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02-16-2012, 11:08 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2011
Location: down by the river
Posts: 11,428
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Ya, I've done those searches before for past barbed-hook discussions on here, and have found some original research. Just thought you might have the goods on hand.
There are some obvious problems with experimental design, which have a significant impact when they try to run stats on their data.
Their treatments are too confounded by other factors.
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02-17-2012, 08:26 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TyreeUM
As I stated before, I have been researching this topic for quite sometime for reasons not important to this thread, and to be honest, I have really been on the fence with this one. I have no doubt in my mind that the people on this thread that think it should be up to the angler are more than likely fishing at a level where there would be no statistically significant difference in mortality if they fished a barbed hook or not. It is the average and below average joe that cant pop a barbless hook out the way you can that end up mishandling the fish, thus resulting in a higher level of mortality after the release. I think this is reason enough for me to lobby for barbless.
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I dont completely agree with you there TyreeUM. Poor fish handling is just poor fish handling with average and below average anglers as well as anglers just starting out(and some experienced anglers as well). Again I believe differences would be minimal.
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02-17-2012, 08:41 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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Could someone tell me why a province would go barbless and still allow the use of bait?
Can the guys on here defending the use of barbless(no significant difference in mortality rates) explain how they can justify using bait when there is a significant difference in mortality rates with it use.
Hypocritical!
to say the least.
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02-17-2012, 09:11 AM
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Medicine Hat
Posts: 1,840
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huntsfurfish
Could someone tell me why a province would go barbless and still allow the use of bait?
Can the guys on here defending the use of barbless(no significant difference in mortality rates) explain how they can justify using bait when there is a significant difference in mortality rates with it use.
Hypocritical!
to say the least.
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So do you use bait?
Curious with all your knowledge if there is any province that has a complete bait ban?
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02-17-2012, 09:41 AM
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Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Saskatoon, SK
Posts: 1,353
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huntsfurfish
I dont completely agree with you there TyreeUM. Poor fish handling is just poor fish handling with average and below average anglers as well as anglers just starting out(and some experienced anglers as well). Again I believe differences would be minimal.
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I dont expect you to agree with anyone, you already had your mind made up before you even entered this discussion.
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02-17-2012, 10:20 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: medicine hat
Posts: 9,037
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im not sure this law is good or not. screw the studies....im going on 35 years of fishing experience and have come to this conclusion. fish mortality in my opinion is going to be largely dependant on the angler. ive seen a few that like to drag out a fish fight for as long as possible because they arent catching many and want that fun to last......that aint good for fish.
ive seen lots more drag fish up onto the rocks and gravel/prairie/bottom of the boat etc to flop around for several minutes while they dig up a tape measure to see if they are allowed to kill it....without realizing THEY ALREADY ARE!!! for christ sake, if you want to keep one where size limits exist, have that crap ready before the fish gets to you!!!
others yet will turn a fish inside out removing the hooks and then shot put it for distance like they are training for the olympics. again....not good for the fish.
how about the guy that horses them up from 60 feet of water thinking that minimalizing the fight time will save them......without knowing anything about the swim bladders....
for those that care about fish, the best thing you can do is to try to educate those who dont know on the proper handling of fish if you plan on releasing them. for those interested....im pretty well C&R only. its been quite a while since i knowingly killed a fish. im sure some of those that swim away from me looking pefectly healthy go on to die, but for the most part i do my best to limit handling. i keep the pliers on me and if i can avoid it, i wont even touch a fish. pretty well all my tackle is single hooks, and ive been pinching barbs for much longer than it has been the law.
im not trying to sound h0olier than thou....just explaining my point of view. do i think barbless laws make sense......i dunno....maybe, maybe not.....id like to see more guys get help on this stuff from those that know and care. good fishing to all......
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02-17-2012, 12:44 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madatter
So do you use bait?
Curious with all your knowledge if there is any province that has a complete bait ban?
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Yes I do! For over 50 years
To my knowledge there are no complete bait bans.
