Blue Green Algae

[Kurt505]

Is it just me or is blue green algae getting more and more prevelant in lakes across Alberta? I don't remember seeing blue green algae as a kid.

Can anyone tell me where it came from or what causes it? Has it been here all along and I just never noticed?

[walleyechaser]

High levels of nitrogen and phosphorus usually from agriculture run off (atleast that's what Google box is telling me)

Every body of water has always had the bacteria for the algae to bloom. It is only now that the availability of nutrients is high enough in certain bodies of water to spark a bloom
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[mikebossy]

also riparian zones, ie weedlines along shorelines that used to buffer the effects are lost more and more as people develop cottages etc waterside and want easy access to boating on there front 'step'

[Mr Flyguy]

It's all about warm weather (I'm not calling it climate change, yet) and consequently water temperatures rising in lakes and ponds.

If you want all of the gory details look up cyanobacteria in Google.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by walleyechaser

High levels of nitrogen and phosphorus usually from agriculture run off (atleast that's what Google box is telling me)

Every body of water has always had the bacteria for the algae to bloom. It is only now that the availability of nutrients is high enough in certain bodies of water to spark a bloom
Sent from my SM-G960W using Tapatalk

I heard about the agriculture run off theory before but with it happening in some of the more northern lakes or lakes as big as cold lake I'm having a hard time buying it. I'm almost thinking it's airborne spores, I have no scientific evidence, it's just a theory I've been thinking. After talking with the guy who farms my land, he said some of the crop deseases he has can come from across the globe, caught up in jet streams and making their way to Canada. I don't know if what he said is true, but if it's possible to contaminate crops from across the globe it wouldn't be too far fetched to think it could happen to lakes.

Of course I could be way off here, and that's why I'm hoping there is someone on board who knows for sure.

[walleyechaser]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

I heard about the agriculture run off theory before but with it happening in some of the more northern lakes or lakes as big as cold lake I'm having a hard time buying it. I'm almost thinking it's airborne spores, I have no scientific evidence, it's just a theory I've been thinking. After talking with the guy who farms my land, he said some of the crop deseases he has can come from across the globe, caught up in jet streams and making their way to Canada. I don't know if what he said is true, but if it's possible to contaminate crops from across the globe it wouldn't be too far fetched to think it could happen to lakes.

Of course I could be way off here, and that's why I'm hoping there is someone on board who knows for sure.

It's probably a perfect storm of situations. Warmer water has to be a major contributing factor

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[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Mr Flyguy

It's all about warm weather (I'm not calling it climate change, yet) and consequently water temperatures rising in lakes and ponds.

If you want all of the gory details look up cyanobacteria in Google.

After reading that it sounds like the earth is trying to re-oxygenate itself.

[Wolkpack]

My family has had a cabin on Pigeon Lake since the 1930's so that is a lake I can speak about. My dad, who spent every day of every summer out there as a kid, says they never had algae problems. But in the subsequent 50 years there has been a lot of development on and around the lake, and the increase in nitrogen in the run-off is definitely a contributing factor.

Also, the lake is probably three feet lower then it was when I was a kid. With no major stream or river supplying water to the lake, and being only about 25 feet deep in the middle, Pigeon Lake is basically a huge standing puddle. When the weather is hot and there is little rain and wind, the sun can reach far down and cause the algae to bloom. As soon as I start to see dead whitefish floating I know that a bloom is probably coming soon after. I saw a few dead whitefish last week. The pelicans were having a field day.

The Pigeon Lake Watershed Society has done some good work but as is often the case it is a lot of talking and testing and reporting with very little significant action taken. In my opinion the focus should be on how to get the level of the lake up. They could pipe in water from the N. Saskatchewan River - I am told a pipeline already exists and that chemically the water is almost identical to that in Pigeon Lake. With the money and influence that a lot of the cabin owners on that lake have, I am surprised that nothing like this has been done. There are also chemicals, proven safe, that could be put into the lake to inhibit the blue-green algae growth specifically, but the environmentalists would never let that happen.

[Don Meredith]

Here's a piece I wrote about "The Blue-Green Plague" back in July of 2013:https://donmeredith.wordpress.com/20...-green-plague/

Agricultural and residential runoff are definitely contributing factors, as is the general warming of our lakes as a result of ongoing climate change. Cyanobacteria are in most of our lakes and ponds and provide food for many species of animals and contribute to the food chain. The problem comes when an excess of nutrients, such as phosphorus and nitrogen, enters the lake and allow the cyanobacteria to increase rapidly, robbing oxygen from the water and introducing lethal toxins. It's a complicated process and it's going to get a lot worse.

