Kvt - ndp

[bessiedog]

Ugh
I gotta stay outta these threads.
But really, I wouldn’t worry bout this guy.
There’s not a lot of love for Roger down here, but regardless….. you could run a ball of duct tape here for the dominant right wing party and it’d get elected.

Ranchers don’t think much of KVT
Neither do tourism folks…. Nor the forestry folks …… hunters n fishermen don’t care for him…..coal industry folks got no time for him…..

….. how is he a threat exactly..?

Ndp unelectable down here… simple as that

Rest east folks

Down here we’re conservationists… not preservationists

[roper1]

Bessie's got it. Cam Gardner ran for the NDP against Roger Reid last election. Cam former reeve of the MD, 4th generation rancher, very well known. I played a little beer league hockey on the same team with him years ago. UCP beat him like a rented mule.

KVT well-known for his dislike of cows & people in "his" wilderness. My wife accidentally bought me a book of his once, I read it to be fair then G-file.

[sns2]

Originally Posted by bessiedog

Ugh
I gotta stay outta these threads.
But really, I wouldn’t worry bout this guy.
There’s not a lot of love for Roger down here, but regardless….. you could run a ball of duct tape here for the dominant right wing party and it’d get elected.

Ranchers don’t think much of KVT
Neither do tourism folks…. Nor the forestry folks …… hunters n fishermen don’t care for him…..coal industry folks got no time for him…..

….. how is he a threat exactly..?

Ndp unelectable down here… simple as that

Rest east folks

Down here we’re conservationists… not preservationists

You are likely right. 50% difference in a rural riding is likely insurmountable.

But, make no mistake, this election is far far from anything resembling a slam dunk. I just did a finger count. Seems 55 of 87 seats are in Edmonton, Calgary (plus their bedroom communities), Red Deer, and Lethbridge. UCP will without doubt carry the rural ridings, but the urban ridings, Calgary in particular, will be where Albertans determine the next government.

[59whiskers]

Originally Posted by sns2

You are likely right. 50% difference in a rural riding is likely insurmountable.

But, make no mistake, this election is far far from anything resembling a slam dunk. I just did a finger count. Seems 55 of 87 seats are in Edmonton, Calgary (plus their bedroom communities), Red Deer, and Lethbridge. UCP will without doubt carry the rural ridings, but the urban ridings, Calgary in particular, will be where Albertans determine the next government.

Lethbridge West Riding has Shannon Philips NDP. The U of L elected her in with not much spread the year Notley won government. Lethbridge is no slam dunk for a UPC win in this riding.

[sns2]

Originally Posted by 59whiskers

Lethbridge West Riding has Shannon Philips NDP. The U of L elected her in with not much spread the year Notley won government. Lethbridge is no slam dunk for a UPC win in this riding.

All I said was 55 of 87 seats are urban. I am just glad KVT is not running in an urban riding because he would in all likelihood win. Look at the mayors Edmonton and Calgary elected.

Calgary will be where this election is won or lost.

I challenge anyone to convince me otherwise

[jstubbs]

Originally Posted by sns2

Calgary will be where this election is won or lost.

I challenge anyone to convince me otherwise

Of course. Why do you think the UCP continually favours Calgary over and over again?

[boah]

The conservatives has a bad one a few years back also.
Ted Morton.
He was pro “paid hunting”.
He’s out now though, so that’s a good thing
I hope KVT doesn’t get a single vote.

[trapperdodge]

Morton is an enthusiastic hunter and a supporter of the sport. He extended the pheasant season by 2 weeks to the end of October. He gave Alberta hunters more opportunities.

His proposal for lease land, similar to the Montana Block system was misunderstood and vigorously opposed by the AFGA. In the end Alberta hunters lost. Hunter access to grazing lease land could have been much improved but the opportunity was squandered.

[sns2]

Originally Posted by trapperdodge

Morton is an enthusiastic hunter and a supporter of the sport. He extended the pheasant season by 2 weeks to the end of October. He gave Alberta hunters more opportunities.

His proposal for lease land, similar to the Montana Block system was misunderstood and vigorously opposed by the AFGA. In the end Alberta hunters lost. Hunter access to grazing lease land could have been much improved but the opportunity was squandered.

Thank you for that post. I think many of us just learned something we likely never knew.

[roper1]

Originally Posted by trapperdodge

Morton is an enthusiastic hunter and a supporter of the sport. He extended the pheasant season by 2 weeks to the end of October. He gave Alberta hunters more opportunities.

His proposal for lease land, similar to the Montana Block system was misunderstood and vigorously opposed by the AFGA. In the end Alberta hunters lost. Hunter access to grazing lease land could have been much improved but the opportunity was squandered.

You are correct in one sense, someone was misunderstood...........The proposals I heard sounded way more like 'paid hunting' than the block system. A heck of a lot of my rancher buddies were rubbing their hands together.........so they misunderstood the Brinks truck as well.

