6.5 Grendal Kills, including a 752 yrd speed goat

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

I did leave velocity on the table, 400fps to be exact.

How do you think a Swede with a 130gr projectile shot out of a rifle in 1964, using the latest technology of that day would compare to a 130gr projectile shot from a Grendel with the latest bullet technology of today?

Give me an honest answer if you can, it will clear the air for us in sure.

That projectile comparison would apply to most cartridges that are in use today. If it concerned cartridges only it would still be pretty much the same.
The modern Swede action has been around since at least the '50's ..some earlier. Just because the loading manuals are compelled to publish loading data for all the older, weaker Military actions currently in circulation does not make the "modern" 6.5 Swede a old stepchild. It's been around in it's present form for many decades. It too can use modern powders and projectiles, just as any other cartridge, newer or older. It's still an Apples to Apples comparison.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Salavee

That projectile comparison would apply to most cartridges that are in use today. If it concerned cartridges only it would still be pretty much the same.
The modern Swede action has been around since at least the '50's ..some earlier. Just because the loading manuals are compelled to publish loading data for all the older, weaker Military actions currently in circulation does not make the "modern" 6.5 Swede a old stepchild. It's been around in it's present form for many decades. It too can use modern powders and projectiles, just as any other cartridge, newer or older. It's still an Apples to Apples comparison.

Lol, that was a creative side step.

Look, the fact is that the Swede has been a slow killer even with the use of mediocre projectiles for over a century, I hear it all the time. Another fact is the modern day Grendel is spitting out projectiles that are way more advanced in performance than those of the mid 1900's at nearly the same speed. You don't have to admit it, you can keep ignoring facts and sidestepping questions but it doesn't change history or facts.

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

Lol

Did you see some humor in that ?

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Salavee

Did you see some humor in that ?

I see humor in most of your posts regarding anything 6.5, just not much in the way of knowledge.

[West O'5]

Originally Posted by Stinky Coyote

If you had a Grendel for WT then you would not have been left wanting, bush work or dial one up half way across the quarter of crop you might be sitting over, or a cutblock etc. That's the beauty, a proper spec for big game work in an AR platform. More than enough range for whitetails typically killed inside. PBRZ with a 210 yrd zero would get you hold dead on to say 250. Sure a .243 would extend that by 50 yards. But you burn lots more powder to do it. Minimum impact velocities get both to around 400 yards, the s.d. of the Grendal being .252 vs the .242 of a 100 gr .243 partition.

Remember, somebody did push the limits of the Grendel...752 yard antelope above. 400 yard deer are falling routine to this cartridge.

Now you have a reason to get back in the AR game. The blackout was too slow. The 7.62x39 also too slow and not enough b.c./s.d. The 6.8 spc was a better choice and i killed a whitetail doe at 220 with an ASI custom mini 14 and 110gr v-max no sweat before i sold that, fine little cartridge but the Grendel whoops it's butt too. First round poi impact difference was reason i sold it, common in the mini-14 platform. But now with AR's and the Grendel....there's no choice, it is the ONLY way to fly for an auto-loader in that cartridge length. Consistent accuracy and more than enough range for deer, and will do the bigger stuff inside 2-300 without issue either.

Well I guess the .300BLK kit was more of an impulse buy and I simply just lost any interest in hunting deer with the XCR or any AR-ish platform for that matter,as I own(or owned at the same time) compound bow,.45 Hawken,shotgun slug barrel 870,bolt actions in .243,6.5CM,.308 x2,.300WSM,.30-06,and .30-06 pump(my go to bush/do-all rifle for 30+ years).....bottom line is I just never did use the BLK and likely never will use a Grendel nor any AR-like platform for deer hunting when I have 1/2 dozen other/better options at my disposal that will do anything the BLK and/or Grendel will do and then some.
Picking which rifle/shotgun/bow to take hunting on any given day......1st world problems?
Worse case scenario in the unlikely event I take the urge to play jungle combat with bush deer and want to handicap myself with an underpowered semi platform I still have the ol'SKS,lol 😝

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

Lol, that was a creative side step.

