Tuning problems....

SonofDixie · #1 04-30-2015, 08:10 PM

Hey guys.... Havin some trouble with my bow.....
Im not really sure where to start....

I just spent a long time at t and t archery gettin my bow tuned on paper and we got it pretty dang good. Got it home and sited it in witb broadheads, and seemed great....

Went out hunting, and brought my target along with me to take a few practice shots before hunting, and was shooting crazy low.... So i figured MAYBE i didnt have the site tight enough and it got bumped during the drive?? So i adjusted and practiced for a while and it was shooting great...

Now tonight i picked it up again and was shooting great.. Every now and then id notice an arrow dance, but I thought it might be because i twitched... Wasnt sure. Went in for supper, came back out, and my arrows are going everywhere!!
Dancing like crazy and all over the map.... Thinking maybe its my broadheads, i spun them and they were NOT balancing. Wabbled like crap. So i thought "well that must be it" so i put my practice heads back in and the arrows are still dancing but not quite as bad.

I know its not me. My form is very careful and release is super smooth as it has always been...

To be honest, i havent had this kind of trouble since i put that string stop on it.

Its a mathews drenalin. Maybe that has something to do with it? Lol. When tuning, the guy at t and t had to adjust the cam... He said it was leaning alittle. I asked if that was normal, and he didnt seem too concerned..

Where should i start guys....? Please help... Gotta be the most frustrating thing to experience in hunting season...

brohymn2 · #2 05-01-2015, 06:20 AM

Message l.o.s.t. arrow he's probably tuned more mathews then most people

albertabighorn · #3 05-01-2015, 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brohymn2

Message l.o.s.t. arrow he's probably tuned more mathews then most people

X2 or bring it to him

backyard · #4 05-01-2015, 09:30 AM

did anything come lose go back to john and ask him too look at it ...

muzzy · #5 05-01-2015, 09:50 AM

or Lawrence at accurate archery he carries mathews and is a great bow tech

brohymn2 · #6 05-01-2015, 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by muzzy

or Lawrence at accurate archery he carries mathews and is a great bow tech

Yes almost forgot about Lawrence. Another great option

SonofDixie · #7 05-01-2015, 07:03 PM

Hey guys. Thanks alot. I'll start by taking it back to john. If he still cant do anything with it, ill take it to one of the other two recommendations. Id love to go to neil... But thats such a long drive....

raab · #8 05-01-2015, 09:55 PM

Did you replace anything when you were getting it tuned?

3blade · #9 05-02-2015, 12:44 PM

Loose sight component, or malfunctioning rest. If you just had it tuned the cam won't be that far off unless it's actually worn out on the pivot, which would not have come back to good at the shop.

I'd be willing to bet you've got a bad rest and fletching contact somewhere.

SonofDixie · #10 05-02-2015, 01:00 PM

No i didnt get anything replaced..

Yes thats what im wondering. We did adjust the rest quite a bit at the range, but im think it still needs some work. Previously, the fletching was contacting pretty bad, leaving marks on the fletching.

SonofDixie · #11 05-02-2015, 01:04 PM

He also said he think my draw weight was a bit to heavy...

My arrows are about, 29 3/4 with a 29" draw. My arrows are 340s with 125g tips. And i was pulling 65# he had dropped it to 60# and seemed to help some. But i thought it a bit odd that i had been shooting at 65# for quite a while and hadnt seemed to cause an issue...

What do you think?

3blade · #12 05-03-2015, 10:53 AM

Check your sight housing and cables to make sure that's not the problem, and then.....

Put a whisker buiscuit on it

SonofDixie · #13 05-03-2015, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3blade

Check your sight housing and cables to make sure that's not the problem, and then.....

Put a whisker buiscuit on it

Hey.... More and more ive been considering it.

Im using the PSE phantom drop away. Its nice... But it really doesnt give alot of clearance...

Ive seen some biscuits that have the notches in them allowing the flecthing to pass through without touching at all.. Yall used him?

3blade · #14 05-03-2015, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SonofDixie

Hey.... More and more ive been considering it.

Im using the PSE phantom drop away. Its nice... But it really doesnt give alot of clearance...

Ive seen some biscuits that have the notches in them allowing the flecthing to pass through without touching at all.. Yall used him?

