New Shooter - First Rifle

CM29 · #1 06-08-2010, 09:33 AM

Hi, everyone...glad to me a member of the forum. Anyway, I am in my 30s and am wanting to begin shooting/hunting. I never hunted as a child or youth (some fishing and shooting at gophers with a .22), but several of my buddies hunt and I love the outdoors. I am interested in wildlife management and conservation, so it seemed like an obvious choice.

Before I begin hunting large game, I wanted to develop my marksmanship with plenty of practice and possibly join my friends on a deer hunt next fall. After much consideration and research, I think that I've got it down to a .243 Winchester. My reasoning is this...I wanted something big enough for deer, yet light-recoiling as I develop my skills. I wanted something that was a flat-shooting rifle (with .243 bullets leaving the barrel between 2960 and 3350 fps, retaining between 1025 and 1162 ft-lbs of energy, and dropping between 3.2 and 7.5 inches at 300 yards for several 80-100 grain bullets according to Remington ballistics data). I wanted something that could take down a deer-sized animal with a well-placed shot. I had considered the 7mm-08, but after looking around a little bit, it seems that ammo is fairly scarce (at least, not available in a pinch at Canadian Tire or Wal-Mart, if necessary, whereas .243 ammo is stocked everywhere).

Perhaps a year or two down the road, I figured that I would purchase something along the lines of a .270 or a 30-06 (both of which are more than capable of taking down almost any game in Alberta), but to start with I wanted to build my skills, comfort and confidence with what most consider to be a more than adequate deer rifle (plus, I'm hoping my wife may show some interest and then she can shoot the .243 when I get a more powerful gun in the future).

I was thinking of a Tikka T3 with a laminate wood stock, as the T3 has a free-floating barrel and the laminate wood stock seems to be a great compromise between walnut and synthetic (beauty and weight of wood, but less susceptive to humidity, etc.). Thoughts? Am I thinking logically here, or am I way off the mark?

Homesteader · #2 06-08-2010, 10:03 AM

Your far more on the mark, then off. Your choice sounds logical enough, it will mostly come down to what feels right in the hand. Another rifle to consider that is a good value is the Savages/Stevens. Cartridge wise you could add a 308 Winchester to your selection, but since you will be getting a 270/06 down the road, I'd probably stick with your 243. You also need to figure out what you want for optics, I would suggest an Elite 3200 and above for quality wise. I like the lower powered variables, like 2-7, but most guys pick 3-9s, and you can't go wrong with a Fixed 4 either.

M70 · #3 06-08-2010, 10:12 AM

Welcome. Where do you live? Maybe you could meet up with someone on the forum to shoot a few different rifles and calibers to test them out.

rottie · #4 06-08-2010, 10:27 AM

If you are close to Lacombe I have several different calibers you are free to try.
Calibers available are from 25-06.7x57,308,.280, on up to bigger stuff
Drop a line if interested

Ian

Okotokian · #5 06-08-2010, 11:40 AM

Yours is not the route I chose when I got into hunting a few years ago, but I don't see anything wrong at all with your thinking. I suspect you would find the recoil or a .270 no problem at all, but nothing wrong with what you are planning. have you tried all your biddies' guns? You should. There really isn't one right answer.

Whiskey Wish · #6 06-08-2010, 11:57 AM

Sounds like you are right on the mark to me. I started with a 243 and, after a couple of trial and errors, settled on a 270. The only differing comment I can make is you would very likely be okay to step right into a 270 with a good Pachmayr pad if recoil is a concern for you. I didn't find much difference in recoil between the 243 and the 270 and recoil is an issue for me. I am lightly built and shot extensively in my younger years so wanted a caliber I could shoot ALL day and not develop a flinch and my M77 Ruger has done an excellent job. I am a Browning fan and would steer you in that direction but that is purely personal taste.
Good Luck and Good Hunting and Welcome to the Game.

Keep Your Powder Dry,
Dave.