Look, the fact is that the Swede has been a slow killer even with the use of mediocre projectiles for over a century, I hear it all the time. Another fact is the modern day Grendel is spitting out projectiles that are way more advanced in performance than those of the mid 1900's at nearly the same speed. You don't have to admit it, you can keep ignoring facts and sidestepping questions but it doesn't change history or facts.

Now, that is humorous.

For some twisted reason you are comparing a Swede from over a century ago, with century old components, to a modern era Cartridge (Grendel.CM).
That's totally nuts and you should know it so I won't bother with this any further. When the time comes that you actually know as much as you think you know about as many things as you think you do, and actually know what you don't know we may have a basis for further conversation.. Back to Wikipedia.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Salavee

Now, that is humorous.

For some twisted reason you are comparing a Swede from over a century ago, with century old components, to a modern era Cartridge (Grendel.CM).
That's totally nuts and you should know it so I won't bother with this any further. When the time comes that you actually know as much as you think you know about as many things as you think you do, and actually know what you don't know we may have a basis for further conversation.. Back to Wikipedia.

You just don't get it do you? You're a hypocrite. One minute you are bragging up the merits of the Swede, bragging how it's a "proven" cartridge not once stopping to think that it's made its repution over the past century, and guess what that means..........

It means it's built it's reputation using......... wait for it....... ammunition that was produced over the past century!

Not a hard concept for most to comprehend. As much as you don't want to believe it, more can be done with less if you add some technology to the mix.

[Stinky Coyote]

bringing new stuff up to speed here is a riot

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Stinky Coyote

bringing new stuff up to speed here is a riot

Stuff or people?

[Stinky Coyote]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

Stuff or people?

stuff

[walking buffalo]

Back away from the Buck!

Farther.

Farther.....

Ok, shoot.

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by West O'5

Been there/done that...sorta?
I have a RA XCR-L in 5.56......my varmigedden/coyote pack's worst nightmare/zombie apocalypse rifle.
Bought the .300BLK conversion for it,thinking it might be fun to hunt bush WTs with it where shot opps are generally close range and fast follow ups.
Thing is though.....every morn that I headed out for WT over the next 3 seasons,I ALWAYS reached for one of 1/2 dozen other flatter shooting/harder hitting,tried and tested,more traditional deer/elk/moose rifles in my arsenal......never used the .300BLK kit even once for deer hunting as I had originally intended.....so I re-sold it.

I had one of those as well. I had a 223 and 6.8 spc barrel. Was fun for deer pushes but man was it under powered. Every deer on the run went down, but needed at least 2 more bullets to finish it off. Same as you, mine started to collect dust so I sold it

[Faststeel]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

Lol, that was a creative side step.

Look, the fact is that the Swede has been a slow killer even with the use of mediocre projectiles for over a century, I hear it all the time. Another fact is the modern day Grendel is spitting out projectiles that are way more advanced in performance than those of the mid 1900's at nearly the same speed. You don't have to admit it, you can keep ignoring facts and sidestepping questions but it doesn't change history or facts.

Kurt

Do you have a Grendel or a Creed rifle?

I have Steyr Pro hunter in 6.5x55, modern action. I use 48gr of reloder 22 for 140gr bullets. I have killed a moose and several deer. Works well for me. FS

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Faststeel

Kurt

Do you have a Grendel or a Creed rifle?

I have Steyr Pro hunter in 6.5x55, modern action. I use 48gr of reloder 22 for 140gr bullets. I have killed a moose and several deer. Works well for me. FS

No Grendel, I do have a creed, had a 260rem and a 6.5x55 Swede. Of the guns I've owned, in my normal hunting range I have no doubt I can kill whichever big game animal I'm hunting. I haven't owned a Grendel but from what I've read and watched I would imagine there would be no problem killing game out to 300yds, same as an old 6.5x55.



