Top Cop Gently Making Armed Self Defense Suggestion?

[hillbillyreefer]

Shock may have prevented friends from intervening in stabbing: Chief Hanson


BY EVA FERGUSON, CALGARY HERALD APRIL 16, 2014


Calgary Police Chief Rick Hanson speaks to members of the media about the murder of five people at a house party on Butler Crescent NW in Calgary on April 15, 2014.
Photograph by: Leah Hennel , Calgary Herald
A group of 20 young adults might have been too shocked or too fearful to intervene during a horrific stabbing that killed five people early Tuesday, said the city’s police chief.

“These kids were all just out of school, having fun at this party, and completely not expecting anything like this to happen,” said Chief Rick Hanson.

“Some might have wanted to intervene, but others might have been too shocked, and others might have just wanted to leave.

“It’s not always easy to disarm someone who has a weapon, when you don’t have one yourself.”

Hanson said police are continuing to interview and re-interview the 20 people that were at the party at the time of the stabbing in the early morning hours of Tuesday.

Hanson stressed that he understands the community is asking questions, as they should, about why and how something so horrific could happen.

“And I know at some point we will have those answers.”

Beyond interviewing witnesses, police are looking into the details of the whereabouts of the man accused in the killing in the hours leading up to the crime, including his time at work and his state of mind. The man accused of the first-degree murders attended the party that evening as an invited guest.

“We need to know everything that happened leading up to this to help us understand what actually happened.”

Hanson confirmed that the police know the accused arrived at the party some time after his shift Monday at a northwest grocery store.

“In fact he arrived at the party wearing his smock ....”

It’s alleged the accused also brought a box cutter to the home, though Hanson would not say whether a box cutter was used in the crime.

“He arrived and then just visited with people.”

It’s still not clear what led to the fatal incident that was called in as a stabbing in progress at about 1:20 a.m.

For more information on the accused’s state of mind, police are also combing through his belongings and his online activity.

“We are looking through all of this computers, all of his cellphones, his electronic devices, anything that is relevant. We will go anywhere we need to investigate and gather evidence.”

Hanson asked the families of those 20 kids that were at the party to seek out any psychological help they need through the police’s victim assistance unit or Alberta Health.

“I wish I had this pearl of wisdom to impart to parents that would guarantee that this would never happen again. But I don’t and I can’t.

“These were good kids, in a safe place, but then suddenly this happened.”


I'd like to have a beer with the Chief. Of all the cop interviews I've ever read this guy makes the most sense. At least he isn't clamouring for a knife ban like the dip****s in Saskatoon and Edmonton.

[243 wild cat]

Originally Posted by hillbillyreefer

Shock may have prevented friends from intervening in stabbing: Chief Hanson


BY EVA FERGUSON, CALGARY HERALD APRIL 16, 2014


Calgary Police Chief Rick Hanson speaks to members of the media about the murder of five people at a house party on Butler Crescent NW in Calgary on April 15, 2014.
Photograph by: Leah Hennel , Calgary Herald
A group of 20 young adults might have been too shocked or too fearful to intervene during a horrific stabbing that killed five people early Tuesday, said the city’s police chief.

“These kids were all just out of school, having fun at this party, and completely not expecting anything like this to happen,” said Chief Rick Hanson.

“Some might have wanted to intervene, but others might have been too shocked, and others might have just wanted to leave.

“It’s not always easy to disarm someone who has a weapon, when you don’t have one yourself.”

Hanson said police are continuing to interview and re-interview the 20 people that were at the party at the time of the stabbing in the early morning hours of Tuesday.

Hanson stressed that he understands the community is asking questions, as they should, about why and how something so horrific could happen.

“And I know at some point we will have those answers.”

Beyond interviewing witnesses, police are looking into the details of the whereabouts of the man accused in the killing in the hours leading up to the crime, including his time at work and his state of mind. The man accused of the first-degree murders attended the party that evening as an invited guest.

“We need to know everything that happened leading up to this to help us understand what actually happened.”

Hanson confirmed that the police know the accused arrived at the party some time after his shift Monday at a northwest grocery store.

“In fact he arrived at the party wearing his smock ....”

It’s alleged the accused also brought a box cutter to the home, though Hanson would not say whether a box cutter was used in the crime.

