Why the NDP will win.

[roper1]

Lets get the discussion back to more healthcare & less personalities please

[roper1]

Originally Posted by 3blade

Well here I go challenging a mod…see if I get banned lol

You go ahead and tell a bunch of stressed out, predominantly female, predominantly child bearing, highly trained, highly sought after professionals with a mobile degree/profession what they can work and how much time they can spend with their families.

Metaphorically - “File the front sight off first” comes to mind. Homer Simpson playing with a nuclear reactor comes to mind. You being homer.

Everyone WILL leave and you can’t import 3rd world “equivalents” fast enough.

This is not the patch, a feed lot, or a construction site.

Now are there problems in the contract relating to what you and blackheart are talking about - yes - but it’s cheap compared to what would happen.

No one in healthcare gives a flying rats behind about whitetail deer hunting and there’s nothing else in Alberta worth mentioning except money

No worries challenging me. lol. As posted elsewhere here, the traveling nurses are making huge money. How do they have time for this when they're so overworked & stressed? Because they do the 'bait & switch' scam building up time off in hometown. Then they toodle off to Mayerthorpe for a month of contract with the very same employer (AHS) & pull the very same scam with the local nurses. Big money at double time & half. Poor management they're taking advantage of. You or I might well do it, but call it what it is.

[claykuch]

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

I haven’t seen any NDP trolls on here. Someone who presents a concern that could cause folks to vote NDP is a fair statement.

If someone has made a concern you think is false or invalid… by all means point it out.

Otherwise… mirror mirror on the wall…

Do you hunt or own firearms? Do you believe in freedom? Do you believe in capitalism? Not........ You are obviously on this site to try to influence people to your left wing brand of politics.

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by claykuch

Do you hunt or own firearms? Do you believe in freedom? Do you believe in capitalism? Not........ You are obviously on this site to try to influence people to your left wing brand of politics.

Me thinks you are having trouble reading what is written.

Maybe go back to the beginning and stop posting what you think you know based upon reading one sentence.

I can present information and ideas for you but I can’t understand it for you.

Report back once you have read more and thought about what I’ve posted.

[Scott h]

Originally Posted by roper1

No worries challenging me. lol. As posted elsewhere here, the traveling nurses are making huge money. How do they have time for this when they're so overworked & stressed? Because they do the 'bait & switch' scam building up time off in hometown. Then they toodle off to Mayerthorpe for a month of contract with the very same employer (AHS) & pull the very same scam with the local nurses. Big money at double time & half. Poor management they're taking advantage of. You or I might well do it, but call it what it is.

It's very easy, and lucrative. Work a shift on OT, bank it at double time, and take two days off. You can do what you choose on those days off, work, ski, hunt, whatever. Ask me how I know
There are a handful of changes that could be made to the contracts that would save MASSIVE amounts of $$$, and have a HUGE impact on being able to staff hospitals, but you have to be careful on what/how changes are made as you are dealing with a lot of highly trained people who can have their pick of 5 other jobs by lunchtime. The term "be careful not to throw the baby out with the bathwater" comes to mind.
Just to be clear, virtually all of these questionable issues in the contracts were not put in place by the NDP.

[3blade]

Originally Posted by roper1

No worries challenging me. lol. As posted elsewhere here, the traveling nurses are making huge money. How do they have time for this when they're so overworked & stressed? Because they do the 'bait & switch' scam building up time off in hometown. Then they toodle off to Mayerthorpe for a month of contract with the very same employer (AHS) & pull the very same scam with the local nurses. Big money at double time & half. Poor management they're taking advantage of. You or I might well do it, but call it what it is.

That quite literally cannot happen. They can work for a different employer, but they can’t be on any PTO and working shifts for AHS. Perhaps someone did it 20 years ago but it can’t happen now with computerized payroll.

[Sledhead71]

Originally Posted by Scott h

It's very easy, and lucrative. Work a shift on OT, bank it at double time, and take two days off. You can do what you choose on those days off, work, ski, hunt, whatever. Ask me how I know
There are a handful of changes that could be made to the contracts that would save MASSIVE amounts of $$$, and have a HUGE impact on being able to staff hospitals, but you have to be careful on what/how changes are made as you are dealing with a lot of highly trained people who can have their pick of 5 other jobs by lunchtime. The term "be careful not to throw the baby out with the bathwater" comes to mind.
Just to be clear, virtually all of these questionable issues in the contracts were not put in place by the NDP.