CM29 · #7 06-08-2010, 11:59 AM

Wow...thanks for the advice, everyone. I appreciate the wisdom on optics, the offer to fire a few different calibers, as well as everyone else's opinions. I have shot my dad's 12-guage Remington 870 Wingmaster on the farm a bunch, but I know that a high-powered rifle is a different animal. I had thought of trying my buddy's .270 before purchasing...if it felt good, I would certainly consider a more powerful rifle to begin with (I favour the .270 slightly over the 30-06 because it has a little less kick and is a little more flat-shooting). I guess the reason I was looking at the .243 is so that I could spend an afternoon at the range and not worry about the effects of recoil after a long practice session. Rottie...I live just southeast of Sherwood Park, so it's not a bad hike to Lacombe (about an hour and fifteen minutes). It's a busy time of year for me right now, but in a few weeks I should have more time to investigate and explore with a little more diligence. I invite more replies...any advice or wisdom from those more experienced is sincerely appreciated.

rottie · #8 06-08-2010, 12:28 PM

When you have time drop a line and we can get together, I do favour the 25 06 over the .243.Its just my opinion and lots will disagree, but I have used both and found at longer ranges the 25 06 seems to kill better. It also seems more likely to leave a larger exit wound. Again just my experience and opinion of the 2 cartridges

Ian

mudbug · #9 06-08-2010, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CM29

Hi, everyone...glad to me a member of the forum. Anyway, I am in my 30s and am wanting to begin shooting/hunting. I never hunted as a child or youth (some fishing and shooting at gophers with a .22), but several of my buddies hunt and I love the outdoors. I am interested in wildlife management and conservation, so it seemed like an obvious choice.

Before I begin hunting large game, I wanted to develop my marksmanship with plenty of practice and possibly join my friends on a deer hunt next fall. After much consideration and research, I think that I've got it down to a .243 Winchester. My reasoning is this...I wanted something big enough for deer, yet light-recoiling as I develop my skills. I wanted something that was a flat-shooting rifle (with .243 bullets leaving the barrel between 2960 and 3350 fps, retaining between 1025 and 1162 ft-lbs of energy, and dropping between 3.2 and 7.5 inches at 300 yards for several 80-100 grain bullets according to Remington ballistics data). I wanted something that could take down a deer-sized animal with a well-placed shot. I had considered the 7mm-08, but after looking around a little bit, it seems that ammo is fairly scarce (at least, not available in a pinch at Canadian Tire or Wal-Mart, if necessary, whereas .243 ammo is stocked everywhere).

Perhaps a year or two down the road, I figured that I would purchase something along the lines of a .270 or a 30-06 (both of which are more than capable of taking down almost any game in Alberta), but to start with I wanted to build my skills, comfort and confidence with what most consider to be a more than adequate deer rifle (plus, I'm hoping my wife may show some interest and then she can shoot the .243 when I get a more powerful gun in the future).

I was thinking of a Tikka T3 with a laminate wood stock, as the T3 has a free-floating barrel and the laminate wood stock seems to be a great compromise between walnut and synthetic (beauty and weight of wood, but less susceptive to humidity, etc.). Thoughts? Am I thinking logically here, or am I way off the mark?

First of all welcome to the forum. I just joined this year as well and have found the people on the forum to be quite helpful and great to chat with on the posts etc. I thnk you have covered what you want pretty well. A good site for you to check out would be www.aheia.com for your hunter training if you haven't already. They list courses etc that are helpful to a new hunter. A 243 is a great choice for what your looking at doing, low recoil and shoot it all day without any adverse affects. Have fun and feel free to post any guestions you have and someone will be able to help you out

FallAirFever · #10 06-08-2010, 08:28 PM

sounds like you are on the right track for sure. Good luck with your decision, take your time and get your hands on as many rifles as you can. Shoulder them and find what feels best.

Another chambering that you should take a long look at is the .308 Win. It is available everywhere. Same case a .243 but with a 30 cal bullet. Recoil is on the lighter side, you can start with reduced recoil loads and work up from there. Then later when you step-up, if you want to maybe look at 300 Win mag, but that is down the road.

Good luck and welcome the "club"

diesel cs · #11 06-08-2010, 08:53 PM

Just another thought. What about a 6mm A little faster than a .243 from what I have heard but still light on recoil.