I'm comparing the Grendel to the old 6.5x55 because that's the one that started the legend of the 6.5x55 as a cartridge that killed way better than it should. The ballistics on the old Swede vs the modern day Grendel aren't that far off from each other going up to a 130gr bullet. I'm not saying the Grendel would be my pick for a 6.5 hunting cartridge, but I'll give it it's due credit as being a legitimate big game cartridge when used within reason.

The 6.5 magic is in the projectile, not the headstamp. Arguing that one is somehow a proven killer and that others will not measure up over 100 or 200fps at muzzle is ridiculous. So I have to remind people that the Swede got its reputation at 2400-2600fps, not the 2800-3000fps it shoots today to try and explain that the "new breed" of 6.5's will be every bit as capable as the legendary Swede. Having the added technology of the modern day bullets is just a bonus.

[Beeman3]

I would like to see some actual data on a modern Creed or Swede using the exact same bullet. I agree with Kurt that the end results will not be much different. I don't own either but shoot a 6.5X47. The argument could be that the Creed or 260 is superior to the X47 but Again the difference would be so small. Here is Data from my 6.5X47 shooting a 130 Berger hunting, to what I consider max range on deer size game:
MV of 2980 fps
Distance of 700 yds
impact velocity 1887 fps
Energy 1027.8 ft-lbs
TOF .888 Sec
Elev 1500 ft
Temp 32F
Humidity 40%

Some real hard number comparisons could stop the bickering. Plus I would be curious to see how my little X47 does compared to the Sweed and Creed. I personally think the X47 is very impressive. Only takes 42.2 gr of powder (H4350) to get me these numbers.

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

No Grendel, I do have a creed, had a 260rem and a 6.5x55 Swede. Of the guns I've owned, in my normal hunting range I have no doubt I can kill whichever big game animal I'm hunting. I haven't owned a Grendel but from what I've read and watched I would imagine there would be no problem killing game out to 300yds, same as an old 6.5x55.



I'm comparing the Grendel to the old 6.5x55 because that's the one that started the legend of the 6.5x55 as a cartridge that killed way better than it should. The ballistics on the old Swede vs the modern day Grendel aren't that far off from each other going up to a 130gr bullet. I'm not saying the Grendel would be my pick for a 6.5 hunting cartridge, but I'll give it it's due credit as being a legitimate big game cartridge when used within reason.

The 6.5 magic is in the projectile, not the headstamp. Arguing that one is somehow a proven killer and that others will not measure up over 100 or 200fps at muzzle is ridiculous. So I have to remind people that the Swede got its reputation at 2400-2600fps, not the 2800-3000fps it shoots today to try and explain that the "new breed" of 6.5's will be every bit as capable as the legendary Swede. Having the added technology of the modern day bullets is just a bonus.

You're right . The Swedes reputation was built on the projectile ..a 160 RN at 22-2300 fps ... SD 328. With todays new powders it easily runs the same bullet at 2600, and the newer 143's at 2900+. Add any new projectile( including the brand new 150 gr) or powder technology you want to the mix and it still stands head and shoulders above the CM or the tiny Grendel as a hunting cartridge. The headstamp does make a difference. Your genius won't chance the facts.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Salavee

You're right . The Swedes reputation was built on the projectile ..a 160 RN at 22-2300 fps ... SD 328. With todays new powders it easily runs the same bullet at 2600, and the newer 143's at 2900+. Add any new projectile( including the brand new 150 gr) or powder technology you want to the mix and it still stands head and shoulders above the CM or the tiny Grendel as a hunting cartridge. The headstamp does make a difference. Your genius won't chance the facts.

You're hopeless. I don't believe you're as thick as you're pretending to be, you just can't admit you're wrong. It was actually the 139gr bullet that was the most impressive back in the day, out performing the 156-160 grain bullets.

Blah blah blah, the Swede is the greatest 6.5 cartridge ever.......