Actually Scott you do not have to be careful at all.... System is broken, people like yourself know this and take advantage of it, plain and simple. You point out that change will save massive amounts, and have a huge impact on services but don't advocate change. You sir are part of the problem.

Make the changes, take it in the chin and suffer short term pain for long term goals... There is a saying, your position is not going to end when you leave, this is true with these highly skilled people as well....

[Scott h]

Originally Posted by 3blade

That quite literally cannot happen. They can work for a different employer, but they can’t be on any PTO and working shifts for AHS. Perhaps someone did it 20 years ago but it can’t happen now with computerized payroll.

You use your PTO as your time off, and book all your normal days off as OT.

[Scott h]

Originally Posted by Sledhead71

Actually Scott you do not have to be careful at all.... System is broken, people like yourself know this and take advantage of it, plain and simple. You point out that change will save massive amounts, and have a huge impact on services but don't advocate change. You sir are part of the problem.

Make the changes, take it in the chin and suffer short term pain for long term goals... There is a saying, your position is not going to end when you leave, this is true with these highly skilled people as well....

I don't wholly disagree, and I do advocate for change, but measured change. Totally tearing down a system that you depend on comes with some massive costs. Are you willing to do without the healthcare that you are used to? Most people find it kinda nice to have a cath lab open when you show up at ER with chest pain.

[Grizzly Adams1]

Originally Posted by roper1

Lets get the discussion back to more healthcare & less personalities please

The Feds have been talking out of one side of their mouth about improved health care, while continually cutting back on their share of funding over the years. with the other.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/pre...care-1.6515070

Grizz

[One'n'Done]

Why the NDP will win?

Because the conservatives have done nothing but mess their own beds for the last twenty years, retained none of the lessons from May 5th 2015 and only accomplished a name change and a shift to the hardline side.

[3blade]

Originally Posted by Scott h

You use your PTO as your time off, and book all your normal days off as OT.

Again, that’s not how it works. See if you can understand this, and let me know if I need to explain something better.

The reason for the OT based on shift length (vs total hours in a week, or pay period) and on designated days off (which is not every day) is that a part time employee is part time because they need to be, usually for child care. So they cannot be treated like an “extra” and have their schedules/lives rearranged by management whims to fill gaps without OT compensation.

Now yes - some nurses absolutely do work a low FTE and only come in for OT on their DDOs. But why is that? Why are they needed? Inadequate staffing levels.

It’s worth noting that that there is a whole crap ton of “mandatory” and “operational need” clauses that management can use to mandate staff to work in an emergency. Problem is, that was abused as a way to cover regular, entirely predictable staffing needs, usually due to unfilled shifts/positions or poor management.

If management staffed for the top workload, instead of the “median” - no one would get overtime unless there was a plane crash (or pandemic). But then there would be downtime, and some finance bro would say it’s not efficient.

I’ve seen this go in cycles. Business degree #1 “we are paying too much in part time benefits so everyone need to be full time!!!” - **** tons of OT gets paid, shifts are left unfilled, staff get burned out and leave.

Business degree #2 comes in “we are paying to much in OT and sick time, we need more part times!!!”

But they never, ever, actually increase staffing levels to accommodate the top workload. It’s always the median, 75%, or some other metric.

[3blade]

Originally Posted by BlackHeart

The RHA I worked for had a community with a captive employment market....meaning if you were a nurse living in that community you either worked for us or you didn’t live there, as a commute was not possible.

The hospital had the need for 5 FTE (full-time-equivalent) nurses. We had 12 RNA nurses (that we knew of) working in the community...for us. But we could not fill vacancies for positions .....especially full time ones. WHY??? Because all 12 nurses were making enough gaming the system and the union agreement.

