Lethal injection site in Lethbridge?

[wildbill]

This is one thing I thought I'd never see in Lethbridge, what a disappointment, why enforce the law? Lets pay for a nice warm building to shoot junk in! This is unfathomable to me, like really, when did it come this? I agree with giving people in recovery all the help they need, but paying for a place for people to get high in? What is happening to our society? Seems stupid decisions are a plague this day and age.

[CaberTosser]

I'd be totally down with a lethal injection site, but you're probably referring to a safe injection site

[mattthegorby]

Originally Posted by wildbill

This is one thing I thought I'd never see in Lethbridge, what a disappointment, why enforce the law? Lets pay for a nice warm building to shoot junk in! This is unfathomable to me, like really, when did it come this? I agree with giving people in recovery all the help they need, but paying for a place for people to get high in? What is happening to our society? Seems stupid decisions are a plague this day and age.

Hey Wildbill, if you are interested in understanding the why behind safe injection sites just Google "Harm Reduction" to read about the philosophy behind it.

Safe injection sites are not about a place for junkies to go party - they are an an intervention meant to keep severe addicts alive who would otherwise be shooting up in an alley. Safe injection sites are also about keeping the streets safer for everyone and building relationships with addicts that can eventually lead to other treatment options.

That being said, I so not know the dollars and cents argument for Safe Injection sites and how that money could be used for additional rehab programs, but I do know that the threat of jail time means nothing to a severe addict, there is also no shortage of drugs in jail, and it costs you and me a crap load to lock someone up.

Matt



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[bobtodrick]

Originally Posted by mattthegorby

Hey Wildbill, if you are interested in understanding the why behind safe injection sites just Google "Harm Reduction" to read about the philosophy behind it.

Safe injection sites are not about a place for junkies to go party - they are an an intervention meant to keep severe addicts alive who would otherwise be shooting up in an alley. Safe injection sites are also about keeping the streets safer for everyone and building relationships with addicts that can eventually lead to other treatment options.

That being said, I so not know the dollars and cents argument for Safe Injection sites and how that money could be used for additional rehab programs, but I do know that the threat of jail time means nothing to a severe addict, there is also no shortage of drugs in jail, and it costs you and me a crap load to lock someone up.

Matt



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If they overdose and die...doesn't cost us anything.
Look up 'Darwinism'.

[58thecat]

Originally Posted by CaberTosser

I'd be totally down with a lethal injection site, but you're probably referring to a safe injection site

Now that made me laugh....one is beneficial to society the other is a waist of tax payers money.

[Weedy1]

Originally Posted by bobtodrick

If they overdose and die...doesn't cost us anything.
Look up 'Darwinism'.

If they were your own children would you be saying that?

These programs can reduce the overall costs associated with this type of drug use to the taxpayer by as much as 80%. In Vancouver the EMT's spend a ridiculous amount of time keeping addicts alive. And no, they don't have the right to make a choice to let them die.

Watch this http://www.ctvnews.ca/w5/it-s-coming...isis-1.3377480

[Sundancefisher]

For many it is the only safe place to inject using safe needles and the only place where society can approach them and help the kick the habit.

They do receive information to help them.

[mattthegorby]

Originally Posted by bobtodrick

If they overdose and die...doesn't cost us anything.
Look up 'Darwinism'.

Totally Darwinism.

If giving addicts an injection site is going to have positive effect on their families stability and reduce street crime then my neighborhood will be safer and I can concentrate on things other than survival - like breeding and spreading myself throughout the gene pool. ;-)


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[Ken07AOVette]

I agree Bill.

I am as excited about these sites as I am seeing habitual criminals released instantly instead of serving actual time for crime committed. Liberal coddling crap that is becoming all too prevalent in society. Another way to buy votes.

[play.soccer]

The government makes diabetics pay for needles but hands them out for free for addicts. Why? Oh right feelings.

[Weedy1]

As much as I wouldn't want an injection site in my neighborhood or anyone elses the simple fact is these injection sites are the only solution to cleaning up these areas, lowering costs and in some cases setting these people on the right track. The medical industry cannot let these people OD and die nor can they turn a blind eye to providing them treatment. Anybody have an alternate solution?

[CaberTosser]

I've had a contract in Edmonton recently and I saw what I thought was a port-a-potty for workers when the neighborhood where my jobsite is located was getting new sidewalks and repaved, after the work was finished I thought it odd that the port-a-potty eyesore was still there on the boulevard. When I had to park a bit further from my jobsite and I walked past the thing there were a bunch of new packaged needles on the ground right in front of the door to it at which point I caught on to its purpose. I'm sure the taxpaying residents of that neighborhood must be ecstatic about it being there.....

[Weedy1]

Originally Posted by CaberTosser

I've had a contract in Edmonton recently and I saw what I thought was a port-a-potty for workers when the neighborhood where my jobsite is located was getting new sidewalks and repaved, after the work was finished I thought it odd that the port-a-potty eyesore was still there on the boulevard. When I had to park a bit further from my jobsite and I walked past the thing there were a bunch of new packaged needles on the ground right in front of the door to it at which point I caught on to its purpose. I'm sure the taxpaying residents of that neighborhood must be ecstatic about it being there.....