Well what about a 6.5-06, or 264 win mag, or 264 Norma, or Nosler 26 just to name a few? They all blow your puny little Swede out of the water, that's not what this is about to anyone but you apparently.

It's about the capabilities of the Grendel. It's hilarious how you constantly side step the questions then keep pointing out how great the modern day Swede is when absolutely nobody is asking or questioning it.

Simple yes or no question here, you should be able to answer without side stepping unless your ego gets in the way.

Can you make a clean kill on a deer with a 6.5 Grendel at 300yds?

I have never shot a Grendel but I guarantee I can make a clean kill on a deer at 300yds.

[last minute]

I really don't see the big deal sorry just me i guess .

TOO Each there own

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

You're hopeless. I don't believe you're as thick as you're pretending to be, you just can't admit you're wrong. It was actually the 139gr bullet that was the most impressive back in the day, out performing the 156-160 grain bullets.

Blah blah blah, the Swede is the greatest 6.5 cartridge ever.......

Well what about a 6.5-06, or 264 win mag, or 264 Norma, or Nosler 26 just to name a few? They all blow your puny little Swede out of the water, that's not what this is about to anyone but you apparently.

It's about the capabilities of the Grendel. It's hilarious how you constantly side step the questions then keep pointing out how great the modern day Swede is when absolutely nobody is asking or questioning it.

Simple yes or no question here, you should be able to answer without side stepping unless your ego gets in the way.

Can you make a clean kill on a deer with a 6.5 Grendel at 300yds?

I have never shot a Grendel but I guarantee I can make a clean kill on a deer at 300yds.

Yes . Anybody that can shoot at all could kill a Deer at 300 yds with any legal cartridge. Would that make the Cartridge great ? What's your point ?

Up the ante a bit.

[mattthegorby]

Just want to say that as a newbie I find it really informative to read the 6.5 debate threads that every mention of a 6.5 cartridge brings out. Thank you guys for battling it out - even if you are arguing from two different philosophies on what makes a cartridge great.

The end result is that while I am looking forward to reloading for and shooting my new 6.5 Creedmoor... I now also want a Grendal and a Swede.

Matt

[Big Lou]

Originally Posted by mattthegorby

Just want to say that as a newbie I find it really informative to read the 6.5 debate threads that every mention of a 6.5 cartridge brings out. Thank you guys for battling it out - even if you are arguing from two different philosophies on what makes a cartridge great.

The end result is that while I am looking forward to reloading for and shooting my new 6.5 Creedmoor... I now also want a Grendal and a Swede.

Matt

I like the information provided as a result of the clashes as well. I don’t believe I’ve ever been or will be passionate enough about x cartridge to go to war over it but I can appreciate the fact that others are. The debates always give some food for thought. As well as laughs. What round are we on now between Kurt and Slavaee in the last few 6.5 threads? 50? 60? I’m actually impressed it has remained as civil as it has. Good work boys!

[Big Sky]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eIGMUdayOFg

[nube]

i'll stick with my 7mmSTW...... lol

[Salavee]

Well, I can say it's been fun as well but I think it's time .. I'll rest my take as to the Swede being the superior overall hunting cartridge based on the following and call it a day:

Swede: 750 yd 6.5CM
143 ELDX 143 ELDX
Terminal Velocity .. 1900 fps 1808 fps
TME .. 1780 ft lbs TME 1679 ft lbs

450 yd
160 gr Woodleigh Can't shoot it
Terminal Velocity .. 1930 fps
TME .. 1930 ft lbs




300yds
160 Woodleigh 2189 fps Can't shoot it
TME 2185 fps

100 yds 100 yds
143 ELDX 143 ELDX
MV .. 2927 2865


160 Woodleigh 2740
ME 2672 ft lbs Can't shoot it

To me, nothing else really matters regarding a hunting cartridge. What the CM can do, the Swede can do, but the CM can't do what the Swede can do. That's it for me.
.. But the format didn't transfer correctly and I can't edit . Sorry

