Regina Mass Burial Site

[nelsonob1]

They have discovered another, larger mass grave at a former reside tial school site. Being reported on CBC, CNN.

[Scott N]

Originally Posted by nelsonob1

They have discovered another, larger mass grave at a former reside tial school site. Being reported on CBC, CNN.

Mass grave or unmarked graves? Huge difference in my mind.

[Freedom55]

This is going to continue well into the decade. With all the monies being made available to pay for the searches and the number of these dungeons authorized by the white citizens of this nation these reports will be frequent and more heartbreaking. Do we need a new thread every time?

Free

[kingrat]

Says it was a communal grave from 1885 taken over by the residential school later so theres alot of adults buried there as well.

[WayneChristie]

Originally Posted by Scott N

Mass grave or unmarked graves? Huge difference in my mind.

this site is starting to sound like the CBC, whats with the hysterical BS titles?

[bessiedog]

Originally Posted by WayneChristie

this site is starting to sound like the CBC, whats with the hysterical BS titles?

What title would you have given it Wayne....?

[bat119]

There are lot's of unmarked graves everywhere not just residential schools

Shiloh church in Saskatchewan was a black community the graves were marked with large stones later during a cleanup the stones were removed by those not knowing why they were there. There is a group looking for funding to find the graves so they can be marked.

At the Regina jail executed prisoners were buried in what is now Wascana park the exact location remains unknown

https://kentondejong.com/blog/who-ar...n-wascana-park

Any old cemetery has graves that were only marked with wooden crosses long gone.

The real crime is those graves being undocumented every community cemetery has records and maps of who and where they are buried, are there records kept by the Catholic church?

[tirebob]

This is starting to feel like a subject that warrants another SuperThread. There will understandably be a lot of comings and goings regarding the residential schools and First Nations Peoples affairs for the foreseeable future and keeping it all under one roof and keeping the forums manageable and running clean is a good idea IMHO.

[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by bessiedog

What title would you have given it Wayne....?

Cemetery?

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by WayneChristie

this site is starting to sound like the CBC, whats with the hysterical BS titles?

That it is

[kingrat]

Weird they went to a known graveyard dating back to 1885 and found many bodies some even appear to be children.

[Ackleyman]

This is going to run like a prairie grass fire. I bet the guys that own the GPR companies have their phones ringing steady. A man should have compassion and i do to an extent , but when MILLIONS of $$ are involved it all turns into a Safeway without a checkout

[tirebob]

Originally Posted by bessiedog

What title would you have given it Wayne....?

Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette

Cemetery?

A cemetery implies burial organization and a place where ones can knowingly go and pay respects to known loved ones, and I think we can all agree that this is not what we are discussing here whether or not we all (speculatively) agree on what actually happened.

The fact is that these are absolutely the unmarked graves of peoples who were supposed to be in the care of a country that could and should of done everything possible to make certain they were cared for and treated with respect, alive or dead, while in said care and to anyone watching it appears to be anything but the case.

I think mass burial site is not inappropriate, at least at this point in time.

Originally Posted by WayneChristie

this site is starting to sound like the CBC, whats with the hysterical BS titles?

Originally Posted by MountainTi

Evil white people!

Sensationalism, whether eventually determined to justified or unjustified, is going to happen in the media. It's the media... We all know it. Does that mean we all have to sink to the same level and contribute to it just because we feel somehow put out?

Speculating and discussing the aspects of this terrible part of our Canadian story is absolutely normal and healthy, but it is a fine line where we can easily start being just as guilty of pre-determining what happened as the media is. How about we all attempt to do it with a bit of respect to each other and not get caught up flames of the fire which burns everybody when we get too close.

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by tirebob

A cemetery implies burial organization and a place where ones can knowingly go and pay respects to known loved ones, and I think we can all agree that this is not what we are discussing here whether or not we all (speculatively) agree on what actually happened.

The fact is that these are absolutely the unmarked graves of peoples who were supposed to be in the care of a country that could and should of done everything possible to make certain they were cared for and treated with respect, alive or dead, while in said care and to anyone watching it appears to be anything but the case.

I think mass burial site is not inappropriate, at least at this point in time.





Sensationalism, whether eventually determined to justified or unjustified, is going to happen in the media. It's the media... We all know it. Does that mean we all have to sink to the same level and contribute to it just because we feel somehow put out?

Speculating and discussing the aspects of this terrible part of our Canadian story is absolutely normal and healthy, but it is a fine line where we can easily start being just as guilty of pre-determining what happened as the media is. How about we all attempt to do it with a bit of respect to each other and not get caught up flames of the fire which burns everybody when we get too close.

If there are 2 sides, you've picked yours.
Interesting to see a post above seems to place the blame on "white citizens", and that is okay. Calling that comment out is not. Interesting times indeed

[tri777]

Food for thought:
If this thread were in the oven, it would be close to being fully cooked an well done..