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02-17-2012, 12:48 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ishootbambi
im not sure this law is good or not. screw the studies....im going on 35 years of fishing experience and have come to this conclusion. fish mortality in my opinion is going to be largely dependant on the angler. ive seen a few that like to drag out a fish fight for as long as possible because they arent catching many and want that fun to last......that aint good for fish.
ive seen lots more drag fish up onto the rocks and gravel/prairie/bottom of the boat etc to flop around for several minutes while they dig up a tape measure to see if they are allowed to kill it....without realizing THEY ALREADY ARE!!! for christ sake, if you want to keep one where size limits exist, have that crap ready before the fish gets to you!!!
others yet will turn a fish inside out removing the hooks and then shot put it for distance like they are training for the olympics. again....not good for the fish.
how about the guy that horses them up from 60 feet of water thinking that minimalizing the fight time will save them......without knowing anything about the swim bladders....
for those that care about fish, the best thing you can do is to try to educate those who dont know on the proper handling of fish if you plan on releasing them. for those interested....im pretty well C&R only. its been quite a while since i knowingly killed a fish. im sure some of those that swim away from me looking pefectly healthy go on to die, but for the most part i do my best to limit handling. i keep the pliers on me and if i can avoid it, i wont even touch a fish. pretty well all my tackle is single hooks, and ive been pinching barbs for much longer than it has been the law.
im not trying to sound h0olier than thou....just explaining my point of view. do i think barbless laws make sense......i dunno....maybe, maybe not.....id like to see more guys get help on this stuff from those that know and care. good fishing to all......
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Very well said.
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02-17-2012, 02:06 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Perdue SK
Posts: 1,570
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Gfys
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyreeUM
...for reasons not important to this thread, ...I have ...no ...mind ... the people ...are ...statistically ...a ...below average joe ...that end up mishandling ...a ...mortality ...for me ...
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TyreeUM
...expect ...your mind ...before you ...discuss...
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Does not make a lot of sense to me either, done this way. I will say this; I lied earlier when I said I "put them ashore." What I meant was, "I throw them overboard."
As you can see, I too can have a bit of fun misquoting you.
Free
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02-17-2012, 02:10 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Perdue SK
Posts: 1,570
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To the pike meister
Quote:
Originally Posted by WayneChristie
so in your opinion the many thousands(millions?) of anglers who fished from the beginning of time until the barbless rule were totally unethical? and every fisherperson who doesnt live where barbless hooks are the law are unethical.
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Took you a while Mr. Christie, but you were finally, after two years, able to Troll me. That's patience.
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02-17-2012, 03:12 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Saskatoon, SK
Posts: 1,353
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Freedom55
Does not make a lot of sense to me either, done this way. I will say this; I lied earlier when I said I "put them ashore." What I meant was, "I throw them overboard."
As you can see, I too can have a bit of fun misquoting you.
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you are a wack-o
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02-17-2012, 04:13 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Medicine Hat
Posts: 1,840
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huntsfurfish
Yes I do! For over 50 years
To my knowledge there are no complete bait bans.
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I'm a little curious as to why the barbless law has you so excited when in your own words bait fishing has a much higher effect on fish mortality....yet you have no issue whatsoever bait fishing.
Using bait is allowed.
Using barbed hooks isn't.
Get over it!
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02-17-2012, 04:24 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madatter
I'm a little curious as to why the barbless law has you so excited when in your own words bait fishing has a much higher effect on fish mortality....yet you have no issue whatsoever bait fishing.
Using bait is allowed.
Using barbed hooks isn't.
Get over it!
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Makes lots of sense! Not.
You still cant figure that out?
I suppose you were for the long gun registry too!
Last edited by huntsfurfish; 02-17-2012 at 04:35 PM.
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02-17-2012, 04:43 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Medicine Hat
Posts: 1,840
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huntsfurfish
Makes lots of sense! Not.
You still cant figure that out?
I suppose you were for the long gun registry too!
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Well I know you make no sense....
Guess that's the way you like it tho...
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02-17-2012, 04:45 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Medicine Hat
Posts: 1,840
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huntsfurfish
Could someone tell me why a province would go barbless and still allow the use of bait?
Can the guys on here defending the use of barbless(no significant difference in mortality rates) explain how they can justify using bait when there is a significant difference in mortality rates with it use.
Hypocritical!
to say the least.
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You seem a little hypocritical using bait for 50 years
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02-17-2012, 04:47 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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I guess you will never get it
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02-17-2012, 04:57 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madatter
I'm a little curious as to why the barbless law has you so excited when in your own words bait fishing has a much higher effect on fish mortality....yet you have no issue whatsoever bait fishing.
Using bait is allowed.
Using barbed hooks isn't.
Get over it!