Haven't myself, heard there have been issues with uneven wear on the contact parts. Realistically, never had a reason to change. set it and forget it. I have never needed to tune my rest after it's been set up.

manosteel · #15 05-03-2015, 09:13 PM

You have a few issues. First paper tune dosen't mean it's broadhead tuned. After getting all measurements to manuf. specs, timing set and centere shot set ( various methods to achieve these shooting thru paper most common) but that is just the beginning of the tuning process. Lots of different ways to get broadheads shooting to the same POI as fieldpoints but the point being more adjustments usually need to be made. Screwing on a broadhead and resighting will yield poor results, accuracy, penetration, arrow flight.

Second, when your arrows are spinning pure with BH you will never get good arrow flight, fix that first, many ways to do this.

My best guess is that Your immediate problem would be rest related. Sounds like your rest moved, probably came loose and that is your biggest issue right now since you say when you left the shop arrow flight seemed ok.

Take it back to t and t or any other of the shops in around edmonton and they should get you straight.

SonofDixie · #16 05-04-2015, 06:45 AM

Hmmm. I never knew that. How would i begin with "broadhead tuning"?

And do you mean "when there are NOT spinning true"? Lol. Hiw would i gi about fixing that as well?

Thanks for all the advice guys.

L.O.S.T.Arrow · #17 05-04-2015, 07:54 AM

The Dren was one of the easiest bows to tune...sounds like you have either a fishtail...[arrow kicks left to right] or a porpoise [ arrow kicks Up or down] or a combination of the two an "oscillating" arrow...All can cause issues...

Re-garding the cam lean...only way on a Dren to correct cam lean is replace limbs...however top Idler wheel lean is a different issue...easy to adjust via cable yokes...everyone is close but many are different...spec is string running square with idler string track at full draw...

Bow or Arrows having issue's with fieldpoints may look minimal but add a broadhead and that issue gets magnified extremely..

using an ASD [Arrow Squaring Device], one can get broadheads spinning true unless broadhead is damaged or flawed...all heads doing the same is rare...

This is our Mathews tuning Guide and broadhead tuning guide...covers all bows...

http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=222095

http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=165209

Hope they help out...as stated above bringing the issue to a PRO Shop may be the best bet if tuning is an issue!!!

Neil

SonofDixie · #18 05-04-2015, 10:06 PM

Thanks Neil! Im really thinking about coming and giving you a visit!

L.O.S.T.Arrow · #19 05-05-2015, 07:49 AM

Certainly your more than welcome to come and spend a few hours...will go thru the process with you...simple once done a time or two!!

Neil

elitearcher · #20 05-05-2015, 03:10 PM

don't want to steal any thunder here but last time I was out shooting after weeks of practice at the same distances, I was hitting several inches high, basically could use my 30yd pin to hit 40 ect, and checked to see if my rest, and or sights came loose they were both solid. I did notice that my peep seemed to be a bit out of place, and am wondering if the peep sliding higher or lower would cause that difference?

L.O.S.T.Arrow · #21 05-05-2015, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elitearcher

don't want to steal any thunder here but last time I was out shooting after weeks of practice at the same distances, I was hitting several inches high, basically could use my 30yd pin to hit 40 ect, and checked to see if my rest, and or sights came loose they were both solid. I did notice that my peep seemed to be a bit out of place, and am wondering if the peep sliding higher or lower would cause that difference?

Much yes...measure you center of peep from nock point [top loop knot] and keep that record when pep is set so it comes to you on draw and you can see entire sight ring...

peep off 1/8 is 1 foot at 30yds on some setups...

Neil

gpelker · #22 05-09-2015, 07:06 AM

All great suggestions and valid points to check.
Just a note: seems odd, you are having problems at some times and not at others? Maybe a bit of form issue causing ever so slight fletching contact?.
I had a Dren for 2 years and depending on what arrows I was shooting and the poundage was a huge difference on the tuning, you may be in a "zone" that is finicky for tuning for your particular arrows. My Dren tuned the best at 68 lbs with my 385 grain hunting arrows.

Lumberman · #23 05-12-2015, 08:04 PM

Thanks for the tips guys. I learned a lot that I was struggling with too...

L.O.S.T.Arrow · #24 05-13-2015, 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gpelker

All great suggestions and valid points to check.
Just a note: seems odd, you are having problems at some times and not at others? Maybe a bit of form issue causing ever so slight fletching contact?.
I had a Dren for 2 years and depending on what arrows I was shooting and the poundage was a huge difference on the tuning, you may be in a "zone" that is finicky for tuning for your particular arrows. My Dren tuned the best at 68 lbs with my 385 grain hunting arrows.