[tirebob]

Originally Posted by MountainTi

If there are 2 sides, you've picked yours.
Interesting to see a post above seems to place the blame on "white citizens", and that is okay. Calling that comment out is not. Interesting times indeed

That's not what I am doing at all. I just realize people get heated with serious issues such as these and do not feel the need to attack at every possible moment and acknowledge that maybe reading into something in such a cut and dry fashion is possibly misdirected and unwarranted.
I think a big part of the problem is something you touched on... Stating there are "two sides and I picked one". The fact is there are a lot more than two sides on any issue that is so large scale such as this, and those sides blur and cross over each other in an incredibly large amount of areas. Whether one chooses to acknowledge and maybe view those areas from another angle is up to them however.

Again, I respect a persons right to their view. I am just trying to not add to culture of being intentionally inflammatory and hopefully open a new mind or two to allowing oneself to consider another viewpoint.

[Ken07AOVette]

Tirebob- In the prairies in 1800-1900 is there a chance that this is actually a cemetary that had sticks for grave markers? I have seen pictures of this, sometimes the odd rock or carved wooden headstone, not all 'cemetaries' were what we perceive them to be today.
Just asking.

You can bet though, with money being begged to be thrown by the PM and his ilk that there are going to be groups out digging up sites for the next few years.

[bessiedog]

Sorry
I kinda thought mass burial site was an attempt to not call it ‘mass grave’ cause it sorta connotes something different and it’s exactly the same as cemetery or place where some kinda possible ceremony internment happened ....

You google it and see if you see it different.

I’m thinkin we gots some knee-jerk opposition responses.

Wayne..? Guys...? Am I wrong?

And Mountain TI.... I don’t think Bob is’declaring sides’ or drawing lines in the sand’ here.

[tirebob]

Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette

Tirebob- In the prairies in 1800-1900 is there a chance that this is actually a cemetary that had sticks for grave markers? I have seen pictures of this, sometimes the odd rock or carved wooden headstone, not all 'cemetaries' were what we perceive them to be today.
Just asking.

You can bet though, with money being begged to be thrown by the PM and his ilk that there are going to be groups out digging up sites for the next few years.

Yeah I hear what you are saying Ken and there is no way I can emphatically say you are wrong on that, but I also don't think you are emphatically right either. That is why I am saying the title of Mass Burial Site is not wrong, inflammatory or inappropriate until such a time that one can emphatically say such a thing as calling it a cemetery. Just as being sensational about something can cause people to skew an opinion and potentially overblow a scenario, so can trying to make something sound gentler than maybe it is warrants and cause them to overlook something that needs genuine focus and attention.

I will say that I believe it is reasonable to assume the Church and government who was responsible for running these things would never have treated their own family, co-workers, fellow priests etc in the same way upon their deaths, so even if one assumes all those deaths were not due to some form of neglect or nefarious thing, I also do not think it unreasonable to have given these people who were in their care the same respect they would have extended to their own.

Edit - Bessie is hitting the nail on the head... Mass burial site is not the same as Mass Grave and I think that distinction is what is being misconstrued.

[sns2]

Originally Posted by tri777

Food for thought:
If this thread were in the oven, it would be close to being fully cooked an well done..

No disrespect intended, but this topic is going to dominate the news cycle for some time, so it is far from done. It's a forum. People will disagree. I see no personal insults, but some have strong opinions. That's life man. This ain't going to end, so let us members talk. We are grownups. If someone is a real dickwad and resorts to insults, infract them or give em a timeout, but don't lock the thread. Members understandably get very frustrated when things are closed down just because people don't see eye to eye. Make a super thread, and just call it Residential Schools Fallout, that way no one can say anything about tabloid titles. Combine the two threads, but if you guys lock this down all you are going to do is drive more people away. Sigh.

[Jerry D]

Guys can think what they want but 750 graves outside the edges of these schools is pretty disappointing.

The fact that these graves were even lost in the first place and not maintained goes to show the level of care the children received in my opinion.

As a young father with children in elementary school I can’t even begin to imagine sending my children to boarding school and only possibly receiving a letter that they passed away largely due to mistreatment and to never see them again.

[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by tirebob

Yeah I hear what you are saying Ken and there is no way I can emphatically say you are wrong on that, but I also don't think you are emphatically right either. That is why I am saying the title of Mass Burial Site is not wrong, inflammatory or inappropriate until such a time that one can emphatically say such a thing as calling it a cemetery. Just as being sensational about something can cause people to skew an opinion and potentially overblow a scenario, so can trying to make something sound gentler than maybe it is warrants and cause them to overlook something that needs genuine focus and attention.

I will say that I believe it is reasonable to assume the Church and government who was responsible for running these things would never have treated their own family, co-workers, fellow priests etc in the same way upon their deaths, so even if one assumes all those deaths were not due to some form of neglect or nefarious thing, I also do not think it unreasonable to have given these people who were in their care the same respect they would have extended to their own.

Edit - Bessie is hitting the nail on the head... Mass burial site is not the same as Mass Grave and I think that distinction is what is being misconstrued.

Agreed.
Unfortunately it makes news, makes headlines, and makes money.

Imagine 100 or 200 years from now when all the covid graves are found, hundreds of thousands of bodies pushed in to mass graves without a single marker.