Cowtown guy · #12 06-08-2010, 08:55 PM

People can argue calibres with regards to recoil all day long and not agree. The fact as I see it, is that the recoil is all in the fit of the rifle. Try lots of rifles in the stores and buy the one that fits you the best. If you aren't comfortable with it, then you get the gun in weird spots while shooting and that is when the recoil gets to be a problem.
The calibre is up to you, but I wouldn't be so quick to discount the 7mm08. I have one and I love it. Bigger bullet weights than the .243 and better BC. Yes they are a little slower but as a rookie you won't be shooting across fields. Right?? Right????
Too many people see the speed as a be all end all to shooting. I would rather have a good accurate load that I can dial in, than to have to rely on the load being flat enough to try and guess where you have to play with Kentucky Windage. Especially since most guys can't guess yardage if their life depends on it without a rangefinder. Me being one of them.

CM29 · #13 06-08-2010, 10:03 PM

Great advice, everyone. I don't plan on shooting across fields, Cowtown Guy, that's for sure. I believe that hunting needs to be ethical and shots need to be certain and within the capabilities of the shooter. I simply like that the .243 has a light recoil but bullets come out at a high velocity and retain good energy out to 300 yards (as opposed to a 30-30 which, according to Remington ballistics data, seems to really "fizzle out" by about 200 yards).

I have certainly not discounted the 7mm-08, but what is it like to find ammo in a pinch if necessary? I haven't seen it at any common stores like Wal-Mart, Canadian Tire, etc (mostly .243, .270, .308, and 30-06). I guess if I like the 7mm-08, I should make sure I buy enough ammo when I go into an outdoors/gun store. However, then I start to think...if I'm going to a 7mm-08, it's not that big of a jump to a .270...so why not just go there? Then again, my wife would absolutely get scared off of shooting if I had her try something that powerful. Perhaps the .243 as a starting point would give me an excuse to expand my gun collection in a year or two. If I go into something like a .270 now, I really won't need to purchase anything else unless I plan to hunt grizzlies or bison (and even then, I think that a .270 with the proper bullet would do just fine and dandy).

I really appreciate the advice on the fit of the stock to the shooter. As much as I like the design and value of the Tikka T3, I should really make sure it fits me properly. Who knows? I might end up with a Browning or a Remington when all is said and done. Thanks again, guys! Let's keep this discussion going.

elkhunter11 · #14 06-08-2010, 10:09 PM

I used a 243 early in my hunting career,and shot a few deer with it,however,I find the 7mm-08 much more versatile.As far as ammunition availability goes,find a load that your gun likes,take the lot# off of the box,and then buy several boxes with the same lot # if possible.The only excuse for running out of ammunition on a hunt,is extremely poor planning.

CM29 · #15 06-08-2010, 10:47 PM

Great...now you've got me thinking about a .308. There's a huge variety of ammo out there (nearly as much as is available for the 30-06), it kicks a little less than a .270 and performance is very similar. Now what?

MK2750 · #16 06-08-2010, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

I used a 243 early in my hunting career,and shot a few deer with it,however,I find the 7mm-08 much more versatile.As far as ammunition availability goes,find a load that your gun likes,take the lot# off of the box,and then buy several boxes with the same lot # if possible.The only excuse for running out of ammunition on a hunt,is extremely poor planning.

X2 I have never understood the logic behind "you can't get bullets in Timbucktwo". Unless you live there who cares.

If you get to your hunting spot and have no ammo you probably have forgotten your rifle or knife as well so it will make little difference.

I have some odd ball rifles and can always find ammo in Rocky and Red Deer.

I have never had a 243 but have a 7X57 and really like everything about it. It is the twin to the 7mm you are considering.

Mad_Mikee · #17 06-09-2010, 07:57 AM

The 243 is a cool little cartridge. You could also look at the 7mm-08. I've often heard it refered to as a womans rifle cartridge but I really love mine. It has a little more juice than a 243 but hardly any recoil.

I imagine that finding the calibre you like is the easy part once you find out what brand and model of gun feels good in your hands.

Twisted Canuck · #18 06-09-2010, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mad_Mikee

The 243 is a cool little cartridge. You could also look at the 7mm-08. I've often heard it refered to as a womans rifle cartridge but I really love mine. It has a little more juice than a 243 but hardly any recoil.

I imagine that finding the calibre you like is the easy part once you find out what brand and model of gun feels good in your hands.

x 2. I actually traded of my .308 to get the 7mm-08 that I had fallen in lust with. Ammo availability shouldn't be an issue, there are lots of gun shops out there that carry it even if Crappy Tire doesn't.