My solution.... though the politics chickened out once UNA started screaming about it....all new positions are full time, and we are going to move to 50% overstaffing levels (funny how UNA keeps telling the media how they want more Bodies due to overwork but freak out when you actually add them as full time)....means zero overtime, lots of slack for sick days, AND only 7-8 nurses employed...the other 4-5 would become unemployed.

Funny how that most important part has never happened eh? And you can’t blame that on the union. No business degree, admin, finance bro, or manager has ever allowed staffing for the top workload, never mind 50% overstaffed

[Scott h]

Originally Posted by 3blade

Again, that’s not how it works. See if you can understand this, and let me know if I need to explain something better.

The reason for the OT based on shift length (vs total hours in a week, or pay period) and on designated days off (which is not every day) is that a part time employee is part time because they need to be, usually for child care. So they cannot be treated like an “extra” and have their schedules/lives rearranged by management whims to fill gaps without OT compensation.

Now yes - some nurses absolutely do work a low FTE and only come in for OT on their DDOs. But why is that? Why are they needed? Inadequate staffing levels.

It’s worth noting that that there is a whole crap ton of “mandatory” and “operational need” clauses that management can use to mandate staff to work in an emergency. Problem is, that was abused as a way to cover regular, entirely predictable staffing needs, usually due to unfilled shifts/positions or poor management.

If management staffed for the top workload, instead of the “median” - no one would get overtime unless there was a plane crash (or pandemic). But then there would be downtime, and some finance bro would say it’s not efficient.

I’ve seen this go in cycles. Business degree #1 “we are paying too much in part time benefits so everyone need to be full time!!!” - **** tons of OT gets paid, shifts are left unfilled, staff get burned out and leave.

Business degree #2 comes in “we are paying to much in OT and sick time, we need more part times!!!”

But they never, ever, actually increase staffing levels to accommodate the top workload. It’s always the median, 75%, or some other metric.

I understand thanks. I know why DDO's came into effect, but the fact is many switch to a lower FTE and then work OT on those DDO. That happens all the time, and makes perfect sense for those doing it. Why wouldn't you? BC got rid of the designated days off years back strictly for that reason. That was an example of a targeting low hanging fruit so to speak, and it made taking a lower FTE less appealing, unless you actually wanted it for work, life balance.
I completely agree with the poor understanding of staffing, and then the need to book OT. How many times can they make the same mistake ......

[Scott h]

Originally Posted by 3blade

Funny how that most important part has never happened eh? And you can’t blame that on the union. No business degree, admin, finance bro, or manager has ever allowed staffing for the top workload, never mind 50% overstaffed

And we have a winner
Having two people on shift at straight time, is no more expensive than having one at double!!!! In fact it's MUCH cheaper in the long run because you won't be dealing with people taking that banked time off.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by Scott h

And we have a winner
Having two people on shift at straight time, is no more expensive than having one at double!!!! In fact it's MUCH cheaper in the long run because you won't be dealing with people taking that banked time off.

Exactly, no having to pay to have someone cover two days.

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by roper1

Lets get the discussion back to more healthcare & less personalities please

Just a reminder....

[Sledhead71]

Originally Posted by Scott h

I don't wholly disagree, and I do advocate for change, but measured change. Totally tearing down a system that you depend on comes with some massive costs. Are you willing to do without the healthcare that you are used to? Most people find it kinda nice to have a cath lab open when you show up at ER with chest pain.

There was no discussion on tearing the system down, overhauling it and providing our citizens the care we all deserve. Unfortunately today, we do without healthcare on many many levels. If this is the level of care your finding acceptable, I'm a loss for words...

Many Albertan's are without a family doctor, many walk in clinics fill up well before there hours of operation expire and refuse more citizens, Emergency rooms have planned closures, wait times are beyond realistic for most... No this is not the health care system I want to be use too.

[Camdelle]

Because we have a "new" premier who should have already been charged as being a thief against the people.

I mean she already stole once.

Now we have more ministers than every making more than ever and at the same time she is putting normal provincial employees out of work and are reducing services for Albertans.

[AB2506]

Originally Posted by Fisherdan

10+ hour wait time at the children’s hospital in Calgary right now.

Waiting room is full with an extra 20-30 kids lying on the hallway floors.