Which neighborhood?

[Redfrog]

Originally Posted by mattthegorby

Hey Wildbill, if you are interested in understanding the why behind safe injection sites just Google "Harm Reduction" to read about the philosophy behind it.

Safe injection sites are not about a place for junkies to go party - they are an an intervention meant to keep severe addicts alive who would otherwise be shooting up in an alley. Safe injection sites are also about keeping the streets safer for everyone and building relationships with addicts that can eventually lead to other treatment options.

That being said, I so not know the dollars and cents argument for Safe Injection sites and how that money could be used for additional rehab programs, but I do know that the threat of jail time means nothing to a severe addict, there is also no shortage of drugs in jail, and it costs you and me a crap load to lock someone up.

Matt



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So they can continue their lifestyle and put everyone else at risk. I heard about a young guy who had a gun to his head in Edmonton . Do you think it's more important to keep the addict who robbed him and threatened his life to keep on stealing oxygen.

Tell me what these addicts contribute to making society better. or even not harming society.

[nube]

Rehab success rates are lower than 20% for heroin
Fentanyl and meth addicts it's around %5
Sorry to say but if you get mixed up in these drugs you are done.
Eventually you will most likely be dead and by the time you get there will cost the system a pile of money for very little good in return.
I am not a fan or these injection sites.
With the way heavy drugs are these days I think it's a lost cause if your hooked and want to get off. Seen it too much. Actually responded to the same guy for the 4th time in the last 3 weeks due to an overdose and had to give him a shot to wake him up to save his life. We will be there again and again till one day he is dead. It's the way it is.
It's sad to give up on people but i'm sorry to say you really can't do much else with the way the drugs are these days.

[Rastus]

We have had them for awhile, but it still bothers me that the people who sell this stuff get off free, or at worst a slap on the wrist. I got no problem with an addict because they got that way with help. But I have a problem with the helpers.

[mattthegorby]

Originally Posted by Redfrog

So they can continue their lifestyle and put everyone else at risk. I heard about a young guy who had a gun to his head in Edmonton . Do you think it's more important to keep the addict who robbed him and threatened his life to keep on stealing oxygen.

Tell me what these addicts contribute to making society better. or even not harming society.

I am not going to defend anyone who is robbing people at gun point - addict or not. I know tons of addicts and the vast majority would not be capable of this - though for sure some are.

I also agree that the actions people take to feed their addictions hurts society. For me though, when I look at the long-term solution to making society more secure it involves treatment options working along with enforcement. There are a ton of nasty people in the drug trade, but the severe addicts in the alleys are the kids these guys are exploiting and destroying.



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[walking buffalo]

Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette

I agree Bill.

I am as excited about these sites as I am seeing habitual criminals released instantly instead of serving actual time for crime committed. Liberal coddling crap that is becoming all too prevalent in society. Another way to buy votes.

DO you have a problem with Addiction Rehabilitation facilities too, detox centres, methadone clinics and counselling sites?


Should we shut down these Liberal coddled crap Rehab sites?


Consider the idea that these safe injection sites are actually part of the Addiction Rehabilitation program....

[^v^Tinda wolf^v^]

I thuaght maybe when you said lethal it was a convienent place to gather up some black sheep to take in😁

Would you rather have used needles all over the place? I’m all for safe injection sights. Don’t get me wrong, sticking a needle on ones self to get high absolutely repulses me, gross.

[Newview01]

Safe injection sites should be used for getting these people off drugs. The addicts should be detained and sent to Claresholm for some heavy duty rehab, and then possibly off to a permanent institution. Keeping the people on the street is not a solution, it is a bandaid.

[Scott h]

Originally Posted by nube

Rehab success rates are lower than 20% for heroin
Fentanyl and meth addicts it's around %5
Sorry to say but if you get mixed up in these drugs you are done.
Eventually you will most likely be dead and by the time you get there will cost the system a pile of money for very little good in return.
I am not a fan or these injection sites.
With the way heavy drugs are these days I think it's a lost cause if your hooked and want to get off. Seen it too much. Actually responded to the same guy for the 4th time in the last 3 weeks due to an overdose and had to give him a shot to wake him up to save his life. We will be there again and again till one day he is dead. It's the way it is.
It's sad to give up on people but i'm sorry to say you really can't do much else with the way the drugs are these days.

On a brighter note, the LARGE INCREASE in the number of organs donated from over dose patients has made a HUGE difference to the life of many waiting for a heart, kidney, lungs, etc.

[rocpilefsj]

I hope none of you have to ever deal with a close family member who has addiction issues, may skew your outlook on topics like these. Easy to say when it’s a stranger laying in the gutter, put a loved ones face on that person and see if you feel the same way.

[silverdoctor]

Originally Posted by rocpilefsj

I hope none of you have to ever deal with a close family member who has addiction issues, may skew your outlook on topics like these. Easy to say when it’s a stranger laying in the gutter, put a loved ones face on that person and see if you feel the same way.