“He arrived and then just visited with people.”

It’s still not clear what led to the fatal incident that was called in as a stabbing in progress at about 1:20 a.m.

For more information on the accused’s state of mind, police are also combing through his belongings and his online activity.

“We are looking through all of this computers, all of his cellphones, his electronic devices, anything that is relevant. We will go anywhere we need to investigate and gather evidence.”

Hanson asked the families of those 20 kids that were at the party to seek out any psychological help they need through the police’s victim assistance unit or Alberta Health.

“I wish I had this pearl of wisdom to impart to parents that would guarantee that this would never happen again. But I don’t and I can’t.

“These were good kids, in a safe place, but then suddenly this happened.”


I'd like to have a beer with the Chief. Of all the cop interviews I've ever read this guy makes the most sense. At least he isn't clamouring for a knife ban like the dip****s in Saskatoon and Edmonton.

Sad times for sure. Sounds like the Chief may have actually came up with a speech from the heart good for him. Not like incompetent dip s*#%@ from Saskatoon / Edmonton that have no human concept of what may have been the problem. KNIFE BAN!!! How does this CRAP! come out of there mouth!

[connexion123]

Really it is the truth. We have been hobbled in this nation. Carrying a tazer or pepper spray may have helped. If one was getting stabbed he/she may have still died but when the pepper sprayed knife wielding person was screaming about his eyes it could have brought more attention to the situation. Maybe 1 or 2 instead of 5.

Either way, there are reasonable less lethal and lethal options out there that the liberal government of pet said we're too evil to have. A shame really.

All of this proves calling 911 does nothing to save a life. Kudos to our police but when seconds count they are minutes away.

[elkdump]

it will get worse ! far worse!

a society that copes with bullying from a very early age by calling a friend, texting, going online to report a bullying incident is quickly turning into a nation of defenseless jellyfish,
basic pacifism from Birth will keep you safe !!,,, good luck with that !

simply put ? a healthy average 20 year old male Canadian civilian is about as helpless as a 2 year old when push comes to shove,,

[rugatika]

He'll be getting his peepee slapped for that one at the next chief's meeting.

[Unregistered user]

Anyone who thinks gun ownership in Canada is guaranteed better heed the calls for knife bans.

[therookie]

Originally Posted by rugatika

He'll be getting his peepee slapped for that one at the next chief's meeting.

Not a chance...

[Big Daddy Badger]

Originally Posted by hillbillyreefer

Shock may have prevented friends from intervening in stabbing: Chief Hanson


BY EVA FERGUSON, CALGARY HERALD APRIL 16, 2014


Calgary Police Chief Rick Hanson speaks to members of the media about the murder of five people at a house party on Butler Crescent NW in Calgary on April 15, 2014.
Photograph by: Leah Hennel , Calgary Herald
A group of 20 young adults might have been too shocked or too fearful to intervene during a horrific stabbing that killed five people early Tuesday, said the city’s police chief.

“These kids were all just out of school, having fun at this party, and completely not expecting anything like this to happen,” said Chief Rick Hanson.

“Some might have wanted to intervene, but others might have been too shocked, and others might have just wanted to leave.

“It’s not always easy to disarm someone who has a weapon, when you don’t have one yourself.”

Hanson said police are continuing to interview and re-interview the 20 people that were at the party at the time of the stabbing in the early morning hours of Tuesday.

Hanson stressed that he understands the community is asking questions, as they should, about why and how something so horrific could happen.

“And I know at some point we will have those answers.”

Beyond interviewing witnesses, police are looking into the details of the whereabouts of the man accused in the killing in the hours leading up to the crime, including his time at work and his state of mind. The man accused of the first-degree murders attended the party that evening as an invited guest.

“We need to know everything that happened leading up to this to help us understand what actually happened.”

Hanson confirmed that the police know the accused arrived at the party some time after his shift Monday at a northwest grocery store.

“In fact he arrived at the party wearing his smock ....”

It’s alleged the accused also brought a box cutter to the home, though Hanson would not say whether a box cutter was used in the crime.

“He arrived and then just visited with people.”

It’s still not clear what led to the fatal incident that was called in as a stabbing in progress at about 1:20 a.m.

For more information on the accused’s state of mind, police are also combing through his belongings and his online activity.