As far as recoil goes, I get the feeling you might be over thinking it. Sure the .243 has relatively light kick, but any of the others mentioned here (.308 7mm-08 .270 .25-06 etc) are all very manageable rounds to fire particularily if you are getting a rifle that fits you as mentioned above. Add a Simms recoil pad to the deal if you are really sensitive, but on my part for a first rifle for deer, I'd go with 7mm-08, because sooner or later you will want to go after a bigger critter like a moose or elk....and the .243 may leave you feeling a little undergunned. The 7mm-08 with a good bullet (I like the Barnes TSX, but the Nosler Partition is still a great bullet) will be good for whatever you want to hunt in Alberta, and I find mine very comfortable to shoot. Most important part is finding one that 'fits' when you bring it to your shoulder though.

I wish I could hunt everything with my Browning BL-22, it is the most natural point and shoot gun I have ever lifted.....but the .22 LR may not be appropriate for anythig other than prairie rats and rabbits.....

gitrdun · #19 06-09-2010, 04:44 PM

CM29, I wouldn't let what Walmart, Canadian Tire or Home Hardware stocks for ammunition affect your caliber choice. Personaly, I'm not a big fan of the .243. I feel that it's marginal for big game and too much gun for coyotes. I think that the 7-08 is a much better choice even though the .308 casing is parent to both calibers.

jpohlic · #20 06-09-2010, 04:49 PM

I also have a 7mm-08 and with a Limbsaver pad on it the recoil is negligible. Yes, its true that Canadian Tire doesn't usually stock ammo, but if you go to almost any "hunting" store you'll find plenty to choose from. Why limit yourself with a .243 deer rifle when you can get something that can take moose or elk as well?

Also, I've fired my uncle's Winchester model 70 .270 and it had as much kick as my dad's model 70 featherweight 30-06. I wouldn't be rushing out to pick up a .270

Marlin xl7 · #21 06-09-2010, 05:37 PM

The first big game rifle I purchased was a marlin xl7 in 270. This rifle is amazing, you get a lot of gun for $350, crowned barrel, fluted bolt, soft/thick recoil pad. This rifle will consistently shoot sub M.O.A at 100, 200, and 300 yards. The recoil of this rifle is less than I expected. I can shoot it off the bench all day long, and I'm 14.
Just a thought.

CM29 · #22 06-09-2010, 11:57 PM

Good points, all of you. I hate to focus on recoil, but I really want to get a firearm that I truly enjoy shooting. This is why I'm shying away from the .270 or 30-06 to start with. However, with all of the discussion, I am still up in the air. The .243 might make for a great beginning deer rifle and a great gun for a day at the range, but as mentioned, if I want to get into some larger game, I may end up feeling undergunned. I like the idea of the 7mm-08 and the .308 (although from recoil data I've checked out, the .308 has only slightly less recoil than a .270 with similar-grained bullets). The 7mm-08 seems like it may really work and may serve me well for a longer period of time. I'd really like to try all four (.243, .270, 7mm-08, and .308) before I buy. Once I find a caliber I enjoy shooting, it's time to shop for a nice-fitting rifle. Is ammo for the 7mm-08 expensive? I wouldn't want a day at the range to turn into a $100 venture. I guess I could cruise over to Wholesale Sports (the nearest location is about 20 minutes away, so I don't know why I was concerned about ammo availability elsewhere) and see for myself, but any ammo wisdom (and other related first firearm comments) would be appreciated. I know that there is a plethora of affordable practice ammo available for the other aforementioned calibers.

leo · #23 06-10-2010, 06:18 AM

If felt recoil is a major factor in your cartridge decision , proper stock fit and design with a good recoil pad will tame felt recoil to a manageable level . Choose the gun you like and that fits well regardless of chambering. Anything from a 243 up to 30-06 will handle what you need.

lone wolf · #24 06-10-2010, 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okotokian

Yours is not the route I chose when I got into hunting a few years ago, but I don't see anything wrong at all with your thinking. I suspect you would find the recoil or a .270 no problem at all, but nothing wrong with what you are planning. have you tried all your biddies' guns? You should. There really isn't one right answer.

x2

Welcome CM29. Like you I did not start hunting until I was a little older, and in my late 20s. As other members have pointed out, you are a lot closer to the mark than off it and have obviously done your homework. Also refreshing to see you have the common sense not to get sucked into the "magnum mania" that a lot of beginners do. Regardless, just wanted to say that when I started I went with the .270. In a good fitting rifle you will not feel much difference in recoil between the .243 and the .270 - shells are well priced and readily available too. My all around favourite is the 7mm-08 but even in Medicine Hat my store bought shell options are very limited. On the plus side it would also give you an excuse to get into reloading !! Good luck in your quest.

