Sibbald range improvements?

propliner · #1 01-28-2010, 02:21 PM

I was at the Sibbald public rifle range yesterday and there were a couple of serious looking fellas there who were eyeing up the range for some badly needed improvements. They talked about adding some more tables, improving the ones that are there and moving a LOT more dirt in to build up better backstops.

I think the lead and copper they could haul out of there would pay for it all

Albertadiver · #2 01-28-2010, 03:13 PM

That would be cool... I've always been worried they were going to shut it down.

aulrich · #3 01-28-2010, 04:33 PM

What it needs now is some sort anti-idiot filter.

BallCoeff.435 · #4 01-28-2010, 10:10 PM

Not just more benches, but REAL benches. That means concrete base and stand, topped by a 5 inch thick c/c bench top.

A couple of prone shooting area on spaced boards would be good too, to be able to stay out of the dirt.

Mad_Mikee · #5 01-29-2010, 07:06 AM

I'd like to see a level range where you dont have to shoot uphill. An area for shooting prone would be really nice as awell.

if you had the right equipment, I'm sure you could at least level it out a bit.

Dick284 · #6 01-29-2010, 07:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aulrich

What it needs now is some sort anti-idiot filter.

Even if they charged a fee the idiot factor still abounds.

Some folks just don't get it, and never will.

foothillsman · #7 01-29-2010, 10:25 AM

Not much is going to change there. I was at the APRA general meeting and there was no mention of anything being changed. They will do as little as possible to improve that range because it gets shot up so much. The biggest **** offs are that the garbage cans get ventilated severely ( stupid), and the benches get shot up as well (******). The only reason that that part of the range exists open to the general public is that it was part of the deal with the provincial gov't for the APRA getting the Homestead range.

Some members would be happy to close that section down, because of the concern that the feds may shut down the whole range.

What most likely is going to change, is that there will be an extention for the Service Rifle's pistol range at some point. Another bay will be going in, and this may ease the time conflicts between RCMP , Calgary City Police, and Service Rifle members.

Wille Takeit · #8 01-29-2010, 11:25 AM

The place has potential. It is in need of some major clean up and revisions as suggested by a previous entry. Prone shooting benches and modifications / improvements to existing ones would be nice.
The major problem here is the lack of consideration, on the part of a few, towards their fellow outdoorsman.
Pick up garbage when you leave isn't a hard concept to most, yet it doesn't seem to sink in with some folks who use the range.
I don't see anyone putting significant funding into a place that isn't looked after.
I propose a blitz one day - bunch of guys/gals and a few trucks - wouldn't be much but it would get rid of some of the junk there. It would be a small improvement anyway. This idea will probably get mixed reviews. Anyone else have suggestions?

Okotokian · #9 01-29-2010, 11:30 AM

The only change I'd really value is if they dragged it about 30 miles closer to town.

More benches would be nice... and maybe some POSTED ETTIQUETTE RULES.... like don't keep shooting when all the other shooters have finished a while ago and are standing there glaring at you, waiting to go out and check their targets.

foothillsman · #10 01-29-2010, 12:44 PM

Quote:

I don't see anyone putting significant funding into a place that isn't looked after.
I propose a blitz one day - bunch of guys/gals and a few trucks - wouldn't be much but it would get rid of some of the junk there. It would be a small improvement anyway. This idea will probably get mixed reviews. Anyone else have suggestions?

That will likely change the attitudes of some of the APRA members toward the public range and those who use it. Some may even try to get the APRA to improve the range if something like that happens more than once. That someone actually cares and doesn't take that range and the work by the APRA to keep that range functional for granted would definately be appreciated.

But how to keep the idiots from doing more damage.

dmckay · #11 01-29-2010, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wille Takeit

The place has potential. It is in need of some major clean up and revisions as suggested by a previous entry. Prone shooting benches and modifications / improvements to existing ones would be nice.
The major problem here is the lack of consideration, on the part of a few, towards their fellow outdoorsman.
Pick up garbage when you leave isn't a hard concept to most, yet it doesn't seem to sink in with some folks who use the range.
I don't see anyone putting significant funding into a place that isn't looked after.
I propose a blitz one day - bunch of guys/gals and a few trucks - wouldn't be much but it would get rid of some of the junk there. It would be a small improvement anyway. This idea will probably get mixed reviews. Anyone else have suggestions?

This is a great idea. The only problems would be getting enough people and equipment to get it done and getting permission from the APRA to post it as being shut down for a day. Good luck keeping the morons out while trying to get it cleaned up. Then of course........how long will it stay that way?

Ormachek · #12 01-29-2010, 03:14 PM

I'd be more than happy to volunteer to help with the clean up!!