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Salavee

Well, I can say it's been fun as well but I think it's time .. I'll rest my take as to the Swede being the superior overall hunting cartridge based on the following and call it a day:

Swede: 750 yd 6.5CM
143 ELDX 143 ELDX
Terminal Velocity .. 1900 fps 1808 fps
TME .. 1780 ft lbs TME 1679 ft lbs

450 yd
160 gr Woodleigh Can't shoot it
Terminal Velocity .. 1930 fps
TME .. 1930 ft lbs




300yds
160 Woodleigh 2189 fps Can't shoot it
TME 2185 fps

100 yds 100 yds
143 ELDX 143 ELDX
MV .. 2927 2865


160 Woodleigh 2740
ME 2672 ft lbs Can't shoot it

To me, nothing else really matters regarding a hunting cartridge. What the CM can do, the Swede can do, but the CM can't do what the Swede can do. That's it for me.
.. But the format didn't transfer correctly and I can't edit . Sorry

You are comparing a 6.5 Swede to a Creedmoor on a thread that's about the Grendel........

I compared the Grendel to the early chamberings of the Swede to try and pry a little bit of reasoning into you, hoping you would realize that there isn't much difference between the two, hoping you would realize that the 6.5 projectiles are the magic ingredient, not the casing it sits in, but nope, that part didn't get through.

The Grendel and the Creedmoor fit into a short action, Swede can't do that so you have go with a long action. If you're going to use a long action why waste your time with a Swede when you can shoot a 264win, 264 Norma, 6.5-06, or a Nosler 26, when all of which will put the Swede to shame?

When was the last time you shot an animal over 750yds away? When was the last time you shot an animal over 300yds away for that matter? You've admitted that you in fact could make a clean kill on a deer at 300yds away with the Grendel, that doesn't seem like catching a 30lb fish with 4lb test to me at all...... not even a remotely close comparisson.

Like I said, in my opinion the Grendel is a capable big game cartridge when used within its intended range, and so is the Swede. I would not consider either however to be a superior hunting cartridge over all by any means. You seem bent on how well it can shoot a 160gr woodliegh, how about you run the numbers next to a 6.5-06 @ 2700fps and see how well it can compare.

If I were to have a choice between the Swede, the Creed, or the Grendel it would without a doubt be the Creed by a landslide, followed by the Grendel. If I wanted a long action the Swede wouldn't even make my top 10 list.

[Stinky Coyote]

Originally Posted by marky_mark

I had one of those as well. I had a 223 and 6.8 spc barrel. Was fun for deer pushes but man was it under powered. Every deer on the run went down, but needed at least 2 more bullets to finish it off. Same as you, mine started to collect dust so I sold it

I think you'd find a much different result with an ar in Grendel. Accuracy advantage but the real difference is the projectile. More weight but also much higher s.d.

[Stinky Coyote]

Originally Posted by mattthegorby

Just want to say that as a newbie I find it really informative to read the 6.5 debate threads that every mention of a 6.5 cartridge brings out. Thank you guys for battling it out - even if you are arguing from two different philosophies on what makes a cartridge great.

The end result is that while I am looking forward to reloading for and shooting my new 6.5 Creedmoor... I now also want a Grendal and a Swede.

Matt

Lmao, drink the koolaid, it's excellent!

[mattthegorby]

Originally Posted by Stinky Coyote

Lmao, drink the koolaid, it's excellent!

Flat shooting, ballistic coefficient, fps, blah, blah, blah - I just think the 6.5's have the most badass names of all the cartridges.

[gtr]

Good choices, but there is better for some of us. Enjoy whatever you choose!

[roper1]

[QUOTE=Stinky Coyote;3801776]http://www.65grendel.com/forum/showt...yard-speedgoat

The way I read this is a very, very borderline shot. 752 yds & he broke the spine? What's the dim-dot doing shooting a high neck shot at that distance? Or any distance? I hope the twit is BS'ing the distance or the shot placement, or he really should be shooting gongs........or an airsoft!