“We are looking through all of this computers, all of his cellphones, his electronic devices, anything that is relevant. We will go anywhere we need to investigate and gather evidence.”

Hanson asked the families of those 20 kids that were at the party to seek out any psychological help they need through the police’s victim assistance unit or Alberta Health.

“I wish I had this pearl of wisdom to impart to parents that would guarantee that this would never happen again. But I don’t and I can’t.

“These were good kids, in a safe place, but then suddenly this happened.”


I'd like to have a beer with the Chief. Of all the cop interviews I've ever read this guy makes the most sense. At least he isn't clamouring for a knife ban like the dip****s in Saskatoon and Edmonton.

Naw... I think he was just stating the obvious... it is hard to disarm someone and even more so if you are not armed ...preferably with a superior weapon.

I think he was just trying to help folks understand how it is that one guy with a knife could do so much damage in the face of ordinarily overwhelming odds.

[Jimboy]

Originally Posted by hillbillyreefer

Shock may have prevented friends from intervening in stabbing: Chief Hanson


BY EVA FERGUSON, CALGARY HERALD APRIL 16, 2014


Calgary Police Chief Rick Hanson speaks to members of the media about the murder of five people at a house party on Butler Crescent NW in Calgary on April 15, 2014.
Photograph by: Leah Hennel , Calgary Herald
A group of 20 young adults might have been too shocked or too fearful to intervene during a horrific stabbing that killed five people early Tuesday, said the city’s police chief.

“These kids were all just out of school, having fun at this party, and completely not expecting anything like this to happen,” said Chief Rick Hanson.

“Some might have wanted to intervene, but others might have been too shocked, and others might have just wanted to leave.

“It’s not always easy to disarm someone who has a weapon, when you don’t have one yourself.”

Hanson said police are continuing to interview and re-interview the 20 people that were at the party at the time of the stabbing in the early morning hours of Tuesday.

Hanson stressed that he understands the community is asking questions, as they should, about why and how something so horrific could happen.

“And I know at some point we will have those answers.”

Beyond interviewing witnesses, police are looking into the details of the whereabouts of the man accused in the killing in the hours leading up to the crime, including his time at work and his state of mind. The man accused of the first-degree murders attended the party that evening as an invited guest.

“We need to know everything that happened leading up to this to help us understand what actually happened.”

Hanson confirmed that the police know the accused arrived at the party some time after his shift Monday at a northwest grocery store.

“In fact he arrived at the party wearing his smock ....”

It’s alleged the accused also brought a box cutter to the home, though Hanson would not say whether a box cutter was used in the crime.

“He arrived and then just visited with people.”

It’s still not clear what led to the fatal incident that was called in as a stabbing in progress at about 1:20 a.m.

For more information on the accused’s state of mind, police are also combing through his belongings and his online activity.

“We are looking through all of this computers, all of his cellphones, his electronic devices, anything that is relevant. We will go anywhere we need to investigate and gather evidence.”

Hanson asked the families of those 20 kids that were at the party to seek out any psychological help they need through the police’s victim assistance unit or Alberta Health.

“I wish I had this pearl of wisdom to impart to parents that would guarantee that this would never happen again. But I don’t and I can’t.

“These were good kids, in a safe place, but then suddenly this happened.”


I'd like to have a beer with the Chief. Of all the cop interviews I've ever read this guy makes the most sense. At least he isn't clamouring for a knife ban like the dip****s in Saskatoon and Edmonton.

KIDS? they were all over 20,23/24

[hillbillyreefer]

I think the media chose to use the words youths and kids to give a bit more sensationalism to the story. Pathetic, this story doesn't need any more sensationalizing.

Gust I'd ask you point out where I said anything about using firearms or anything else for self defense in this thread.(edit: I guess you won't be replying) In fact I went ahead and found actual police training videos showing how useless a firearm is in a knife attack situation. I backed up what Huntinstuff said earlier.

[huntinstuff]

I used an electric Taser knife to "kill" 8 policemen in 6 seconds in a training scenario.

I know first hand how fast it can happen.

Ive seen guys stabbed that thought they had been punched or slapped only to realize they are bleeding out.

One Somalian kid was sitting on a couch with his guts hanging out, telling me that a guy punched him. I said it must have been one f$@& of a punch because your intestine is on your knee.