Bushrat · #13 01-29-2010, 04:24 PM

That range is a glaring representative example of how a few people will wreck everything for the majority. 3 ranges directly adjacent to each other, 2 are beautiful well maintained orderly and safe ranges, 2 of them operated by people who have to pay memberships and take pride in their ranges, and 1 free range open to anybody that is a public disgrace. If you want a nice place to shoot buy a membership somewhere. I think the APRA would love to see that range closed down.

shooter55 · #14 01-29-2010, 05:16 PM

unfortunately, all the work and etiquette signs in the whole world doesn't stop the morons who attend the range...all the serious shooters who would use it are outnumbered by the stupidity at Little Beirut.
I will pay the membership fees and stay at Rosebud

gramps73 · #15 01-29-2010, 05:31 PM

How are the roads on the way up there? Heading to Edmonton to pick up a new 223 and then out to the range Tuesday...
thanks

redneck posse · #16 01-29-2010, 05:37 PM

the stupidity is restricted to that range. gennesse spent 2 days cleaning up and replaceing the target boards at the 25 and 50 yard range. to only have some azzholes shoot them apart with thier shotguns.

gramps73 · #17 01-29-2010, 05:47 PM

People just don't care and that sucks. I will tell you the signs on the way up there are shot to sh*t...Thanks to those who cleaned it up

Renslipevol · #18 01-29-2010, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redneck posse

the stupidity is restricted to that range. gennesse spent 2 days cleaning up and replaceing the target boards at the 25 and 50 yard range. to only have some azzholes shoot them apart with thier shotguns.

I am new to a gun range, but does one really need to target with a shotgun unless they are firing at clays?

foothillsman · #19 01-29-2010, 07:57 PM

The only time that someone with a shotgun needs a paper target is while they develop a load. They use the paper target to see how evenly the load patterns as well as the density at different yardages.

The damage is done by immature a-holes who find it amusing to screw up the property for someone else. Usually liquor is involved.

AB2506 · #20 01-29-2010, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by foothillsman

The only time that someone with a shotgun needs a paper target is while they develop a load. They use the paper target to see how evenly the load patterns as well as the density at different yardages.

The damage is done by immature a-holes who find it amusing to screw up the property for someone else. Usually liquor is involved.

Don't forget sighting in your slug loads, if you hunt deer with a shotgun, or for that matter if you use a sight on your turkey gun.

propliner · #21 01-30-2010, 12:03 AM

I'd really like to be there to chew out one of those morons who drag their old computers and the like onto the range to shoot it up. Of course, they never bother to clean up junk like that when they're done. It's too bad there's nothing that can be done to discourage that kind of idiotic behavior besides closing it down or charging fees.

Robmcleod82 · #22 02-03-2010, 05:39 PM

I will never forget the guy that brought a gunny sack full of frying pans to shoot with his 10-22, what a moron

Traps · #23 02-03-2010, 09:01 PM

I saw a guy bring his computer and was so mad at the ****** for bringing it on the range. I told him that if he brings it he hauls it out, but in retrospect should have told him to put it back in his car.

Saw a father and son ready to fire while there was two people still down range at the 200 yard - had to stop them both, only good thing was at least they were apologetic and realized what they had done, but it still was a bad situation.

A guy who just showed up was sitting at the bench with his firearm pointed down range while guys were changing their targets and he was fooling with his bolt. Told him that guys were still down range and all the fool could do is say "But I am just seeing if my bolt is ok" He takes the cake, tried to argue his point, only could see it thru his own goggles.

Every time I am out there there is usually one or two morons that make you think, does this guy really deserve to be shooting a gun.

hansol · #24 02-03-2010, 09:20 PM

Are you the official Sibbald range officer? I get a kick out of the guys who selflessly undertake that "role"...

I do agree though, all the senseless shooting up of the benches and signs is ridiculous. I was VERY impressed when I showed up one day and found a "standing" bench. It made sighting in my big bores sooooo much more comfortable. 3 weeks later, and some wanker had shot it up...

I'm thinking I'm going to haul a new garbage bin up there though. The one there is going through some pretty hard times.

PJT · #25 02-04-2010, 07:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hansol

Are you the official Sibbald range officer? I get a kick out of the guys who selflessly undertake that "role"...

I do agree though, all the senseless shooting up of the benches and signs is ridiculous. I was VERY impressed when I showed up one day and found a "standing" bench. It made sighting in my big bores sooooo much more comfortable. 3 weeks later, and some wanker had shot it up...

I'm thinking I'm going to haul a new garbage bin up there though. The one there is going through some pretty hard times.

