daughter of the police captain he blames for losing his job. Kind of blows your opinion on how he views them out of the water. He also called her dad and taunted him about her death. Some hero. Do you just instantly make an opinion or do you actually have any knowledge of what's really happening?

[huntingd]

He deserved to lose his job and he deserves everything he's got coming.

[Okotokian]

Originally Posted by canadiantdi

If you need to pick apart my other posts, just PM me instead of clogging up this thread with your need to argue.

A little touchy there. I'd say I've been pretty selective, simply arguing two of your statements on one thread. You mean to say that if I search more broadly I'll find more of your justifiable homicide lunacy? LOL

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by Classic_Cool

You're partly right. But I grew up in a town of 30,000 with about 250,000 total in the greater area. If I use the LAPD as a statistical example then alot of the people I know should be dead or in jail

Good point. I would say that you are comparing 30,000 farmers to 10,000 policemen. You will get a statistically different mix of personalities. They are also in an entirely different sociological group.

That being said I am not justifying even one bad cop. The system is in place to deal with it at the cop level...then the next would be the FBI.