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Old 10-21-2020, 01:12 PM
Rick. Rick. is offline
 
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Default Need a new knot

Hello all. For years I've been using the improved cinch knot with no complaints. This fall I lost a couple of Rapala dt16's and in both cases it was my knot that failed. In fact both times my rod hadn't even loaded yet so I'm thinking the knot must have slipped prior to my last cast. I'm using stren magna thin 12lb line. Anyone have a better knot recommendation? Much thanks. Rick.
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  #2  
Old 10-21-2020, 01:20 PM
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Palomar
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  #3  
Old 10-21-2020, 01:35 PM
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One and done. Palomar.
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Old 10-21-2020, 01:56 PM
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I'm a uni knot guy....use it for almost everything. Palomar is a great choice too though.
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Old 10-21-2020, 02:03 PM
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I do Palomar on most knots.
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  #6  
Old 10-21-2020, 05:06 PM
huntsfurfish huntsfurfish is offline
 
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Quote:
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Palomar
x2 on palomar
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  #7  
Old 10-21-2020, 06:50 PM
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Palomar wins hands down. Simple easy strong knot
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  #8  
Old 10-21-2020, 09:48 PM
OL_JR OL_JR is offline
 
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Palomar is a great knot but...

I can't help but think there is something going on with your line. For mono and flourocarbon the improved clinch, trilene, fishermans knot or whatever you wan't to call it is strong. You should have close to if not 100% line strength.

Not here to argue which one is stronger just saying that I'd be looking closely at my line. Is it old? (I think mono or flouro should be changed yearly at the least). Does it have any damage from abrasion due to fishing conditions or damaged guide/guides, maybe the knot strength isn't great with that particular line etc...
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  #9  
Old 10-21-2020, 11:53 PM
Wes_G Wes_G is offline
 
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Sounds like you need new line. If you are breaking off 12lb like it's 4 lb then there is something wrong.
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  #10  
Old 10-22-2020, 01:02 AM
Rick. Rick. is offline
 
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Thanks for all the replies. The Palomar looks easy enough for me to learn. My line was less than six weeks old but who knows how long ago it was made. I don't think the line broke, more like it the knot slipped. I will have a close look to see if it's in rough condition and I'll have a look at my rod guides as well. One thing worth mentioning perhaps is these Rapala dt16 baits do put a fair strain on my rod when trolling them. I've not had problems with other baits except for the odd hard snag which caused line brake. Thanks.
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  #11  
Old 10-22-2020, 09:08 AM
TimboLefty TimboLefty is offline
 
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Try a double clinch also known as the trilene knot
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  #12  
Old 10-22-2020, 12:39 PM
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I typically use Palomar for braid and trilene for mono.

If you looking to learn knots, the below link is a great resource.
https://www.animatedknots.com/fishing-knots
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  #13  
Old 10-22-2020, 12:54 PM
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Fishin fool knot is the way to go. Itís a little less popular, but itís the bomb.
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  #14  
Old 10-22-2020, 01:19 PM
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The knot you are currently tying shouldn't cause any issues with the type of line on your reel.

The type of knot you tie is irrelevant if your line has degraded.
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  #15  
Old 10-22-2020, 09:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ab_hunter View Post
The knot you are currently tying shouldn't cause any issues with the type of line on your reel.

The type of knot you tie is irrelevant if your line has degraded.
Kind of what I was thinking.

If you have properly tied a clinch knot, the chances of failure are very very low.

Change out your line.
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  #16  
Old 10-24-2020, 03:04 PM
Darkbreez Darkbreez is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick. View Post
Hello all. For years I've been using the improved cinch knot with no complaints. This fall I lost a couple of Rapala dt16's and in both cases it was my knot that failed. In fact both times my rod hadn't even loaded yet so I'm thinking the knot must have slipped prior to my last cast. I'm using stren magna thin 12lb line. Anyone have a better knot recommendation? Much thanks. Rick.
I personally prefer the snell knot. i will snell all my hooks....
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  #17  
Old 10-24-2020, 03:13 PM
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Dean2 Dean2 is offline
 
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Snell is a good knot but doesn't work well on Plugs. Polymar knot would be my suggestion. Works for mono and braided lines, is very strong and will not slip. Very easy to tie, even with cold or stiff fingers.