1.5 hours just to get admitted.

Good job driving our doctors and nurses into the ground and to different provinces Kenny. Good luck with more of your out of touch rhetoric and priorities Danielle.

Will try taking our son again tomorrow in the morning.

The NDP failed to improve the AHS in their 4 years in power and I doubt that they would if they were to win again.

My daughter is a nurse at the hospital in Lethbridge. By the sounds of it, the system is broken. She's taking her masters of nursing and aims to work to change the system if it isn't changed before graduation and gaining more experience.

[AB2506]

Originally Posted by FortMac

Alberta's Healthcare budget has never been higher, what .ore can they do? AHS needs to be dismantled and the system rebuilt. Nurses should be on a 40 hour work week with zero overtime.

You're dreaming in technicolor. Most nurses are on a defined work week. However, due to illness, vacation, etc, the wards are seldom fully staffed and there comes a time where the managers have to fill the holes to make sure the patients are properly looked after. So, if a nurse has worked their weekly hours, and the staffing persons have run through the staffing list and there are no takers and the call goes to the nurse who has her weekly hours worked and she takes the shift, obviously it will be overtime.

My daughter is a nurse at the hospital in Lethbridge. When she is visiting us, her phone never stops beeping with offers of shifts that need to be filled. I'd say that it is a least 3-5 times an hour that she is offered a shift. WTF?

She's 25 and is stressed. Her ward is stroke and acute medicine. To say people go there to die is pretty accurate.

[AB2506]

Guys, the system does strange things that drive up costs for little gain.

For example: A 97 year old patient is in rapidly declining health as observed by the nurses. The patient has advanced CPOD and has developed heart arrhythmia. The doctor decides to install a pacemaker. On a severely ill 97 year old? The procedure alone could kill the patient.

I don't believe in euthanasia, but at what point does the system say that the patient is 97 with severe irreversible health conditions and nothing further should be done. That pacemaker will not allow the patient to have a significantly extended life span. IIRC, the patient passed away 2 months later without having been discharged from the hospital. What did the patient gain? What did the health care system gain?

For example: A 94 year old patient is on life support, their organs are shutting down. The doctor advises the family that the patient does not have the will to thrive, they are no longer fighting to get better. The family refuses to take off life support. Why? Because dad really wanted to make 95. Dad is gone (according to the doctor), he won't know or care if he reaches 95. I know it is had to take your loved one off life support, (we did it in 2008 when my mother-in-law stopped fighting her respiratory infection and her organs were starting to fail), but we have to be realistic about their prognosis and stop being selfish. It's not about the survivors, it's about what's best for the patient.

How much money is spent transporting patients from centers like Lethbridge to Edmonton or Calgary for advanced diagnostics and specialty units? It's got to be a huge number. Maybe centers like Lethbridge, Medicine Hat, Red Deer, Grand Prairie, Fort McMurray need some of these specialists? Would it save money?

Seniors homes need more beds and also more review. How many patients are in the hospital, too sick to go home, not sick enough to remain in the hospital, but there are no beds in a senior home for them. It costs way more for that patient to remain in the hospital, than in a senior home. Regarding senior home review. There are homes that send a resident to hospital for symptoms that they are capable of caring for themselves. This should not happen.

One final thing. Covid 19 hung a licking on the health care system that I don't think it has fully overcome yet. If nothing else, the money that was spent on Covid 19 is HUUUGE. (I'm not debating whether Covid 19 is real or not. Regardless of one's opinion of Covid 19, billions were spent on treatment and the "vaccines". That is a huge drain on the system's budget and employees.)

As for the NDP, if they had been power, there is a good chance we'd still be in a Covid lockdown.

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by AB2506

You're dreaming in technicolor. Most nurses are on a defined work week. However, due to illness, vacation, etc, the wards are seldom fully staffed and there comes a time where the managers have to fill the holes to make sure the patients are properly looked after. So, if a nurse has worked their weekly hours, and the staffing persons have run through the staffing list and there are no takers and the call goes to the nurse who has her weekly hours worked and she takes the shift, obviously it will be overtime.