He lived. Crapped in a bag for months but lived

[Big Daddy Badger]

Originally Posted by huntinstuff

I used an electric Taser knife to "kill" 8 policemen in 6 seconds in a training scenario.

I know first hand how fast it can happen.

Ive seen guys stabbed that thought they had been punched or slapped only to realize they are bleeding out.

One Somalian kid was sitting on a couch with his guts hanging out, telling me that a guy punched him. I said it must have been one f$@& of a punch because I think your intestine is on your knee.

He lived. Crapped in a bag for months but lived

Bingo.

Knife fights are short fast and bloody.

We trained with magic markers so only tip contacts left a mark but that was enough to leave a lasting impression.
A guy can do a lot of damage in a very short period of time with a knife.

[Morbius131]

This is absolutely disgusting that people would sit there and do nothing. With that said, fear, shock and disbelief are very powerful controls of behaviour.

I have also seen demonstrations on how quickly someone with a knife can kill or seriously harm numerous victims so I can understand that it was likely over before most people realized.

Tough to judge without being there but I would hope I would do what I think I would have.

Morb

[Trev]

You won't always be able to protect yourself from these senseless acts all the time, no matter what you are carrying

[rem338win]

Originally Posted by Trout Man 82

I have trained a lot in edged weapon defense, both empty hand and with edged weapons, stick/baton, improvised weapons. This included a lot of study into what kinds of attacks can be the most fatal. It is true that the majority of knife attacks require many stabs to kill someone assuming that person can get professional help relatively quickly. It can take dozens of slashes to the center of mass to kill someone.

I don't intend to get on the Interwebz and start telling people I think I am a ninja, but your study seems to lack a bit I definition. First, you just casually used stabbing and slashing in your statement as if they are synonymous and for at least 4000 years now we know that they are not. A few professional soldier eons ago found that stabbing was ridiculously more effective at killing than slashing.
Secondly, with a blade the size of a kitchen knife one solid to the upper abdomen or chest will result in death in a few minutes tops untreated the gross majority of the time. If this was untrue, I wouldn't archery hunt anymore.
And the MAJORITY of knife attacks do result in multiple wounds because of the speed at which they can be delivered effectively. Pretty hard to gather relative evidence when the other side of the teeter-taughter is so desperately unbalanced.

For goodness sake folks, just stop armchairing the other folks in attendance at this party. The person that did this obviously had intent when he arrived given what we know. Maybe someone smart enough to get accepted to law school knows how to look up anatomy and how to use a knife. We get the impression things did happen fast, and unless you are prepped to deal with some thing like this all of the time good luck going Captain America on the spot. Hope for all your sakes your short sighted theory of self reflection is never tested.

[raab]

Originally Posted by rem338win

I don't intend to get on the Interwebz and start telling people I think I am a ninja, but your study seems to lack a bit I definition. First, you just casually used stabbing and slashing in your statement as if they are synonymous and for at least 4000 years now we know that they are not. A few professional soldier eons ago found that stabbing was ridiculously more effective at killing than slashing.
Secondly, with a blade the size of a kitchen knife one solid to the upper abdomen or chest will result in death in a few minutes tops untreated the gross majority of the time. If this was untrue, I wouldn't archery hunt anymore.
And the MAJORITY of knife attacks do result in multiple wounds because of the speed at which they can be delivered effectively. Pretty hard to gather relative evidence when the other side of the teeter-taughter is so desperately unbalanced.

For goodness sake folks, just stop armchairing the other folks in attendance at this party. The person that did this obviously had intent when he arrived given what we know. Maybe someone smart enough to get accepted to law school knows how to look up anatomy and how to use a knife. We get the impression things did happen fast, and unless you are prepped to deal with some thing like this all of the time good luck going Captain America on the spot. Hope for all your sakes your short sighted theory of self reflection is never tested.

I don't think myself or trout man are saying anything regarding whether the kids should or shouldn't have done something. I think its just that were trying to explain the amount of time this must of took. I don't want anyone thinking I'm saying these kids should have reacted and didn't. Because for all the public knows they did react when they realized what was going on and made the suspect flee.