[trapperdodge]

Have you hunted in Montana and utilized the Block system?

Yes, landowners get paid to allow hunters access. The system is sustained by hunters paying a small fee when they purchase their license. Landowners get paid when they submit their records proving they allowed hunting.

Morton's system may not have been perfect but the blow back from AFGA brought an instant end to a proposal that could have worked out to a compromise that hunters and leaseholders could live with. Morton was all about more hunter opportunity. Surely something could have been worked out. What we ended up with not satisfactory.

[fishnguy]

^ Why do leaseholders need to be paid for allowing me to access the lease?

Where can I read about this “Morton’s system”?

[Walleyedude]

Originally Posted by trapperdodge

Morton is an enthusiastic hunter and a supporter of the sport. He extended the pheasant season by 2 weeks to the end of October. He gave Alberta hunters more opportunities.

His proposal for lease land, similar to the Montana Block system was misunderstood and vigorously opposed by the AFGA. In the end Alberta hunters lost. Hunter access to grazing lease land could have been much improved but the opportunity was squandered.

Originally Posted by sns2

Thank you for that post. I think many of us just learned something we likely never knew.

There are two sides to this story.

PLEASE, do not take this post as being the whole truth, or even partial truth. Do some digging on this forum and ask around, talk to some of the same people you talked to about KVT, and form your own opinion. I think you’ll see this was anything but a “squandered opportunity” for the outdoorsmen of Alberta.

[fishnguy]

Originally Posted by fishnguy

^ Why do leaseholders need to be paid for allowing me to access the lease?

Where can I read about this “Morton’s system”?

Read what I think was mentioned and I did not see leaseholders mention anywhere.

[sns2]

Originally Posted by Walleyedude

There are two sides to this story.

PLEASE, do not take this post as being the whole truth, or even partial truth. Do some digging on this forum and ask around, talk to some of the same people you talked to about KVT, and form your own opinion. I think you’ll see this was anything but a “squandered opportunity” for the outdoorsmen of Alberta.

If you read one person’s take, it doesn’t mean you take it as gospel. Relax. Morton’s retired. Doesn’t mean the UCP won’t float something similar in the future , but for now it’s something that has passed.

[Walleyedude]

Originally Posted by sns2

If you read one person’s take, it doesn’t mean you take it as gospel. Relax. Morton’s retired. Doesn’t mean the UCP won’t float something similar in the future , but for now it’s something that has passed.

I watched the whole thing go down, and saw how close it came to getting rammed through.

Relaxing is not an option, it's like a bad weed, it's never dead, just dormant. Morton was the green on the surface, and he *might* be gone, but the roots are still there. If you're not vigilant, weeds have a way of working their way to the surface and starting to spread again...

[Dick284]

And all the while, the voters in Alberta get distracted by a useful idiot whose running for the NDP.
At the same time worrying about a failed land access system once floated by a no longer political party in the way back machine.

It kinda reminds we of waving a puppies tail in its face, and once the pup is going in circles, stealing it’s just given beef bone.

Divide and conquer, divide and conquer!

[landowner]

KVT will not be a minister, in fact he won’t get to Edmonton. There is no way he can win this riding…ever

[sns2]

Originally Posted by Dick284

And all the while, the voters in Alberta get distracted by a useful idiot whose running for the NDP.
At the same time worrying about a failed land access system once floated by a no longer political party in the way back machine.

It kinda reminds we of waving a puppies tail in its face, and once the pup is going in circles, stealing it’s just given beef bone.

Divide and conquer, divide and conquer!

It’s a forum, Dick. We aren’t doing rocket science. You got anything more pressing or urgent to talk about

[One'n'Done]

Originally Posted by landowner

KVT will not be a minister, in fact he won’t get to Edmonton. There is no way he can win this riding…ever

^This^ Doubled down^

And as far as the rest of vitriol spouted above in this thread... It ain't the read I get from KVT after having fished with and known him for a number of years.

[ehrgeiz]

Doesn't really matter if KVT is elected MLA or not. KVT will have reach as an advisor to the party, I'm sure. If the NDP forms Government they will quickly look to pick up the Y2Y and CPAWS agenda. Those well funded orgs will pump out misleading advert campaigns in various medias pushing for new parks using tags like "Protect the East Slopes from Coal Mining". Another Trojan Horse.

With that said, I don't think the NDP will secure a victory, we had a split conservative vote when they did. I don't think we'll see the conservative party split here before the election. Maybe after.

Back in 2014/15 I had an open mind to the NDP post Redford scandal, but boy I won't make that mistake again. Especially as the NDP and left of today are an absolutely delusional pronoun cult. I saw a note that they decided on a policy to lower the voting age to 16 at their AGM (if elected Gov). Have they met a 16 year old? Even at 18 I don't think most have enough real world understanding to cast a competent vote, but maybe that's the point hey.