Twisted Canuck · #25 06-10-2010, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CM29

Good points, all of you. I hate to focus on recoil, but I really want to get a firearm that I truly enjoy shooting. This is why I'm shying away from the .270 or 30-06 to start with. However, with all of the discussion, I am still up in the air. The .243 might make for a great beginning deer rifle and a great gun for a day at the range, but as mentioned, if I want to get into some larger game, I may end up feeling undergunned. I like the idea of the 7mm-08 and the .308 (although from recoil data I've checked out, the .308 has only slightly less recoil than a .270 with similar-grained bullets). The 7mm-08 seems like it may really work and may serve me well for a longer period of time. I'd really like to try all four (.243, .270, 7mm-08, and .308) before I buy. Once I find a caliber I enjoy shooting, it's time to shop for a nice-fitting rifle. Is ammo for the 7mm-08 expensive? I wouldn't want a day at the range to turn into a $100 venture. I guess I could cruise over to Wholesale Sports (the nearest location is about 20 minutes away, so I don't know why I was concerned about ammo availability elsewhere) and see for myself, but any ammo wisdom (and other related first firearm comments) would be appreciated. I know that there is a plethora of affordable practice ammo available for the other aforementioned calibers.

If you have a WWS within 20 minutes, you are good to go as they stock a good selection of 7mm-08. I bought several different boxes of premium when I got my .08, and they were around the $50 mark (Federal Premium TSX, Winchester Silvertip Supreme) and also bought a box of Fusion ammo which was I think around $24, and not nearly as accurate a load in my ammo trials.

Not cheap, but not bank breaking either. I was shooting 140 gr bullets, and was fairly pleased with the groups, but sent the rifle to Corlanes for pillar block bedding and now need to get out and shoot it some more. So far I lean towards the Federal Premium loads with TSX for bigger game.

Now go handle a nice 7mm-08 you know you want to....

I'd suggest looking at the Tikka T3, Remington 700, but also the Howa has some great reviews and is moderately priced.....have fun, make sure you get what you like!

CM29 · #26 08-05-2010, 01:03 AM

Hi again, everyone. Well, it's been a while as I've checked out different calibers and researched different rifles. I'm about 1-2 weeks from picking up my baby and have decided that a .270 or 30-06 would not be too much to handle and would serve well as an all-around hunting calibre here in Alberta. I like the 7mm-08 as well, but it doesn't seem to quite have the punch of the .270 or 30-06. Anyway, I have shouldered and held many rifles over the past month and have it down to three (really two, but a friend of mine and a sales guy at Wholesale Sports threw a wrench in my spokes). I have it narrowed down to the:

- Winchester Model 70 Sporter
- Weatherby Vanguard Sporter

and thanks to my friend and the sales guy...
- Tikka T3 Hunter (the package with the Burris Fullfield II scope for $999)

Any thoughts on these rifles? All are walnut stocks as I am not interested in a synthetic stock. They are all comfortable (with the Winchester and Weatherby having a slight edge over the Tikka in this department). I'm not a fan of the two-piece bolt or the drop box magazine on the Tikka, but everyone seems to be raving about their accuracy and the smoothness of the action. Please remember that it is a new Model 70, which is much truer to the pre '64 in terms of some features. Also, what about safety in the event of a misfire or ruptured primer? I know that the Weatherby has the three gas ports that vent out the side. I would really appreciate any information or experience you might be able to give. Thanks!

leo · #27 08-05-2010, 05:56 AM

If your instincts are leading you towards the Winchester or Weatherby, then there is only 2 left in the running . All 3 are fine firearms, pick the one that feels best and is suited to your style of hunting(consider weight and barrel length). Does one fit your budget with rings and mounts attached etc. good luck.

bigoldan43 · #28 08-05-2010, 06:32 AM

It looks like my counterparts have covered most bases.
There a volumes written on calibers and their pros and cons. You want to open a can of worms on opinions, just ask a bunch of guys what caliber to use.

