Scope ring tightness

[FlyFanatic]

I have a Sako A7 300WSM that I received as a package with the Burris E1 3-9X40. I had noticed that I had markings around scope next the rings suggesting that the scope was moving presumably due to the recoil of the rifle and perhaps insufficient rings.

I wanted to upgrade my scope and rings so I purchased a vortex 4-16X50 and put on vortex precision rings. The guy behind the counter at cabelas mounted it for me and I still noticed a mark on the scope on my first visit out to the range.

Should I buy/find a torque wrench and tighten them myself? how tight it too tight? I've read very conflicting things on the internet.

Thanks

[AndrewM]

Make sure you check the alignment. Maybe something is off.

[Cheyenne 1]

Yes all screws should be torqued.
Most tend to over tighten hardware causing damage to the scope tube.
Most ring makers have a recommended torque. I mostly use nightforce rings.
The recommend Ring top screws - 25 inch pounds. • Ring crossbolt nut - 68 inch pounds.

[Dubious]

Each scope manufacturer will have a different max amount. Swaro is 17 inch lbs check the scope user manual to get the correct number. You may want to buy a lapping kit as they come with a wrench and you will be able to lap your rings aswell.

[AndrewM]

Also check out Burris signature rings with the inserts. They won’t mark. The wheeler scope kit on amazon comes on sale for 115 with 1” and 30mm.

[Battle Rat]

Make sure the rings and scope are clean and free of any lube.
Torque it to 25" lbs then put a pencil mark on scope to see if it moves.
I've had hard kicking (45-70 guide gun with 40gr bullets) still move at that torque.
It could be the accuracy of my Fat Wrench, who knows if they are calibrated the same.
There is also likely some diameter variations between scopes and rings that could account for movement.

[covey ridge]

A Vortex rep told me that the rings should not be tightened more than 18 lbs and to do so might interfere with the internal mechanism inside the tube.

He also told me that reticle adjustment problems or tracking problems are often solved by reducing the amount tightened. They found this to often be the problem with scopes sent to them for warranty.

I followed those instructions on an A-7 7mm/08 and there has been no movement in 2 years. The rings were zee rings with those sticky inserts.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

A Vortex rep told me that the rings should not be tightened more than 18 psi and to do so might interfere with the internal mechanism inside the tube.

He also told me that reticle adjustment problems or tracking problems are often solved by reducing the psi. They found this to often be the problem with scopes sent to them for warranty.

I followed those instructions on an A-7 7mm/08 and there has been no movement in 2 years. The rings were zee rings with those sticky inserts.

Rings are torqued to in lbs, not psi.

I have found that it also depends on where the ring sits on the scope tube, right next to the magnification ring can make the ring difficult to turn, and right next to the turrets can cause the adjustment to not move properly.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Rings are torqued to in lbs, not psi.

I have found that it also depends on where the ring sits on the scope tube, right next to the magnification ring can make the ring difficult to turn, and right next to the turrets can cause the adjustment to not move properly.

You are correct as usual and I have edited my post. My fingers do not always type what my mind is thinking. One of the Vortex reps claimed that many scopes that their warrant department deals with, the only problem was over tightening.

[ayman76]

No the correct torque for the rings are 20 in/lb and the ring bases 60 in/lb ... speaking about scope alignment , that's where any x-lock comes as the king because you can't go wrong with he x-lock rings . I have a browning x-bolt stainless stalker with x-lock , the moment I mounted my scope on it using x-lock rings it was on dead center.


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[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by ayman76

No the correct torque for the rings are 20 in/lb and the ring bases 60 in/lb ... speaking about scope alignment , that's where any x-lock comes as the king because you can't go wrong with he x-lock rings . I have a browning x-bolt stainless stalker with x-lock , the moment I mounted my scope on it using x-lock rings it was on dead center.


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Good luck getting #6-48 or even #8-40 base screws to 60 in lbs without breaking them.

[petew]

More important than any torque number is the sequence of tightening, and the number of steps coming to full torque / tightness and a good fitting screw driver / or Allen key.

I have never used a torque wrench / driver in probably 50 years,on scopes and rings and never broke a screw putting it in, never had a scope move. My favorite ring is the Weaver, they seem to work well. Typicaly a drop of glue goes on the thread, sometimes it was clear nail polish, sometimes plastic cement, sometimes fletching glue, sometimes removable Loctite , but always something was used on the threads.

Years ago we learned what snug tight meant and there was a difference in an 8/32 screw and a 3/4" bolt.

[JCP]

Get a ring lapping kit and do it right. Lapped rings will hold tighter at less torque than non-lapped at the same torque. I torque my rings to 18in/lbs and my bases to 25in/lbs.

P.S. I have NEVER found a set of rings that weren't out of alignment and I've mounted a ton of scopes.

I recommend the Kokopelli kit. http://www.kokopelliproducts.com/

[YoteStopper]

Originally Posted by JCP

Get a ring lapping kit and do it right. Lapped rings will hold tighter at less torque than non-lapped at the same torque. I torque my rings to 18in/lbs and my bases to 25in/lbs.

P.S. I have NEVER found a set of rings that weren't out of alignment and I've mounted a ton of scopes.

I recommend the Kokopelli kit. http://www.kokopelliproducts.com/

Depending on what you are using for a base....have several rifles set up with a NF 1 piece rail and ATRS rings, they have not moved since mounted and no lapping required.