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by One'n'Done

^This^ Doubled down^

And as far as the rest of vitriol spouted above in this thread... It ain't the read I get from KVT after having fished with and known him for a number of years.

Must have a different opinion/attitude in person vs. the world wide web

[Dick284]

Originally Posted by sns2

It’s a forum, Dick. We aren’t doing rocket science. You got anything more pressing or urgent to talk about

It’s the classic shell game, and guess what happens when the electorate fall for it……..


That’s pretty pressing I’d say.

KVT is a useful idiot, and he’s running in a riding he has slim chances of taking, yet we pontificate long and hard as to what he is all about.

I just hope the electorate sees this for what it is.

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by Dick284

It’s the classic shell game, and guess what happens when the electorate fall for it……..


That’s pretty pressing I’d say.

KVT is a useful idiot, and he’s running in a riding he has slim chances of taking, yet we pontificate long and hard as to what he is all about.

I just hope the electorate sees this for what it is.

You figure this thread will drag more over to the orange side?
As I see it there are a number of members on the fence leaning left. Knowing what kind of character this guy is will change a mind or two. The thread may indeed serve a purpose. Here's hoping anyways

[Dick284]

Originally Posted by MountainTi

You figure this thread will drag more over to the orange side?
As I see it there are a number of members on the fence leaning left. Knowing what kind of character this guy is will change a mind or two. The thread may indeed serve a purpose. Here's hoping anyways

I’m all for dialogue, it’s how we share, and interact, if a few minds see a different light because of our banter, that is not a bad thing.

[boah]

Originally Posted by One'n'Done

^This^ Doubled down^

And as far as the rest of vitriol spouted above in this thread... It ain't the read I get from KVT after having fished with and known him for a number of years.

Well, I guess, he managed to pull the wool over your eyes???

[ehrgeiz]

Originally Posted by ehrgeiz

Those well funded orgs will pump out misleading advert campaigns in various medias pushing for new parks using tags like "Protect the East Slopes from Coal Mining". Another Trojan Horse.

Not to make this thread too political, but it kind of is... my crystal ball was right again. Saw the following post on Twitter from Notley this morning. The NDP even changed their logo to show the mountains. Looks like the park protection on the eastern slopes will be one of their prime attack vectors in the coming election. I'm sure most on here won't be fooled, but some of the electorate will be, particularly in Edmonton and Calgary.

[goldscud]

Why would we want Selenium pollution heading downstream from our eastern slopes just like Teck is sending down the Elk river to Montana? Do we need to kill Cutthroats just like Teck does?
150 parts per billion near the mines....ya that's really acceptable.
I guess all the folks who receive selenium laced water from the mountains will be excited about mines.
-------------------

Teck — as a Canadian company operating coal mines in Canada — is not subject to Montana’s rules, which apply only to the U.S. side of the reservoir. But in a recent petition, submitted to Montana’s Board of Environmental Review, the company argues the state’s selenium limit, a Lake Koocanusa site-specific selenium standard of 0.8 parts per billion, is illegal and targets their coal mining operations.

B.C.’s existing water quality guidelines, which are not legally binding, recommend selenium levels be kept to two parts per billion to protect aquatic life. In waters tested throughout the Elk Valley, however, selenium levels have been found to exceed 150 parts per billion near mining activities.

[Smoky buck]

Originally Posted by goldscud

Why would we want Selenium pollution heading downstream from our eastern slopes just like Teck is sending down the Elk river to Montana? Do we need to kill Cutthroats just like Teck does?
150 parts per billion near the mines....ya that's really acceptable.
I guess all the folks who receive selenium laced water from the mountains will be excited about mines.
-------------------

Teck — as a Canadian company operating coal mines in Canada — is not subject to Montana’s rules, which apply only to the U.S. side of the reservoir. But in a recent petition, submitted to Montana’s Board of Environmental Review, the company argues the state’s selenium limit, a Lake Koocanusa site-specific selenium standard of 0.8 parts per billion, is illegal and targets their coal mining operations.

B.C.’s existing water quality guidelines, which are not legally binding, recommend selenium levels be kept to two parts per billion to protect aquatic life. In waters tested throughout the Elk Valley, however, selenium levels have been found to exceed 150 parts per billion near mining activities.

I can fully understand concerns regarding coal mines and being in opposition of them. I can respect this even though I also see value in a well managed coal mine with a solid plan regarding environmental impact. Not into wreck less abandonment in the name of the economy though

But there also needs to be a full assessment of what a party brings beyond their playing on peoples views on a hot topic. One also needs to watch how this is exploited to push through other agendas. You will also be impacted by the false promise of protecting the mountains

I hate to tell you but neither party is truly your friend on this issue and both are looking to exploit the Rockies.

[goldscud]

There isn't much to like in either party.
It is a sad state....you have to pinch your nose and vote either way you decide to go