But in saying that we shouldn't be saying this was a 10 second stabbing that left 5 dead by an untrained teenager with a large cumbersome knife. And if he did indeed stab them in the chest unless it was perfectly placed and he hit the heart or aorta that stab wound would have been survivable for the 10-15 minutes it takes for EMS to get on scene, same with the upper abdomen unless he hits the aorta its survivable if managed fairly quickly. The fact that all 5 died from their wounds, to me anyways, means the suspect took more time to ensure that he inflicted fatal wounds to all the victims. Instead of the alternative which would be sporadically stabbing anyone in close proximity.

[Trout Man 82]

Originally Posted by rem338win

I don't intend to get on the Interwebz and start telling people I think I am a ninja, but your study seems to lack a bit I definition. First, you just casually used stabbing and slashing in your statement as if they are synonymous and for at least 4000 years now we know that they are not. A few professional soldier eons ago found that stabbing was ridiculously more effective at killing than slashing.
Secondly, with a blade the size of a kitchen knife one solid to the upper abdomen or chest will result in death in a few minutes tops untreated the gross majority of the time. If this was untrue, I wouldn't archery hunt anymore.
And the MAJORITY of knife attacks do result in multiple wounds because of the speed at which they can be delivered effectively. Pretty hard to gather relative evidence when the other side of the teeter-taughter is so desperately unbalanced.

For goodness sake folks, just stop armchairing the other folks in attendance at this party. The person that did this obviously had intent when he arrived given what we know. Maybe someone smart enough to get accepted to law school knows how to look up anatomy and how to use a knife. We get the impression things did happen fast, and unless you are prepped to deal with some thing like this all of the time good luck going Captain America on the spot. Hope for all your sakes your short sighted theory of self reflection is never tested.

I am very aware of the difference between stabbing and slashing, I only brought it up as a second thought.

Most kitchen knives are slashing weapons (if used as a weapon), it is much easier to penetrate bone/get past ribs with something like an arrow then something with significant width.

I am sure you are right about the professionals realising the difference as well, but most people are not professionals.

[uglyelk]

Sooner or later the ninja types show up in any thread that discusses violence! It was only a matter of time before we got the knife experts and baton twirlers. (no offence to guys who play with knives or rattan) We have had a host of Monday morning quarterbacks, guess you lads should give it a go too.

A friend of my son was invited to this shindig, the lad was kind of worn out and decided to just take his girlfriend for a tour of K Country and Banff on his way home to B.C. He skip the party and just went home to his family. I'm glad he did!

Disappointing to see young lives end abruptly.

I think the police officer and the soldier have made some pretty valid statements on this thread. Most responding on the thread have probably never experienced unexpected life threatening violence. It triggers some rather unusual hormonal responses. Lots of people go into denial, it's not really happening, some just become deer in the head lights. Most people that get stabbed never see the weapon. Initially they don't even realize they sprung a leak.

What did I learn from this incident....nothing...but it does tend to confirm that consuming debilitating substances in places were people go off might be a poor decision. Better to be at the top of your game if your hanging with the altered mind.

If you like to get out of your gourd with strangers you just might end as the next statistic.

[Big Daddy Badger]

Originally Posted by uglyelk

Sooner or later the ninja types show up in any thread that discusses violence! It was only a matter of time before we got the knife experts and baton twirlers. (no offence to guys who play with knives or rattan) We have had a host of Monday morning quarterbacks, guess you lads should give it a go too.

A friend of my son was invited to this shindig, the lad was kind of worn out and decided to just take his girlfriend for a tour of K Country and Banff on his way home to B.C. He skip the party and just went home to his family. I'm glad he did!

Disappointing to see young lives end abruptly.

I think the police officer and the soldier have made some pretty valid statements on this thread. Most responding on the thread have probably never experienced unexpected life threatening violence. It triggers some rather unusual hormonal responses. Lots of people go into denial, it's not really happening, some just become deer in the head lights. Most people that get stabbed never see the weapon. Initially they don't even realize they sprung a leak.

What did I learn from this incident....nothing...but it does tend to confirm that consuming debilitating substances in places were people go off might be a poor decision. Better to be at the top of your game if your hanging with the altered mind.

If you like to get out of your gourd with strangers you just might end as the next statistic.

That post deserves a slow clap....
Well done you!!