[YoteStopper]

Originally Posted by AndrewM

Also check out Burris signature rings with the inserts. They won’t mark. The wheeler scope kit on amazon comes on sale for 115 with 1” and 30mm.

I had a pair or two of the 30mm ones, didn't like them. The 4 screw arrangement was tough to tighten equally and one screw or another would work itself loose eventually. Switched to ATRS rings and although their spendy they hold tight and are of top quality.

[JCP]

Originally Posted by YoteStopper

Depending on what you are using for a base....have several rifles set up with a NF 1 piece rail and ATRS rings, they have not moved since mounted and no lapping required.

Have you put precision machined alignment bars into those rings to check them? You may be surprised.

[YoteStopper]

Originally Posted by JCP

Have you put precision machined alignment bars into those rings to check them? You may be surprised.

No, I haven't. But when I torque the cross bolts, drop in the scope and torque the cap screws...that scope isn't moving until I say so.

[JCP]

Originally Posted by YoteStopper

No, I haven't. But when I torque the cross bolts, drop in the scope and torque the cap screws...that scope isn't moving until I say so.

I get that. Just for the record, I've had many ring/base combo's that were very close and would never move once torqued, but they were miss-aligned none the less. Ring marks are a sure sign when taking the scope off when previously mounted. Lapping isn't needed for "most", but I like to do things the best I can.

[ayman76]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Good luck getting #6-48 or even #8-40 base screws to 60 in lbs without breaking them.

My apology I ment 40-45 in/lb on the ring bases screw and 20 in/lb on the rings screws


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[qwert]

Originally Posted by ayman76

My apology I ment 40-45 in/lb on the ring bases screw and 20 in/lb on the rings screws

IMHO, Elk11 is still correct, (and you are mistaken).

I torque TOP QUALITY base screws into a steel receiver,
with CLEAN threads (NO oil), well LUBRICATED with PURPLE Locktite.

#8x40 screws to 28 in/lbs
#6x48 screws to 18 in/lbs

Ring screws are very quality and material dependent,
rings should be torqued to manufacturer's spec, ('even' is more important than 'tight').

I prefer a classic beam type torque wrench for its clear indication of torque applied while the screw is still moving,
(torque specs are for a MOVING thread). I tighten in several stages, then back-off and tighten again as required.

Good Luck, YMMV.

[ayman76]

Originally Posted by qwert

IMHO, Elk11 is still correct, (and you are mistaken).



I torque TOP QUALITY base screws into a steel receiver,

with CLEAN threads (NO oil), well LUBRICATED with PURPLE Locktite.



#8x40 screws to 28 in/lbs

#6x48 screws to 18 in/lbs



Ring screws are very quality and material dependent,

rings should be torqued to manufacturer's spec, ('even' is more important than 'tight').



I prefer a classic beam type torque wrench for its clear indication of torque applied while the screw is still moving,

(torque specs are for a MOVING thread). I tighten in several stages, then back-off and tighten again as required.



Good Luck, YMMV.

I sent a feedback to Browning company as I have the x-bolt stainless stalker and the browning x-lock scope rings and bases and I asked them to what torque setting should I set my wheeler driver on to mount the rings and the factory recommended the settings I was talking about so perhaps me and you don't know much more than the Factory who manufactured thousands of firearms before and they know how much stress the bolts threads or the tapped holes can take till they get stripped so wrapping up I say thanks for your input though and i will have to go based on what the browning Factory recommended for my x-bolt rifle .

Cheers


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[Dubious]

Please read the user manual that came with your scope and rings it will give the amount to torque your scope and based to the rifle. most scope rings are 15-18 inch lbs to the scope the base to the receiver can varry by models some tally mounts are 18-20 some are 30 you have to read the book that came with your equipment.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by ayman76

I sent a feedback to Browning company as I have the x-bolt stainless stalker and the browning x-lock scope rings and bases and I asked them to what torque setting should I set my wheeler driver on to mount the rings and the factory recommended the settings I was talking about so perhaps me and you don't know much more than the Factory who manufactured thousands of firearms before and they know how much stress the bolts threads or the tapped holes can take till they get stripped so wrapping up I say thanks for your input though and i will have to go based on what the browning Factory recommended for my x-bolt rifle .

Cheers


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Browning does not manufacture the rings, they are Talley rings sold by Browning. As such, if you really wanted to contact the manufacturer, Talley would be the best choice. That aside, the proper torque is determined by the size of the screws, and the material that they are made of regardless of the rings or rifle they are used in. I for one would never attempt to torque those small screws to 40-45 inch pounds, but you do what you feel is best.

[DiabeticKripple]

always torque to manufacturers specs.

[stob]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Rings are torqued to in lbs, not psi.

I have found that it also depends on where the ring sits on the scope tube, right next to the magnification ring can make the ring difficult to turn, and right next to the turrets can cause the adjustment to not move properly.

OMG ... and i thought i needed a bigger compressor

[Nyksta]

Each ring manufacturer is different. Check what you have and do it as they advise.

[stob]

In the day you tightened them as equally as you could then you hit the driver with a mallet while the driver was under torque

[teledogs]

My Near Mfg. Alphamount rings are torqued to 17 in/lbs as specified by Near for a Zeiss Conquest HD5.