True every Bow has what I call a "Sweet Spot", It usually has a lot to do with what the set up is ...mostly arrows, weight, length , FOC, tip weight etc...so that sweet spot can be changed with different arrows, and even different tip weight sometimes...

Much of that Sweet spot will, have to do with arrow spine...Since most shoot bows maxed out a simple test is just shooting arrows 1 turn down on limb bolts per group...down five turns...[bow maxed] and just see what or where that sweet spot is...

If arrows are over spined five turns down it may mean new lighter spined arrows...

If arrows were too light spine... most will fall into that sweet spot somewhere into that 5 turns down on limb bolts...[which is 10 lbs for most bows approx 2 lbs per turn to both limb bolts]

If you shoot mid bow max weight...55Lbs-65lbs etc...than you have room to play by turning limb bolts up or down 2.5 turns...

you will know when you find that Sweet Spot, because you and the bow become one and it is so comfortable and accurate for you!!!

Neil

Rage.0 · #25 05-13-2015, 08:48 AM

Sounds like maybe a Rest Issue to me, possibly even some string twist issues. Incorrect or uneven individual strand tension can cause the string to change in unpredictable ways, especially when going from cool to warm conditions. Incorrectly tensioned strands can even cause an imbalance which can cause the string to load at different rates from shot to shot, resulting in grouping difficulty. I suggest taking it to an experienced tuner, they can point you in the right direction. Hopefully this is helpful.

L.O.S.T.Arrow · #26 05-14-2015, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rage.0

Sounds like maybe a Rest Issue to me, possibly even some string twist issues. Incorrect or uneven individual strand tension can cause the string to change in unpredictable ways, especially when going from cool to warm conditions. Incorrectly tensioned strands can even cause an imbalance which can cause the string to load at different rates from shot to shot, resulting in grouping difficulty. I suggest taking it to an experienced tuner, they can point you in the right direction. Hopefully this is helpful.

What you are describing is rare and if the string doesnt "balance" after breaking in the strings to "settle" than the only choice is replace the string...
Quaility string makers like Worlds Best Strings will guareentee this wont be an issue!!!

Neil

L.O.S.T.Arrow · #27 05-14-2015, 07:54 AM

Reading back you say this has occured since you put the dead stop on???

...It is possible for a deadstop to effect flight in some cases

Where is your string in relation to dead stop when bow is at rest?

String should be touching but JUST barely touching...
Gaps between the two can cause torque!!

Neil

elkoholik · #28 05-14-2015, 08:04 AM

If you have tight rest tolerances I would also consider you are torquing your bow and creating rest contact with your arrows. If your rest isn't falling away fast enough in a consistent manner this could be your issue with inconsistent arrow flight, also if you are torquing your bow which you may think you are not then this will add to the issue. Try some baby powder on the rest and see if you are getting contact. If you are set on changing out your rest I would highly recommend a HDX drop away or a limb driven drop away rest. Drop aways are the best in my opinion but can be very finicky if they are not built to the tightest tolerances and unfortunately I have no experience with the PSE. Another thing to note is if you haven't shot for a while you may be shooting different than when you shot lots, I have been shooting for some time now and when I can't shoot for a period of time it takes a bit to get everything back in play. I do not paper tune until I have shot consistent without fatigue for a while so I get fewer if any false tears.

Cheers, Elk.

SonofDixie · #29 05-26-2015, 11:59 PM

Hey guys. Sorry i havent been on here for a while. Crazy busy life!

GREAT advice from everyone!! Ive been fartin around with it a bit and i turned down my poundage and has seemed to make a Huge difference. Im still making adjustments, and am seeing improvements. Thanks to you guy!!

Ill let you know if getter bang on and if i figure out the problem. Thanks!!

SportHuntingHelp · #30 05-27-2015, 07:48 AM

One thing I like to do to see if anything moves is mark my peep, cams, sight etc anything that can move with a white out pen. First this is a good way to tell if something has moved on you really quick. Also if you bang your bow, loose a peep or whatever you will be able to fix it in the field easier.

Way off topic but i just got my 360 Versa Cradle and man is it sweet.