There are so many empty heads screaming now about these sites, little blonde girls demanding heads for atrocities they know nothing about, but it gives them another soap box.

A worldwide EMP that targets the internet and text services only would solve so many problems.

[tirebob]

Originally Posted by sns2

No disrespect intended, but this topic is going to dominate the news cycle for some time, so it is far from done. It's a forum. People will disagree. I see no personal insults, but some have strong opinions. That's life man. This ain't going to end, so let us members talk. We are adults man. If someone is a real dickwad and resorts to insults, infract them or give em a timeout, but don't lock the thread. People get very frustrated when things are closed down just because people don't see eye to eye. Make a super thread, and just call it Residential Schools Fallout, that way no one can say anything about tabloid titles. Combine the two threads, but if you guys lock this down all you are going to do is drive more people away. Sigh.

100% agree discussion should not be cut off and definitely it is SuperThread warranted subject matter...

[tirebob]

Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette

Agreed.
Unfortunately it makes news, makes headlines, and makes money.

Imagine 100 or 200 years from now when all the covid graves are found, hundreds of thousands of bodies pushed in to mass graves without a single marker.

There are so many empty heads screaming now about these sites, little blonde girls demanding heads for atrocities they know nothing about, but it gives them another soap box.

A worldwide EMP that targets the internet and text services only would solve so many problems.

1,000,000%!!!

[nelsonob1]

Sorry for the distracting title. Mass = many. Burial = under the ground.

Mods feel free to change to " Reports of hundreds of potential bodies under the ground at site of former resdenti school. Cause of subteraneon location unknown."

Or something else that gets the knickers unwound.

[Phil McCracken]

I have a question on this...if this was discussed prior, and I missed it somehow, then please disregard.

Whenever a child passed on while in these schools, weren't the NOK (Next of kin) notified?

[jstubbs]

So we have another discovery of over 700 unmarked graves with no documentation or records kept on a residential school site and guys here are more concerned with arguing over the semantics of the proper nomenclatures to be used.

Reality is, children were forcibly taken from their loving families and communities, and thousands never made it back home. If those facts alone, without any further context (or sensationalism as some here would dub it) doesn’t make you sick to your stomach not sure what to say.

RIP to all.

[webster]

I am a Treaty Indian and members of my family have attended residential schools. To my knowledge they all returned however a good portion male and female were sexually assaulted and did suffer lifetime effects. I don't have any idea as to what the discovered burial grounds should be called.
I think we need to acknowledge that residential schools did happen and there are bodies of children. Sorrow needs to be expressed by all Canadians. Different First Nations may want the sorrow expressed in different ways. Some may want the bodies identified, left where they are at, others may want the bodies brought back and buried in their First Nation.
Lets recognize that residential schools did exist (many if not all schools now teach about residential schools). Get to know some First Nations culture perhaps by attending a powwow or other events. Likely most of you have friends that are members of First Nations if they want to talk about residential schools and other issues please listen.

[tirebob]

Originally Posted by Phil McCracken

I have a question on this...if this was discussed prior, and I missed it somehow, then please disregard.

Whenever a child passed on while in these schools, weren't the NOK (Next of kin) notified?

This is one of the things that there is no general answer to.

You would sure hope that they were, but history and experiences dictate that many kids ran away from the abuse they faced at the hands of their abusers running these residential schools never to be heard from again, and that leads to the understandable speculation that it is wholly possible that some of the people in charge that were the monsters perpetrating the abuses could have easily been reporting dead children as runaways. It does not take much of a leap of faith to think that someone capable of performing the many of the acts of abuse and neglect against children that they did could also be capable of something like this.

This is where the lack of forthcoming records from the churches and the government only fuels the thoughts further. It pretty much shows that they don't want what actually happened brought forth into the public eye or that they did not care to keep the records, both of which are a problem. That said, the Catholic Church is quite well known for keeping records going on a couple millennia and keeping them entirely private. Couple that with their record of child abuse I think it pretty understandable the jump to automatic public outrage. The trouble starts when the media glamours onto the outrage and starts using it to maneuver the public for their own profit and gain and it makes it hard for all people to stand back and objectively dissect and and digest how it all went down and avoid turning it into an entirely new version of the same old us against them situation.

With human nature being what it is, I honestly don't know if that can ever happen, but I sure hope it can! The one thing I know is it never well if we can't choose to try and understand each other from the other persons experiences and view.

[bat119]

The First Nation took over the school's cemetery from the Catholic Church in the 1970s.

Earlier this month Cowessess started using ground-penetrating radar to locate unmarked graves. It was not immediately clear if all the remains are connected to the residential school.

Cowessess Chief Cadmus Delorme spoke at a virtual news conference Thursday morning.

"This is not a mass grave site. These are unmarked graves," Delorme said.

Delorme said there may have at one point been markers for the graves. He said the Roman Catholic church, which oversaw the cemetery,may have removed markers at some point in the 1960s.

He said it was not immediately clear if all of the unmarked graves belonged to children, but that there were oral stories within Cowesses First Nation about both children and adults being there.

The church owes an explanation as why the markers were removed