How to tie one illustrated.

https://www.animatedknots.com/palomar-knot
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  #18  
Old 10-24-2020, 04:39 PM
orvisman orvisman is offline
 
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No matter what knot you use, ALWAYS test it after tying. Give it a good pull with even pressure. Donít jerk it.
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  #19  
Old 10-24-2020, 05:47 PM
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double palomar or a triple granny
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  #20  
Old 10-24-2020, 06:40 PM
EZM EZM is offline
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I tested the double Palomar vs the standard Palomar on our tensile testing machine in the lab at work. I tested it with a few weights of braid and using fluorocarbon (2 heavier weights of fluorocarbon leader) and there was no difference in strength or knot failure through slipping OR breaking - as a matter of fact, the double had was slightly "less" resistant to breaking (although it would/could be statistically insignificant) based on the fact we did maybe a dozen pulls until I ran out of line to fill the fixture.

The improved clinch was better on fluoro by a fair margin, but the Palomar was the ticket for the braid although only slightly better.

In many cases the break was at the base of the knot but not always - there seemed to be no pattern.

And ....... interestingly ALL samples broke ABOVE the line rating in every case. So 14lb broke close to 20lbs in some cases.

I would have done more testing, but the guys had stuff they needed to do and didn't want them to have to explain what the heck they were doing on work time testing fishing line for me instead of doing their tests on materials they were supposed to be testing.... lol

You would probably need to do a little more of a population to have "sound" results and we should have used the optical comparator to make sure the thicknesses were uniformed throughout the samples and inspected them with a microscope and stuff - but I just peeled off 10-12 feet of line of whatever spools I had and brought them in to play with.

The other thing that was cool to see, braided line stretches, but hardly compared to fluoro - the fluoro had elongation prior to failure versus the braid just exploded upon failure which was loud and fun to watch - the 40lb braid was like a grenade going off - scared us every time .... lol

Last edited by EZM; 10-24-2020 at 06:49 PM.
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  #21  
Old 10-24-2020, 11:57 PM
Bow flyman Bow flyman is offline
 
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I almost always use a palomar knot when spin fishing.
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  #22  
Old 10-26-2020, 06:30 PM
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The Fisherman Guy The Fisherman Guy is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EZM View Post
I tested the double Palomar vs the standard Palomar on our tensile testing machine in the lab at work. I tested it with a few weights of braid and using fluorocarbon (2 heavier weights of fluorocarbon leader) and there was no difference in strength or knot failure through slipping OR breaking - as a matter of fact, the double had was slightly "less" resistant to breaking (although it would/could be statistically insignificant) based on the fact we did maybe a dozen pulls until I ran out of line to fill the fixture.

The improved clinch was better on fluoro by a fair margin, but the Palomar was the ticket for the braid although only slightly better.

In many cases the break was at the base of the knot but not always - there seemed to be no pattern.

And ....... interestingly ALL samples broke ABOVE the line rating in every case. So 14lb broke close to 20lbs in some cases.

I would have done more testing, but the guys had stuff they needed to do and didn't want them to have to explain what the heck they were doing on work time testing fishing line for me instead of doing their tests on materials they were supposed to be testing.... lol

You would probably need to do a little more of a population to have "sound" results and we should have used the optical comparator to make sure the thicknesses were uniformed throughout the samples and inspected them with a microscope and stuff - but I just peeled off 10-12 feet of line of whatever spools I had and brought them in to play with.

The other thing that was cool to see, braided line stretches, but hardly compared to fluoro - the fluoro had elongation prior to failure versus the braid just exploded upon failure which was loud and fun to watch - the 40lb braid was like a grenade going off - scared us every time .... lol
Very cool.
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  #23  
Old 10-30-2020, 09:33 AM
Rick. Rick. is offline
 
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Thanks for all the responses. Finally went out nd checked things yesterday. Rod guides were fine but the line is not. Checked about fifty feet of line and it was in awful condition. I must of bought some very old/ or poorly made line. Rick.
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  #24  
Old 10-30-2020, 10:53 AM
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58thecat 58thecat is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dean2 View Post
Snell is a good knot but doesn't work well on Plugs. Polymar knot would be my suggestion. Works for mono and braided lines, is very strong and will not slip. Very easy to tie, even with cold or stiff fingers.

How to tie one illustrated.

https://www.animatedknots.com/palomar-knot
and with shaking hands that are viewed through old err correction aging eyes...
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