I'd stick with what has the most readily available ammunition. Most of the calibers listed are, like the 270 win, 243 & 308.
My suggestion on make of rifle will be what fits you. Try them all. Spend some time shopping, handle them all. Yes Tikkas are good, but these days most are good. Yes, some are better, but for the most part, they're all adequate for hunting at decent ranges.
Depending on how deep your pockets are, I'd really look long and hard at optics. Everyone has their opinions on optics too. Some folks will swear by Bushnells, other folks look at Leupold VX-3's as low end. There is a difference between a $200 and a $2000 scope. Some folks can't tell the difference, other can. Maybe the $2000 Swarovski doesn't fit your budget, but have a look at it anyway. That will let you know what the big dog looks like.
And get your scope mounted right. On good mounts. Good is a relative term, too. Most sporting goods stores will mount your scope for free in a couple of minutes while you wait. What do you do for a living? What kind of job would you do if you were spending a couple of minutes working for free?
Sure buddy can mount your scope at the range in a couple of minutes with a screwdriver and a Leatherman.
On your rifle, your accessories and how you get it all put together you get what you pay for.

roadkill · #29 08-05-2010, 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CM29

Hi again, everyone. Well, it's been a while as I've checked out different calibers and researched different rifles. I'm about 1-2 weeks from picking up my baby and have decided that a .270 or 30-06 would not be too much to handle and would serve well as an all-around hunting calibre here in Alberta. I like the 7mm-08 as well, but it doesn't seem to quite have the punch of the .270 or 30-06. Anyway, I have shouldered and held many rifles over the past month and have it down to three (really two, but a friend of mine and a sales guy at Wholesale Sports threw a wrench in my spokes). I have it narrowed down to the:

- Winchester Model 70 Sporter
- Weatherby Vanguard Sporter

and thanks to my friend and the sales guy...
- Tikka T3 Hunter (the package with the Burris Fullfield II scope for $999)

Any thoughts on these rifles? All are walnut stocks as I am not interested in a synthetic stock. They are all comfortable (with the Winchester and Weatherby having a slight edge over the Tikka in this department). I'm not a fan of the two-piece bolt or the drop box magazine on the Tikka, but everyone seems to be raving about their accuracy and the smoothness of the action. Please remember that it is a new Model 70, which is much truer to the pre '64 in terms of some features. Also, what about safety in the event of a misfire or ruptured primer? I know that the Weatherby has the three gas ports that vent out the side. I would really appreciate any information or experience you might be able to give. Thanks!

Hiya. I was in your spot last year, only I was hesitating between a 30-06 and a .308, with a mild interest in .270--based purely on what I'd been reading about them, as I had zero experience with firearms outside of an air cadet range team about a hundred years ago.

I was also hesitating between a Remington 700 CDL and one of the new Winchester m70s. In fact, I had been reading about the new special m70s that Winchester was putting out in the first year of production (2008) before I had my license and was wishing I'd gotten it earlier so I could get one of them.

Then I came across a lightly used one at CGN in .270. I pounced and love it. Since re-launching the rifle, Winchester's done everything right, at least, as far as I can see. If you go the Remington route, I'd say to try and find an older one, based again on what I'm reading about their quality, not any real-life experience.

I'd still really like a nice Remmy 700 CDL one day, but I'll probably go the used route as well.

Okay, the point: I'm glad I went for the .270, because I'm recoil-shy and the kick is not as noticeable as on my buddy's 30-06, which gives me flinch. And anyone here will tell you that flinch = unspectacular hunting results.

Also, the flatter shooting of the .270 won't mean nearly as much to someone sitting here in Québec as it will to someone who gets some honest-to-goodness distance (like you guys in Alberta), but because I'm still so new to the whole shooting thing, it gives me more confidence when I'm pulling the trigger.

As for the gas ports, I don't remember what the m70 does, but you'd have to work pretty hard to find a rifle that's unsafe in the event of a ruptured case these days, I'd think.

Welcome to the club, by the way.

rottie · #30 08-05-2010, 10:22 AM

Youve narrowed it down to two fine cartridges,either will serve you well for all Alberta has to offer.

With rifle choices again you are making some good choices,my advice would be to try handling them when you are wearing your hunting clothes and see which one fits you the best. Thats the one to go with. All are fine well madr rifle you cant go wrong with any of them

Ian

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