Yep. Always easier when it's strangers. Had a close family member that lived on the streets due to alcohol addiction, that's where he died.

Stare into the face of a close family member that's dealing with addiction, and your minds will change.

[Redfrog]

Originally Posted by rocpilefsj

I hope none of you have to ever deal with a close family member who has addiction issues, may skew your outlook on topics like these. Easy to say when it’s a stranger laying in the gutter, put a loved ones face on that person and see if you feel the same way.

If these sites or anything else works why would you leave your loved ones lying in the gutter? And yes I have experience up close and personal.


I think some people make this a whole lot more complicated than it is. I've known some addicts, both alcohol and drugs over the years. I think lots of them. I know of none who were forced to start using or forced to keep using. I do know a lot .....all of them who choose to over their family, kids, friends, job and ultimately their life. also know that if these same people raised a finger and said I need help, there are a ton of people and programs just waiting to help. Instead they choose to destroy themselves and everyone around them. And yes it is a choice. How many experts say you can't help an addict until they 'choose to quit'.

So they are responsible enough on one hand to decide when to quit, but not responsible for getting starting in the first place. How does that balance?

If they want to quit help them but I think it is wrong to put resources into the problem only to sustain the lifestyle until they may decide to quit. The inmates are running the asylum.

Does anyone know of one addict who is clean and sober after being forced to undergo treatment?

[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

DO you have a problem with Addiction Rehabilitation facilities too, detox centres, methadone clinics and counselling sites?
Should we shut down these Liberal coddled crap Rehab sites?
Consider the idea that these safe injection sites are actually part of the Addiction Rehabilitation program....

ARE we talking about them?

What's your expert take on them?

[wildbill]

When I cleaned up my act over 12 years I went to detox in ft mcleod and treatment @ Landers, and countless meetings, one thing I learned is, you can't change people, they have want to change, from a totally selfish point of view, yes the facility would reduce needles laying around and get people off the street but, I think it's a waste of time and money, realistically all these sites do is enable people to use, the dealers won't be far and these are the lowlifes they should be going after, start charging these goofs with pre meditated 1st degree murder, when you knowingly sell drugs that will kill, that is pre meditated murder!! I personally know two people who have died from that garbage, I know their parents, they were people with there struggles like you and I, while their dealers run free with ZERO consequence whatsoever! It's one thing to sell weed coke acid shrooms, but selling fentanyl is murder, they should making an example of these dealers and taking away what they have taken away from the these addicts, LIFE, no possibility of parole!

[bobtodrick]

Originally Posted by Weedy1

If they were your own children would you be saying that?

These programs can reduce the overall costs associated with this type of drug use to the taxpayer by as much as 80%. In Vancouver the EMT's spend a ridiculous amount of time keeping addicts alive. And no, they don't have the right to make a choice to let them die.

Watch this http://www.ctvnews.ca/w5/it-s-coming...isis-1.3377480

I don't have an issue with helping the young kid who is experimenting with drugs and gets a hit of fentanyl...that's no different than when we were young and had too much to drink.
Hopefully they survive and learn a lesson.
But the injection sites are mainly frequented by hard core meth and heroin users...they aren't likely to turn their lives around.
I have as much sympathy for them as I do the hard core criminal...and just like I don't like tax dollars going to keep a hard core criminal in prison for his entire life...I don't like tax dollars going to 'help' the hard core addict who is just going to require saving again and again.

[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by rocpilefsj

I hope none of you have to ever deal with a close family member who has addiction issues, may skew your outlook on topics like these. Easy to say when it’s a stranger laying in the gutter, put a loved ones face on that person and see if you feel the same way.

Again? Or do you mean for a first time? Ever thought that may be the reason that some of us are so against addiction may be because we have lost people to it?

Also be careful with your assumptions, some of us have dealt with far more of it first hand than you can imagine. There are a lot of First Responders, EMT's, EMR's etc on the board.

[CaberTosser]

Originally Posted by Weedy1

Which neighborhood?

Old Strathcona, the hut is located two blocks south of Wheaton Chev.

[robson3954]

Originally Posted by nube

Rehab success rates are lower than 20% for heroin
Fentanyl and meth addicts it's around %5
Sorry to say but if you get mixed up in these drugs you are done.
Eventually you will most likely be dead and by the time you get there will cost the system a pile of money for very little good in return.
I am not a fan or these injection sites.
With the way heavy drugs are these days I think it's a lost cause if your hooked and want to get off. Seen it too much. Actually responded to the same guy for the 4th time in the last 3 weeks due to an overdose and had to give him a shot to wake him up to save his life. We will be there again and again till one day he is dead. It's the way it is.
It's sad to give up on people but i'm sorry to say you really can't do much else with the way the drugs are these days.

Those are rookie numbers. I like the guys with 20 empty home kits piled beside their bed.

And regardless of if you like harm reduction or not, everybody can get on board with saving some tax payer money.