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I guess you need a little help.
Would make more sense the other way around.
Using barbed hooks is allowed.
Using bait isnt.
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02-17-2012, 04:57 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Medicine Hat
Posts: 1,840
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huntsfurfish
I guess you will never get it
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I got a headache from reading this!
Practically every province has a barbless rule...
No province has bait ban....which really means squat when we are talking about the barbless rule....good thing too cause you love using bait!
Guess you are smarter than everybody..
Last edited by madatter; 02-17-2012 at 05:04 PM.
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02-17-2012, 05:22 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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02-17-2012, 05:35 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Medicine Hat
Posts: 1,840
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huntsfurfish
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Uh no....the long gun registry was a proven money waster with little or no benefit.
While you say barbless is not proven to be any better,it sure isn't proven to be worse.
You don't like it....too bad
Most people think it helps and don't mind taking the seconds to crimp/file barbs....
Time to move on....
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02-17-2012, 05:42 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madatter
Uh no....the long gun registry was a proven money waster with little or no benefit.
While you say barbless is not proven to be any better,it sure isn't proven to be worse.
You don't like it....too bad
Most people think it helps and don't mind taking the seconds to crimp/file barbs....
Time to move on....
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Thats the whole point!!!! Barbed or Barbless no significant difference. sheesh.
Thank you for this post. You made my point!!!!
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02-17-2012, 10:26 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Medicine Hat
Posts: 1,840
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huntsfurfish
Thats the whole point!!!! Barbed or Barbless no significant difference. sheesh.
Thank you for this post. You made my point!!!!
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In your mind yes.....it's not proven,YOU SAY...
In mine yes....it is proven by personal experience
U can't make your point,why would I?
Still the law...you still have to get over it!
But you could stop using bait....since you keep bringing it up!
Last edited by madatter; 02-17-2012 at 10:36 PM.
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02-18-2012, 08:41 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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Ok I was wrong - Yes I am smarter than you lol
Same thing dude. Lots of similarities.
Only difference was the amount of money spent.
If you cant see that, well I cant help you.
I bet you have not even read the studies in question, they are out there do a search. You are spouting the same liberal reasoning used in the Long gun registry.
And ya you did make my point!
PS-I was not in favour of long gun registration
Did we get over the long gun registry
Last edited by huntsfurfish; 02-18-2012 at 08:53 AM.
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02-18-2012, 09:31 AM
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Medicine Hat
Posts: 1,840
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huntsfurfish
Ok I was wrong - Yes I am smarter than you lol
Same thing dude. Lots of similarities.
Only difference was the amount of money spent.
If you cant see that, well I cant help you.
I bet you have not even read the studies in question, they are out there do a search. You are spouting the same liberal reasoning used in the Long gun registry.
And ya you did make my point!
PS-I was not in favour of long gun registration
Did we get over the long gun registry
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You might be the smartest d...b person I know!
Ok I don't know you....
I find it very interesting you keep bringing up other things,bait fishing,long gun registry that have ZERO to do with the topic.
I guess smart people like you think they do in your world....wherever that may be.
Comparing the long gun registry to the barbless rule may be the silliest thing I have ever heard....but if it makes sense in your world all the power to ya!
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02-18-2012, 10:21 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Alberta
Posts: 2,152
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madatter
Comparing the long gun registry to the barbless rule may be the silliest thing I have ever heard.
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x2, beyond silly! Totally unrelated laws really.
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02-18-2012, 02:36 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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Not if you give it a little thought.
But some might have to give it a lot of thought though.
Can you spell s l o w.
Besides no need for you guys to hurt yourselves
Last edited by huntsfurfish; 02-18-2012 at 02:54 PM.
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02-18-2012, 02:46 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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Some may not like/appreciate the references to bait, hypocracy, long gun registry. I can understand that. But those that cannot see why I have made the references are beyond help
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02-18-2012, 02:58 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 7,268
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wow dude, go fishing or something...... (dont forget to pinch those barbs.)
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02-18-2012, 03:03 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 7,350
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Thanks Pickeral Pat, Good idea, getting cranky and wound a little tight! Always pinch the barbs cause its the law.
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02-18-2012, 03:13 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 7,268
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huntsfurfish
Thanks Pickeral Pat, Good idea, getting cranky and wound a little tight! Always pinch the barbs cause its the law.
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lol, no problem.
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