My daughter is a nurse at the hospital in Lethbridge. When she is visiting us, her phone never stops beeping with offers of shifts that need to be filled. I'd say that it is a least 3-5 times an hour that she is offered a shift. WTF?

She's 25 and is stressed. Her ward is stroke and acute medicine. To say people go there to die is pretty accurate.

Sound like a great reason why AHS needs to be dismantled and the system rebuilt and nurses should be on a 40 hour work week with zero overtime.

[Scott h]

Originally Posted by Trochu

Sound like a great reason why AHS needs to be dismantled and the system rebuilt and nurses should be on a 40 hour work week with zero overtime.

Now that DS has won her election she should hold a press conference and announce that very plan.

[Fisherdan]

Originally Posted by AB2506

Guys, the system does strange things that drive up costs for little gain.

For example: A 97 year old patient is in rapidly declining health as observed by the nurses. The patient has advanced CPOD and has developed heart arrhythmia. The doctor decides to install a pacemaker. On a severely ill 97 year old? The procedure alone could kill the patient.

I don't believe in euthanasia, but at what point does the system say that the patient is 97 with severe irreversible health conditions and nothing further should be done. That pacemaker will not allow the patient to have a significantly extended life span. IIRC, the patient passed away 2 months later without having been discharged from the hospital. What did the patient gain? What did the health care system gain?

For example: A 94 year old patient is on life support, their organs are shutting down. The doctor advises the family that the patient does not have the will to thrive, they are no longer fighting to get better. The family refuses to take off life support. Why? Because dad really wanted to make 95. Dad is gone (according to the doctor), he won't know or care if he reaches 95. I know it is had to take your loved one off life support, (we did it in 2008 when my mother-in-law stopped fighting her respiratory infection and her organs were starting to fail), but we have to be realistic about their prognosis and stop being selfish. It's not about the survivors, it's about what's best for the patient.

How much money is spent transporting patients from centers like Lethbridge to Edmonton or Calgary for advanced diagnostics and specialty units? It's got to be a huge number. Maybe centers like Lethbridge, Medicine Hat, Red Deer, Grand Prairie, Fort McMurray need some of these specialists? Would it save money?

Seniors homes need more beds and also more review. How many patients are in the hospital, too sick to go home, not sick enough to remain in the hospital, but there are no beds in a senior home for them. It costs way more for that patient to remain in the hospital, than in a senior home. Regarding senior home review. There are homes that send a resident to hospital for symptoms that they are capable of caring for themselves. This should not happen.

One final thing. Covid 19 hung a licking on the health care system that I don't think it has fully overcome yet. If nothing else, the money that was spent on Covid 19 is HUUUGE. (I'm not debating whether Covid 19 is real or not. Regardless of one's opinion of Covid 19, billions were spent on treatment and the "vaccines". That is a huge drain on the system's budget and employees.)

As for the NDP, if they had been power, there is a good chance we'd still be in a Covid lockdown.

In your daughter’s opinion, what key things need to change?

I think you are right about Covid. We are still suffering from a huge hangover from that. I heard that trying to catch up with all the delayed surgeries is taking resources away from front line emergency services.

[FortMac]

Originally Posted by AB2506

You're dreaming in technicolor. Most nurses are on a defined work week. However, due to illness, vacation, etc, the wards are seldom fully staffed and there comes a time where the managers have to fill the holes to make sure the patients are properly looked after. So, if a nurse has worked their weekly hours, and the staffing persons have run through the staffing list and there are no takers and the call goes to the nurse who has her weekly hours worked and she takes the shift, obviously it will be overtime.

My daughter is a nurse at the hospital in Lethbridge. When she is visiting us, her phone never stops beeping with offers of shifts that need to be filled. I'd say that it is a least 3-5 times an hour that she is offered a shift. WTF?

She's 25 and is stressed. Her ward is stroke and acute medicine. To say people go there to die is pretty accurate.

Yeah, I have also heard the more senior nurses go on part time hours, then when they are called in on their "time off" it's paid at Overtime rate even tho they havnt reached 40 hours for the week.