Hang on it is the responsibility of ALL shooters to POLICE themselves, range officer or not. We put too much focus on are you a range officer, lets put more on taking care of fellow shooters and deal with the yahoos who put our sport and ourselves in danger.

If more people spoke up or facilities would be cleaner, safer and alot more enjoyable.

Okotokian · #26 02-04-2010, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hansol

Are you the official Sibbald range officer? I get a kick out of the guys who selflessly undertake that "role"...

I do agree though, all the senseless shooting up of the benches and signs is ridiculous. I was VERY impressed when I showed up one day and found a "standing" bench. It made sighting in my big bores sooooo much more comfortable. 3 weeks later, and some wanker had shot it up...

I'm thinking I'm going to haul a new garbage bin up there though. The one there is going through some pretty hard times.

I'm confused. You chastize him for saying something to these morons, then you go on and complain about their actions. If you don't think anyone should talk to them or intervene, then stop complaining and live with it.

LongDraw · #27 02-04-2010, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hansol

Are you the official Sibbald range officer? I get a kick out of the guys who selflessly undertake that "role"...
.

When I shot there years ago I appreciated those with more experience than me who would act as range officer, explain the safety rules and kinda run the show. It definately made it a safer place.

The problem with the public range is it is unsupervised and any yahoo can just show up.

Look at all the crap that guys haul out there to do "penetration tests"; TV's old appliances, old phone books, I have seen it all. Try this at a private range and you will be shown the door permanently.

hansol · #28 02-04-2010, 09:40 AM

I'll clarify. I like the Sibbald range, because there is nobody there to babysit you. No guy looking over your shoulder saying "Ahem, you can't do that." Usually that same guy has a mall-ninja complex who believes he can act like a drill sergeant. Thanks, but no thanks.

Any time I've been out there, everyone has generally had mutual understanding and respect. When people are done shooting, they step back and wait, and generally things run very smoothly. I have heard the stories of the sketchy behavior, but have yet to see it personally.

On the other hand, you still see the benches and garbage cans shot to hell, but again, I haven't seen it happen when I was there. So that leads me to believe that no matter how much you "regulate" or "police" Sibbald, as soon as your "range officer" goes home, some wanker will start shooting signs. You can't fix stupid.

I'm one of those guys who hauls "stuff" out to the range. All the large steel plate gongs at 200m, and the one at 300m, I hauled them out there, and left them. So far, people seem to appreciate those. I also bring out boxes of stacked newspaper to do penetration tests. The catch is I bring that stuff home when I'm finished (save for the gongs. But I have yet to hear complaints about those). So please don't lump us all into that "Category". I admit, all that junk that gets left out there is unsightly and disrespectful, but again, you can't fix stupid.

Maybe it's not a popular opinion on this forum, but I tend to appreciate my freedom, and not have some wannabe drill-sergeant on a power trip breathing down my neck. Maybe I'm naive in thinking that people can take care of themselves, however, WITHOUT the need for increased regulations. That's the beauty of Sibbald: anyone can show up there, at any time that is convenient for you, and pop off a few rounds. It's not an old-boys club, you don't need to "call ahead", unlike some ranges that are *ahem*, just down the road, so to speak.

(I still want to lynch the guy who shot up the standing-rest though... Dick move, guy)

marlin1 · #29 02-04-2010, 09:59 AM

I also enjoy the freedom of the place but don't enjoy having a firearm pointed at me , which has happened there . I agree that they'll never be able to stop it from being messed up out there just like the never ending sign shooters . I think there will always be guys willing to impart the vast knowledge they posses and the great feats they have achieved shooting . I know a guy , ex-military, really knows his firearms and shooting , had a gentlemen proceed to tell him what he was doing wrong . gotta wonder sometimes why they feel the need , maybe to hear themselves talk I guess

Okotokian · #30 02-04-2010, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hansol

Maybe it's not a popular opinion on this forum, but I tend to appreciate my freedom, and not have some wannabe drill-sergeant on a power trip breathing down my neck. )

I agree Hansol, whether it comes to self-appointed enforcers or the government. But that depends on everyone acting responsibly. But sometimes when you are dealing with idiots someone has to step in.

It's a fine line to be sure, and I don't always know where it is, but there are times something has to be said. Going slightly off topic here but it seems that years ago people, particularly kids, watched what they did in public because an adult would likely come up to them and straighten them out. These days people just scurry by and avoid eye contact, scared. A while ago I walked by a bunch of teens smashing glass bottles on a wqlking path. Some other adults had just walked by, giving them a wide berth. I told them to knock it off and clean it up... and you know what? They did. When I was young we at least snuck off to do our bad deeds. A lot don't now, unworried about getting any sort of flak. But confronting the small stuff is how New York got cleaned up in the past decade.