Pumping water into lakes, etc. and flushing the lakes would help, but they are expensive processes and don't really solve the problem: our over development around lakes and streams, and climate change--yes it's real and it's here.

[wind drift]

It’s not just agriculture, but land clearing and road development in general. Phosphorous runoff from land that has been logged is increased for a period of time. Roads are sediment and nutrient conduits. Our boreal forest regions are much different now than 20+ years ago. Some lakes have small watersheds and are less affected. Others have large watersheds. Everything that happens in the watershed can affect rivers and lakes.

[cube]

Originally Posted by Don Meredith

Here's a piece I wrote about "The Blue-Green Plague" back in July of 2013:https://donmeredith.wordpress.com/20...-green-plague/

Agricultural and residential runoff are definitely contributing factors, as is the general warming of our lakes as a result of ongoing climate change. Cyanobacteria are in most of our lakes and ponds and provide food for many species of animals and contribute to the food chain. The problem comes when an excess of nutrients, such as phosphorus and nitrogen, enters the lake and allow the cyanobacteria to increase rapidly, robbing oxygen from the water and introducing lethal toxins. It's a complicated process and it's going to get a lot worse.

Pumping water into lakes, etc. and flushing the lakes would help, but they are expensive processes and don't really solve the problem: our over development around lakes and streams, and climate change--yes it's real and it's here.

I don't think Cyanobacteria, esp toxin producers, provide food for the food web. At least not directly. They do give decomposers a food source but it really does not go up the food chain like algae does. ("Climate change could drive marine food web collapse through altered trophic flows and cyanobacterial proliferation"). It seems to lock those nutrients into a lower order cycle of growth and decay of the Cyano contributing to high BOD (Biological Oxygen Demand) during die off while not actually feeding the higher order food web.

Of course there are many factors that are contributing to this but here is one you might not have thought of.

With the high levels of Walleye we have in our walleye managed lakes it is quite possible there very levels could be contributing to the cyano problem. If you look in a number of scientific papers high predator rates lead to a lack of small fish which normally feed on grazing zooplankton. With this lack of bait fish the grazing zooplankton levels go up. The grazing zooplankton do not eat Cyano but they do eat algae. This leads to

a drop in normal algae which then leaves lots of excess nutrients for the cyano to use up as they no longer have competition for nutrients from the normal algae.

I know I have certainly seen what appears to me a drop in bait fish populations in walleye managed lakes. I know that walleye lakes that had algae problems in the past certainly do seem much worse now. I know lakes like Wabamun which never had much green floaties in the past certainly have gotten worse in the last few years. I know lakes like Pinehurst which does not have agricultural land around it have greened up immensely since it became a walleye managed lake. It used to have schools and schools of bait fish everywhere. There are now lots and lots of walleye but very few bait fish in comparison and water quality/clarity has gone way down. The last couple of years there I could not believe the change. I know the Cyano on Wolf lake which also gets very little agricultural runoff has gotten much worse since the walleye levels have gone way up.

Again I know there are many factors involved here and allot of what I put down was correlation and not necessarily causation. For what it's worth it was my wife who doesn't fish that brought this to attention, hence, I looked it up and was quite amazed that the science supports this.

[Red Bullets]

Originally Posted by cube

I don't think Cyanobacteria, esp toxin producers, provide food for the food web. At least not directly. They do give decomposers a food source but it really does not go up the food chain like algae does. ("Climate change could drive marine food web collapse through altered trophic flows and cyanobacterial proliferation"). It seems to lock those nutrients into a lower order cycle of growth and decay of the Cyano contributing to high BOD (Biological Oxygen Demand) during die off while not actually feeding the higher order food web.

Of course there are many factors that are contributing to this but here is one you might not have thought of.

With the high levels of Walleye we have in our walleye managed lakes it is quite possible there very levels could be contributing to the cyano problem. If you look in a number of scientific papers high predator rates lead to a lack of small fish which normally feed on grazing zooplankton. With this lack of bait fish the grazing zooplankton levels go up. The grazing zooplankton do not eat Cyano but they do eat algae. This leads to

a drop in normal algae which then leaves lots of excess nutrients for the cyano to use up as they no longer have competition for nutrients from the normal algae.

I know I have certainly seen what appears to me a drop in bait fish populations in walleye managed lakes. I know that walleye lakes that had algae problems in the past certainly do seem much worse now. I know lakes like Wabamun which never had much green floaties in the past certainly have gotten worse in the last few years. I know lakes like Pinehurst which does not have agricultural land around it have greened up immensely since it became a walleye managed lake. It used to have schools and schools of bait fish everywhere. There are now lots and lots of walleye but very few bait fish in comparison and water quality/clarity has gone way down. The last couple of years there I could not believe the change. I know the Cyano on Wolf lake which also gets very little agricultural runoff has gotten much worse since the walleye levels have gone way up.