There should be 4, 8 hour shifts a day at all major hospitals, 5 days a week. No Overtime. Anyone that can visit a walk-in clinic is turned away at the desk during regular hours.

[KegRiver]

I doubt that an overhaul of AHS will solve the biggest issue we have in the healthcare system at the moment.

That is, lack of trust in government by health professionals.

After what the government did to those people I am not at all surprised that we have staff shortages.

I know that here several of our nurses left the profession after they were threatened with getting fired for not getting vaccinated.

One of our doctors was given his termination notice for the same reason.
He along with four other doctors sued the government and won.

His termination was rescinded as a result but he lost his clinic privileges in retaliation.

The level of disrespect shown for our doctors and nurses at the height of the pandemic was astounding.
No wonder so many left the profession or the province looking for better treatment.

I realize the government denies this and many people believe them, but I know for fact it happened.

It is why, for the first time in the history of this town our emergency department was closed for several days due to the lack of staff to run it.

Imagine that, no emergency department to deal with car accidents, heart attacks and other bonafide health emergencies.

This is not a minor problem, this is an unmitigated disaster of biblical proportions and there is only once cure.

A total overhaul of government that gives the power back to the people where it rightly belongs.

[Talking moose]

Originally Posted by KegRiver

I doubt that an overhaul of AHS will solve the biggest issue we have in the healthcare system at the moment.

That is, lack of trust in government by health professionals.

After what the government did to those people I am not at all surprised that we have staff shortages.

I know that here several of our nurses left the profession after they were threatened with getting fired for not getting vaccinated.

One of our doctors was given his termination notice for the same reason.
He along with four other doctors sued the government and won.

His termination was rescinded as a result but he lost his clinic privileges in retaliation.

The level of disrespect shown for our doctors and nurses at the height of the pandemic was astounding.
No wonder so many left the profession or the province looking for better treatment.

I realize the government denies this and many people believe them, but I know for fact it happened.

It is why, for the first time in the history of this town our emergency department was closed for several days due to the lack of staff to run it.

Imagine that, no emergency department to deal with car accidents, heart attacks and other bonafide health emergencies.

This is not a minor problem, this is an unmitigated disaster of biblical proportions and there is only once cure.

A total overhaul of government that gives the power back to the people where it rightly belongs.

Hear Hear!!!!!!

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by KegRiver

I doubt that an overhaul of AHS will solve the biggest issue we have in the healthcare system at the moment.

That is, lack of trust in government by health professionals.

After what the government did to those people I am not at all surprised that we have staff shortages.

I know that here several of our nurses left the profession after they were threatened with getting fired for not getting vaccinated.

One of our doctors was given his termination notice for the same reason.
He along with four other doctors sued the government and won.

His termination was rescinded as a result but he lost his clinic privileges in retaliation.

The level of disrespect shown for our doctors and nurses at the height of the pandemic was astounding.
No wonder so many left the profession or the province looking for better treatment.

I realize the government denies this and many people believe them, but I know for fact it happened.

It is why, for the first time in the history of this town our emergency department was closed for several days due to the lack of staff to run it.

Imagine that, no emergency department to deal with car accidents, heart attacks and other bonafide health emergencies.

This is not a minor problem, this is an unmitigated disaster of biblical proportions and there is only once cure.

A total overhaul of government that gives the power back to the people where it rightly belongs.

Maybe although it seems more likely that health professionals were so overcome by the work load over Covid… no holidays… essentially forced overtime to help fellow workers that they are just fed up.

Work load hasn’t improved.

Hospitals were slammed and it wasn’t a workers paradise.

[Redhorse Ranch]

Originally Posted by FortMac

Yeah, I have also heard the more senior nurses go on part time hours, then when they are called in on their "time off" it's paid at Overtime rate even tho they havnt reached 40 hours for the week.

Not quite true; the managers do their best to fill shifts at regular time, before offering overtime. Mostly they do, at our hospital.

If a nurse is mandated to work on a "slash day off" they must pay OT. Each nurse has 2 scheduled days off per week, same as any other. If a nurse accepts a shift on a day which is not a scheduled off day, they pay straight time.

The staffing shortages being experienced right now are a direct result of the covid mandates.