Again I know there are many factors involved here and allot of what I put down was correlation and not necessarily causation. For what it's worth it was my wife who doesn't fish that brought this to attention, hence, I looked it up and was quite amazed that the science supports this.

Makes good sense. Great info and logic. So then maybe the cyano is just excess walleye snot.

[darren32]

Is there an easy way to tell the difference between regular algae and blue green algae?

Algae of some sort was pretty terrible on the SW shore of Wabamun on the weekend. From shore to about 150' out it was pretty thick. We have been there for 10 years and have not seen anything like it, not even close.

We went to the North shore (Fallis) to swim, there was no way we were getting in that.

Hope it's not here to stay.

https://myhealth.alberta.ca/Alberta/...een-algae.aspx

https://www.albertahealthservices.ca/news/bga.aspx

[Wolkpack]

Originally Posted by cube

Of course there are many factors that are contributing to this but here is one you might not have thought of.

With the high levels of Walleye we have in our walleye managed lakes it is quite possible there very levels could be contributing to the cyano problem. If you look in a number of scientific papers high predator rates lead to a lack of small fish which normally feed on grazing zooplankton. With this lack of bait fish the grazing zooplankton levels go up. The grazing zooplankton do not eat Cyano but they do eat algae. This leads to

a drop in normal algae which then leaves lots of excess nutrients for the cyano to use up as they no longer have competition for nutrients from the normal algae.

I know I have certainly seen what appears to me a drop in bait fish populations in walleye managed lakes. I know that walleye lakes that had algae problems in the past certainly do seem much worse now. I know lakes like Wabamun which never had much green floaties in the past certainly have gotten worse in the last few years. I know lakes like Pinehurst which does not have agricultural land around it have greened up immensely since it became a walleye managed lake. It used to have schools and schools of bait fish everywhere. There are now lots and lots of walleye but very few bait fish in comparison and water quality/clarity has gone way down. The last couple of years there I could not believe the change. I know the Cyano on Wolf lake which also gets very little agricultural runoff has gotten much worse since the walleye levels have gone way up.

Again I know there are many factors involved here and allot of what I put down was correlation and not necessarily causation. For what it's worth it was my wife who doesn't fish that brought this to attention, hence, I looked it up and was quite amazed that the science supports this.

This is an excellent point and I wonder if there is any scientific validity to this theory. Anecdotally I can confirm that when I was a kid we never had blue-green algae at Pigeon Lake and I spent days catching perch by the hundreds from the pier. I don't think I have seen a perch or even a minnow in Pigeon Lake in the past 20 years, which coincides with a rising algae problem. I realize the million or so walleye in that lake have to be eating SOMETHING, but I'm not sure exactly what that is.

[curtis_rak]

darren32...

this is actually a pretty decent reference... lots of good pics

http://www.epa.ohio.gov/portals/28/D...uide-DRAFT.pdf

[Don Meredith]

Good catch on what eats blue-green algae, cube. There are actual many species of cyanobacteria, most of which aren't toxic or cause blooms. Many of these are eaten by zooplankton. But you're right, the ones causing the toxic blooms don't have a lot of predators and most likely compete with the other algae.

Your walleye predation hypothesis is an interesting one. I know in Wabamun, many people have commented on the lack of forage fish in shallow waters over the last few years, correlated with the introduction and expansion of walleye. I'm on the board of the Wabamun Watershed Management Council (http://www.wwmc.ca) and we are seeking to have a study done on the flora and fauna of the lake to explain the changes we are seeing. Many factors to consider, indeed.

[darren32]

Originally Posted by curtis_rak

darren32...

this is actually a pretty decent reference... lots of good pics

http://www.epa.ohio.gov/portals/28/D...uide-DRAFT.pdf

Thank you

[fish99]

Originally Posted by Wolkpack

This is an excellent point and I wonder if there is any scientific validity to this theory. Anecdotally I can confirm that when I was a kid we never had blue-green algae at Pigeon Lake and I spent days catching perch by the hundreds from the pier. I don't think I have seen a perch or even a minnow in Pigeon Lake in the past 20 years, which coincides with a rising algae problem. I realize the million or so walleye in that lake have to be eating SOMETHING, but I'm not sure exactly what that is.

they are eating all the minnows fisherman are using for bait, can you imagine how much extra nutrients were add to the lake each year in bait alone